Who Gets To Define What Spyware Is?
from the the-user? dept
One thing that's been clear for a long time is that spyware/adware companies and consumers define spyware completely differently. Most consumers seem pissed off over one main point: this stuff gets installed secretly without them realizing what it does. In the past, adware companies would say that the real problem is the "spying" and would then claim they didn't do that. They might be changing their minds a bit. We've recently been talking about how Claria's attempt to change isn't really a change at all. All they did was get rid of pop-ups. They still install secretly in too many cases and they still are doing things on the backend that make people uncomfortable. However, in yet another article talking about the Claria makeover, it's implied that this is okay because: "nobody much minds behind-the-scenes spying." This is symptomatic of the industry thinking that they get to define what does and doesn't annoy people. The latest example? 180Solutions is suing Zone Labs for giving their software a spyware designation. This is nothing new. Other companies have sued over the spyware label in the past as well. But, what it comes down to is that it should be the user's call what they do on their computer and how they define stuff. The industry doesn't get to decide what people want on their own computers, and telling anti-spyware companies that they can't point out that many people dislike these products and don't know how they were installed just makes it seem like they have more to hide. The answer isn't to sue anti-spyware companies but to stop making software that pisses off users.
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No Subject Given
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Re: Renaming Adware/Spyware
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...too funny!
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I'll decide
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Amen that
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Re: Amen that
Is the Adobe Gamma Loader spyware? When I install Photoshop I don't ask for it. That Winzip Quick Pick? How about those Quicktime and RealPlayer system tray apps?
Admittedly some of these you *can* opt out of on install, but assume for a moment they aren't.
Ok, they obviously aren't spyware by any sensible definition.
But where do we draw the line? Is it just a bundled application that isn't related to what we installed? Anything that calls home without permission?
Legislative headache.
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Re: rikko
I mean how do you define everything wrong a program MIGHT do that CAN qualify it as spyware/adware/the good suggestions for new names on this page such as malware. If an anti malware company wants to classify a program as what it is, and no one is against it but the company that designed the program- who is the bad guy? Yes the guy covering his ass and getting all huffy-puffy about people being saved from his good programming certainly is the good guy. No doubt those darn anti-malware companies are trying to make us happy now, only to betray us later...
If a legit anti-malware company could simply merge with the government so that the government could have better insight on malware, perhaps they can illegalize malware as defined by their database in the anti-malware program. Who would sue in defense of their malware then, at the risk of going to jail? Who would then, still be a proud malware programmer daring enough to break the law just to rain unhappiness on people with computers, while gaining nothing in return by doing so. How much easier could it be, I mean anyone computer savy can tell what malware is and what it isn't. So why can't a skillful, trustworthy anti-malware company be able to correctly guide the government in their fight against malware? Sure, I suppose developing new programs not qualified on the list may be a way of exploiting the loop hole to this idea. But much like trojan related viruses, the way the malware is programmed should be an illegal part as well, so that the same malware company can't keep spurting out the same program with a new name while the old ones are becoming illegal. Who would have the time or the interest in creating a new peice of crap from scratch almost on a daily basis?
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Re: rikko
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spyware def..
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as far as popups go, recently i called a local restaurant chain that had been plastering me with popups and said i wouldnt patronize them again.. unfortunately the guy who gives a shit was off that day.
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You got it dead right!!!
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Easy to know, hard to define
Spyware: any peice of software which gathers information from a users computer and sends it to a 3rd party without the user's knowledge or consent.
Addware: any peice of client side software that presents the user with unwanted adds
Malware: any spyware or adware that is loaded to the user's computer without the users knowledge or consent. (excluding other more traditional viruses etc. from the definition)
Seems pretty straight forward, but where is the line drawn... it a greyscale from cookies for storing user preferences to keylogging root kit. What about normalware that sends version information to a server without bothering the user? What about those imbedded adds in Opera - I certainly dont want to see them! Could that be classed as addware?
There needs to be a clear set of published guidlines based on
1. Intention of software
2. Disruption to normal running processes
3. Level of deception
and a body set up to officially classify applications which is beyond question.
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Re: Easy to know, hard to define
Parasites won't go away is the biggest problem because in all reality it means more money for computer manufacturers. How many people get full of parasites clogged overloaded and have 0 zip nada copies of their Operating System to totally restart their computers? How many of those just buy a new computer for 500-1000 bucks rather than spend 150 to have their old slow outdated computer that's three giga hertz slower than the new one fixed.
Too much money involved we learn to cope or someone learns to make a better immune system to these parasites because there isn't one on the market pay or free that effectivly works on all of them. You also have to take into account that if you use say comcast for your broadband needs automatically you get parasites that cannot be removed without losing your connection to the internet. There is a fix for this but they won't tell you unless you harass them. Many major companies add parasites to their software now and there is no way around that because in order to have their software you have to agree to take full responsibility for it's content.
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Re: Easy to know, hard to define
This is news to me. I was a Comcast subscriber and now use Verizon DSL. Neither one of these broadband companies has forced me to install any sort of software. There is a setup disk that comes with my Verizon router to configure my router and connection but once I'm done setting up, it never runs again and can be easily removed.
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180solutions
http://blog.180solutions.com
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Definition
Software is a program that tells you what it does, and makes no bones about it, before you install it.
Spyware is a program that does not tell you what it does before you install it, tries to hide itself or is misleading in its operation or description.
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Ok Guys It's simple. to me at least.
With that said, i will be bold enough to say that ANY information added to my computer without my knowledge should be a crime. And me and most of the people i know whould willingly kick someones ass over putting software on there pc without there knowledge. the problem is, we dont know who is putting it there or when. just simply that its there.
I mean this shouldnt even be a question. If you go to a body shop and have you wrecked fender fixed with a new one are they then allowed to change your radio and relign your seats?
if you have movers come in and put in a new stove, are they allowed to change your countertops? pet your dog? take your child to the park?
NO, if it is yours, and they dont have permission, it is your constitutional right to protect it!
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Ok Guys It's simple. to me at least.
With that said, i will be bold enough to say that ANY information added to my computer without my knowledge should be a crime. And me and most of the people i know whould willingly kick someones ass over putting software on there pc without there knowledge. the problem is, we dont know who is putting it there or when. just simply that its there.
I mean this shouldnt even be a question. If you go to a body shop and have you wrecked fender fixed with a new one are they then allowed to change your radio and relign your seats?
if you have movers come in and put in a new stove, are they allowed to change your countertops? pet your dog? take your child to the park?
NO, if it is yours, and they dont have permission, it is your constitutional right to protect it!
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