Law Students Say Message Board Postings Are Costing Them Job Offers
from the if-it's-online-it-must-be-true dept
As people increasingly live and document their lives online, stories about potential employers doing web searches on job candidates and turning up information candidates would rather not have them see -- information that often costs them a shot at the job -- are becoming more common. The Washington Post has a front-page story on this topic today, focusing on some law-school students who aren't having a lot of luck finding jobs, and blaming it on message board postings. What makes this story a little bit different is that the students didn't make the postings themselves, they're just the subject of certain threads and messages -- some which could possibly be viewed as defamatory, while others are simply unbecoming (such as a discussion of a female student's breasts). The employers weren't finding the students' MySpace pages or blogs, or other sites documenting their personal lives, but rather their inadvertent digital resumés were being created by other people. The article seems to put the blame on the owner of a particular site that's popular among law students, but that's misplaced -- perhaps the more questionable activity is on the part of employers who are using this information. If they're going to search the web, they need to have the understanding that people can't control what other people say or post about them (similar to the idea of hearsay in a courtroom), and that not every mention that casts a student in a poor light is true, or an indication of their character. It's also not entirely clear why potential employers should consider many of these comments relevant to their hiring decisions, though one person says law firms are afraid of candidates who could attract controversy. Of course, it's also possible that comments a person labels as "defamatory" may be unflattering, but true. While site owners have no legal liability for what third parties post on their sites, thanks to Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, at least one company senses an opportunity here, and searches for potentially damaging content online and "destroy it on behalf of clients", which we'll assume to mean they drown site owners with cease and desist orders and threats of lawsuits akin to legal bullying. All in all, this sounds like quite a bit of overreaction -- not just on the students' parts, but from their potential employers, too.
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common sense?
C'mon, you're expecting a lot here. Most HR types are completely clueless. These are the type of people who were posting Job Ads stating a 5 year experience requirement in Java back in 1996 (Java 1.0 came out in 1995).
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Nope, makes sense
Be nice if 'kids' would grow up and realize that what they do in life they will be accountable for. Including talking about teats.
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Re: Nope, makes sense
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What?
If an employer takes that much solace in what a random 3rd party says then you don't want to work for them anyway. If something you post on a forum comes back to bite you in the ass, it's your own fault. Take responsibility and move on.
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Re: What?
As far as the statement:
"If an employer takes that much solace in what a random 3rd party says then you don't want to work for them anyway."
I would say that I would WANT to work for that employer, because they want to make sure that their people are top notch.
As far as "Take responsibility and move on", yep... that's exactly the attitude they should have. It comes down to integrity in the end, if you've lead a life that wasn't too "quiet", then be prepared for those waves that you've made to come back and resonate off of you.
Karma is a biotch!
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Re: Re: What?
Additionally, someone being "top notch" has nothing to do with the results of a Google search. An idiot can just as easily have a clean 'net profile as a top notch person. That's why there are things like resumes and interviews.
Having said all that, yeah-- if these students are that brilliant, I doubt a shady 'net profile with questionable sources is the only reason they were passed over. If it is, I agree-- you're better off without them. Places with top-notch people find them by talking with them.
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Re: Re: What?
Um, sure. Nudge. Nudge. Wink. Wink. Because you can tell so much about an employee from messages left about them during their college days. Besides, who is to say that the person being discussed is the same person who is applying for the job?
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Re: Re: What?
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Re: What?
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Funny
It is kind of sad really, I mean what you do with the Internet at home should never be considered by employers as anything against your character. That would be like refusing to give a job to a candidate who sings show tunes in the shower, simply because you don't like show tunes they sing.
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Re: Funny
Never is a word I seldom use.
Perhaps you mean to restrict this to LEGAL activities. As far as the employers go, if the comments are in any way relevant to the job or the persons's character, it would be appropriate to include them in the total view of a candidate. Got to weight them according to the veracity of the source though.
If somebody made fun of anyone based on the size or shape of a body part -- that is not relevant (for lawyers, anyway) and should never be included in an HR record.
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Re: Re: Funny
Now, I don't particularly agree with judging someone based on their online posts. Well all know that the life span of a website could be a few days or until the end of time. If you posted something about your political views 5-10 years ago, should you really be judged for that today?
Hopefully employers take these things into consideration.
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Re: Funny
Everything you do in life reflects on every part of your life. Parents may tell their children that it’s ok to make mistakes, which is true, but they don’t tell them that they will have to live with them for the rest of their lives. We have a serious problem with taking responsibility in society today.
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Re: Re: Funny
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Re: Re: Re: Funny
The politics was an example, but there is nothing in the law preventing companies from choosing another candidate due to your political views. Only gender, race and religion can not count against you.
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Re: Re: Re: Funny
In the end nothing about life is fair. People need to figure this out. It may not be fair that your political views impact your career, after all, they don't change how you perform in your job (usually), but they do effect the way you are viewed. After all, what you know doesn't matter nearly as much as who you know.
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Another good reason...
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Yeah, it's long.
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Re: Yeah, it's long.
An immature tirade such as your post is the exact reason employers want to look into their candidates. Your posting included unnecessary profanity, poor structure, and no valid point. When in that long mess of a paragraph did you explain why companies shouldn't look at forum posts? You offered up the fact that a person who is a student of law, is in some way better then a construction worker. So, because someone chose to go to work rather then school, the person who chose school is better? I hate to tell you but a lot of contractors and machine operators make six figures and many are way far more intelligent then you my friend. I am a software developer, does that mean I should look down on someone who chose to go to work in another field that pays less? Does less pay mean they have not or do not work as hard?
Please think before you speak, even rants should have a point.
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Re: Re: Yeah, it's long.
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Re: Re: Re: Yeah, it's long.
How does attending college constitute a larger investment of time or energy then someone working 60 hour weeks at a construction site? Is reading a book harder then manual labor for the equal amount of time? I'm sorry, but your point really is not valid. I work with computers, but I can still appreciate the hard work that people in other professions do. To say that a student deserves anything is absurd. You are going to school to benefit yourself.
As for the condescending tone of my post, how is my condescending tone directed at you any different then the condescending nature of your post directed at everyone who does not go to college? You act as though you are above reproach, however, what experience do you bring to the table in this discussion that would indicate an equal level of competency or knowledge? You do not approve of my condescending tone, yet your response is profanity? I have no problem with swearing, but unlike you, I have other tools at my disposal and I understand the implications of such actions. Currently I am gainfully employed, but if I were not and an employer were reading these posts, who do you think he would be more likely to contact for potential employment? Does your conduct reflect an intelligent and articulate individual or a temperamental child?
What all this boils down to is that you believe you (or law students) are working harder then everyone else and deserve to be treated better. The reality is that I do in fact believe I have a better grasp of reality and the business world then yourself, and that I do doubt your credibility to comment on the inequalities of life. Everyone is entitled to his or her own opinion, but that does not make them right. You may not agree with me, but you also have not even slightly provided a case for your arguments.
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Re: Yeah, it's long.
The people who poke around like this are basically voyeurs. Just because they can, doesnt mean they should. Who lays out the rules on what should and shouldnt be done? I have no idea, but you and I know where that line is. We were raised in the time that built that line, and we feel it in our bones just as surely as the asshats dont.
Work hard, do your part, and have faith. Itll work out.
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Re: Re: Yeah, it's long.
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Re: Yeah, it's long.
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Social Network Paradigm
The paradigm of power within the corporate world is changing rapidly. And Social Networking is contributing to lower costs.
Smart businesses are going to find ways to increase productivity and quality of work using these new collaboration tools available now.
Take Goldcorp for example. A $500,000 iinvestment in Social Networking grossed grew his company from $100M to $10 Billion
http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/59/mcewen.html
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Re: Yeah, it's long.
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privacy tool for social networks
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anonimity
The only thing that ever gets my real name is a resume or job-search engine and the email account reserved for the responses. everything else gets an alter-ego, complete with an address, and a birthdate.
As you can see most of us have screen names, we do it for a reason. so our current employers, future employers, friends, enemies, gov spooks and whoever else out there who may be watching/ spidering (google etc) does not easily link it back to us. Think of it as a virtual condom between you and the stupids. screw em all and keep the possibility of burning to a minimum.
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Read more before commenting
The site owners are not nearly as innocent in all this as they would have you believe, and the women targeted are not nearly as naive as some of you seem to think, either.
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I sincerely doubt that this kind of HR cluelessness would get many "top notch" employees for you to work with, if they cannot realize how easy it is to fill a thread with unwarranted flames on the net.
I can SOMEWHAT see an interviewer or a firm turning down a prospective employee based on their online behavior/opinions, if they can reasonably make the assumption that the behavior/opinions they observe are actually legitimate (whether it is is another argument altogether) but there's really no defense for doing so based on whatever some net troll posts ABOUT an employee for which he/she has absolutely no control.
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Just goes to show, without knowing all the facts, you really can't make a decision.
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reading comprehension!
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Chiropractor
http://www.innatechiro.net/
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considering...
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