Kodak's New Battle Plan: Cheap Printer Ink

from the ah,-finally! dept

Tue, Feb 6th 2007 3:34am — Mike Masnick

For many years we've had stories about the ridiculously high price of inkjet printer ink. It is, according to some, one of the most expensive liquids around, costing more than vintage champagne. Someone once worked out that if you filled an Olympic-sized swimming pool with printer ink bought at retail, it would cost you $5.9 billion dollars (yes, with a b). Obviously, that's not the cost of manufacturing the ink, but includes hefty margins for the printer makers, who give away their printers cheap and make it up on the ink margins. The printer makers then go to extraordinary lengths, including using all sorts of intellectual property law to stop anyone else from selling ink for their printers. Some printer companies have also been accused of making ink cartridges expire while they still have plenty of ink. In fact, just a few months ago in a report about how Epson was blocking others from selling compatible ink, we wondered why no printer company saw this as an opportunity to come in and undercut these raw deals, and advertise heavily on the fact that they wouldn't rip you off on ink. Apparently, it was just a matter of time.

Kodak is supposedly announcing new photo printers today, with the explicit focus on the fact that their ink is a hell of a lot cheaper than anyone else's. In fact, they're also promoting that the ink cartridges hold a lot more ink, so you won't have to refill as often either. In other words, they're doing what any competitor in the space should do: beating the competition by offering what customers want, rather than trying to squeeze extra money out of them at the expense of reputation. The reports suggest that Kodak will still make plenty of margin on the ink sales, but that it might finally force some of the other printer companies to lower their prices a bit. Sometimes it takes a while, but it looks like the market is finally doing what it's supposed to.

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132 Comments

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Erica, 6 Feb 2007 @ 4:08am

Finally!
It is about time a mfg did this! Wow, I might even have to dump the HP and Epsons here and get a kodak printer.

Now if the other companies would just get the clupon...
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nunya_bidness, 6 Feb 2007 @ 4:23am

Im in
There was a time when Kodak was the only way to go to produce a finished print. From film to processing chemicals to mounting supplies, etc. If this becomes a serious endeavor for Kodak, I'm sure millions of photographers will come back to old faithful.
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Ross M Karchner, 6 Feb 2007 @ 4:39am

Next question
Who's gonna make the same move for consumer (non-photo) inkjet's?
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Laudanum Milkshake, 6 Feb 2007 @ 5:05am

This is a perfect example of governments holding back markets; the use of copyrights and patents to attack anyone who threatens their monopoly. Tech companies realized years ago that just like their more conventional brethren, once you have a market share, it's easier to use the government to control it with legislation than it is to maintain it the ethical way.
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Christopher Allen, 6 Feb 2007 @ 5:41am

INK
I might forsake my HP all in one and photo printers for this. I have discovered that you can buy a new printer for what it costs to buy the replacement ink.
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Anonymous Bum, 6 Feb 2007 @ 5:41am

Cost of Ownership
Last year a cliet needed a photo quality printer for a medical practice. They wanted a Cannon yeloow ribbon printer because of the marketing they had read. I talked them into an HP 8400 because of cheaper ink. (still expensive though).

They paid more for the printer, but the ease of operation of reloading cartridges and the better price on consumables have made up for the difference.

BTW: Click on the adsense links for Mike
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NateDog, 6 Feb 2007 @ 5:47am

The margin is in the cables ...
Sure, cheap ink, cheap printers are all well and good ... just don't buy their $25 USB cable.
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Bob, 6 Feb 2007 @ 5:49am

Now if Kodak would actually make a good printer instead of dumbed down printers with little to no advanced capabilities and that print in a size other than 4X6. They obviously only market to dumb people that want to just sit their camera on a dock and push print. Also with cheaper ink they will probably charge more for the printer than everyone else.
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ScaredOfTheMan, 6 Feb 2007 @ 5:49am

Supposedly Kodak is trying to change the way they do business and reinvent themselves...this could be one of those initiatives.

If you go to YouTube and search for 'Kodak - Winds of Change' you will see a funny internally produced video that talks about their new way.

Good luck to them
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Sanguine Dream, 6 Feb 2007 @ 5:52am

Good idea...
It's good to see someone actually trying to serve the customer intead of just trying to milk them for all the money they're worth. Hopefully this will teach those other printer ink jerks a lesson.
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haywood, 6 Feb 2007 @ 6:00am

It is quite the merry go round
I think I've tried all the printer brands except Lexmark. I've stayed with Canon, buying genuine ink from EBay as long as it could be had for less than $9 a cartridge. I started on Canon when they offered the replaceable print head thinking; that's usually what goes first, how clever. Who would have though that that print head would be nearly impossible to find, and when you did, it would cost 3/4 the price of a new printer. Bring it on Kodak, my brand loyalty is up for grabs.
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Anonymous Coward, 6 Feb 2007 @ 6:10am

I work for a local kodak shop in town, and I'd like to point something out. For the EasyShare printers, you have to buy the cartridges and paper together...does this mean they will say the ink's cheaper and increase the price of the paper? Or will they finally start selling the damn things separately so I can be relieved of customers yelling at me as if it's personally my fault?

/endrant
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Ryan, 6 Feb 2007 @ 6:12am

Just Buy a New One
I just bought a new printer instead of buying ink..

It was cheaper.

Yeah, I threw away a perfectly good printer, but hey... I'll be throwing away another perfectly good printer in a couple months when it runs out of ink too. Saves me about $20 that way.

How long until our landfills are nothing but piles of working printers?
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lar3ry, 6 Feb 2007 @ 6:35am

Three printers will be available in March
You can see them on Kodak's web site.
According to the site, prices will be $149, $199, and $299 (not bargain basement prices, but remember that they are not offsetting the price with outrageous prices for ink). Ink cartridges are $9.99 (black) and $14.99 (5-color). The low end machine doesn't have memory card slots or LCD preview display. All models offer Bluetooth as an optional accessory.

All three printers are all-in-ones, offering copying and scanning as well as printing. The $299 model also offers Fax. Availability, as reported on the site, is March, 2007 from the web site or Best Buy.

What isn't mentioned is if they are Windows-only or will also work with Macs.
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Si, 6 Feb 2007 @ 6:39am

Epson ink might be great, but the printers die if
Added to all of this is the fact that many printers (specifically Epson) have system where if the printer is unused for more than a couple of weeks, the jets dry up and can no longer be cleaned. When Epson support is contacted, they readily admit that it "might" be cheaper to buy a new printer rather than repair the old one. If their inks are so good, there should be a way to ensure that the jets remain lubricated in some way. This isn't rocket science, is it?
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user, 6 Feb 2007 @ 6:51am

oh brother...
so my parents have a "nice" brother all in 1 printer, with a multi card reader and flatbed scanner.

my mom useses it to make copies and color printouts of her spreadsheats, used in her business. one day she came yelling at me to "fix" her printer. it wouldn't print.

after some digging, i found that the yellow ink was low (it's a 4 cartdridge printer) so i figured, hey, ok. just hit clear and we're good to go.

not so fast. still didn't work.

in my infinite wisdom, i called brother. what i was told AMZAED me. they said if one cardride was out of ink, the printer was disabled. i.e if you had no yellow ink, you couldn't print in b/w. WTF i asked why this was, they said it is a design feature. FEATURE. that's not a feature. now, to get the printer to work, i need to buy a yellow cardride. oops. they only sell 3 pack for like 50 bucks. i did find a yellow cardridge for 47 bucks. go figure.

about a week later, her black ink runs out....same process. i install a new black cardrigde, thing lasts for 2 days, max. she can get at least 2-3 months out of it. called brother again, compalined. this time they sent us a new 4 pack ink. how nice.

i'm just waiitng for the printer to go, it's the biggest piece of junk ever. don't buy brother.
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Anonymous Coward, 6 Feb 2007 @ 6:52am

Cheaper ink, that's great. The real shocker would be to actually include a USB cable in the box with the new printer. Honestly, what self-respecting peripheral (other than printers) isn't sold along with the means to hook up said peripheral to your computer?

This baloney has gone on long enough. Wake up printer people. I'm sure USB cables only cost you like one or two dollars. You can afford it. I for one would much rather pay an extra $5 for the convenience of a cable in the box than $25-30 for an aftermarket cable.
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Dam, 6 Feb 2007 @ 6:58am

Re: Next question
I'd get a small lase printer if I were you. A Brother can be had for under $75 and the cartridge costs about $40 to replace. You'll get about 3000-4000 pages from it so it's not a bad deal. Better than inkjet.
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Happy Guy, 6 Feb 2007 @ 7:23am

OKI is OK!
I got tired of the outrageous inkjet prices so I started looking for laser. I found an OKI data color laser (c3200n I believe) on sale for about $250.00.
It was even network ready! Goodbye print server that used to serve me for the 2 printers I needed. One B/W inkjet and one photo quality inkjet. Why two? The B/W one was cheaper for general use. The cartriges were only $12 each and lasted about a month under general use. As stated above, when the color one ran out of a color that was it. UGH!
I am very happy with OKI so far. If Kodak makes a touch more expensive printer but makes the consumables cheaper then I may be looking at going to Kodak if my OKI ever goes down hard.
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Overcast, 6 Feb 2007 @ 7:32am

hmm, interesting

I might buy one if it was reasonable...

We bought a 25$ Ink Jet Printer - took one look at the price of Ink for it - and went to Staples and bought a Laser Jet the day it ran out of ink.

lol
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misanthropic humanist, 6 Feb 2007 @ 7:45am

use a print shop
It doesn't work for everyone, but if you live in a city and you can find a print shop nearby it will save you a fortune.

When I need paper copies I just pop them on my server, walk down to the local print shop and give them the URL and how many copies I want.

I've saved hundreds, maybe thousands this way over the last few years.
Plus you get very high quality copies from a pro printer, and a bit of exercise too.
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Anonymous Coward, 6 Feb 2007 @ 7:58am

printers
my rx640 came with a usb cable... didn't stop the shop trying to sell me another one, dispite the label on the box saying 'usb cable included'.

not that it mattered, since I already have several.

biggest mistake i ever made was binning my lc-200c, only way to get printing cheaper than that 9 pin was a potato and some paint (and maybe even then the printer wins)

excellent for basic text. photo quality too (if your partial sighted or blind) and quiet (if your deaf).

the rx640 hasn't needed new carts as yet, when it does a refil kit will be obtained.

I've found buying a new cart with the refil kit.. refil it till the kit runs out then repeat works ok, the quality with refil inks is worse, but for general printing its 'good enough'
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Joe Brell, 6 Feb 2007 @ 8:08am

Competition!
This just shows what happens in a competitive industry! I remember reading an article a few months back about how a gallon of printer ink would cost a customer $1,000 if purchased at retail rates.

In a monopoly there is no incentive for things to change.
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Craig, 6 Feb 2007 @ 8:08am

Count me in.
If the printer is wi-fi enabled, I'm taking my HP and throwing it out the backdoor. Count me in on this!
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poor college kid, 6 Feb 2007 @ 8:13am

if you live near a relatively large institution, check if they have a "salvage and surplus" store. my university, PSU, did. i bought two (2) 15 inch samsung LCD monitors for 100 bucks, (DVI/VGA cables included) the only problem was that the base/screen bracket was broken and the monitor drooped. so i put a few old cd cases under it, and it's fine. a few friends bought some, and either replaced/fixed the brackets andsome made a nice wall mount for it.

i got an old HP laser MP5 (or whatever) for 10 bucks. (had ink already) had to buy a 'printer' cable for another 10 bucks. best investment i've ever made.

but i know there were laptops, ram, desktops, printers, projectors, server, NAS, switches, etc. available for purchase.
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Jake, 6 Feb 2007 @ 8:18am

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sz6XjXu-oT8&eurl
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Anonymous Coward, 6 Feb 2007 @ 8:20am

Out of ink in my HP, been meaning to buy new cartridges. Now depending on the cost of new cartridges, and a new Kodak Printer, I may fork out the extra on the new printer!!!!!!!
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Earl, 6 Feb 2007 @ 8:34am

Re:
Anonymous Coward. Printers by far arent the only thing that doesnt give you all the cables necessary to use the item. Ive bought an oven, dryer, and Musical keyboard over the last year and NONE of them even came with a power cord so you HAVE to buy a power cord to use them. Most people already have a USB cable laying around which is why they dont include one. Why charge everyone for the cable when only a fraction of people buying a printer need a USB cable
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Erv Server, 6 Feb 2007 @ 8:39am

I want to see the prices first before I become excited.
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Worbod, 6 Feb 2007 @ 10:21am

Re: Government's Fault???
I can't beleive that Laudanum Milkshake could use this to make an anti goverment statement. Businesses have been abusing the patent laws not the government. They spend millions on lawyers and they spend millions to lobby the republic congress to make patents last for hundreds of years. Government isn't the problem, business is the problem
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David, 6 Feb 2007 @ 10:33am

INK
Have there benn any longevity or fading tests? Tests with third party papers?

Has Wilhelm Research done tests?

There is plent of cheap third party inks already out there, some good some bad.

Tell me more Kodak.....

d
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Rick, 6 Feb 2007 @ 10:55am

You do realize that Kodak's 'photo' printers have another expensive advantage. You MUST use their paper as well as their ink. So cutting the cost of the ink doesn't really mean it is cheaper than the other guys. It just makes you think it is.

Their photo printer paper is already the most expensive printer paper available.
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dasmb, 6 Feb 2007 @ 12:55pm

Kodak Paper
I think the jury's still out on the "special Kodak paper." All manufacturers tell you to use their papers, because that's what their drivers are profiled for. Without a good profile indicating how a color should be rendered on a given printer/ink/paper combination, print out can look pretty crummy, and no manufacturer is going to suggest an activity that could produce inferior results.

Furthermore, pigment inks won't even bind properly to many photo papers designed for dyebase inks, resulting in really washed out blacks (I found this out the hard way).

That's probably what all this is about; I would be very surprised if I couldn't load a quality pigment compatible paper like the Ilford Smooth Pearl and acheive good results.
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grepe, 6 Feb 2007 @ 1:25pm

Re: Just Buy a New One
You do realize that the cartridges in new printers are not completely filled up, don't you?

These printer boys can get their economics right...

Cheers,
Peter.
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Anonymous Coward, 6 Feb 2007 @ 2:22pm

Re: Kodak Paper
It's not that they tell you to use their photo paper - you have no choice. A 4x6 piece of photo paper for a Kodak printer must be 4x7" in size - with 2 1/2" inch pieces on the edge you fold and tear off.

Buying 'any' other paper will not help - it won't fit and/or print in the printer - period.
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Chronno S. Trigger, 6 Feb 2007 @ 2:34pm

Re: Count me in.
None of them are WiFi. all are bluetooth.

Black Ink: $10
Color Ink: $15

None come with USB cables
Max paper size 8.5x14"
and yes it comes with the power cord
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Tyshaun, 6 Feb 2007 @ 3:17pm

People still use printers?
Wow, I haven't actually used a printer, aside from work, in at least 2 years. I didn't realize people still used those things.
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Anonymous Coward, 6 Feb 2007 @ 3:38pm

Re: Re: Government's Fault???
Government isn't the problem, business is the problem
Corporate owned government is the problem.
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Anonymous Coward, 6 Feb 2007 @ 3:59pm

Re: People still use printers?
Wow, I haven't actually used a printer, aside from work, in at least 2 years. I didn't realize people still used those things.
Yeah, and they still read those "book" things too.
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Stu, 6 Feb 2007 @ 5:15pm

Low price USB cables
I buy USB cables and other stuff from monoprice.com.

USB2.0 cables under $2 each, no shipping and handling ripoffs, and never had a problem.

Good outfit.
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FredEx, 7 Feb 2007 @ 1:10am

These printers...
I wish Kodak well on this. They for many years were the ones I went with when I was doing photography before the digital age. They always offered a good product and exactly what I was looking for. You could count on a quality final result.

As far as people wondering this and that about the printers...follow a freakin' link or two and get the answers to what you are wondering about!

Also, these are not just photo printers, if some of you followed some links you'd know that and that you don't have to use their papers like the photo only printers.

GEEEZ!!
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Ben Quady, 7 Feb 2007 @ 2:08am

You can do better!
We have a Canon MP760, which is quite a good printer. Canon-branded cartridges cost ~$12 each. Staples-brand replacement cartridges for this printer cost ~$12. But I can get these cartridges for $4 online from any of many ink sellers. I used 4inkjets.com, for example, and the ink works perfectly. Orders arrive in like two or three days, the shipping is cheap, and I'm stoked. I mention the online retailer I used just to get you started, but really, there are tons of equivalent operations.

This brings to mind a general truth these days: there are very few kinds of items which can't be bought cheaper online. Prescription eyeglasses, ink, silverware, non-perishable foods, etc. Before you pull that hundred-dollar bill out of your wallet for ANYTHING, think about whether you could maybe, with a few searches, save twenty or forty percent on that purchase by buying online.
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dasmb, 7 Feb 2007 @ 7:51am

Replacement cartridges
One of the reasons third party replacement cartridges are a lot cheaper is that they're made with much lower standards. The ink doesn't bond the same as manufacturer's ink, it isn't reactive to the nozzle magnets in the same way which can cause clogs and it's not the same color, not even between different cartridges from the same company! I run a color test every time I change a cartridge and am often shocked how different a given "color" can look.

This is bad, because your printer knows pretty exactly what colors it's "supposed" to spray with the company's inks. Change the color or the properties of the inks, and you start printing differently because the printer's doing the wrong thing for that type of ink. Cheap inks tend toward bronzing and some don't combine very well -- I lost a lot of good prints to a cheap black cartridge that created "bubbles" on any dark texture.

There are some good third party inks -- I've had good success with MIS (www.inksupply.com) -- but on the whole, the cheapest inks are unreliable and isn't worth the savings to me.
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PER, 7 Feb 2007 @ 1:00pm

Inexpensive inkjet printing
Have a look at inkbags.com

That is way to print for about 1/3 of the price with some of HP's printers .
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Marius, 16 Feb 2007 @ 12:42pm

Buying or replacing
I have for a while now dumped perfectly working printers for a new one that includes the ink. The trend is now that you can buy a printer dirt cheap, but have to buy the ink seperately or the ink provided only have a limited capacity, running empty much quicker that the standard cartridges do. This is a great hoax throughout the industry and sanity will prevail.

Koda has started to break the barrier, but we are not there for a long shot.
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Reality, 19 Feb 2007 @ 3:37pm

Re: Laudanum Milkshake - gov'ts fault- yea right!!
Laudanum Milkshake obviously does not have a job in corp America. Must be a student artist or a union employee...

Don't get me wrong, I am really looking forward to the "cheap ink."

The market driven economy that demands the ink creates a market for printer companies to chase, with the attractivness of big margins on ink, the printer companies a) get rich (welcome to america) and b) invest in new and exciting products.

Our ink will be less expensive now, that is great for the consumer. I myself am looking forward to this. the mfr's will still be looking for the same margins on their product. the result is one of the follwoing two (or both):
- The price of printers will go up.
- The innovation of new printers with new features will not happen at the same pace.

very similar to the drug companies, the only real profit they make is in the US, the rest of the world is free to buy generics and their are caps on the costs for drugs. The money is all made in the patent protected US where the money for research and phat paychecks for execs comes from. It is Very fair. If you don't like it, make your own printer.

Milkshake, pass the pipe and enjoy life in your bubble...
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Michael Bell, 21 Feb 2007 @ 1:21pm

Cheap ink is for real
Kodak really is going to do it.
http://www.inkisit.com
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SusieQ, 22 Feb 2007 @ 10:42am

Re: Next question
In all actuality - the printer they sell that only prints, would be a two banger - one for the photo print person and one for the no photo print person. Either way - the black and color inks are absolutely cheaper and larger quantity in the tank itself. If you don't use color ink - then you will only have to fill the color cartridge area once and just replaace the black tank when you run out for $9.99 !! Gotta LOVE this idea !!!
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SusieQ, 22 Feb 2007 @ 10:46am

Mis understood
OK - all the printers are all in ones - I ASSUMED the lesser cost one only did printing and not all the other stuff - sorry, BUT still ......... if you don';t want to print photos - then you still will only use the black ink -
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Uncle B, 23 Feb 2007 @ 8:01pm

Printer Problems
Proud owner of 3 Lexmarks, 1 Canon, 1 Star 1000-9pin, 1Epson.
The fascination of seeing my own words and pictures in print has been overcome by my love for the environment. I now store all on CD's or DVD's and store them in folded, stick-glued one side printed folded paper from my old printers. I try to send mail by email, and have been known to send fully authored CD's with print and photos that will play on computers, video CD players and various DVD players.
I don't need or want to go backwards to the 20th century age of printers, by Kodak or anyone else. I can carry more info on a single memory stick than is found in a whole printed dictionary. Welcome to the 21st century, an electronic age.
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Rudi Jock, 4 Mar 2007 @ 9:33am

Continuous ink Systems or refillable cartridges
HP and Lexmark should be ashamed for putting printer heads right on the cartridges which end up being thrown away when empty (or partially). I use continuous ink systems and empty refillable cartridges on my Epson printers, which not only save me thousands of dollars to date, but give me the freedom to be expressive, and give my work away. No more cartridges.

Here is one hooked up to my R200 printer:

http://www.geocities.com/rudedude121/Continuous_ink_system.html

Folks- it is worth tossing your current printer in favour of one that works with a CIS. 10 ink cartridges worth of ink for less then the price of one.
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Anonymous Coward, 24 Mar 2007 @ 2:10pm

No, it is tougher than rocket science
Ink technology is tougher than rocket science. Rocket just goes up on one mission and burn for just a few minutes. Inkjets - have to work with a variety of papers, image types, dry immediately on paper, never dry up in nozzles, have vibrant colors, images last for years, ink has to stay good in storage, oh and can I print cheaper than film based systems for image capture and printing. Oh, and by the way, I want to print nice looking text, too.
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JOHN Higgins, 30 Mar 2007 @ 3:32am

Kodak new Printers
I saw a demo at Best Buy. A great printer, the color was amazing for photos and the ink prices were an honest 50% off of HP prices.. more than 50% actually.
Bad news.. Best buy was sold out here in MI.
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Raist3d, 13 Apr 2007 @ 3:56pm

NOT TRUE at all
You can use pretty much whatever reasonable inkjet paper you can find. It is WAY cheaper than CAnon. I have both.
And Canon was until they jacked up the price for Chroma Life's, the lower cost (still more expensive than Kodak by quite a margin)

- Raist
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raist3d, 13 Apr 2007 @ 3:59pm

This is false.. not all printer manufacturers do t
Canon gives you full tanks, and from what I see, so does Kodak.

HP from what I understand does so for the most part but varies by model. Not sure on Epson.

Lexmark is the one you are thinking of.

- Raist
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Greg, 28 Apr 2007 @ 4:58am

The Real Truth
I am a remanufacturer and a reseller of ink products.
The only way to measure the cost of what ink cartridge you have is to:
Know how muck liquid mLs are in your cartridge and dividie it by the total price your paying for the cartridge.
Most hp and lexmarks are about a dollor per mi. or more
Epson is about .92 cents per ml.

Compatible cartridges that work in canon, epson, brothers machines can be as low as .30 per ml.

You can meaure the liquid not how many pages a cartridge gets.
Want to know more about your cartridges and printers?
Let me know
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Anon, 4 May 2007 @ 4:32am

HP, Lexmark, Epson. Brother etc etc all make between 2 and 10% Operating profit. For every $10 you spend on their products, they make 8c out of you.

They have traditionally followed a simple model - they make a loss on the hardware and a profit on the ink. If Kodak wants to split this the other way, and is succesful, then all the manufacturers will follow - and you'll just have to start paying a lot more for your printers, but pay less for your ink.

I think it's also worth noting that if a ink cart costs $10, the Govt takes $2.50, the manufacturer €3.50 and the retailer the reamining €4.00. Tell me again who's ripping you off???
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KodakFan, 6 May 2007 @ 2:04pm

Re: Three printers will be available in March
They are mac/ windows and Vista ready
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Kodak fan, 6 May 2007 @ 2:08pm

Re:
All the new Kodak all in ones; come with USB in the box/
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might know something, 16 May 2007 @ 5:36pm

Printers and stuff
no cable in the box is a holdover from when they (end users) might have used parallel and/or a Macintosh adaptor (complicated) to use the printer; as well as a way to get back margin for the retailer (GM is way down on the initial purchase). Puttin in USB finally makes sense in late 2006.
It is "catch up" time here.

A consumer printer with print costs even as low as Kodak's (new ones) should give a long lasting print, but professional level longevity tests by WR should be fundamental: Epson.

Inkjet printer pro/comsumer sales (V high volume for me 1999-2005, in a major center) have always been a quasi hard sell.

But being your own darkrom: PRICELESS.

Your friend, AAT.
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Bosco, 20 May 2007 @ 3:16pm

Re: Just Buy a New One
I hear ya man. Flippin' ridiculous!
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MargaretKrainer, 31 May 2007 @ 8:11pm

Re: Re: Just Buy a New One
Interesting comment - but how do you know how much liquid is in a cartridge?

I had a cartridge refilled at "Cartridge World" locally - and it ran out of red ink first. I always run out of blue ink first, I have certain things for which I use a great deal of blue ink (graphics for a logo on what I print most frequently).

The capacity of a cartridge is one thing - how much ink is in there is quite another!!
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Don, 11 Jul 2007 @ 7:53pm

Re: Epson ink might be great, but the printers die
I have an Epson Photo 820 and I leave it for a week at a time and it don't dry up using Epson ink but no refills work. I have to clean heads up to 5 times on refilled cartridges just to get them to print when new. The Epson ink is water base and hot water will unplug the jets if they get pluged. I clean my printer when it needs it with hot water and Q-tips that keep it working. My gripe is the high cost of Epson Ink. Color is up to $22.95 plus tax and Black is $24.95. This T26 & T27 cartridge is not stocked in all stores now. I may need to switch to Kodak printer now!
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Rudi, 3 Oct 2007 @ 3:59pm

Continuous ink systems
Buy a printer that has readily available CIS or refillable cartridges available.

don't waste your money on a printer that uses disposable cartridges. Not good for the environment. (or pocket book)
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robert, 29 Nov 2007 @ 1:51am

Re: Ease of Use = dumb- who's the idiot?- hint - y
Do you research and understand dye-sublimation prints.
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M Graham, 20 Jan 2008 @ 1:10am

Kodak easy use printer with 4x6 photos for under 1
I dont understand why kodak A well known name in american photos since the early days 3 or 4 years ago just quit with there peinters and I dident understand why they where the best with the nest pictures in the biz but it is nice to see them return with a much needed printer that can make doing it yourself make sence again by puting reality back meaning you save money with great do it yourself Ideas instead of costing you more to do it yourself.
Hope I can find a rebate or discount to pick a 5300 or 5500. And scrap my all in one HP. That runs about $56.00 for 90 4x6 photos cheaper for me to pay walmart 13 cent ea
Glad you are back in the printing arena kodak.
I know it will pay for itself in ink Savings. I dont have to pull my hair out every time the Kids get Creative.
What made the USA Great
Thanks!
If anyone knows of discounts for a Kodak 5300 or 5500 please e-mail gtmike4@excite.com
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Bill Wolter, 21 Jan 2008 @ 7:02pm

Kodak 5300 All in One Printer
I have had this printer since December and it still does not print. I have spent over 6 hours on the phone with the tech department at Kodak. After replaceing cartridges and print heads I am awaiting my brand new, rebuilt, used printer replacement from Kodak. I tried to return the printer to Office Depot but was told that they have a fourteen day return policy. Well I learned something about two different companies from the purchase of one printer and will be wiser about what brand to buy and who to buy from in the future.
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terrybarker, 16 Feb 2008 @ 11:00pm

supplies
i am a photographer with 50 years and i can tell u thatKodak delivers i never worked for K but they were there to help me and millions of pros including hollywood sxuceed with flying colors now Kodak is still american and the future is big for anyone offering savings printer co,s are ripping off the consumer GO KODAK PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Tmo, 9 Mar 2008 @ 9:07pm

Kodak the BEST VALUE for HOME PRINTER
I was so fed up and frustrated trying ink refills, cartridge tampering, etc...I nearly went for a Epson continuous ink system, but I happen to stumble upon the Kodak 5100 series....on sale at Wal-Mart for $80. Thought I would buy it and give it a try seeing I was there about to spend $100 @$@#% dollars on another set of HP ink cartridges anyways. All I can say is since I have been using the Kodak 5100 as of Dec 07 I have been very happy and just awe struck. I have so far spent a total of $26 for both ink cartridges !!!! The printer works great for my needs. The bonus is it the scanner works fine as well. The idea for a continuous feed Epson is not worth it, and as for the still working HP and the Lexmark printers that I have sitting here you can bet they will never ever see another set of ink cartridges. Both printers are headed to the landfill !! I will not even give them away because I would pity the fool having to buy ink for them. Of course I will fun smashing them on some nice hard concrete first, I've got to get some satisfaction for that money I spent on them! Good riddance!

Goodbye to Canon, Epson, Lexmark, Dell,HP and your price gouging collusion...

Goodbye BW only, I have been using COLOR on my COLOR printer!

HELLO KODAK!!!
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VP, 17 Mar 2008 @ 11:05am

Ink price is good but printer features not so hot
Yes, its nice the ink is cheap - but the Kodak Printer *Kodak EasyShare 5300) has turned out to be extremely limited in its capabilities, with a dumbed down interface. Its also a shame that it does not seem possible to recycle these cartridges, as you can with other brands.
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chacha, 1 May 2008 @ 12:13pm

Re: Epson ink might be great, but the printers die if
I have never had this problem with epson printers in my over ten years of using desktop and wideformat professional epsons. The problem I am currently having with the new epson desktops is that if you turn if off, turning it on creates a head cleaning session. And, if your ink starts getting low, it cleans the heads everytime you use the printer, whether or not you left it on, causing the ink cartridges to empty during the cleaning process. I'm heading for kodak's desktops if I find what I need there. ChaCha
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chacha, 1 May 2008 @ 12:14pm

Re: INK
Yes Wilhelm has tested the new kodak inks, which are pigment based, and they last longer than any of the other brands. ChaCHa
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Ed Printer, 14 May 2008 @ 1:25pm

Cheap Printer Ink has Potential
We're in the midst of testing and creating a review for this printer ink. So far, the ink has proven to be very high quality. Calling it cheap printer ink doesn't make sense, as this appears to be a fairly good printer ink product from Kodak. Once we've completed our testing, we'll post a review of our cheap printer ink here.
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Mary, 18 May 2008 @ 9:53am

Continuous Ink System
Look into the continuous ink systems...they make them for every printer...The cost of the system and ink is equal to 1 set of cartridges but it yields equal to 61 cartridges of each color. They have high quality ink and the prints are great.
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Robert Thomas, 19 May 2008 @ 2:01pm

printer ink
What they don't tell you is if you don't print much every time you start up the printer it cleans the heads which uses alot of ink i have printed about 20 papers since ive owned the 5100 and its allready used a color cartridge dont know how this could save any money for someone who doesnt print much I am not happy at all with this feature
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Tina, 21 May 2008 @ 5:36pm

Re: Re: Next question
Can you tell me the model # or name of the Brother laser printer you are referring to? Soon we'll all be deciding whether to buy a cartridge of ink or fill our tank with gas. Thanking you in advance, Tina
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Nelma Scoggins, 20 Jun 2008 @ 3:17pm

Re: Re: Re: Next question
I, too would like the name of this printer and where it is sold.
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Vicki, 25 Jun 2008 @ 3:01pm

Kodak printer and cheaper ink
I own the Kodak 5300 printer and for the money I spent on the printer $88. at a club store, I am happy! happy! The ink is cheaper, the printer is easy to use. The only catch is you must use Kodak photo paper to get quality photo printing. The printer can read the type of photo paper you put in and selects the settings for you. I am very happy with the quality of prints I get. I use regular copy paper for documents and the children's homework, works great! I hope this helps someone.
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Dimitrios Marantidis, 23 Jul 2008 @ 1:10pm

Printers
This is my first time that I expressing my views with all the printers. I had before Epson 777 and 820 color and went fine that time. Now I find out all the problems with the printers. I had a Lexmark and now I have HP Officejet j5780 all-in-one and the problems are plenty. The printer cost me $145.00 and the ink cost $30.00 to $33.00 every 100 pages and even I spoke with them, they told me that they have to make money in some place and forget your complains. This is the way the market works.
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freddyzdead, 10 Aug 2008 @ 11:56pm

Kodak printer and cheaper ink
Kodak (or any other similar size company) will never do anything that benefits the customer (or anyone else but themselves) unless it's a side-effect from benefiting themselves.

These companies stay in business only through gargantuan advertising campaigns which smaller businesses can't afford. The sheeple buy their products because they saw them on the telly.

Kodak was among the first to see the writing on the wall as to the (lack of) future of photographic film. They have applied the same business models to the digital realm as they did to the chemical one.

If you go the Kodak way, you will find yourself forking out money at every turn; it's all planned that way. You are far better to get a good quality lesser known brand camera and an old (pre-chip) Canon printer and refill the cartridges yourself. Never buy a printer that has the printhead and ink tank as an integral unit. The total cost of ownership of these is much higher. That's why I only use Canon or Brother.
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Janys Carney, 11 Aug 2008 @ 9:22am

Kodak cheap ink
I owned cannon printers for many years because there was a site where you could buy one cartridge and get 2 free. My old cannons finally gave out and we replaced one with a pixma ip6210. I love the quality of the print, but ouch, when I went to replace the cartridges it took a big bite out of my wallet, so I bought a KodakESP3. Great pictures, great price on the cartridges and the all in one printer was actually reasonably priced. The other day Woot had a Kodak 5300 for sale and I bought another one. Hummmm, now if I could just get my husband to let go of his old Cannon....
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Danny R., 30 Sep 2008 @ 10:00am

Plenty of evidence on this
A detailed blog on the high price of printer ink was posted at http://www.theamericanconsumer.org/2008/09/16/ink-scam/ and they provide plenty of evidence about the causes of this. What can be done? That is the issue.
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Tom Morris, 5 Nov 2008 @ 1:01pm

Office Depot pulls Kodak printers, ink
I purchased a Kodak printer earlier this year from Office Depot and went today to get more ink. NOT!
The clerk said Office Depot has pulled ALL Kodak printers and ALL ink since they don't sell them anymore.
What the?
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m. egan, 10 Dec 2008 @ 2:50am

Hats off to Kodak
I am on my way to Best Buy this morning to purchase
the new Kodak esp 7 on sale...reason....cheap ink
I am so tired of getting ripped off for ink..
Smart game Kodak....you will grab a large percentage of
the market before the other decide to follow suit...
Hats off to you....

meb
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Greg, 17 Jan 2009 @ 5:48pm

Re: Re: People still use printers?
I agree, but, I still love reading. So am I supposed to use an energy chomping device or just read a book? I have some books that havn't used much energy for a long time.
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Merlin, 25 Jan 2009 @ 9:46pm

Defective printers
The only problem with the Kodak printer is that it just does not print at all, it is defective. Sure it saves ink when you can't print. Google on line for all the the problems people are having with the printer not printing black.
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vicki, 11 Feb 2009 @ 8:42am

ink replacement
The biggest problem with the kodak easyshare 5300 is that when one ink cartridge is empty (either color or black) the printer is disabled and you can not print t all until you replace the cartridge. My color cartridge was empty. I thought no big deal, I'm printing in black anyway...wrong! The printer would not print and when I called tech support at Kodak I was told this is the way they were designed. What a stupid design feature!!!
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glo, 14 Feb 2009 @ 6:45am

Kodak Printer
I have had my Kodak ESP 3 for a few weeks now and I love it. Easy to use, great photo editing a pleasure to use. A bit noisy when you switch it on but a small detail for the quality and ease of use.
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glo, 14 Feb 2009 @ 6:45am

Kodak Printer
I have had my Kodak ESP 3 for a few weeks now and I love it. Easy to use, great photo editing a pleasure to use. A bit noisy when you switch it on but a small detail for the quality and ease of use.
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glo, 14 Feb 2009 @ 6:46am

Kodak Printer
I have had my Kodak ESP 3 for a few weeks now and I love it. Easy to use, great photo editing a pleasure to use. A bit noisy when you switch it on but a small detail for the quality and ease of use.
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Glenn, 27 Feb 2009 @ 7:35pm

True price of a USB cable
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Glenn, 27 Feb 2009 @ 7:41pm

True cost of a USB cable
The question came up as to why they do not but a USB cable in the box. That it must only cost $2 or so. I work for a company that makes cellular modems and when we leave out the USB cable for some customers it's cost to us in less than .24 cents. So a $2 price means a 800% markup.
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Doug R, 30 Mar 2009 @ 3:52pm

Re: Kodak 5300 All in One Printer (post 67)
I have had the same experience with my 5300 (i.e does not work after the first cartridge, Kodak will not resolve) Kodak had better get their customer service together, they risk having their ad campaign drowned out by unhappy former customers.
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jim monette, 11 Apr 2009 @ 6:04pm

ink prices
I have a lexmark printer which cost about 200.00 dollars the printer is slow and the ink is supper expensive. The ink does not last very long and when it gets down a message comes up saying your ink is low and thenit stops after each document that it is low on ink. I used it last night and was able to get 80 pages out of the ink they said was running out by just saying continue to print this document
Someone shoud investigate this printer companies All the ink is made in Mexico so we know it does not cost that much
to make they even have a return catridge program but no money back when you send them in.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Apr 2009 @ 6:43pm

Re: printer paper
do you need to buy their paper for regular printing or just for photos?
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Fred, 26 May 2009 @ 2:48pm

Kodak Printer
My wife bought a Kodak ESP3. We thought we'd save some money on ink. What a mistake! This printer is the biggest piece of junk I have ever seen. Everytime we want to print something, doesn't matter what, we have to remove the cratridges and put them back in. Then, maybe, we get what we want. My kids are very frustrated with it. My oldest has turned in work incomplete because of this thing not printing right.

Do yourself a favor and DON'T BUY ONE.
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Frank Hoffmann, 27 May 2009 @ 7:13am

"Cheap" ink not such a good deal
Well first of all, when the Kodak "decides" that the ink is low, the printer simply shuts down and will not allow you to print. Even with a brand-new black ink cartridge, you cannot print a black-and-white document if the color ink cartridge is out! Kodak's printers also seem to show empty cartridges LONG before the cartridge is truly empty. Oh, and the print head has gone bad twice in 8 months.
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Mary V, 21 Jun 2009 @ 8:14am

Kodak Printer Cartridges
We have a Kodak ESP3 and I just hate it. When you first turn the unit on to print something the noise it makes is unbelievable. It takes forever to get warmed up. As far as saving on ink, forget that as well. We just put a new ink cartridge in it again about a week ago and have only printed a few pages and it says that we are already low on ink. How can they justify you saving money on ink, when you have to replace it all the time after very little use. I told my husband to get rid of it and we will be shopping around for something else.
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Anonymous Coward, 19 Aug 2009 @ 7:12pm

Re: Re: Re: Government's Fault???
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djjs, 19 Sep 2009 @ 12:24pm

looking for new printer based on ink prices
I've been putting off buying ink for my HP at roughly $60 because I can buy a new printer for that, or would be willing to pay more for a printer that doesn't charge such an outrageous amount for ink.
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JAE, 24 Sep 2009 @ 12:34pm

False Advertising
False advertising. I have a Kodak ESP 5 and it runs out of ink as often as ALL the others so they LIED once again. JAE 09/24/09
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cay, 15 Oct 2009 @ 10:48am

Re: Re: no they don't
I bought a esp3200 today and can't believe it didn't come with a USB cable. I have other USB cables, but they don't fit into the back of the (**(^^*(*^986 printer.
Salesman didn't tell me I'd need to buy the cable separately, so need to go back to the shop again
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phyllis satterfield, 4 Nov 2009 @ 4:13pm

ink
it's getting time they do something
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let, 11 Nov 2009 @ 12:32pm

Re: Re: People still use printers?
Hilarious!!!
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jackie stanley, 6 Dec 2009 @ 6:32am

Kodak Printer
I went and bought a kodak printer on hoping to save money on the ink, was I ever wrong. I ran out of in and went to buy new ink, yes it was cheap, but when I put it in the printer, It wouldn't. The colors didn't come out right at all. I ended up going through a whole color ink cartage trying to get it to print right. A new printer Such a waste.
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jackie stanley, 6 Dec 2009 @ 6:32am

Kodak Printer
I went and bought a kodak printer on hoping to save money on the ink, was I ever wrong. I ran out of in and went to buy new ink, yes it was cheap, but when I put it in the printer, It wouldn't. The colors didn't come out right at all. I ended up going through a whole color ink cartage trying to get it to print right. A new printer Such a waste.
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Mac Guy (profile), 8 Dec 2009 @ 7:37am

Do you just landfill the used cartridge ? ? ?
In Canada the new cartridge costs about ten dollars.

So you just throw away the cartridge ?

How about refilling and reusing.
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Giles, 18 Dec 2009 @ 7:59am

Re: Just Buy a New One
how can you save. the new printer only has sample inks in it. if it comes with full carts then i would love to know where to get this
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paul53, 14 Jan 2010 @ 9:51pm

Kodak ESP3250
Had to get a new printer for my Window 7 and found out that Microsoft and Kodak are fully compatible.Went out and got a ESP3250 and just a regular 2.0 USB cable brought it home and hooked it up. It went so smooth I was shocked. Am very happy with the printer and software provided by Kodak and the quality is awesome. For the price of the printer and new ink you can't go wrong.
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Guillermo, 19 Jan 2010 @ 5:44pm

Re: Re: Government's Fault???
Oh trust me, it's the Government. The Gov has always been inefficient, but when it comes to corruption, they are masters at it... much better at screwing the people than big business, Hands down. Just look at how the Govt is trying their best to screw you today.

-Guillermo
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Redford, 23 Apr 2010 @ 1:29am

Ink
It's about time someone did this. There should be an inquest as to why it hasn't materialised sooner, price fixing anyone? Anyhow, at least it seams the cost of refilling/replacing my ink cartridges is goin to be reduced. Happy days.
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louis roberts, 31 May 2010 @ 6:41am

usb printer
like to have one if price is cheap
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Mary (profile), 5 Jul 2010 @ 6:37am

Kodak ESP7
This printer has been nothing but a hassle!!! It takes forever to warm up and is very loud. The ink definitely doesn't last longer. It won't scan if you don't have both black and color ink cartridges...even if you only want to save or e-mail the scanned page! And forget using compatible ink cartridges. I've had to have one printer replaced already because of continual paper jams. I'm ready to throw it out the window. You don't save money, but you definitely have a lot of stress after dealing with this printer. It has caused many arguments because my children haven't been able to complete numerous assignments because of problems and issues with it.
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Cynthia, 4 Aug 2010 @ 11:34pm

Kodak ESP-3
Love the printer.. Love the cheaper ink prices.. HATE the fact that when you need to print a document RIGHT NOW that is black (AND YOUR BLACK CARTRIDGE IS FULL) it will not let you print in only black if the color cartridge is out of ink.. This is their way of making up for low ink prices.. They force you to have to buy both cartridges or you will not be printing BUPKIS!!!!!
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Erick, 8 Aug 2010 @ 9:52am

WLove the printer..
ell first of all, when the Kodak "decides" that the ink is low, the printer simply shuts down and will not allow you to print.
The biggest problem with the kodak easyshare 5300 is that when one ink cartridge is empty (either color or black) the printer is disabled and you can not print t all until you replace the cartridge
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yson, 10 Aug 2010 @ 6:39pm

I purchased some G&G cartridges some time back and we didn't like them that much, purchased some "Premium Imaging Products" cartridges from ConcordSupplies.com and they are better quality and cheap for my printer.
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Anna, 12 Aug 2010 @ 3:36pm

I used the ink cartridges that came with my computer, and when I bought the next new cartridges, the printer will acknowledge that I changed the cartridges. It keeps saying the ink cartridges are low, Order Ink. There's no way I would have another Kodak.!!!!
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Anna, 12 Aug 2010 @ 3:42pm

I used the ink cartridges that came with my computer, and when I bought the next new cartridges, the printer will not acknowledge that I changed the cartridges. It keeps saying the ink cartridges are low, Order Ink. There's no way I would have another Kodak.!!!!
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GERALD PYNCKEL, 1 Oct 2010 @ 2:57pm

KODAK INEXPENSIVE INK
We just purchased a new KODAK print. We have been users of HP printers for over 20 years and saw an advertisement stating that the KODAK printer uses less ink and that their ink cartridges cost less. Respond "AD" verses "FACTS"...our black cartridge was getting slightly low and the color cartridge still had a lot of ink, but it would not let us continue to print, so we had to buy more ink. We purchased a new combo pack of black/colorcartridges and even though there was still a lot of color ink still left in the old cartridge it would not let us replace just the black... This printer/cartridge system definitely does not allow you to print as many pages as the HP ink cartridges...plus you can use the HP cartridges until they are extremely low. Not the case with the KODAK. I will never be swayed by a commercial again... I am going to buy another HP even though we just bought this printer approximately a month ago...the ink is ridiculously expensive
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Oct 2010 @ 4:06pm

Someone shoot these manufactures in the fucking head. (Like the mel gibbson movie ransome or some other movie that some one fucks with his family) mel say's you go far enough up the chain you will find one man who makes the decisions. someone should find the few men who price fix or want to rip off small business owners, students, etc and shoot them in the face.
Why must people just feel it's ok to fuck every one to get rich.
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Dustin, 20 Oct 2010 @ 9:50pm

Kodak Ink Cartriges SUCK, you dry...
I've had a Kodak AIO printer for a couple years now, but I don't use it often at all, maybe once every 3 months. After going through 5 different sets of color / black cartriges, I finnaly realized that the ink dry's up over time, so it's not just a matter of how much ink they give you, it's how long it lasts. I don't know if I'm the only one who's realized this, but I just threw my 5100 in the trash and I'm getting an HP office jet tomorrow since I know they work for a couple years and the ink lasts doesn't dry up and dissapear over a period of a couple months...
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Nov 2010 @ 2:26pm

Ink is a rip off glad someone can sell yhis product for less
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linda pantallion, 19 Dec 2010 @ 9:34pm

i wonder why the companys started packing their ink cartidge one in each package before it toghter and rise the price
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delacydoris@yahoo.com, 17 Feb 2011 @ 12:22pm

kodak printers and ink
Kodak has pulled off another scam. Their printers are such poor quality. Additionally, the black ink cannot run unless it has the color with it, as they have been programmed to require both to run. So it isn't cheap for the poor quality. They were going into bankruptcy and that is where they will be. America hates this company as they sold everyone on the instant photos in the 50' and 60" and swore if we used their solution on the photo it would not fade. All faded and American lost their family pictures. They have not changed and don't buy this junk!!!!!!!!!!!
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Tim B, 28 Mar 2011 @ 3:54pm

Ink Costs
I purchased a Kodak all in one printer. loved it until they raised the ink price up from $14.99 for color. Then it went up to $19.99. The black is the same still $9.99. They sold a lot of printers to consumers. So now they raise the price up on the color. I'm getting a ink refill kit..Then if this printer goes I will not buy any more.
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Julie W., 2 May 2011 @ 11:43am

printers
Hey Tim,
Good luck on the refill kit. I refilled my Kodak ink cartridges and there's something in the printer that will not let you use the old cartridges. I got the Kodak printer because the H.P. printer cartridges would expire and yes, I had them expire and they still had ink in them.
Printers are a real money making gimick I'll tell you that.
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Linda Fergusson, 7 May 2011 @ 10:09am

Kodak Printer Ink
I own one of these printers and what a joke. The ink might
be cheaper to buy but what they don't tell you is that there is next to no ink in the cartridge so you need to buy twice as much. How is that a saving. Darn't right false advertising if you ask me.
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Joy, 30 Jul 2011 @ 9:33am

Kodak Ink
We bought the Kodak printer then last month the price sky-rocketed. Very Bad Kodak.
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Mortaryan, 24 Sep 2011 @ 9:58am

Re: narcissistic arrogance
Complexity = suicidal idiocy or insanity or both, especially in the market place of ideas, technology, and economics.

Ease of use = profitability and prosperity.
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william catlin, 11 Apr 2013 @ 5:01pm

kodal printer
Finally!
It is about time a mfg did this! Wow, I will even have to dump the HP and Epsons, Canon, and get a kodak printer. copyright law last to long and cost the public way to much money
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Ms P, 27 Oct 2015 @ 8:32pm

Kodak will be my next printer!!!
I am so OUTRAGED by the price stealing of ink prices that I will drop ALL other printers just to get a fair printer with reasonable printer prices!!! THANKS Kodak, you're on to something!!!
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Never Kodak, 14 Nov 2015 @ 2:19pm

ESP7 AIO
Never would I buy a Kodak printer/scanner that stops scanning to file when the ink is low.
It doesn't make sense, it's ripoff and I hope many more will follow and avoid these products.

Don't buy!
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