Does The MPAA Simply Make Up Piracy Numbers Out Of Thin Air?
from the doing-the-math dept
Remember in the last few months how the movie industry was hyping up the idea that Canada was the center for camcording movies? This was bogus for many reasons -- with the biggest being that movies recorded in theaters on camcorders are a tiny, tiny part of the counterfeit market. It's much more common to actually get a movie leaked from an insider and then have the real copy spread around. However, the MPAA kept claiming (without any evidence) that Canada was a hotbed of this activity -- accounting for approximately 50% of camcorded movies. However, now the same movie industry is claiming that New York City is responsible for 40% of camcorded movies. That would mean that only 10% of camcorded movies come from outside New York City or Canada -- a number that hardly seems realistic especially given an entirely different report from the movie industry that highlighted how camcorded movies were happening in many states across the US. It seems like the movie industry just makes up numbers. The reason they're doing so, of course, is to push for stronger legislation in their favor. So far, Canada has resisted, noting that it already has very strict laws when it comes to taping movies. However, the folks in NY weren't able to resist, and have now passed a new law upgrading the penalties for people caught taping movies. Instead of a $250 fine, you can now face a $5,000 fine and up to 6 months in jail. It's unclear how this is a victory for the movie industry. Insiders will still leak copies (that are much better in quality than camcorded ones) and they'll still be available on the internet. Instead of focusing on pointless legal solutions, the industry would have been better off making the movie-going experience better so that people actually want to go out to the movies. In the meantime, though, why doesn't anyone ask the movie industry to actually back up the numbers they put forth?
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Yes, next question?
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Out of Thin Air?
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Re: Out of Thin Air?
Maybe they should try pulling something else out. Like their heads.
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Serve Up
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Anyone read the DCI spec?
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MPAA
Gee MPAA.. Maybe if it didn't cost a family a small fortune to go see a movie in your crappy theatres with sticky floors and underpaid, rude teenage employees....we'd actually go see 'em. Oh, and...maybe if 95% of "Hollywood" movies didn't SUCK ASS...we'd go, too. Don't blame your decreased profits on piracy. That is BS. Try producing some decent movies...and not 4 friggen Superman movies or 25 remakes of some old 50's movie... enough! Oh...and why does an actor get paid 1000 times more than the world's best surgeon??? It's just NOT right.
Stop treating us like criminals....damn hypocrites.
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Re: MPAA
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Just ask Kramer
How would you KNOW that a "camcorded" movie came out of Canada anyway? Do they subtitle the "Eh's" and "hoser" onto the film??
Disclaimer to all Canadian readers/posters: I do NOT dislike you or your country. But I DO enjoy saying "hoser" and "Eh". Maybe I should move up there, eh?
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Re: Just ask Kramer
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gotta love ya!!
you are consistent... in the latter part of your article, you state that the industry should just make the movie experience better so people would want to go to the movies, and not steal the content...
so.... if someone is stealing cars... the auto industry should just make the experience better, so people would want to buy the cars!!!
umm.. if enough people got up and said, the only way they'd go to the movies, would be if the studios paid them, and if they weren't paid, then they would keep buying the copied movies, i guess you'd state the movies/studios should capitulate to their requests!!
peace..
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Re:
It's nice that you keep coming by to argue, but it would help if you actually responded to what I've said rather than what you think I've said. It might make for a more fulfilling discussion.
in the latter part of your article, you state that the industry should just make the movie experience better so people would want to go to the movies, and not steal the content...
No, that's not what I said. I didn't say anything about stealing. I just said that the movie industry has *always* been selling the experience, even if they don't realize it. And the way to keep selling the experience is to make it better than alternatives. Then, once they realize they're selling the experience, they don't care any more if people download the movie, because that's got nothing to do with whether or not they want to go out and have a good social experience out.
so.... if someone is stealing cars... the auto industry should just make the experience better, so people would want to buy the cars!!!
Have you actually read anything I've written? Do you understand the difference between scarce and non-scarce goods? Seriously. Go back and reread what I've written. What you said makes no sense and has nothing to do with what I said. My position is that by encouraging people to view your content and then tying it to something you can sell you can do much better. So the movie industry would be better off letting the content go free, but making the experience of watching movies much better -- that way even if people download the content they still want to pay for the experience of seeing it in the theater. If you don't believe that happens, just look at what happened with the last Star Wars film.
Stealing cars is totally different. That's a scarce item.
umm.. if enough people got up and said, the only way they'd go to the movies, would be if the studios paid them, and if they weren't paid, then they would keep buying the copied movies, i guess you'd state the movies/studios should capitulate to their requests!!
Again, do you even read what I write? The point is that you can make a much better business model giving people what they want. So if the economics supported paying people to go to the movies, then someone would start offering that and then others would be in trouble. However, I don't see the economics supporting that. The economics, however, do support free content.
Sam, I like the fact that you come here and state your opinion, but it would help if you actually tried to understand what we were saying before responding.
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Re: Re:
I like your idea of making the experience better. But the experience has been that way since I started going to movies in the early forties and is still the same today. So it isn't likely to change in the near future.
As far as buying pirated movies, I have bought one, and it wasn't very well produced. grainy, bad sound, etc. I wouldn't buy another one. I don't see them around either. I'm in the Sea Tac area, so maybe they don't have many of them here. Sounds to me like the movie industry is just paranoid. Maybe their falling sales have nothing to do with people making copies. Maybe it has to do with their lousy movies.
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Re:
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Re: try reading the article again...
(I prefer DVDs -I can get them the same price as 2 movie tickets. And if you wait 1-2 years you can see all that cr@p on movie channels and TNT anyway.)
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One perspective
Maybe one of the requirements to work at the MPAA is the ability to cheat while playing solitare. (not on the computer)
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offering a better experience
Some other theaters realize they are serving a social service by adding other family activities to their theater like one I've been to has a whole game area with tickets you earn for prizes for the younger customers and a club like area in another part of the building for older customers.
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some quick math...
New York State has a population of just under 20 million (http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/36000.html).
World population is ~6.5 billion. (http://www.census.gov/ipc/www/world.html)
So that means that 0.008% of the world's people are responsible for 90% of movie recording?
Sounds plausible to me.
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Re: some quick math...
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Re: Re: some quick math...
I don't know, that seems like a lot of money to me.
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Re: Re: Re: some quick math...
7 mil is probably less than what tom cruise donates a day to that scam business called scientology or the cost of the plastic surgery Joan Rivers has had in the last 10 years. Its fuckall to be clear.
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Re: Re: Re: some quick math...
think about it how many horror movies can one watch before they get bored and love movies with the same plots and actors that have to get there emotions edited into the fill since they cant act. comedy fills seem to sort of keep fresh and im more of action type of person which they dont make much of anymore (well at least god action).
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Re: Re: Re: Re: some quick math...
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: some quick math...
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Theatres
Now if the MPAA offered an @Home movie service...say through cable or satellite...that offered the brand new movie theater shows the day they came out, I would pay money for that. Put a price tag on it, I would pay $20.00, maybe more, to see the show I want to see, since I would spend twice that at a theater.
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cam movies bite
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Ramblings of The Movie Industry
I believe that it starts at the core product and works its way from there-- Consider that Lucas and Rodreguez aren't even using film- they prefer the digital Sony HDW-F900 over ol' 35mm. The cost of film made the business cost prohibitive, putting into place unionization, and the entire legal system that exists today. An old college buddy told me that Rodreguez editd his last few movies at his house. I believe that neither Lucas or Rodreguez are members of SAG too...
But the costs of tech are invarably going to come down. This means that it will be within reach to many business segments and hobbyists alike.
Instead of prosecuting, and levvying higher fines, the content providers should focus on the underlying theme of the day- people want content and if a reliable delivery system was in place, consumers will be willing to pay a premium for it, **especially** if it worked device independent.
I think that AppleTV is a huge leap in the right direction, and the suits in Hollywood should see this as a much larger threat than some kids camm-ing a 480i copy from a movie screen... Apple's distribution system is the system of the future, and they should take notice. It's open, scalable, and works on the "technology investment" which people have in their homes- (read: HDTV, DTS, DD, DTS Neo, et al.)
On another note, for the movie theater chains to survive, The suggestion I have is to start seeing yourself as a service industry, and add value to the value chain, something tangible that may relate to the production that can't be replicated over an internet connection. Try this instead of trying to extract every penny out of your consumer per transaction, with the aim for repeat business somehow. Provide a unique experience, and get your customers hooked at to the location.
When customers are willing to travel 15 miles to your competitor to see a movie that is more convenient, it should be a clear indication that the model doesn't work, and customer loyalty is virtunally non existant.
Anyways, that's just my opinion...
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Re: Ramblings of The Movie Industry
Good main article too, keep em coming :D
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Re: Re: Ramblings of The Movie Industry
Hey Cristopher, Thx for the correction.
While I can't explain everything, but try my best based on the artifacts. (Hey that's pretty cool. Maybe that'll be my sig from now on...)
Any input on Rodreguez's last films?
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We have here 5 organizations, made out of many men, claiming to have "seen a tiger":
The RIAA
The MPAA
Congress
The BSA
The ESA
Hmmm....
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Response to: A chicken passeth by on May 4th, 2007 @ 7:36pm
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Alphabet Soup
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stealing != Copyright infringement
This is not theft, this is copyright infringement.
Theft deprives physical property
copyright infringement simply violates the 'right' to control ability to copy or clone content.
Theft = criminal act
Copyright infringement = Civil act
Ill even make an analogy for you:
Theft would equate a burgalar breaking into your house and taking several belongings, thus depriving you of physical property
Copyright infringment would equate, someone making an exact copy or clone of something you own, leaving you with the original.
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Re: stealing != Copyright infringement
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Re: Re: stealing != Copyright infringement
that's awesome.
the future of media is internet distribution. you know it, i know it, they know it.
the film industry (along with the music industry) is poised to change.
it's all going to change and they will eventually change with it. right now they are just trying to milk the current state of things for as much money as they can because the days of record opening day releases (ala spidey 3) are coming to an end.
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criminal infringement
It's bad enough that the MPAA makes shit up. Why does moviedownloader guy have to do the same? Two wrongs still don't make a right.
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Re: criminal infringement
Actually, the statute reads, more than $1,000 worth of content in any 180 day period.
as follows from:
§ 506. Criminal offenses5
(a) Criminal Infringement. - Any person who infringes a copyright willfully either -
(1) for purposes of commercial advantage or private financial gain, or
(2) by the reproduction or distribution, including by electronic means, during any 180-day period, of 1 or more copies or phonorecords of 1 or more copyrighted works, which have a total retail value of more than $1,000,
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So the MPAA/RIAA caused their own demise by lobbying for stricter control over copyrights and for making it so that copyrights last an eternity, as opposed to the 30-40 years that they were intended to last for until hitting the public domain.
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Re:
Pay Attention.
Piracy is NOT Stealing, Piracy is copy-right Infringement.
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It's working...
So if your wondering why they make stuff up. It's because it's working...
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movies and theaters
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MPAA are liars
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OMG
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copy-right laws should be eliminated
The absurdity of the actions taken against the citizens of the United States, or any other country for that matter, by these huge corporations known as the RIAA and MPAA etc can be seen in their estimates of profit "loss". How exactly can one lose profits that they have not made? Aside from the many arguments like this that can be made, these civil suits represent what is traditionally known to many as fascism. Where fascism here is defined as the corporate control of government.
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New York? no way
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There is a reason...
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Piracy is stealing
I define piracy a little differently then most people. The pirates are the ones who copy other peoples works and resell it. Those are the pirates, and they are stealing revenue.
There is a lot of piracy that goes on where companies replicate current DVD's, repackage them and distribute them to small mom and pop shops as the real movies. Many of these stores don't even know they are buying pirated materials.
The real pirates who profit off of stealing other peoples work, are the ones who should be charged as criminals.
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Conficaste recording devices
So did he take every single mobile phone that could take a picture, a video, or an audio recording? Those are all recording devices.
And what right does he have to take private property from someone? Man... I'd go in with a camcorder, turned off of course, and see exactly how they plan to confiscate my private property without due process of law.
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the mpaa
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09 f9 11 02 9d 74 e3 5b d8 41 56 c5 63 56 88 c0
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Most copies you see on the Internet are not camcorder copies or cell phone recordings, they are high quality versions available sometimes before the movie is even in the theater.
If you download or upload them or buy content and then share it with others you are breaking the law.
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RE: Alphabet Soup
BSA = Business Software Alliance
ESA = Entertainment Software Alliance
They are the computer industry's equivalents of the RIAA and MPAA. All things considered, although they do blurt out questionable numbers and do questionable things, they aren't as "activist" as the guys governing the movie and music industries.
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@A Lousy Canadian: ROFLMAOOL
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Downloading by Students Overstated
http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2008/01/23/mpaa
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Those are lofty goals
Then, what do you do with sites like this where
you can free streaming television shows including those from cable? The provider I use here has the right to stream them. They also have a download link and provide you a link to their videos.
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