Verizon Says Vonage Should Have Cited Obviousness Issue Before Supreme Court Even Said They Could

from the going-back-in-time dept

Thu, May 24th 2007 12:47pm — Mike Masnick

As the Verizon/Vonage patent trial moves onto the next phase, Vonage is clearly trying to use the Supreme Court's new ruling on patent obviousness to get Verizon's patents tossed out. Vonage lost in its request to have a retrial at the district court level, but they're still using the new Supreme Court rules at the appeals court. However, Verizon is claiming that this is unfair and that since Vonage didn't bring up these issues at the lower court level it can't use the new obviousness test in the appeals court either. It is true that the appeals court is supposed to focus on the arguments that were made at the lower court, but the situation gets trickier when the fundamental rules have changed in between the cases. Still, it's amusing to have Verizon claiming that Vonage should have known about this new obviousness ruling before the Supreme Court even made the ruling. Verizon's suit claims that there was plenty of publicity about the KSR case, which is true, but that doesn't mean that Vonage (or anyone) had any idea how the Supreme Court would rule. Of course, even without the ability to use the new obviousness test, it seems like all the new prior art that's coming to light should raise questions about Verizon's VoIP patents. Verizon's filing also asks the court to bring back the injunction while whining about how many customers it's losing to Vonage. What they don't explain is that they might be losing customers because Vonage offers a better cheaper service and Verizon doesn't want to compete -- but that probably doesn't play as well in court.

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9 Comments

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Wyatt, 24 May 2007 @ 1:36pm

All I have to say about this is... LOSERS!!!
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Joe Smith, 24 May 2007 @ 1:45pm

obviously
So, is Verizon saying:
1. it was obvious there was an obviousness issue with their patents?; or
2. it was not obvious there was an obviousness issue and now they are taken by surprise and prejudiced?
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glitch, 24 May 2007 @ 3:40pm

2 months ago i switched to Vonage from Verizon
now i am getting Come Back mails from Verizon
offering me 1 year service [comparable] for $19.99 a month

had i not switched to Vonage, i would have still been paying $60 a month

My lady still has Verizon and I gave her one of those letters, to see if she could get that deal. She couldn't.

She pays like $40 a month for a very limited calling area.

When i first tried out VOIP servies, my choices were AT & T Callvantage and Vonage. Verizon didn't even offer VOIP.
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frankb, 24 May 2007 @ 4:50pm

f*ck Verizon
Verizon is a bully, just like the big Media Companies. They don't want to update their business model, so they bully those that are coming up with new models that take away their customers. They're just greedy old Dinosaurs.
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jason hartzog, 24 May 2007 @ 7:29pm

verizon
Verizon knows this case is weak at best. The obviousness test makes this case a moot point. If Vonage goes out of business someone else will come along to take it's place. Hopefully this new company will piss on Verizon and bury them upside down.
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SomePerson, 25 May 2007 @ 5:33am

Vonage will win
There's no doubt in my mind that Vonage will win in the appeals court. If they don't, then the judge is a complete moron (or, once again, paid off by Verizon's bullys). #4 is absolutely right and I couldn't agree more. verizon is like the insecure, schoolyard bully who steals another kid's lunch but thinks he's entitled to it, cause he's "bigger than you."

The bottom line. Verizon screwed up. Instead of getting into the VOIP market themselves, they decided to do nothing and try to get away with ripping of their customers using old technology. Then when another company decides to innovate and customers flock to that service, Verizon gets jealous and plays the "they stole our idea!" card and does everything they can to shut down any possible competition. I still don't understand how verizon won the first case to begin with. Didn't we split up AT&T's monopoly way back when...because, in our DEMOCRACY country, it's supposed to be illegal to have a monopoly??? But yet, Verizon is trying to do just that...force out all competition. I just...don't get it.

Screw you Verizon. As the old saying goes, YOU SNOOZE, YOU LOSE. It's NOT Vonage's fault that they innovated and decided to give VOIP a try.
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Manitcor, 25 May 2007 @ 8:02am

Verizon Is lossing business not because of Vonage.
But because they are terrible. Like many of the big telecom companies their services come from multiple business units all with their own systems and agendas. While Verizon wireless is great their terrestrial business is terrible. We recently moved and signed up for FIOS and a voice line 3 weeks in advance. On the scheduled day they couldn't even be bothered to show up or even call to tell us there was a problem. I call in to their customer service department and I get passed from rep to rep each one trying to explain to me that somehow this situation is my fault.

In the end I was told that there was a "technical issue" with my line and that they would call me back in 24 hours to tell me when/if they were going to install service. They encouraged me to wait because FIOS would "blow me away" (multiple reps used this phrase). I cancelled and called Comcast. I had an 8mbps Internet connection in less than an hour and now I see they are offering a 16mbps connection for only $20 a month more. hmmmmm

Somehow, I don't think Vonage is the problem if they are indeed losing customers.
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Daniel Hoffman, 27 May 2007 @ 10:00pm

I have had Vonage over a year and I love the services. I switched because Verizon screwed up and didn't auto my checking account for three months then suspending my account. Since I need my phone for work I was forced to pay the reconnect fee. I left them about a month later and got Vonage and have been happy every since. On the flip side my cell phone has been with Verizon Wireless and have had great customer service. Seems the land line guys need to take lessons from the wireless guys.
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Verizon: Can you here any of our customers ?, 27 Jul 2007 @ 12:21pm

Verizon: Can you here me ? I don't think so
I don't think so.. You will loose all of your customer if you do your business this way.
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