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1. 

   Griffon, 6 Jan 2006 @ 5:18pm

   
   

   dos is dos

   He basically tried to implement a DOS attack, saying the school needed to be setup up better doesn't really make what he did ok. Yeah it seems a little over the top reaction wise, but still, trying to implement a DOS attack even though mundane means isn't something that should be ignored (though the relative level of sucess should be considered :) ).

   [ link to this | view in thread ]

2. 

   outsider27, 6 Jan 2006 @ 6:34pm

   
   

   Re: dos is dos

   do we honestly believe that he had criminal intent with that comment? in addition to that, is it really a felony to tell people to do something?
   
   Maybe they should just charge all the people that did it with the same as co-conspirators

   [ link to this | view in thread ]

3. 

   Karel, 6 Jan 2006 @ 6:42pm

   
   

   No, a real felony would be if you...

   ... posted the story on all the major news services and encouraged everyone in the world to all hit F5 repeatedly at the same time.

   [ link to this | view in thread ]

4. 

   Anon, 6 Jan 2006 @ 6:45pm

   
   

   Re: dos is dos

   So, if I say, "Hit reload on this page you are reading right now on this story!" then I'm setting up a DOS attack on techdirt? Thinking about this, I don't care how many times a single person hits reload, you have to have many people doing it to even get a bump on a very horrible site.
   
   Of course, in this case, I think anyone actually and seriously trying to crash the server might get... 3 days suspension, tops. Maybe a charge for Criminal Mischief at most.
   
   BTW, this is also a reformat of an old joke. The old joke can be written on a dollar bill or on a piece of paper:
   
   "How do you keep (insert target group, like blonds here) busy for hours? Look on other side for answer."
   
   You write the same thing on the other side, and then hand the piece of paper to a blond (preferably a friend who knows you are joking). ;) Didn't read the actual page, but I could see F5 used in a similar joke.

   [ link to this | view in thread ]

5. 

   Anonymous, 6 Jan 2006 @ 6:59pm

   
   

   Wouldn't it just come out of browser cache?

   I thought the default behaviour of F5 (at least in Internet Exploder) was just to reload the page... and that to force it to go back to the source server, you had to hold ctrl-F5? Wouldn't the page be simply reloading from browser cache?

   [ link to this | view in thread ]

6. 

   Anon, 6 Jan 2006 @ 7:21pm

   
   

   Re: Wouldn't it just come out of browser cache?

   Exactly. And, many ISPs use GET cache's that would even prevent a DOS of this type, unless the user was rePOSTing information each time. And, even further, if the server being accessed had a proper setup, it would have a fast cache to serve up static and non-changed dynamic pages without using much CPU time.
   
   The F5 DOS was only really a serious action 7 years ago or before. Today, most admins are smart enough to see their bandwidth rising because of a few people, and banning their subnet. This is exactly how an automated DDOS is stopped (though usually by firewall or automated server scripts, not directly be the admin themselves).
   
   What's really funny about this story is the incompetence of this school's admin. Think about this. He had to actually report this as a crime, and investigate 3 or 4 students reloading a page. I know us admins are thought of as geeks (proudly, I might add, haha) who do nothing but spend our lives in front of computers. But this guy really does have no life, and he is seriously lacking in skill. My guess? The server admin is the principle of the school, who does this in his spare time. This was not a real admin, and definately not a real geek.

   [ link to this | view in thread ]

7. 

   Gabe, 6 Jan 2006 @ 7:26pm

   
   

   Lake High

   If anyone wants to check out the site for themselves, for any reason at all, here is the link:
   
   lake.stark.k12.oh.us/hs
   
   although for some reason, it won't load...i wonder why?

   [ link to this | view in thread ]

8. 

   Rich, 6 Jan 2006 @ 8:06pm

   
   

   why?

   why do small tasks always raise big issues?

   [ link to this | view in thread ]

9. 

   Scott, 6 Jan 2006 @ 8:29pm

   
   

   Re: Lake High

   That's an incorrect link, that's why it doesn't load. Try this: http://www.lakelocal.k12.oh.us/lhshome.htm

   [ link to this | view in thread ]

10. 

    Anonymous Coward, 6 Jan 2006 @ 8:35pm

    
    

    Re: Lake High

    No, there is a video of the newcast. You can see http://lake.stark.k12.o typed into the screen before it zooms out.
    
    The Lake High School you linked to is in a completely different part of Ohio than the one in the story.

    [ link to this | view in thread ]

11. 

    Anonymous Coward, 6 Jan 2006 @ 8:55pm

    
    

    Re: Lake High

    wrong lake High School... that link is to one near Toledo.

    [ link to this | view in thread ]

12. 

    What is in a name?, 7 Jan 2006 @ 2:26am

    
    

    Why is this a problem?

    I tell clients that they ought not keep important data, and confidential data on the same server as your web server, while it can be done, and you can make things pretty secure, there is always that traffic issue.
    
    Is this server JUST a web server? Or does it run other critial applicaitons that contribute to the day-to-day operations of the school? If it is just a web server, then no harm done.
    
    If it is more important than that, then it is more the admins fault.
    
    Finally: the schools ought to be thankful that a weakness in their system had been found out. And if they would have kept their mouths shut, they could have avoided the streisand effect, and fixed the problem. But alas, they had to exercise their foolish zero tollerance attitude and make a big 'ol stinky fart out of this mess, and now THEY are in much deeper, uh, doodoo.
    
    I hate it when stinky 'ol farts leave a mess. But that is what you get when you don't take care of the poo in good time.

    [ link to this | view in thread ]

13. 

    Samuel Walter, 7 Jan 2006 @ 3:34am

    
    

    Re: dos is dos

    Your assertion that the student's actions constitute an attempted Denial of Service (DoS) attack is ridiculous. The student simply posted a comment on a public blog, not operated by the school, requesting that others go to the site and refresh the content. Regardless of his intentions, all he did was tell people to visit the site. He didn't setup flood bot, he didn't coordinate a distributed attack, and he didn't take advantage of or even mention possible weaknesses to exploit. Again, all he did was ask people to visit the site and refresh the content. At the most, the boy's actions equate to harassment and could have been remedied by simply talking to him.
    

    
    Charging this boy with a FELONY is reckless, and irresponsible, and illustrates incredible ignorance by the school, the police, and the prosecutor. Furthermore, the actions taken and comments made by the prosecutor demonstrate his own brazen arrogance, poor judgement, and malice. If convicted of the charge this boy, who is just beginning his life, will carry the burden of being a "convicted felon" until he dies or is absolved by a higher court. Here's a sample of the collateral consequences his conviction would bring:
    

14. Ineligible for student loans and other financial aid.
    
15. Ineligible for most jobs requiring licensing by state or federal government (i.e. teacher, doctor, architect, lawyer, electrician, real estate broker, stock broker).
    
16. Ineligible for governmental employment.
    
17. Prohibited for possessing firearms.
    
18. Must disclose "convicted felon" status on employment applications.
    
19. Loses the right to become an elector and cannot vote, hold public office, or run for public office.
    
20. Potential disqualification from applying for public housing and other social services.
    
21. Potential disqualification from applying to be a foster parent.
    
22. Potential disqualification from adoption applications.
    

    
    Even if this boy is exonerated and the charges are dropped or dismissed, he will have been put through a process reserved for those accused of the highest order of crime defined by law. The prosecutor's rash decision to file felony charges without first consulting with a technology expert is reprehensible. Regardless of the outcome, it is clear he lacks the sound judgement and integrity that is necessary to competently represent the People of his municipality. He should resign from or be removed from his post, and be replaced by someone who will represent the People with the integrity and consideration they deserve.
    

    
    Respectfully,

    Samuel Walter
    Network Engineer / Security Analyst