Potter Publisher Says Selling Legally Obtained Copy Is Illegal

Wish I Could Save Your Life, But That Kind Of Surgery Is Patented...

from the apparently,-it-will-never-stop dept

Fri, Jul 20th 2007 12:21pm — Mike Masnick

Patent madness keeps on growing as patent attorneys keep trying to convince people in all different professions that patents are an important strategy to "protect" their interests. It explains the ridiculous explosion in patents in areas that never would have bothered with patents in the past. That's why we see things like tax strategies being patented. Now, Marc has alerted us to an alarming rise in patents for surgery techniques, once again being pushed by patent attorneys. It seems that medical device companies were getting rich patenting their equipment and patent attorneys realized an even better route was to talk to surgeons themselves, convince them to patent any new kind of surgical technique and then sue any device maker who created devices for those types of surgeries. Never mind that lives may be at stake, there's more money to be made and the patent attorneys are thrilled.

Thank you for reading this Techdirt post. With so many things competing for everyone’s attention these days, we really appreciate you giving us your time. We work hard every day to put quality content out there for our community.

Techdirt is one of the few remaining truly independent media outlets. We do not have a giant corporation behind us, and we rely heavily on our community to support us, in an age when advertisers are increasingly uninterested in sponsoring small, independent sites — especially a site like ours that is unwilling to pull punches in its reporting and analysis.

While other websites have resorted to paywalls, registration requirements, and increasingly annoying/intrusive advertising, we have always kept Techdirt open and available to anyone. But in order to continue doing so, we need your support. We offer a variety of ways for our readers to support us, from direct donations to special subscriptions and cool merchandise — and every little bit helps. Thank you.

–The Techdirt Team

Filed Under: patents

39 Comments

If you liked this post, you may also be interested in...

Reader Comments

Subscribe: RSS

View by: Time | Thread

discojohnson, 20 Jul 2007 @ 1:14pm

and the laughing
...is all the way to the grave, er bank.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
A reader, 20 Jul 2007 @ 1:25pm

Hype without backup
Doctors can't be held liable for performing surgeries - the patent law specifically exempts them from infringement.

I wish you'd stick to facts instead of generating sensational titles.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
An actual reader, 20 Jul 2007 @ 1:31pm

re: Hype without backup
Reread the article, and follow the links, and them maybe try to re-think your comment.

Nobody said anything about suing the doctors.

I think the facts are pretty well represented here.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Fed Up with This Shit, 20 Jul 2007 @ 1:33pm

Complete Bullshit
this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. So there is a couple hundred grand in it for you, a reasonable amount of profit. But what of the thousands of people who die because some fucking jack-off in a cheap suit decided to patent a surgical practice designed to save lives? If anyone deserves the rights to the patent I say is the poor bastards that got to play guinea pig the first time Dr. Douche decided to try the procedure. I am fucking tired of hearing about some asshole suing some cock sucker over a "possible infringement of intellectual property". Unless someone has literally stolen the very thought from your head and buried it in their back yard, SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Seems you don't read, 20 Jul 2007 @ 1:34pm

He stated "I wish you'd stick to facts instead of generating sensational titles." The title of the article was "Wish I Could Save Your Life, But That Kind Of Surgery Is Patented..." Looks to me like his statement was proper and dead on.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Another actual reader, 20 Jul 2007 @ 1:37pm

Re: re: Hype without backup
Don't even have to follow the links to see that:

It seems that medical device companies were getting rich patenting their equipment and patent attorneys realized an even better route was to talk to surgeons themselves, convince them to patent any new kind of surgical technique and then sue any device maker who created devices for those types of surgeries.

Becasue frankly if this were about doctors stockpiling for a patent war amongst themselves it would not be a tech issue.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
wow yer still stupid, 20 Jul 2007 @ 1:48pm

um, in the discussion with the people who think he wasn't reading when he made his comment. Let me clear it up by expressing in words what I thought this article was about when I read the title. I thought it was going to tell me a story about how a doctor could not perform surgy because that particular surgery was patented. This of course is not even close to the case. The title is not appropriate, period.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Sanguine Dream, 20 Jul 2007 @ 1:57pm

What I want to see...
is the very first time a patient dies because the hospital has a surgical device that could have helped the surgeon but was not allowed to use it becuase the device maker had not paid licesening fees to holder of the patent.

I can just imagine now:

Someone will patent a device that is inserted into the chest and assists the heart in keeping a proper rhythm.

Next will be a patent on a device that monitors your vital statistics while you are unconscious during surgery.

And before you scream that no one would dare patent such an obvious device remember that some webiste tried to patent the concept of "purchasing items over the internet".
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 20 Jul 2007 @ 1:59pm

Re:
Duh! How else do you think they are going to get readers?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
FH Harris, 20 Jul 2007 @ 2:04pm

Re: Hype without backup
Didnt the article say that any equipment made that is designed for that surgery was infringing????? Didnt see that excluded.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
FH Harris, 20 Jul 2007 @ 2:05pm

You think there aint
a patent on pacemakers? Bet there is......
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 20 Jul 2007 @ 2:41pm

Re: What I want to see...
These are patents on devices and machines. There's no way a doctor can infringe on someone's IP or not perform a surgery unless he has a machine shop in his backyard and he makes his own devices and machines.

The hospitals still have to buy the devices; and yes, most of them are patented. And for good reason too.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Nilttab Yllib, 20 Jul 2007 @ 2:55pm

This is absolutely...
DISGUSTING!!!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Willton, 20 Jul 2007 @ 3:05pm

TechDirt: Patents=Evil
Apparently anytime there is an article that has the word "patent" in it, TechDirt has a knee-jerk reaction to write some inflamatory title and caption on their post that bashes patents and patent lawyers. Keep in mind that lawyers are just like every other service profession: they respond to the desires of the client. If you think people are abusing patent law in the medical field, perhaps you should be pointing your venom at the doctors that initiate these lawsuits.

I like coming here, but I think there should be a little more thoughtful discussion about patent issues from Mr. Masnick.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
P. logo, 20 Jul 2007 @ 3:30pm

Re:
um, in the discussion with the people who think he wasn't reading when he made his comment. Let me clear it up by expressing in words what I thought this article was about when I read the title. I thought it was going to tell me a story about how a doctor could not perform surgy because that particular surgery was patented. This of course is not even close to the case. The title is not appropriate, period.

Right on! The problem is that this is completely sensationalist, and now you're getting morons posting about something just from the headline, not reading the abstract and certainly not checking out the articles.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Mike (profile), 20 Jul 2007 @ 3:32pm

Re: TechDirt: Patents=Evil
Apparently anytime there is an article that has the word "patent" in it, TechDirt has a knee-jerk reaction to write some inflamatory title and caption on their post that bashes patents and patent lawyers.

It's not knee-jerk or inflammatory. We've backed up our position repeatedly with quite detailed support. If you have a problem with it, why don't you point out where the problem is?

If you think people are abusing patent law in the medical field, perhaps you should be pointing your venom at the doctors that initiate these lawsuits.

The article itself makes it clear that it's the patent lawyers who have been pushing for this, and we've pointed to numerous examples in the past where it's the patent lawyers initiating this.

I like coming here, but I think there should be a little more thoughtful discussion about patent issues from Mr. Masnick.

If you provide a specific example that would help, but I've tried to be as detailed as possible, and I'm at a loss as to what the problem is in this case.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
JP, 20 Jul 2007 @ 3:50pm

It makes sense
Surgeons start using Technology, therefore new procedures are created, why on earth the company with the surgeons that came up with the technology can't patent the procedure ?
So you spend millions in R&D and after anyone can use your R&D ?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
PenisMasterVag, 20 Jul 2007 @ 3:55pm

Re: and the laughing
Well, Penis anus vagina cock hands pinkness, sometimes you just have to anus feet colon sexy party bloody fart.

IMHO vagina anus penis feces.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
hedbanger, 20 Jul 2007 @ 5:04pm

exclusivity
is it a conspiracy to exterminate everyone who's not rich? the rich will have access to any surgical methods. for the rest of us it's too bad. i'm sure insurers will categorically refuse to allow any patented procedures. of course the elite don't want the poor to die off completely, they just want to curtail the lifespan after an individual's peak usefulness has passed.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Sanguine Dream, 20 Jul 2007 @ 9:33pm

Re: Re: What I want to see...
I get it. Thanks for explanation.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Buzz, 20 Jul 2007 @ 9:33pm

Kill patents!
I say we just remove the patent system altogether. Let everyone steal each other's ideas. Then, the true innovators will emerge!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 20 Jul 2007 @ 11:35pm

Re: Kill patents!
Let everyone steal each other's ideas.
You can't steal and idea. You can copy it, but you can't steal it.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Yawn, 21 Jul 2007 @ 12:20am

Was going to comment but I got bored when nothing else was discussed but the apropriateness of the title...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
callmekate, 21 Jul 2007 @ 1:35am

Greed
Greed is consuming us, and our humanity has lost compassion and dignity.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
death by proxy, 21 Jul 2007 @ 3:06am

unimpressed
This is no more ridiculous than the US embargo on Cuba, who developed a Menigitis vacination over 15 years ago but you cannot import because of the political status... how many US and European children have died from this blinkered approach?
But back to this article, the surgeon or hospital would 'own' the intelectual property for a technique, but it would be unenforcable to stop a equipment manufacturer from producing the tools to replicate the technique...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Lucretious, 21 Jul 2007 @ 5:19am

trial & other types of product litigation attorneys produce absolutely NOTHING of value to society. How it ended up being considered one of the noble professions (ie; Physician, Architect, Engineer, Research Scientist etc) is beyond me.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Buzz, 21 Jul 2007 @ 10:19am

Re: Re: Kill patents!
Oops. You're right. I meant "steal" in the sense of taking it without permission. So, "let everyone copy each other's ideas". :)
[ link to this | view in thread ]
kneeL, 21 Jul 2007 @ 3:25pm

Re: Re: and the laughing
Well, Penis anus vagina cock hands pinkness, sometimes you just have to anus feet colon sexy party bloody fart. IMHO vagina anus penis feces. I have to agree with this gentleman above. Very clear, concise, and to the point. And no flamey trolling like most of the commenters here :)
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Paul, 21 Jul 2007 @ 3:58pm

Oh look, Mikes back with more sensationalist headl
I looked at my RSS feed, saw this headline and instantly thought "Mike".
Not glad to see you're back.

So I guess this compares to "Wish I could save your life, but that medicine is patented"

"Wish I could fix your car, but the part is patented"

"Wish I could sell you an iPhone, but it is patented"

Because no one ever licenses patents, right?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Mike (profile), 21 Jul 2007 @ 9:50pm

Re: Oh look, Mikes back with more sensationalist h
So I guess this compares to "Wish I could save your life, but that medicine is patented"

Actually, no, this doesn't compare. This isn't about those who invent the device patenting it, but doctors patenting surgical techniques and then preventing device makers from making devices that perform that surgery. That's quite different.

But, your other points don't really support your position either, because why should markets be limited with monopolies when they hurt the market? That's not good for anyone.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
JP, 21 Jul 2007 @ 11:41pm

@30
Most new tech device create new surgical procedure.
When a company create the device with the help of the surgeons, they are often (surgeons) included either in the patent or with Royalties.
You would prefer everybody stealing the R&D of everybody ?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Divad, 22 Jul 2007 @ 2:37am

Patent Surgical Proceedures
This goes beyond any word I can find above f_____g ridiculous. As attorneys continue to wreak havoc over America, this is a new low

So now they can win on every side while patient loses: Doctor can't use patented proceedure ... patient dies ... family (needs lawyer) sues doctor (needs lawyer) ... doctor sues patentee (needs lawyer) ... patentee sues lawyer for coming up sith such a stupid idea.

By the way folks: THE PATIENT DIED!!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Freelance Employment, 22 Jul 2007 @ 7:11am

Hmm
It does make you think. This wouldn't be the first thing about patents to see that maybe there should be some changes.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
takeaswag, 22 Jul 2007 @ 12:06pm

My dog had torn cruciate ligaments bilaterally. There are a few different surgeries that have various effects on this ailment, but the one that actually WORKS is called a TPLO (Tibeal Plateau Leveling Osteotomy). This VETERINARY practice is PATENTED! They control it with a patent on the special plate that must be used. It makes this otherwise simple surgery cost $3000 (yes, that is three thousand dollars) PER LEG! Sure am glad I have dog health insurance. He is OK now. (http://glatco.com/floppy)
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Mike (profile), 22 Jul 2007 @ 9:05pm

Re:
You would prefer everybody stealing the R&D of everybody ?

That makes two huge assumptions, both of which are wrong. You can't "steal" an idea, you can only copy it. Also, it assumes that only one person can come up with an idea and they therefore deserve a monopoly on it. Neither thing is true and therefore your statement doesn't make much sense.

Companies should compete in the marketplace and you don't need a patent to do that. If you're worried about someone copying your product then you need to get better at what you do (or get better marketing).
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Vincent Clement, 23 Jul 2007 @ 5:22am

Re:
I would prefer everybody copying everyone else's R&D. The real innovation is not inventing a good or procedure, it's successfully marketing that invention.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Phil, 23 Jul 2007 @ 12:24pm

Wish I Could Save Your Life, But That Kind Of Surg
Douchebags. The world would be a much better place if patent lawyers and pro sports agents would just go away.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Phil, 23 Jul 2007 @ 12:27pm

Re: Complete Bullshit
Nice. Completely bang-on, buddy.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
D, 27 Aug 2008 @ 10:31pm

Re:
I am so glad your dog is doing well with having the TPLO procedure. Although it has supposedly helped many dogs, it does come with the risk of plate related cancer. There are a number of dogs who have had the TPLO and the metal implants used had corroded into the bone, causing osteosarcoma, bone cancer. I am aware of a number of dogs who had to have their legs amputated after developing plate related cancer from the TPLO procedure... including my own beloved canine.

This is a horrendous cancer that metastasizes quickly, causing severe pain and suffering. The surgeons who are so knowledgable on the TPLO procedure have little knowledge on what to do once the dog develops plate related cancer. Sadly, when the cancer metastasizes into inoperable tumors, the only option the vets can offer is euthanasia.
I paid thousands of dollars to have the TPLO procedures done on my dog, believing it was a wonderful procedure that would help him. I'd like to know if there are any attorneys who believe in the health care and justice for our loved ones who become victims of products that were used by doctors that were suppose to help them... NOT give them cancer! Are there any attorneys who have an interest in providing justice from these companies who produce faulty products that cause cancer? The attorneys I've spoken with recommend I sue the veterinarian who performed the procedure.... I would prefer to sue the damned company who created the faulty metal implants to prevent other dogs and the people who love them from suffering physically, emotionally, and mentally. I paid thousands of dollars for my beloved dog to have procedures done on him that were suppose to help him.... NOT give him cancer!!!!!!
[ link to this | view in thread ]