High School Principal Sues Students For Phony MySpace Profiles
from the please,-make-fun-of-me dept
Not all MySpace-related lawsuits involve the same predictable factors like underage users and sexual assault. A high school principal in Pennsylvania has sued four students after they created parody MySpace profiles for him that listed interests such as smoking pot and watching pornography. He claims that the profile has damaged his future earnings potential and so he wants monetary compensation. It's not clear whether the students' actions qualify as first amendment-protected parody or whether they'd be seen as defamation of a private citizen. Either way, the most likely outcome here is more copycat attempts as he's just put a target on himself inviting other students to attack him. Instead of suing, it seems like a better course of action would have been to simply contact MySpace and request that the profiles be taken down. Now, for better or worse, he'll always be known as the principal that sued his students over fake MySpace profiles, to anyone who searches for his name. To his credit (or maybe his lawyer's) he's suing the students and not the site itself, which is the proper legal course. Then again, it's hard to imagine that he'll be able to get much in damages from a few high school students.
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also id like to say
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Gotta say...
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The Rents
We had a (elementary school) kid who racked up so many weekend detentions that he got expelled. He was given a weekend detention, but his parents didn't want to get out of bed to take him, so they skipped it. That means he got another one. They skipped those, so he had four, they skipped two more so he got expelled. They raised Cain because they had to pay for daycare and use vacation to take care of him during the day. Not because he missed so much school, or that they were lazy morons.
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Hehe.
Can't solve anything without a lawyer.
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Re: Hehe.
Can't solve anything without a lawyer.
that's exactly how the lawyers want it...
$cha-ching$
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Re: Hehe.
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I wonder
1) Though the children are responsible they aren't liable under the particular state's laws so neither are their parents so there is no judgement against either.
2) The children are responsible, but their parents aren't, so the plaintifs only recourse is to wait until the children are of legal age and try to collect the judgement from them.
3) The children are responsible, and because of state law or because the parent could have or should have forseen the problem, the parents are responsible and have a judgement made against them.
There are other variations, but these seem to be the big three, and they always make me curious when I read about the *IAA suing children/teens or about suits like this.
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He had it coming...
Obviously, the principal was once a student and knows that HS/MS principals are THE target of teenage satire (beyond other students). Given the times, I'm surprised that he didn't see this one coming. The internet IS the new high school bathroom stall.
Was it wrong for those kids to do that? Yes. Just like it was wrong of us to make fun of our principals back in school, but should the principal be able to sue? You would think that the principal of a high school should be able to turn the other cheek (post-Easter humor) when it comes to kids making slander-ish jokes.
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Had it coming
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Re: Had it coming
Parents pay attention to things like this, what if one of them comes across these profiles BEFORE its known that its a parody?
He's a position of authority over other people's children, he has to take this seriously.
If these profile's were simply him with a clown nose or said he worked at burger king or something that truly was only meant to poke fun he could perhaps chill.
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Re: Re: Had it coming
What if in all likeliness no one gives a shit about the myspace profiles.
What if parents NEVER see the profiles?
What if the parents don't give a shit about them?
What if they have ZERO impact on his future ability to get/keep/change his job?
James, you're a twat and so are all the other sue hungry idiots here.
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this guy is kinda lame
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I'm on the prinicipals side here
The kids used the biggest ammunition they had (placing the mans entire career in shambles) and the only bigger gun available was a lawsuit.
The principal cannot afford to "roll over" and let the students get away with this.
And don't pretend the kids are the victims here, they know damn well the power they were weilding.
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Re: I'm on the prinicipals side here
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Well
This is why I think it's wrong for employers to go online looking for info (read: gossip, dirt, secrets) on candidates.
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Streisand Effect
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When U Sue Someone It Is Public - Therefore His Na
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What's the difference?
"Awww shucks! I don't wanna go! All the kids make fun of me, the teachers hate me, and the lunchladies always spit in my food! I'm not goin'!"
"But honey, you have to go... you're the principal"
This guy needs to grow up and grow some balls. What's the difference if some kid is drawing pictures of the principal with penises in his mouth on a piece of paper in the school? It happens every day. I don't think he would be suing some kids if that were the case.
Sounds like if he doesn't like to be picked on, he shouldn't have become a high school principal.
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Re: What's the difference?
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Re: What's the difference?
I have one thing to say to ALL Principals who can't take the heat... GET OVER YOURSELVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you can't take being "slagged off" then GET THE HELL out of the profession!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IDIOTS.
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Are you 12?
That comment may have made sense 10 years ago, unless you live in some 3rd world country. Europe is sue happy now too.
@ keyboard: What planet do you live on? Are you 12? What if I post a doctored photo of you having "sex" with your mother on the side of a large building in your town? Based on your answer, you would "praise me for being creative", or perhaps hire me to paint your home (er, bicycle)? Yeah right. Its so easy for you to talk about what other people "should" do. Your are a f*ckin hypocrite. I am sure that the principal is not able to do what he would like to do - and that is to kick the livin shit out of the little morons and then smear their school records, but then the kid's parents would sue him and he would be without work wit his rep ruined. The only way these kids' parents will care at all is if it costs them beer and cigarette money...losers breed losers.
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Re: Are you 12?
These kids are our future? How could they help create anything positive with this behavior? This can only create war and hate because of their ease to spread anger, disrespect, prejudice, and profanity! What good can anyone see in that? They deserve their punishment if they can't abide by gradeschool level laws and rules of moral decency. It will come back to them 10 fold!
Too bad more parents aren't aware of what their kids say on the NET. It is a parent's right and responsibilty to PARENT/supervise. It is not the school's responsibility to watch these kids on their computers at home or outside of school property! Expecting kids to be mature, have good morals, ethical, and socially responsible is a joke. Parents need to be in control more than ever before, because of the acessibility to the internet, weapons, and drugs. No company would hire these kids who have a record of any indiscretion. Have these kids even thought about how all things are going to be held against them for the rest of their lives? I doubt it! Their future would be bleak!
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Principal is a loser
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What an Idiot
He's a high school principal. He should act like it.
Suspend the kids. Get MySpace to take down the profiles. But a lawsuit. Absurd!
What if someone wrote those nasty things on the bathroom stalls for everyone to see? Would he have grounds for a lawsuit then. I doubt it.
This guy just saw an opportunity and fueled by a lawyers prodding makes another embarrassing entry of the American Legal System.
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uh huh
The kids were just being kids, but as such they knew that they'd get into trouble if they got caught. I'm sure they didn't have the foresight to predict whether that punishment would take the form of school suspensions/detentions or a lawsuit. But I'm also sure that they weren't surprised by the fact that the principal wasn't willing to just let it slide.
Regardless of whether or not WE think it was wrong, I'd bet the farm that the students thought what they were doing was wrong when they did it. Should that matter? I think so.
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Shoe on the other foot
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Fire the Principal
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Has anyone thought...
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They just allow anybody to create a profile on there. Myspace is a horrible excuse for a web site. Everything about it is crap.
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Re: azure rune's comments
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Re: Re: azure rune's comments
A school can remove a student who is disruptive or a threat to other students, but at the end of the day, teachers who are unable to teach are about a useful as a square wheel.
I agree that there are a lot of kids that need to be punished for misbehaving, but you can not carry it beyond the confines of the school and under the rules of the school. It is NOT the place of the teachers to punish students or attempt to fix them for parents short comings, they are employed by the parents to make sure they do their best to educate the students. If a disruptive student needs to be removed, then he is removed. End of story. The problem with this case is that nothing these students did was in the school. They were not trouble makers, they were not a threat to the other students, and they did not violate school rules.
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Re: Board of Education
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Hmmm
Anyway, I partially agree with azure rune. This kind of thing would have never happened in the past. Not because there wasn't a medium like the internet, but because those kids parents would have beat them silly, then turned them over to the principal so that he could get his fill. So far the kids produced by the new rules of "time outs" and "stern warnings" are below average quality... not to mention we have them brain washed to think "trying" is the same as "doing". I actually had a short term employee tell me he "was trying his best" to be at work on time...
Where my opinion differs is in the ages. I don't think these problems are limited to people in their teens. I encounter 40+ year olds who think that because they are older then other people, that they must be treated with more respect and are not required to reciprocate that respect. It floors me why some people believe age is a qualifier of respect. The way I have always looked at it is that everyone deserves a certain level or respect. From there they can move up and down my respect scale, but I always start them out on the same level. The new employee fresh out of school is going to get the same respect as a 30 year professional when we walk into a meeting.
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The other side of the story
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Re: The other side of the story
This is a case of people being to stupid to analyze a situation. All that needed to happen was to have his parents give him a good beating, give his principal an apology, and move along. Any legal proceedings carried by the student or administrator should be separate from school as they do not pertain to his education.
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Re: Re: The other side of the story
This punk needs to learn that this kind of thing is not acceptable end of story.
The principal is in effect the face of the school to the outside world. Thus the school is affected, had they not impersonated him, this would be a moot issue.
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Re: Re: Re: The other side of the story
This punk needs to learn that this kind of thing is not acceptable end of story.
The principal is in effect the face of the school to the outside world. Thus the school is affected, had they not impersonated him, this would be a moot issue."
It is not the schools duty to parent. If a student violates their rules they can discipline the student in accordance with their rules. Nothing personal can be carried over to the school environment from the principal to introduce punishment. I can guarantee that there is not a rule saying that you can not "parody" a school official outside of school, therefore, he is not in violation of rules. This does not mean he should not be punished, but if he breaks the law, that is law enforcements responsibility. All other punishment duties for activities outside the school grounds that do not involve other students are the parents responsibilities.
Also, at no point did they claim to "impersonate" the principal. That is where the legal gray area is for this issue. Impersonation requires you to offer yourself as that person, where as this actually falls under a parody of the person. In this instance they could go for defamation of character, but that is a civil matter and not under the schools jurisdiction.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: The other side of the story
This means they assumed his identity...thus impersonated him, they did not create a page about him, they created a page as him.
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Re: Re: The other side of the story
I thought the principal was suing, not the school or the school district. So the school isn't out of it's juisdiction since it's not taking any action.
Regardless, first amendment rights or not, what these kids did makes it extremely difficult for the principal to carry out his duties effectively. Interfering with his job function has to have reprocussions.
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Re: Re: The other side of the story
It was up for 3 days.....what the hell is the lawsuit for? I can understand fighting fire with fire, but punish the kid and move on...dragging it out only makes things worse and will make the principal a bigger target than he already was.
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high school principal
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Re: high school principal
Coming from someone who signed his posting "enough is enough"...
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Re: Re: high school principal
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Re: high school principal
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Doncha know??
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had to sue
But even if he could have Myspace pull the profile down and avoid all this, there's nothing he can do to find out who made these profiles without filing a lawsuit. Myspace will delete the page, but won't release any identifying info about the account holder w/o a John Doe suit being filed first. If Myspace thought this was protected by the First and told the principal to take a hike, he really had no choice but to file a suit.
It's just like with the RIAA. ISPs refuse to reveal people's identities w/o a suit being filed first. After that, it's up to the suing party to decide whether to continue or drop the suit once they find the culprit. I can't find the suit itself, but it sounds as if the principal is continuing with or amended his suit.
Leaving aside the issue of schools expanding their reach into the private lives of students (schools are overreaching if you ask me), what else is this principal supposed to do? Just b/c he's a principal means he has to put up with Myspace profiles purporting to be made by him that are insulting? Everyone should have the right to stop this kind of behavior and, if possible, to seek damages if they can actually show harm (which should be a rather high bar to show). In actuality, b/c the streisand effect is in full swing here, I bet you plenty of high school kids will here about this and think twice about doing the same if they know these kids here were held to account. So while its too bad for this principal, his stand here will serve to establish new norms on how to use the Internet appropriately.
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Re: had to sue
I agree that schools are overstepping their bounds, but I also feel that it is a matter of the lines being too blurred. Parents don't step up enough and teachers step up to much, this leads to confusions on who has the authority in what situation. There are also the issues of personal vs professional that teachers get confused on. As posted by the reader above who incorrectly stated that the principal was representing the school to the public and that justified the action, people do not realize that there is a line dividing their roles. The teacher is employed by the parents to teach the student, personal matters are left at the door when they enter the school (at least they should). This applies to everything from politics to personal dislikes.
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I'm sorry, but from what I have read about this guy, his future earnings are already damaged by the fact he is grossly overweight, and seems to be an outright "prick" about everything.
In my opinion, this guy probably shouldn't be an authority over anybody's children. For all we know, some of the accusations may have been correct, without real proof, and that is why he is attacking with a lawsuit so aggressively.
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This is just wrong
And to the person who said.
"Americans.
Can't solve anything without a lawyer."
You are an idiot, the law should be the last recourse in most situations but the principal is the one who started it and the student should finish it. Never let anyone bully you and when they try make them regret it.
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You forgot.
It's not anything like having crude pictures drawn on a bathroom wall. I highly doubt anyone in said bathroom thinks the principal actually writes the things on the wall, nor do the school board members patrol the bathrooms before making decisions on promotions. However, a profile on myspace could be passed off as the real deal, and could affect promotions.
Another point that seems to be confused is saying that the school is going to far, but unless I'm confused, the school isn't suing the kids-- the Mr. Trosch is, and he happens to also be their principal. His job isn't important so much. Which also explains why he's sued. The school system doesn't have rules that say you can't make fake myspace pages for your principal-- but the legal system does. Were he to punish the children with detention or what not, it would seem to me that is where he would have overstepped his bounds. He's kept it in the legal system, not the school system, as is the right thing to do.
If some kids decided to make a myspace page for you saying you like to touch little boys, sure you could contact myspace asking them to remove it (which, if I recall, requires you to take a picture of yourself holding a sign that says "Hi Tom" and the date to verify that you are the person who the page is about) but you could be reasonably assured that another would just take its place. Or you could sue the little bastards and hit them where it hurts. In mommy and daddy's wallets.
I don't know about you, but I know that when I get a resume' on my desk, I check myspace. Lots on the information is worthless when deciding to hire someone, but if all the page is about is drug use, well, they won't be getting a call.
That's just how I see it.
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Re: You forgot.
Promotion considerations for a high school teacher take into account an obviously fraudulent mys pace profile? Why wouldn't they just ask him about it? Wouldn't suing a student hurt his chances more then a parody of him?
"Another point that seems to be confused is saying that the school is going to far, but unless I'm confused, the school isn't suing the kids-- the Mr. Trosch is, and he happens to also be their principal"
The problem is that he sued them, then punished them in school. Did you miss the part where they were expelled? You can not use both forms of punishment without drawing a line under which jurisdictions regulations they violated. Not only is he attacking them financially, but he also ruined one of their chances to get into the school of choice. Who is the adult in this instance?
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obviously suing the student causing them to THINK about
consequences before taking action probably will encourage others to THINK before they take actions. Like pulling out a key to a nice car no consequences no care. Maybe the parents can pay for defense maybe the parents can teach their children to behave responsibly.
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Equally important, if this guy appeared to do nothing about the situation, the signal goes out to all the students in his school that he's an amiable target for all kinds of pranks. Taking severe action that ripples down from the student to the parent level is worse than some kid getting detention for 2 weeks.
Kids under 18 don't have fully developed brains. They'll continue to do stupid stuff, that's what makes them so entertaining. It takes harsh consequences to make them even begin thinking twice about pulling a stupid stunt.
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Re:
I doubt he's suing to collect damages. I'd bet he suing to put the fear of God into those little rugrats.
I highly doubt that. He may be trying to put the fear in them but he will try to score some cash too. Probaly enough to cover his court costs, lost wages, and whatever he calculated the "damage" to his reputation was.
And one more thing. In order to prove that his reputation was damaged and all that don't you have to prove that what was said about you was not true and that the offender knew it was not true?
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Idiots
He is trying to swat a fly with a sledge hammer and the fly just happens to be a good persons life. This mans actions are sickening he should not have authority because he obviously cannot handle it. That mad for power jackass should lose his job for this. And the student should sue the school board.
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Re: Idiots
...and being a French tutor *does* make him a bad person. :P
(I kid, I kid..)
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My space is just the begining...
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GPA?
That attitude really bothered me when I was in college and saw kids smoking marijuana and doing coke regularly, while they looked down their noses at people serving prison sentences for engaging in the exact same activities.
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calmer heads
Yes kids should not be punished at school for what happens out of school, but then again, you can't tell a teacher fu every time you see them outside and think that you're beyond punishment. That the Internet blurs geographic boundaries applies no less with schools: post something from home and you better expect someone will see it at school while school is in session. At that point, what's the difference if the posting happened somewhere else?
No the student probably has no first amendment interest here. It's not political. It's not personal. It has no greater social import. These kids put up a profile that was hurtful to the principal and portrayed him falsely, to the entire world (or everyone who cared to look) no less. The first amendment gives you the right to say whatever you want, it does not give you the right to say whatever you want with no consequences if its untrue or hurtful.
Yes I believe these kids might have committed a crime. Now it could have been worse, but these kinds of fake postings online stir up lots of trouble. What if I create a fake profile of an ex and put up all sorts of identifying info (picture, address, phone number, etc.) and then sit back and wait for all the crazies out there who can't tell its a faked page to harass the person? What about the woman in Seattle who had her home looted because of a fake Craigslist ad? First amendment I think not.
Granted it doesn't appear that any such details were included on the page, but people ought to have the right to protect themselves from these kinds of things online and use whatever the law gives them. I could easily see someone in the school district coming across the profile and the whole situation turning into a debacle just like that substitute teacher in Connecticut who's facing jail time for pop-up porn in the classroom. Yes, schools may be totally f'ed but that doesn't mean teachers need be held hostage by people "protecting the children."
And since when is 18 too young to be held accountable? At 18 they'll give you a gun and ship you off to be the face of this nation in a foreign land, but you're not responsible for what you do to other people online? Bogus. Maybe these kids didn't expect to be sued but they knew what they were doing wasn't right. The Internet is a powerful tool and there shouldn't be special immunities for kids. I can't tell who's who on the web, but something that hurtful, mean, and potentially damaging is so regardless of who posts it.
I agree with everyone who thinks the whole situation is just terrible and shouldn't have been handled this way, but then again, if someone spoofed me on Myspace I'd like to reserve the right to sue as well if the page was bad enough.
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Re: calmer heads
To put it in perspective. I'm active duty military and some of the people in my unit created a fake myspace for our unit commander. I can assure you he, nor the post leadership, were amused at any level. They got the message loud and clear about personal responsibility when they lost rank/stripes and had money withheld from their paychecks as punishment. Obviously the environments are different but the principals are the same.
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Ah, the good old days...
Later, when the parents found out, they'd kick the shit out of you again.
Guess what? We didn't do that kind of BS, any more.
...Parents/teachers (society in general) these days, nothing but a bunch of sniveling cowardly socialistic fingerpointers.
Beat'em down, I say.... (isn't that what all you little gangbangers out there do, anyway?)
ha ha whaaaaaa!!
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Re: Ah, the good old days...
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high school principal
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High School Principal
Your statement of "He is trying to swat a fly with a sledge hammer and the fly just happens to be a good persons life" is do disturbing. HOW EXACTLY IS THIS A GOOD PERSON THAT IS DEFILING the reputation of an INNOCENT person? A 3.3 gpa is not that high and not indicative of a quality person! It seems to show that they are not that smart and are not facing the consequences of HIS ACTIONS! He did this to himself, not the person who has filed charges for his OWN actions. Whats the word again... OH yes. Consequences and accountability! Well, you didn't get to go to the college of choice because of what you did to yourself!
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stupid
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i loves boyz
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im gay
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Students
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STUPIDITY
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SMOKE BUDZ
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math
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Bahahaha...!
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BULLSHIT!!!!
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response
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