Of All The Reasons To Say No To Internet Voting, Wouldn't Porn And Beer Be Near The End Of The List?

FCC Finally Admits Its Broadband Penetration Numbers Are 'Stunningly Meaningless'

DirecTV DVR Will Delete Pay-Per-View Shows

(Mis)Uses of Technology

from the record-at-your-own-risk dept

Thu, Mar 20th 2008 7:32am — Mike Masnick

First we had ABC thinking that not allowing people to fast forward through commercials on a DVR-type product was a good idea, and now comes the news that DirecTV will automatically delete Pay-Per-View shows you record with your DVR after 24-hours. This is apparently at the request of the major Hollywood studios who have decided that the best way to build up an audience is to piss them off by not allowing them to record the movies that they legally paid for via PPV, and then chose to record and time shift. Time shifting is perfectly legal, so there's absolutely no legal reason for DirecTV to ban the practice. As for the Hollywood studios, this is more backwards thinking. One of these days, someone in Hollywood is going to realize that pissing off your loyal customers isn't a good idea.

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Filed Under: dvrs, hollywood, pay per view, time shifting
Companies: directv

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Bob, 20 Mar 2008 @ 7:40am

Well...
It seems to me that Pay-Per-View spells it out pretty clearly. Why the need to time shift an on-demand movie? Just start it when you want to watch it. Where is the piss-off factor in that? If you want to watch the movie over and over again over several days buy the DVD.

Back on the ABC deal, if I am unfortunate enough to miss my show or forgot to DVR the show I will pay the price by sitting through the commercials. They aren't asking to make it so the shows we DVR from "live' TV can't be commercial skipped, just the premium "I forgot to watch or record the show versions"
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Ima Fish, 20 Mar 2008 @ 7:40am

"One of these days, someone in Hollywood is going to realize that pissing off your loyal customers isn't a good idea."

Highly doubtful.
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Ima Fish, 20 Mar 2008 @ 7:57am

Re: Well...
"Just start it when you want to watch it."

Apparently you live in a world where nothing comes up interrupting your viewing experience. The rest of live in a different world where such interruptions are common. In fact, it's those interruptions that lead people to buy/rent DVRs in the first place.

In your world without interruptions, do they even sell/rent DVRs?!
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Erv Server, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:09am

DirecTV
Another reason to not have DirecTV, like we needed another one
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:12am

Re: Well...
So what if I keep a copy of the movie and watch it twice? Thats like telling me I cant watch a movie twice if I rent it from a store. Screw that.

Let me tell you about the last movie I bought on xbox live. It was Braveheart HD. I began watching it when it said it had buffered enough. The buffer ran out fairly early on in the show. I wasnt too invested in the movie yet. So I said okay Ill just let it finish downloading and watch it again tomorrow.

Tomorrow comes. Around the same time as I started trying to watch it the first day. Movie is downloaded. I started watching the movie.
3/4 through the time is exactly 24 hours after I first started trying to watch the movie.

WHAM! Expired. Can't finish the movie.

Did I say that was the last movie I ever bought on xbox live?
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A. L. Flangan, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:15am

Wrong, Wrong, Wrong...
"One of these days, someone in Hollywood is going to realize that pissing off your loyal customers isn't a good idea."

Do you have even a shred of evidence to back up that outrageous statement?
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:17am

Re: Wrong, Wrong, Wrong...
Yes

Detroit & cars.

They did not get it either.
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bob, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:18am

i disagree
I completely disagree. It's not legal to burn a copy of a DVD you rent at Blockbuster and play it over and over. (even if you dont sell it) so why should pay-per-view be any differently?
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shanoboy (profile), 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:22am

Copy DVDs
This is why folks like me have resorted to renting movies, ripping them to my hard drive and bypassing the whole DVR thing in favor of a mediacenter PC that I just stream the copied movie to my TV with.

Oh, and out of spite I make copies of all my movies for friends and family.
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Freedom, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:25am

More Restrictions = Increased Piracy
It's funny, the one thing that I always liked about getting a PPV with a DVR on DirecTV is that you can watch it weeks later. We have a busy family and this gives everyone a chance in the family to watch it.

By restricting this capability, all it's doing is increasing my costs and reducing my benefits. As any business owner or savvy consumer will tell you, these two combined items are a sure way to get someone to look for another solution.

In this case, it makes DVD Rentals or bitTorrent sites look more attractive. With the usual Friday Night Rental Store Issues, bitTorrent or NetFlix VoD services start to become a better alternative if you have the setup for it.

Not sure if this is going to hurt the Movie Industry, but it will definitely reduce our spending on DirecTV PPV.

Freedom
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bored, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:25am

Re: i disagree
Ok moron,,, What if you can't get back in to watch your show within that 24 hour time frame. What if it's 36 - 48 hours later that you are able to watch the show that we paid to see? Start thinking outside of the box for once.
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shanoboy (profile), 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:25am

Re: i disagree
I just ripped a DVD I rented from Blockbuster for you Bro!

Seriously though, whats the harm in letting someone store a pay-per-view movie on their DVR? Or at least let them store it for a week. Blockbuster at least gives you a week to return movies!
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chris (profile), 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:26am

24 hours is all you need
to get it ripped and up on the pirate bay :-)
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Chronno S. Trigger, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:27am

Re: Well...
I see you don't understand the concept of Pay-Per-View on DirectTV. DirectTV is a satellite company. There is no on-demand. You pay for it to watch when they say you can and only then. That's where the DVR comes in.
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Wine Country Man, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:31am

Ah the wisdom....
I'm afraid yet again, you are right they don't get it. Sometimes it isn't reality in our busy lives to watch something in the 24 hour period after. If they did that with the regular recording, what would be the point of even having a DVR. Another reason to switch to TIVO
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JB, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:31am

Movies vs. Events
I doubt this affects anyone watching an on-demand movie. You would normally not purchase the movie until you were ready to watch it, and those movies can be paused anyway without using DirecTV.

Where this policy really matters is for pay-per-view EVENTS, such as a boxing match. It is not available on demand. Here you might want to purchase it at the time it is broadcast for future viewing.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:33am

Okay, first of all, pay-per-view and video-on-demand are two different things. PPV means exactly what it says, you pay for each viewing. I personally hate it because it's so restrictive. You have to watch it when it's showing, and can only watch it once for about the same price you can rent the DVD from your local video rental store. Most rental places I know of let you rent a DVD for 3-4 days at a time, plenty of time to watch it at your leisure, and several times if you want. VOD, on the other hand, let's you watch a movie whenever it's convenient, but I believe it's still subject to a time limit.

I do think that expiration times are necessary for this type of content, but 24 hours is ridiculous. As I said, any self-respecting rental store lets you hang onto a movie for 3-4 days, so PVR recordings of PPV movies and VOD rentals should also have at least a 3-day time limit on them. That is not unreasonable by any stretch of the imagination. Also, it will make such services more valuable to people, so they will use them more, generating more profit for the providers. It's a win-win situation, and it's stupid to constantly try to crack down on supposed piracy. Whenever you start treating all your customers as potential criminals, it will never help your bottom line.
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PRMan, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:33am

Still have Return of the King in HD PPV
On my DirecTV HD TiVo (which DirecTV just replaced), I still have Lord of the Rings: Return of the King in HD (this from before DirecTV began reducing the resolution). It has been years.

Also, when I rented Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer for my daughter's birthday party, they said it would expire in 1 month. That was November 29 and I checked it about a week ago and it still works. Shh.

I agree, though. There have been several times that we could not finish a movie in a single night and if it expires in 24 hours, we wouldn't rent it from DirecTV.

I guess they want us to use Netflix instead.
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Thom, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:36am

Dish
I have Dish Network and the DishPVR. A couple months back one of the channels (AMC?, TCM?) ran a marathon of old "The Saint" shows. I set the PVR to record every one.

That night I turned on the TV, checked the list of recorded shows and verified all were present and one was still taping. A check the next morning showed all episodes taped. A couple days later I came back to watch all the Saint episodes and they were all gone - but my other, prior and later, recordings were still there.

That's happened to me a few times in the past year but it was always one episode here or there and I always blamed the unit's sluggish response and my quick fingers for accidentally removing the shows. There was no way that was the case this last time - it was either a very bizarre bug that deleted half a dozen episodes or it was automatically deleted by the device. Personally I suspect the latter, that Dish Network snuck this "feature" in during a firmware update and that it's just not seeing widespread enough use that customers are noticing it.
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moe, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:36am

Re: Well...
Your understanding of the ABC deal is wrong. You cited, "forgetting to DVR the show" and thus having to sit through the commercials.

You also said, "They aren't asking to make it so the shows we DVR from "live' TV can't be commercial skipped." In fact, that's exactly what they wanted to do -- their plan was that if you DVR'd a show, then you couldn't skip the commercials.
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SP, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:39am

DTV sucks
Yet another reason to cancel DTV and switch to DISH Network. DirecTV always seems to cater to the big boys in Hollywood... Wonder why that is... hmm...
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MadJo (profile), 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:42am

Hollywood execs = gun+foot+itchy trigger finger...
I think I'll buy a regular VHS recorder instead. Timeshifting without them being able to delete the content.
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RobG, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:49am

It's all about money and rights. If you don't like it, vote with your wallet and spend your money elsewhere.
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Yeah, another AC whatever, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:54am

Of all the things the entertainment idustry is pul
for some reason this one seems reasonable, I have never had a problem with the 24 hour window to watch an on demand movie, I really didn't think there were still PPV movies, I thought anything PPV was live, like boxing or a concert. If I pay for a movie ticket, I get to watch it once for the cost of that ticket, I cant leave halfway through and show up the next day to catch up, this seems like a similiar situation ("pay per view") Like a previous poster said, if you want to watch something as often as you want, purchase the movie, whether it be DVD or a legal download.
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Scott, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:59am

Time Warner
TWC does not even allow you record the PPV stuff, they do give you access to anything you purchase for 24 hours, but you can not record it...sucks right?!?!?
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bshock, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:00am

You get what you pay for
Buy a DVR, reap the "rewards" of external control of your media.

Try BitTorrent instead.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:01am

I still have my old Microsoft UltimateTV DVRs on DirecTV. I don't have to worry about this I guess.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:08am

possible workaround?
what about pulling out the harddrive, and copying the movie off before the dvr deletes it!
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:08am

Pay-Per-View != On-Demand
I guess this might be hard for some of the younger folks to get, but Pay-Per-View is not the same thing as On-Demand. If it were, thenthe arguments about just 'buying' it when you intend to watch it, or comparissons to copying a rented DVD, would make sense.

Pay-Per-View is a lot older than On-Demand. I don't keep up with it these days, not worth my time, but I remember when big boxing or wrestling matches, or cetain sporting events, would be on Pay-Per-View. They tell you the time, you pay them the money, and then you sit and watch, captive-audience like. Now, If I pay for it why shouldn't I be allowed to record it and watch it at my leisure? I copy lots of shows on my DVR specifically because I don't have time every day to sit down and watch TV -- giving me a 24-hour window won't help much, and effectively discourages me from buying in the first place.
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Dave, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:11am

No problem
I'm sure it will take the fine folks over at DealDatabase.com about a week to figure out how to turn off this "feature" in Tivo. Problem solved...
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Jeff, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:23am

Re: Well...
The only problem with your logic, Bob, is that DirectTV's PPV movies are NOT on-demand. They have set start times so timeshifting makes perfect sense.

I am a DirecTv customer, and I vote with my wallet. I never buy their PPV programs because there are too many legal and less-than-legal options that are more consumer-friendly.
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Mike Burda, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:25am

It's Piracy
I loved this comment - "Oh, and out of spite I make copies of all my movies for friends and family".

That is not spite. That is piracy.

I think it is hilarious that people say, "Add protection will create added piracy". The fact of the matter is that piracy is rampant now and will continue to be that way unless media companies protect themselves.

Pirates create piracy and by reading the number of open posts in this thread extolling piracy, we have a lot of pirates.
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Rick, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:38am

Re: It's Piracy
Pirates will continue to pirate no matter what media companies do to protect themselves.

All this "protecting" that media companies do simply hurts honest consumers and makes these products less valuable to them.
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RobG, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:42am

I don't have DIRECTV anymore but, when I did, I had some movies that sat on my hard drive for years. It was kinda like buying a DVD for $3.99. Not surprising that the party's over.
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Rochesterted, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:43am

It'll only effect their bottom line
I think a one month expiration wouldn't be nearly as upsetting - then folks don't "own" the video, but do have plenty of time to enjoy it. If they want to rent it again they might as they don't feel "burned". My girlfriend often falls asleep during movies. Being able to finish watching on the weekend is a requirement.

By putting this 24 hour constraint on people it makes them less likely to use DirectTV services. I was considering satellite, definitely not getting DirectTV. Really hurts DirectTV as it makes their revenue generating pvr and ppv services much less attractive.
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tubes420, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:44am

First of all......On-Demand is not even an option with satellite. Quit throwing that into the argument.

I was a subscriber to DirecTV for over ten years. I just recently moved to an apartment where I can't receive the signal (facing east instead of west). DirecTV shot themselves in the foot when they quit their partnership with TiVO. Their new DVR system is the absolute worst DVR system I have ever used & I'm with Time Warner right now and their system is pretty bad. Thats why I'm building my own DVR now, where the software automatically edits out the commercials, I pay absolutely no monthly fee & I can watch everything that I download. I didn't mind pay an extra fee for the convenience but they all keep on getting greedier & greedier.

The cable companies, music industry, & the movie industry is driving people to look for alternatives of getting their programming. Because of the cost of many things now I haven't purchased a movie or a CD in YEARS!! I still buy them but I will never pay full price, I'll go to the used places and buy them there @ a 1/4 of the price.
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RobG, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:49am

Btw, David Pogue blogged about this very issue. Check it out at: http://pogue.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/15/the-27-hour-day/
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Carl, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:50am

They just don't get it
Those of you defending this are taking "pay per view" too literally -- a better name would be "pay TO view", but the old name predates DVRs.

My favorite time to purchase a PPV movie is 2am midweek when my tuner isn't busy showing some other program, and my favorite time to watch one is the weekend. Why should that be so terrible?

Oh, and one other thing: how exactly is anybody financially harmed if I record "Cars" and my son watches it every day for a month? The PPV price is pretty fair compared to buying the DVD given that you saved the studio all kinds of manufacturing and distribution costs.

Talk about Artificial Scarcity!
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SomeGuy, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:51am

Re: It's Piracy
Out of spite, or hatred, he comits piracy. So it is both spite and piracy.

However, I think your logic that companies have to protect themselves from pirates is faulty. Yes, piracy is rampant now, but why is it rampant? Because people have an idea of what they want to do with content and they are being denied the ability to do it. And I mean basic things like, "watch the shows I enjoy when it's convenient to me," and "play the movie I own on any device I own" and other things like that. Content providers can either work to provide the services their customers want, or put up roadblocks against their customers to "protect" the way they do business.

They've chosen the latter route, abusing their customers rather than changing (even slightly) their business. The music industry is a great case study here: AmazonMP3, In Rainbows, and Ghosts I-IV prove that people are still willing to pay for music (even if it's available for free!) if you make available to them in a convienient way for the uses they want.

Companies should serve their customers, not 'protect' themselves from them. (Nevermind that these 'protections' have proven useless in stopping piracy.)
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RobG, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:52am

Re: They just don't get it
It's not about harm. It's about sucking as much money out of your wallet as possible.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:52am

Re: Re: It's Piracy
Essentially, 'protecting' content turns honest consumers into disgruntled pirates.
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Old_paranoid, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:57am

DVR and
While I do not redistribute content that I watch, I have no qualms about changing the viewing terms to suit myself. Rather than buying a PVR, I bought a DVD burner and put it in-line between the satellite receiver and my TV. Thus my wife can drop in a disc and hit the record button and pick up 2 hours of stuff, mostly foreign kids shows. She has hundreds of un-labelled discs that I am now gradually finalizing and then ripping to my computer. I will have the kids split the rips into individual cartoons and shows without the adds. Then my wife can choose what she wants to keep and in the end we will have a much smaller and rather full collection of the shows that she likes.

Since it is burned to disc, it is outside of the control of the studios. It is not HD, but I find that standard DVD / TV quality is adequate - we only have one TV, a 36" Toshiba HDTV ready device I bought a long time ago, and I have no expectation of replacing it before it dies.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:59am

Oh, and one other thing: how exactly is anybody financially harmed if I record "Cars" and my son watches it every day for a month?

Imagine the PPV cost is, oh, $12. If you pay that once and save to the DVR, you pay $12. If you're made to pay it every 24 hours, that's, what, $360? *gasp!* You're stealing $348 worth of content! You should be ashamed.
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SoonerSkeene, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:07am

It's not just DTV
I work for DTV. We are going to implement this on April 15 for our DVR's, but our TiVo boxes will be short to follow. DishDVR and cable company DVR's also have to comply with this -- it's industry wide.

Trust me, we don't like it (that's not an official statement of DTV), but we pretty much have no choice if we want to keep our PPV provider contracts.
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Jason Still, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:16am

Re:
Oh, and one other thing: how exactly is anybody financially harmed if I record "Cars" and my son watches it every day for a month?

Imagine the PPV cost is, oh, $12. If you pay that once and save to the DVR, you pay $12. If you're made to pay it every 24 hours, that's, what, $360? *gasp!* You're stealing $348 worth of content! You should be ashamed.

Oh, its much worse than that. Wikipedia says the budget for Cars was 120 million. Therefore, every time you watch the movie, if you don't pay $120 million per viewer you're obviously stealing cold, hard cash directly from the poor voice actors, artists, etc. How do you expect these poor people to live if you don't pay up (handing the money, of course, to some nice gentlemen in suits and trusting that they'll actually make sure those folks get their share)? The way I see it, you owe these folks 3.6 billion dollars! They may also accept limbs and organs if you beg and grovel.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:16am

Re: Hollywood execs = gun+foot+itchy trigger finge
Just get a DVD Recorder, less room to take up than a VHS tape, and you can get Blank DVDs cheaper than you can get Blank VHS tapes.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:20am

Re: Re:
OK, now you're just being silly. :p
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James, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:24am

Easy
Don't purchase PPV shows. Make them suffer monetarily for their bad policy.. I could make the same other forms of content.

The weirdos in the entertainment industry need to get a clue and realize you can control every single solitary instance of how your content is viewed; people will do what they want to do, and if you make it a PITA for them they will simply (one hopes) stop buying your crap.
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SlappyJack, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:25am

Re: Dish
DishDVR instructions are very explicit about "locking" shows you want for more than a few days. If you check the box to lock it, it won't delete automatically after a period of time. You can lock the recording at the time you set the event, so you don't have to do it after the fact.
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Vincent Clement, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:26am

I can't talk enough about the ability to watch programs when it is convenient. I have fallen in love with the On Demand channels on digital cable and I have fallen in love with Windows Media Center. If more shows were available On Demand or via a PVR, I would watch more TV.
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w/e, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:31am

Re: possible workaround?
What the hell? Do you just post comments like that to show that you understand the components of a DVR? Who the hell is going to disassemble their DVR, remove its HDD, find the crazy cable that allows this nutso computer hookup, and then rip one movie off before it expired. Man that's dumb. You're dumb.
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j, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:32am

bittorrent + appletv, best thing ever
bittorrent + appletv, best thing ever ... at least until i can buy movies from my set top box that i don't have to worry about not being able to move them to other media devices.
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Bob, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:50am

Well...Part II
People, if you don't like the inconvenience of "Pay-per-view" or "not-quite-on-demand" get a services that truly offers it. If it is unavailable rent the DVD if you can't rent a DVD because you are too busy than why worry about watching a movie anyway.

Just because they are trying to protect their movies from being saved on dvr doesn't mean they are trying to piss you off. You understand you are paying for a view of the movie or the movie for a time frame. Even with true on-demand you can only watch it for 24 hours.

If I understand the way the satellite service works - the program come on every 30 minutes or hour or 2 hours or whatever and you can save it then. You don't need to save it for more than 24 hours. If you are so busy that it takes you 24 hours to watch it by pausing it while you have time than you really just don't have time to enjoy a movie.

If you all are truly worried about being able to enjoy what you pay for you will drop the silly arguments. If you just want to "own" the movie for a rental price than say so.

Yes there are many ways to illegally enjoy movies good for you, you are a thief, whether you like it or not. The product is for sale you don't want to pay for it so you "pirate" it.

I have been on the side of digital distribution for a long time. But it is arguments like this that make me think we have turned into a bunch of moochers waiting for the next free entertainment.

I understand about business models and how free works. If you "choose" that business model I applaud you and I even agree with it and support it. But just because someone doesn't want to give you their product doesn't mean they are stupid. If you are willing to stea...err "pirate" their product than it has value to you. If it has no value to you stop bitching because they won't give it to you.

Peace!
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:58am

Screw DVR. My dad buys the movies and burns them with his DVD recorder. :D

I love DTV's service and selection. Also you can't really blame them for not letting you have your way. I bet if they didn't do this the movie studios would take them to court and sue the piss out of them like they do everything else they don't like.
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RobG, 20 Mar 2008 @ 11:05am

Hey, I canceled my DIRECTV/TiVo service and switched to a TiVo Series 3 box with cable. Now I don't get PPV or VOD. I can get Amazon Unbox but those movies expire in 24 hours too. If I really want to own a movie I can buy it or wait until it comes on to HBO and DVR it.
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SP, 20 Mar 2008 @ 11:28am

"Bob"
Bob, who do you work for? Sony, BMG, RCA, MPAA? C'mon. You don't fool me. You're the only one on here who is trying to make the "entertainment" industry look like they aren't crooks themselves. You're one of those sheep who believes that the RIAA is actually doing good for the artists and paying them their share. There is a good reason why so many of us DO "pirate." And for the last time, STOP CALLING IT STEALING. I am not walking in to a store and running away with unpaid merchandise. I am downloading it. It is being DISTRIBUTED on the Internet and weather or not I pay for it is not the issue. The guy who ripped the movie or CD paid for it. He's now SHARING it and PROMOTING it. It is *NOT* STEALING. But yeah, maybe if the RIAA and MPAA weren't crooks themselves, more people would actually buy their shit. And maybe if they didn't charge $18.98 for a music CD that only has two good songs on it... Or $24.99 for a movie that isn't worth watching more than once.
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SomeGuy, 20 Mar 2008 @ 11:36am

Re: Well...Part II
It has value to me. However, I would like to do X or Y with it, where X and Y are not unreasonable requests. Your time-limit, DRM, or similar 'protections' prevent me from doing X and/or Y. Now it has value and they aren't giving it (or even selling it!) to me; what recourse do you offer or propose?
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bigstinky, 20 Mar 2008 @ 11:58am

Re: Time Warner
I have Time Warner and can DVR any PPV and keep it as long as I want. UFC!
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Tom Sawyer, 20 Mar 2008 @ 12:02pm

DirectTV
DirectTv has the worst customers service department i have ever spoken to and the screw up my account every month. They have put me on paperless billing 4 times without asking me and even shut off my account due to non-payment when I did not receive a bill. I have 4 boxes and I have had my equipment replaced no less tha 10 times in 3 years because their equipment is crap. One time they sent me a replacement box that looked liek it was dropped out of a speeding vehicle. I told them it was unacceptable and they said too bad that's the way it foes until I told them to get their shit equipment out of my house. Their techs have lied to me about how the equipment works and have even installe faulty equipmrnt and told me some made up story so they could leave and let the next guy deal with it. They also send nothing but African immigrant techs that barely speak english and smell like the haven't showered in weeks. DirectTV is without a doubt the worst company ever whne it comes to customer service and quality of equipment. THEY SUCK and as soon as my contract is up I am switching to Verizon FIOS.
I am tired of having to call these morons every month and tell them how to do their jobs. Maybe they should pay more than minimum and hire some Americans instead of third world dim wits.
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Bob, 20 Mar 2008 @ 12:43pm

Well...Part III
Crook, thief whatever.

I don't work for any of those people. I am mildly in the entertainment business but only in the Non_profit sense. In one instance the non-profit is an organization, the other instance I am a non-profit artist because I am not good enough to make a profit. So I do web development for bread and butter and entertain for the fun of it.

I hat analogies because there are always holes in them, but here's one:

If you saw a car for sale for $20,000 but you didn't think it was worth that much you can't just take it and keep it without paying for it because you think it isn't worth what they are asking. I know you can't copy a car but the analogy is in the fact that the people selling crappy music and crappy movies have a right to charge whatever they want, and to do whatever they want with it.

This article isn't even about any of the AA's it is about the studios, the actual owners of the product.

Stop the argument that the product sucks so it is ok if you steal it. Again if people want to give away music or movies, I actually think it has merit. But don't go bitching about people not wanting to give you stuff that they sell.

If this model is outdated and I am not saying it isn't, let Darwin do its thing and keep bitching about the model but don't try and argue that you steal their stuff or rent it in a way that they don't allow because the content sucks.
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Bob, 20 Mar 2008 @ 12:46pm

error error error
I hate analogies, to hat them would be silly...
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moe, 20 Mar 2008 @ 1:11pm

Re: Well...Part III
Bob,

The major flaw with your analogy is that if I steal the car, you no longer have it. For movies or music, if I pirate the content you still have it and can still sell it but now I have a copy. There is no loss to you -- only a theoretical loss that maybe I would have bought the content, but now I have it for free. There are many problems with counting that theoretical loss as an actual loss.

Now, there are many, many people that would not resort to piracy if content distributors (not creators, but that's another argument) didn't try to lock down the content.

If I buy a movie or a CD and take it home I can play it in my entertainment center or my computer. Well, I've got a Video iPod and I'd like to listen to that CD and watch that movie on my iPod. The *AAs don't want me to be able to do that, so I have to break the DMCA law if I want to put the movie on my iPod.

Now, I can put the CD on my iPod. Then I get to work and want to put the music on my work computer. But, I can't do that because you can't copy music from the iPod to another computer. I could carry my CD collection with me wherever I go, but that's kind of a pain.

I've already paid my $15 for the CD and my $20 for the DVD. Back when it was cassette tapes & VHS, it was perfectly legal, fair use if you will, to make copies of my cassette & vhs so I could keep one at home, one in the car, one at work, and maybe one at the vacation home. But now doing so is illegal and the only thing that changed is the medium on which the content is delivered.

The content distributors used to be happy getting my $15 and my $20 for the content, and then I could use it as I saw fit. Now the content distributors want $15 and $20 for every device I'd like to use the content on.

Does that make any sense at all? Of course they want to make money, but this is ridiculous. This is the reason piracy is rampant. As other have mentioned above, these tactics have turned piracy from a small subset of user into the status quo of getting content.
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Bob, 20 Mar 2008 @ 1:30pm

Re: moe
To fix the analogy (slippery slope) Do you consider it stealing to pay for one movie at a theatre and stay and see it twice? The theatre does -- and that is what I am saying. You "have" to follow the purchasing rules of the content owner or the distributor, because they didn't pay for anything that can be touched. They paid actors to produce art, and distibutors pay for the "exclusive" right to sell that art to people who want to see a copy of it.

Again if you don't want to pay to see a movie "cuz it sucks", don't. If you "Get it for free" by methods that the owner or distributor do not allow, you are stealing. Simple.

Other than that, I am not arguing against any of your points never was. I am for fair use, legal or not, it doesn't hurt the industry and I never said it did.
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moe, 20 Mar 2008 @ 1:39pm

Re: Re: moe
Bob,

My biggest problem is that they changed the rules because the delivery medium changed. For some reason, Congress can't see that copying the DVD is the same as copying the VHS tape and they've made copying the DVD illegal.

Fair use is fair use. Both Congress and the distributors think that DRM will stop piracy -- it won't. Unlocking the content for honest users will reduce the amount of piracy. Most people out there aren't going to make a ton of copies for family and friends, or put content up on torrent sites. They just want to use the content.
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Bob, 20 Mar 2008 @ 1:48pm

Fair use
Fair use seems to apply more to purchasing then renting which is the subsject of this article.
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LJSeinfeld, 20 Mar 2008 @ 1:48pm

Re: No problem
DirecTV is no longer using TiVO units... so it may be longer than that.. But, there always is the "analog hole".

Same thing for the guy who says "why not just pull the HD and get the video from it".. well, if you could find it, you'd find it's encrypted.

DRM hurts consumers. Period. I guarantee that people that were going to share the content anyway will not be hindered in the least.

I don't understand how Hollywood expects to compete with filesharing, when the product you get through filesharing is VASTLY SUPERIOR to what Hollywood's pushing. I can watch it when I want on whichever device I wish. --being free of charge is just an added bonus

The MPAA and RIAA are just two rats on a sinking ship.
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LJSeinfeld, 20 Mar 2008 @ 1:51pm

Re: It's Piracy
LOL. By the way, I just took a screenshot of your homepage... but it says "All Rights Reserved" at the bottom... Please don't send the black helicopters after me!
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ljSeinfeld, 20 Mar 2008 @ 2:01pm

Re: Re: moe
Umm... nice try.... but at the theatre (and some of them have no problem with you setting in on the second showing), has a FINITE number of seats to sell, has to comply with local fire codes, pays insurance to cover you as a customer should you choke on a good-n-plenty, etc.

If you stayed over for a movie and by doing that cost the theatre a paying customer because they were out of seats, then you've injured the theatre. This does not hold true with watching a PPV movie/event twice. The cost associated in getting the data to you has already been paid for in the initial transaction.

How long until you're told that you're not allowed to *remembe*r a PPV event longer than 24 hours?
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Layne, 20 Mar 2008 @ 4:17pm

lame
I really dislike when they limit what I can do with media I have purchased. I paid for the music/movie, hence I own it, so I should be able to do whatever I want with it. I will never buy another DVD again and I can guarantee I won't ever buy PPV. The harder they make it for me to do what I want with my media the more attractive piracy without restrictions looks. I'm positive others feel as I do and right now I hope the "hacker underground" gets much more mainstream making it easy for everyone to have an alternative to annoying, unnecessary limitations on media.
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Rawalex, 20 Mar 2008 @ 8:30pm

Pay Per View is just that, pay and view the movie when you want to view the movie. It isn't "pay per download" or "pay to own", just pay per view. The nature of the product is a license that runs from the start time to the end time, and nothing beyond that.

Time shifting is legal for material that comes without restriction (ie, over the air broadcasts) but PPV is a different animal. You are paying for both access and access at a specific point in time, not an unlimited personal use license (which is what over the air grants you) but rather a limited single use license.

DirecTV would in fact be well withing their rights to block PPV movies from the DVR altogether, but they are playing nice and giving you a pretty big window to enjoy your movie. If you didn't have time to watch the movie, why order it? If you wanted to watch it tomorrow, then order it on PPV tomorrow.

Perhaps you would like the studios to deliver you a DVD copy for the price of a PPV viewing?

Unrealistic expectations of the ignorant "data wants to be free" shills.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:27pm

Re: Re: Well...
The only problem with your logic, Bob, is that DirectTV's PPV movies are NOT on-demand.

Bob's an idiot; he can't understand the difference.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:32pm

Re:
If you don't like it, vote with your wallet and spend your money elsewhere.

And spread the word about it so other people will know to spend their money elsewhere too. That's what's going on here.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:38pm

Re: Of all the things the entertainment idustry is
for some reason this one seems reasonable,

And then you go on to state that you thought "anything PPV was live", thus proving that you didn't know what you were talking about. I guess anything might seem reasonable if you don't know what you're talking about.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:39pm

Re: possible workaround?
what about pulling out the harddrive, and copying the movie off before the dvr deletes it!

One word: encryption.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:43pm

Re: Re: It's Piracy
LOL. By the way, I just took a screenshot of your homepage... but it says "All Rights Reserved" at the bottom... Please don't send the black helicopters after me!

Too late. Your browser already copied it to cache. You may go turn yourself in now. Don't make Mike Burda come after you.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:48pm

Re: Re: Re:
OK, now you're just being silly. :p

Hollywood started it!
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 9:53pm

Re: Well...Part II
Yes there are many ways to illegally enjoy movies good for you, you are a thief, whether you like it or not.

If you're talking about copyright infringement, that's not theft. People who go around calling it that are liars.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:03pm

Re: Well...Part III
Crook, thief whatever.

Yeah, like lies are no big deal to you, huh?

I don't work for any of those people.

You've already shown yourself to be a liar and in my experience liars are often like alcoholics; they can't stop with just one. So when you say that don't you don't work for any of those people I find it very hard to believe.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:06pm

Re:
Time shifting is legal for material that comes without restriction (ie, over the air broadcasts) but PPV is a different animal.

If you'd like to cite any court cases that say time shifting PPV is illegal then please do. Otherwise, I'm calling bullshit.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Mar 2008 @ 10:10pm

Re: Re: moe
Do you consider it stealing to pay for one movie at a theatre and stay and see it twice? The theatre does...
You're really on a role. Truthfulness seems to have very little meaning to an industry shill.
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Rekrul, 21 Mar 2008 @ 3:34am

The real problem with this story is that it's only the tip of the iceberg.

Networks and studios know that they can't impose strict limitations on home recording overnight. If they did, the customers would revolt and other companies would spring up to offer people more choice.

The ultimate goal is to restrict and control ALL home recording. To do this, they need to gradually restrict how and what you can record. First they start with the PPV shows. Next it will be network specials, like the Grammy awards. Then there will be some shows that can't be recorded or kept, because they're "special". Finally, once everyone is using a networked DVR provided by their satellite or cable company, they will be able to impose strict rules on what can be recorded and for how long. Nobody will oppose them because at each step of the way, people will say "Oh well, there's so much other content that not being able to record that one thing won't matter." Once they realize that they're no longer in control of the recording, it will be too late because there won't be any other options.

If anyone thinks that I'm just being paranoid, let me ask you this; What would you have said if 30 years ago (for those who are old enough) I told you that in the future, all channels would have a logo permanently stuck in the corner of the screen, banner ads across the botton of the picture after every commercial break, end credits that you can't read because they're so small or go by so fast, more ads instead of ending music and a full 1/3 of every program devoted to commercials? Would you have called me paranoid?

What if 5 years ago, I told you that all of the above, with the exception of commercials, would also start happening on the premium movie channels? Most now have logos on the screen, Showtime and some others shrink the end credits and mute the music to show ads and Showtime even started putting banner ads across the bottom of the picture to advertise other shows.

When it comes to the studios and networks, they will go absolutely as far as people will let them. When they do one thing and people let them get away with it, they start working on the next step, and the next, and the next...
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2008 @ 9:34am

Re: Re: Well...
looks like most comments in this forum are from people who have no clue and need a realiry check. DirectTV has on-demand (look to be a new feature of the latest (and not so great) update) and, I have a PPV moview on my DVR for about 6 months now, just watched it again last night.
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Mike (profile), 23 Mar 2008 @ 11:22am

Re: Re: Re: Well...
looks like most comments in this forum are from people who have no clue and need a realiry check. DirectTV has on-demand (look to be a new feature of the latest (and not so great) update) and, I have a PPV moview on my DVR for about 6 months now, just watched it again last night.

The announcement said this was going into effect in April.

So check back with us in May and let us know if you can still do that.
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Anonymous Coward, 25 Mar 2008 @ 12:23am

**cough** more BS
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Denise, 28 Mar 2008 @ 1:14pm

Re: DTV sucks
I love Direct TV and if you think that this change isnt going to apply to DISH Network, then you are totally out ot lunch. The issue needs to be taken up with the movie studios not with the satellite providers or cable providers. They have to abide, unfortunately, by the rules of the studios......
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SteveSBE, 3 Apr 2008 @ 6:48pm

Re: It's not just DTV
Per "Trust me, we don't like it (that's not an official statement of DTV), but we pretty much have no choice if we want to keep our PPV provider contracts." My old company lowered their service level too and are now just also-rans. If DTV had any guts they would drop the PPV contracts. We record PPV movies to avoid wasting fuel and time trying to get a DVD from a local provider. We don't save the movie (the new DVR will not let us do that in HD). We would save the movie because we wanted to watch it but since our lives are so busy we might not watch it until a month later. It was convenience and I pay DTV for that convenience and want it back. We will vote with the wallet. I told DTV we will no longer watch PPV movies and when our contract expires will drop the service. NetFlicks or the like is a possible option but then again that gives a user unfriendly recording industry monies they IMHO do not deserve. Library rentals anyone?
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SteveSBE, 3 Apr 2008 @ 6:57pm

Re: Well...Part III
I don't steal it. I only want to watch the movie at my convenience and that's what DVRs provide. We are busy and we might watch a recorded move a month later since they don't hang around forever to pay per view a month later. It's the service I pay DTV for not the movie. They charge me for the movie too. I have told them we will refuse to use PPV from now on and will drop them and go back to the bad ol' free networks if needed. Their DVR is a piece of ***p anyways compared to the TIVO/DirecTV I had...but that's another story.
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Anonymous Coward, 4 Apr 2008 @ 10:05am

You all american sucks!!!
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Fred Maxwell, 7 Apr 2008 @ 8:10am

Vote with your wallet -- have them disable PPV on your account
I registered my complaint with DirecTV and had them remove the ability to purchase PPV from my account. If enough people do that, it will hurt the movie studios as well as DirecTV. Then maybe they will, at the least, come up with a more reasonable compromise of, say, 2 weeks. It's asinine that I can't order a PPV and then have my girlfriend watch it, too, unless we are both able to see it that night.
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JR, 7 Apr 2008 @ 4:42pm

Direct TV Pay per view movies expiration
I cannot believe the so-called "movie industry" is doing this. And that Direct TV is not taking a stand!! Do they not think this will hurt their business? Because of this, I have no reason to ever buy a pay per movie again!
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NO MORE PPV, 7 Apr 2008 @ 10:43pm

I WILL NEVER ORDER PPV AS LONG AS I LIVE THIS IS THE REASON
WE HAVE TO SUPPORT BOOTLEG I WILL RENT MY MOVIES AND RIP AND MAKE A COPY EVERY ONE SHOULD STOP ORDERING ALL MOVIES
THAT WILL BE A BIG LOSS TO THE MOVIE PEOPLE THE MOVIE PEOPLE JUST DONT GET IT WHO THE HELL IS GOING TO PAY 3.99
FOR A MOVIE THEY CANT KEEP ON THIR DVR THE REASON IS TO TIME SHIFT AND I TELLING ALL THAT THIS IS ONLY THE START WHATS NEXT YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO STORE HBO MOVIES AS WELL THAT IS COMING NEXT IF CABLE AND DIRECTV LET THIS HAPPEN
THE CABLE AND DIRECTV SHOULD STOP ALL PPV AS REVOLT
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PPV, 7 Apr 2008 @ 11:30pm

Re: DirectTV
VERIZON FIOS USES DIRECTV AS THIR CABLE COMPANY
DID YOU KNOW THAT
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ticked off, 8 Apr 2008 @ 4:50pm

I have cancelled my ability to order PPV movies from Direct TV as well. I'll go back to renting DVDs.
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steve, 8 Apr 2008 @ 5:28pm

directv ppv dvr
is dishtv doing the same thing?also can i record to dv or vcr?
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Gray Mills, 8 Apr 2008 @ 6:02pm

I will cancel all PPV as of now--will never order again.

Ruins the entire experience-especially the HD PPV movies which are much better than BluRay in my opinion.

DirectTv will suffer.

If this expands to premium channels--I will cancel service
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Mark, 9 Apr 2008 @ 3:23pm

Re: Well...Part II
Here is a good example of why I won't be renting movies on DirecTV after April 15th. About a week ago, we rented American Gangster for $3.99 on DirecTV. It is a 2 1/2 hour movie. We started it Friday night but got tired about half way through. Since it was on our DVR, we knew we could resume at the very spot we stopped. It was 4 days before we resumed watching. When we finished the movie, we deleted it from the DVR...no need to keep it to watch again. With the new 24-hour policy, we would have watched half a movie and then we would have had to "rent" it again to watch the rest. Forget that. I do not pirate nor would ever encourage that. I try to be one of the honest customers. I will vote with my pocketbook. After April 15th, Netflix will get my movie rental dollars. I can keep the DVD for as long as I want, watch it as many times as I wish, and then return it for another. And it is less expensive to boot! Sorry DirecTv and Hollywood. Your new plan just cost you this customer.
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tracey, 9 Apr 2008 @ 8:01pm

still, don't switch to dish
i think this is all total crap .. at least if u rent from a store you get 3-4 or 7 days .. 24 hours is stupid.

HOWEVER .. dish network might not have this policy .. but they also don't let you DVR PPV at all! they suck more.

but .. i won't be getting ppv from direct anymore. at least, not after the 15th ...
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Larry, 11 Apr 2008 @ 10:09am

Agree or disagree with the move...
They're still taking something away from us. Seems to be the way of the world nowadays.
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J. Thadeus Toad, 16 Apr 2008 @ 7:02am

Hollywood toadies
Anyone who agrees with what DTV and Hollywood is doing is either an employed blogger whose job it is to go onto websites and dispute customer claims of dissatisfaction, and there are hundreds of them that get paid to do this, or they are employed in the video rental or retail business. This is all about greed and preserving an archaic system of distributing entertainment content. Hack all providers. Steal what you can. They've been stealing from us for decades. The true cost of a DVD u=including rights and packaging is less than three bucks. Why do we pay an average of $19.00? Hollywood greed and our stupidity.
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Lois J. Gilder, 28 Apr 2008 @ 8:53pm

Deleting Movies that have been paid for
Now you have decided that you will delete movies that we pay for after 24hrs. I record them to benifit me at my spare time and so I think you are beinhg unfair with this new policy that has come after the fact.
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Megadrone, 2 May 2008 @ 4:40pm

Disconnected Directv after 14 years as a customer
I was one of the original 5000 customers back in 1994. Today I disconnected Directv. I suggest that everyone cancel their service and go back to either cable or Dish (like they are any better). I just purchased a Tivo HD box. I also put up an outside antenna ( this new Digital OTA stuff is great ) The best part about it, it is free. The only thing these people understand is money. As soon as they start losing lot's of it they will start listening. The only one to blame is ourselves, we are letting them do all this stuff.
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Vic Bradley, 4 May 2008 @ 6:50am

DirectTV DVR Will Delete Pay-Per-View Shows
I can't believe there are NO mentions of MythTV, arguably the BEST DVR on the planet, and the software is FREE! Take an old PC, put a $65 WinTV tuner card in it, Download the free bootable CD ISO image from www.MythBuntu.org and build your own DVR that skips Commercials, burns your Pay Per Views to DVD and LETS YOU KEEP WHAT YOU'VE PAID FOR! How about some new slogans here? How about "SNUFF Commercials & DRM with MythTV" ? Or: "Keep what you've paid for with MythTV" Or: "MythTV prevents DRM Abuse!"
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Vic Bradley, 4 May 2008 @ 7:46am

Expiring Pay Per View recordings
It just occurred to me that whoever's behind these hairbrained ideas don't learn too much by past experience. How many of us remember the original attempt to expire DVD's after 3 playings? Does the term DivX ring a bell? Before it was the name of a video compression codes, it was the name for a self-expiring DVD disk promoted by Circuit City and (I believe) the MPAA. Doesn't this DirectTV DVR deletion smell like an attempt to resurrect the same idea? Don't these idiots realize it failed back then because people are too smart to throw their money away? Circuit City (who I've heard are in serious financial trouble) lost millions of dollars before they admitted defeat. NOBODY BOUGHT THEM!
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dchastain, 4 May 2008 @ 8:17am

Re: i disagree...limited intelligence was behind this thought!
I have 9 kids in the house. We watch everything in intervals and groups over a week to even a year's time. I just had time, finally to watch Fly Boys that we recorded last July. Now my husband has watched it and next my boys will and maybe even the girls. If I had 24 hours in which to watch this movie we would never have seen the movie at all. We do not have the time to waste in front of the TV like others.

I loved PPV because it gave us the flexibility to view at our time and our convience. If someone saw a movie that they thought we might like it got recorded and when we had time we would watch it. If we really liked it we would by the DVD so we could add it to our library.

Now we will watch fewer movies, and as you might imagine, we will not go out to the movies as a family because of the over all cost (who of you would spend $60 to $100 a movie?). The movie industry may never notice, but I have 10 kids in all. What happens if they grow up with the same ideas.....fewer viewers....If they each have 5 kids rather than 10 like me that is 60 people watching fewer movies if any, and 110 if they all have 10 kids and so on through the upcoming generations.

PPV was a way of keeping those people interested. They lost me after I recorded 5 movies yesterday and lost them all. I have limited time and I watch the cost so I doubt I will find an alternative unless someone points one out to me. I will not buy a movie without previewing, and if I cannot preview for a reasonable cost, I won't.

I know that DirecTV has lost us and no one else will get our business either if they have all done the samething.
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dschastain, 4 May 2008 @ 8:20am

Re: 24 hours is all you need...If you are a thief.
That is stealing someone's work. Why don't you take your neighbor's tools too? Oh, that was you.
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Patwell, 6 May 2008 @ 2:48pm

Re: Well...
Thes Pay-Per View movies are NOT on demand. They have scheduled airings, and in some cases only show at ungodly hours.
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customer who?, 14 May 2008 @ 6:42pm

datebook?
I hope Direct t.v. can produce the time to plan my schedule and run my life proficiently. I would like to apologize to Dana White and the UFC because I am not able to vacation over memorial day weekend and watch the fight monday night. Dana White should be pissed about losing money over this bullshiiiit
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customer who?, 14 May 2008 @ 6:43pm

datebook?
I hope Direct t.v. can produce the time to plan my schedule and run my life proficiently. I would like to apologize to Dana White and the UFC because I am not able to vacation over memorial day weekend and watch the fight monday night. Dana White should be pissed about losing money over this communist policy.
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Anonymous Coward, 24 May 2008 @ 6:08pm

Re: Well...
Your an idiot
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Premature Eradication, 4 Jun 2008 @ 7:26pm

It's less than 24 hrs!
Okay, so we rented a PPV from DTV. Started watching it within their "smoking-crack-deadline" of 24 hrs. What happened? Well the friggin movie was deleted AS WE WERE WATCHING IT! Yep! So, not only do you have to start the damn thing before the 24 hr window expires, but you have to finish it in 24 hrs, leaving you about 21 hours after "purchase" to sit and watch your flick. BULLS**T.
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ripped off again, 22 Jun 2008 @ 10:22am

24 hour delete
This how I see it. If new subscribers to cable,dish or direct agree to those terms, Then live with it. I certainly did not. This 24 hr. deletion is not what I bought So where is the reduction in my monthly bill. Do we as consumers not have rights. Is it in my contract with Dish that they may take away benfits and not reduce my bill? Iam guessing that a royalty settlment between the providers and the movie industry would probably settled this whole situation. But the providers of course would rather screw the consumer one more time. Iam guessing but I think I am probably safe in saying 2/3rds of the households at least in this country have cable or a dish plus hotels and every other kind of buiness you can think of times what, probably an average of 2-3 hundred dollars a month per site and thats probably to low. How much money do these companies need. I pay $1200 a year. Let them pay the royalties and let us have our freedom.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jun 2008 @ 3:29pm

Re: Well...
you are an idiot.
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ripped off again, 2 Jul 2008 @ 12:27pm

Re: Re: Well...
You sure like to throw the idiot word around. I see know idiocracy in my opinion. If your going to call someone an idiot have the guts say why, ANONYMOUS COWARD
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idiot, 16 Jul 2008 @ 10:38pm

Re: ripped off again
I stopped going to theaters 20 years ago.
I stopped buying tapes/cds/dvds a decade ago.
I have now stopped buying ppv movies.

The only way to stop the drain on your wallet from media companies is to stop giving them your money. YOU ARE IN CONTROL, DON'T GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY!!!

OK, maybe that was over the top. I'm all for intellectual property rights. I'm not particularly excited about intellectual property ownership abuse.

There is one thing that disturbs me. It seems that capitalism (which I am a big fan of, by the way) has a very short vision horizon. It seems to be all about the next quarterly SEC profit report. Such short term horizons lends itself to errors in customer development. Maybe the term is more like customer encouragement. These companies do want more customers, right?

The current trends seem to me as customer discouragement. I, for one, am a less valuable customer. At least under their new rules.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Duha, 19 Jul 2008 @ 2:51pm

Bob you ingnorant slut Re: i disagree
Bob pick your head out of your ass.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Consumer, 22 Jul 2008 @ 9:34am

Direct TV DVR
So far the DirecTV DVR has been one of the absolute WORST tech devices I have ever owned. Not only does it screw over your PPV purchases if you don't sit down and watch in THEIR timeframe, but I found it will also turn off your ability to watch other recorded programs if you should discontinue your DirecTV service. I recently shut down my service because I'm moving. I was all packed up, last thing to go was my entertainment center. I decided to watch the mid-season finale of Battlestart Galactica. The DVR would not allow me because I'd disconnected my DTV service. I've personally had it with everything to do with DirecTV. Their attitude toward the consumer is abysmal. They just plain disgust me.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Andrea, 31 Jul 2008 @ 7:09pm

You can prevent Directv from deleting your PPV's!
It was easy. We kept our TIVO DVR when Directv made us take their new DVR box. Now we have two DVR's, which is 4 tuners! It took a whole day to set it all up with an HDMI Switch box and cable splitters, but it works fine. When we record PPV on our TIVO DVR, Directv cannot delete it! Now we understand why Directv made it mandatory to change to a new DVR. Anyway, we still get to keep our PPV movies.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
In The Know, 8 Aug 2008 @ 7:10pm

Listen Up!
The Decision to limit PPV viewing is not Directv's decision. How many of you remember the writers strike? Well the main reason of the strike was that the writers were not getting their slice of the profits of PPV's. The limits are felt by all cable, satellite, Fios and power cable consumers. It at first only affected those who ordered with standard, Hd/dvr recievers up until April 15th, then all old TIVO units were included. If you dont have your tivo unit hooked up to a phone line like you are suppose to then it cant delete what you have on your hard drive. The moment you do you can say goodbye to all those saved ppv's. The reason Directv came out with their own brand was due to the limitations of those who dont have land line phones. Tivo requires a phone line for daily callbacks to approve programming/Directv Dvr's do not. Before you post on a subject please check the facts first. You just end up looking like the uneducated consumer that you are.
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Judi, 13 Aug 2008 @ 8:25pm

24 hr PPV limit
This action on the part of the FCC, folding to the pressure of the greedy movie industry stinks and just makes me want to boycott the whole industry further.

It translates to me that I am a criminal? What happen to your innocent until proven guilty? If I could actually watch a movie all the way though in 24 hrs I would rent it from blockbuster or net flix.

As the economy in my state gets worse, taxes higher, wages lower I looked for ways to cut cost. When the VCR died, we opted not to purchase another or a DVD player. Instead we got the dish and 2 DVR.

It was great. I could actually watch a movie over three days and not have to run around trying to program a VCR, find a tape.

It makes no sense. Why put a time limit on it. Just block it so multiple copies can't be made. Why do they care how long I keep it my my DVR.

Cable and satellite providers should be fight this battle for us. They collect enough in revenues.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Judi, 13 Aug 2008 @ 8:57pm

Speak up re 24 Hr PPV limit
Here is the notice on the ruling all the providers who subscribe to PPV service had to comply. I have the Dish and don't think it was in effect in April. But I never watch a movie when I order it. I just discovered. Over the last month I order a couple of movies to watch, because I was going to be recovering from surgery. When I tried to watch them today is when I found out about the 24 hr limit.

Here is some print on the subject from Wikipedia under the Broadcast Flag topic

Pay-per-view movies on DVR
Since April 15, 2008, pay-per-view movies on cable and satellite television have been flagged so that recordings cannot stay on a digital video recorder or other related device for more than 24 hours after the movie begins. The change was a result of negotiations between the major movie studios and the PPV providers. Movies recorded before April 15 are still available from the device.[1]

So, I suggest we flood the major movie studios and the FCC Chairman and the Motion Picture Association of America and send the message that the people watching PPV movies are the criminals they presume us to be and boycott anything related to that industry. Thus my grandsons will not be getting the Kung Fu Panda toys they've been asking for

Here is the address to write to MPAA Office of the Chairman and CEO
Washington, DC
1600 Eye St., NW
Washington, DC 20006
(202) 293-1966 (main)
(202) 296-7410 (fax)

and send an email to the chairman of the FCC

Chairman Kevin J. Martin: KJMWEB@fcc.gov
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Professor, 20 Sep 2008 @ 9:20pm

Re: Movies vs. Events
I'm sorry, JB, that you think that this doesn't affect anyone watching an on-demand movie, but I think you're mistaken. You say that people normally would not purchase the movie until they're ready to watch it. That's certainly *not* true in my case.

For example, I might record a movie tonight, knowing full well I won't get to watch it until three days from now. Why tape it now, and not then? Well, one example should suffice: How about a situation where I'll be out the next two nights, and three nights from now the movie won't be available any longer on DirecTV? So, I'd better record it tonight if I want to see it, and then I'll watch it three nights from now when I'm home again.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
TTroll, 22 Sep 2008 @ 1:37pm

Re: Ah the wisdom....
Unfortunately, my TIVO started doing the time restrictions this weekend. Now we're stuck too.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Kuroyume, 23 Sep 2008 @ 9:43pm

Sad, sad, sad
My DirectTV TiVo HDDVR just showed symptoms of this (Speed Racer - 2 hours 15 minutes) - to be gone in 24 hours. Was going to pause it for later viewing as one of us has to get up early in the morning for - er - work. But after determining that it was definitely going to be deleted before it could be continued, we watched the entire thing. Normally, I do that - watch the PPV movie or event immediately.

But I agree with the Professor. This is not always an option and idiotic. What if there is a one-time event being shown (even if for an entire day of repeated showings) and I'll be away at the time and want to record it to watch when I return? Wait for the DVD? Doesn't this defeat the entire principle of DVR (Digital Video RECORDING)? Might as well disconnect the DVR, get cable, and watch everything live (like in the olden days, kids).

I realize that this is only PPV. But will they start pushing it into the movie channels (HBO, etc.) and then the cable channels and then what? We really will be back to the olden days and DishNetwork, DirectTV, et al will be gone-bye-bye. Maybe the survival instinct will kick in here before it's too late? :)

Good luck...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
T Williams, 28 Sep 2008 @ 10:03am

24 hour PPV
What a ridiculous move. We will NEVER buy another movie. As busy as Americans lives are, this prevents us from recording now and watching when we have time.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Bryan, 12 Oct 2008 @ 8:42pm

Movies
To many issues for me. I will just continue to rent mine from 7-11 or RedBox for $1.00 per day. I can get 4 movies for what those PPV's want to charge!
- Cheap Guy
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Oct 2008 @ 5:19pm

Re: It's not just DTV
Hey lawyers at DirectTV, aren't you smart enough to tell the movie studios that what they are doing is unfair trade practice? Since DirecTV goes after the same consumers as Netflix and Blockbuster, any good business lawyer would tell the studios to go screw themselves until Netflix and Blockbuster force their customers to return the movies within 24 hours and somehow make sure they only view them once. This is a very simple concept. What's the damn problem?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Oct 2008 @ 5:24pm

Re: Well...Part II
Unfair trade practice! Blockbuster and Netflix are after the same consumer base and they are not subject to these 24 hours rules. That is the problem!! Where the hell are the Directv lawyers?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Oct 2008 @ 5:38pm

Re: Listen Up!
Do not call me uneducated! I know what unfair trade practice is. This is it. Blockbuster and Netflix are not subjected to this 24 hour lunacy. Can't Directv afford a few good lawyers to tell Hollywood to buzz off?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Kevin, 15 Nov 2008 @ 3:49pm

sound quality
Hey everyone...just rented a ppv for the first time in months. Yeah, been out to lunch. Didn't know about the 24 hour deal. Don't wanna get into all the talk about yes or no for 24 hours....just wanna know why my sound quality was boring ol' dolby surround for $3.99. Ironman would have been awesome in 5.1 dolby digital. Thought it might have been my problem...but when I checked another movie on my dvr to see if there was a setting problem on my a/v receiver, kickin' 5.1 came ringing through. What gives?!?!?!?! The $3.99 dvd rental from down the road would give me 5.1, unlimited viewings in 3 days, and extra features to view. NO MORE PPV!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
LC, 16 Nov 2008 @ 10:42pm

Re: 24 hour PPV
Agreed, I'll just wait until it comes on HBO. Can't wait for their sales to drop. Hurt them where it hurts the most...In their wallets
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Lazy People, 25 Nov 2008 @ 10:03pm

OPTIONS!!! I've got a dvd recorder, vcr, dvr and pc all tied and hoppin to go. I can burn, rip, copy, edit, duplicate whatever comes across open air, satelite and online. All I have to do is push record. I can record with the pc, dvr, dvdr or the vcr what ever i choose. I can set recording times bla bla bla. There are always options and in my opinion you can't trust anyone to look out for you, your investments and certainly not your viewing pleasure. So just avoid the frustration find another option and claim your viewing pleasure. if you like it burn it, if you want a friend to see it have them give you a blank and burn it for them. These jerk offs make enough money and quite honestly if you want to try and abide by the law you can just sit there and take it. Oh and just remember when your sitting in your car and the officer tells you to give him your wallet, suck his whoo haa, or just writes you a bogus ticket, take it enjoy it and contine to do nothing about it you scared little people. Oh yeah by the way the law states that anything transmitted over open air is free for the capture, the catch 22 is that you cannot use anyone elses product to capture these open air transmissions. My solution Fabricate Everything I have a Dish made completely by me, a reciever built by me and a capture decode system developed my me. So bring it lawyers tell me that the waves flying through the air that are heating up my bodily tissues and giving me cancer aren't mine to capture and do with whatever i please. It just seems that everyone likes to complain but no one wants to do anything about it. if you don't like it get off your lazy butt and do something about it!!!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Funny, 29 Nov 2008 @ 8:59pm

Re: Copy DVDs
Awesome!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
In hiding so they won't take 'em, 6 Dec 2008 @ 2:04pm

Lucky me.
I was angered by this initially, because we have a handful of kids which leads to many(many) interruptions. Being able to watch the movies whenever I was able was/is incredibly convenient for me. I get the restictions, I just think that 24 hours is silly. Getting a PPV is more convenient for me all-around, and I always assumed that that was why I was paying a higher price than I would at a rental place.

Luckily for me...not one PPV has deleted from our TiVo.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Capntomorrow, 30 Dec 2008 @ 6:24am

Re: Re: Wrong, Wrong, Wrong...
So we'll be bailing out hollywood some day?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
April, 3 Jan 2009 @ 2:38pm

Re: i disagree
No, but they don't break into my house and steal it if I keep it past the due date.

I don't mind due dates, but 24 hours is crap. 24 hours from the end time would be much better actually. Watch Once is worse though. At least it's not that.
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bryan, 7 Jan 2009 @ 5:13pm

I'm also agreeing that 24 hours is stupid. I'm OK with a movie expiring after a week or so...but 1 day isn't enough. A good example was a movie I PPV'd last week. It only showed at 9pm. So I recorded it and planned on watching it the next night. So now I have to start it by 7pm the following night to watch it within 24 hours. That just doesn't work.

I can understand studios not wanting me to record Cars and let my kids watch it weekly for the rest of the year...that's what a DVD is for. But a 24 hour rental just doesn't work well.
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Brian, 12 Jan 2009 @ 9:33pm

Re: i disagree
At least if you rent a movie from Blockbuster you can keep it for a week. I don't mind a time limit on PPV movies, but 24 hours is ridiculous. I don't know about you, but my household has parents and kids all with different school and work schedules. Twenty four hours may not be enough time for all members of family to watch the recorded program. So put a time limit on the recording of a week like Blockbuster and others do. The price is the same, why isn't the service?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Brian, 12 Jan 2009 @ 9:41pm

Re: Re: i disagree...limited intelligence was behind this thought!
I agree!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Brian, 12 Jan 2009 @ 10:07pm

Re: It's not just DTV
I am a DTV customer, you say: "Trust me, we don't like it (that's not an official statement of DTV), but we pretty much have no choice if we want to keep our PPV provider contracts." I say renegotiate with your PPV providers for the same time limit as other video rental business's have 1 week. Would you rather loose PPV providers or customers. For the average busy American household 24 hours is not enough time for everyone in the house to watch the movie. Just last month I had to pay for 2 different movies twice just so everyone in the house could watch them, or have a mutiny on my hands. Be fair that's all we ask, and that is what DTV should demand of Hollywood.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Jay, 21 Jan 2009 @ 6:46pm

Pay Per View
And this is why have I have tried NetFlix. You can keep it and watch it as many times as you want with no additional fee.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
me, 8 Feb 2009 @ 7:16am

Re: Re: i disagree
The price isn't the same as Blockbuster though..

Direct TV is now $4.99 for 24 hours and Blockbuster 3.99 for a week. I don't rent from Direct Tv since they raised their price.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
toukuss, 26 Mar 2009 @ 12:06am

Why?
We had it then we dont?? Who voted on this?? i sure didn't get a chance! Did YOU?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
stratman2617, 30 Mar 2009 @ 7:43am

Deleting recorded PPV movies on DirecTV
I don't think this is a fair practice at all. First it was "you're guilty of copyright infringement if you record a movie and the studio and or actors don't get any money." Now, even though you pay a fee to record a movie, you still don't get to keep it. So if you want the movie you get charged another fee to go and buy it. Well, there may be a way around this shenanigan. Buy yourself a DVD Recorder and record the movie while you're watching it.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
stratman2617, 30 Mar 2009 @ 7:55am

Re: DTV sucks
It'll be a cold day in you know where before I switch back to Dish from DTV. Dish had me hooked up with someone elses account and wanted me to pay a 362.00 bill. I refused and they shut my service off so I switched to DTV. Both companies have about the same programming aanyway. Oh, they may differ a little here and there on some things. In the end, neither company cares about the customer. Thery're too big to care about your measley monthly fee. But, so far I'm satisfied with DTV.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
stratman2617, 30 Mar 2009 @ 8:08am

Re:
Don't tell me you've never downloaded an MP3 and kept it on your HD or burned it to a CD. I sure don't see any starving actors or singers. You have the mentality of a Slug. And you're right...you are a coward and a butthole.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
John, 30 Mar 2009 @ 11:21pm

I guess not everyone lives in the real world. Ordered a pay per view and 30 min into the movie a storm comes in and blocks my signal. Great! So now I have 2 options... skip work and keep the family home to watch a movie or eat the $4.99 and order another movie the next night. I guess it must be nice to have nothing ever happen and all you did was watch pay per view with out any interuptions. You must not have kids or at least they must never get sick and you must live in heaven where there are no problems... not even weather. Does Jesus have DirecTV?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Stephanie R, 14 Apr 2009 @ 9:15pm

Directv
I ordered a PPV movie to be recorded that started at 11pm. No other reasonable times were available. Since I am a working professional, I had planned to watch it 2 days later on my day off. Yep, you got it. Movie gone. So, I called DTV. I chewed them out, reminded them how many years I had been a customer and had my money refunded. I will never order PPV from the again. Life gets busy, life gets in the way of perfect brain mush TV watching. I should be able to watch the movie for longer than 24hrs. Its not about watching and rewatching for me. Simply watching when I have some uninterrupted time. There are enough people in this world who try to schedule my day for me. I should be able to watch something that I paid for at my leisure.
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giant poon, 10 Jul 2009 @ 6:38pm

dvr
if you want to keep all shows you record google hack direct tv and find out how to enable your usb ports and use them
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Ron, 9 Aug 2009 @ 12:28pm

direct tv ppv
ok so i have read most the above and there is one thing that has not been mentioned (unless i missed it). the new time limit DOES NOT give you 24 hrs to watch the movie. if you rent a movie at 9 pm (as the wife and i did with the intent on watching it right then) it deletes at 9 pm the next day. counting fingers here but if the movie is 1.5 hrs long you are only getting 22.5 hrs total. so i start watching again and miss anything on the movie that plays after 9pm.

We fell asleep bout 20 mins into the movie and had a busy day the next day and didnt get home till 8pm so we could have watched 1 hr of the movie then poof its gone. i personally will go with netflix and the rental stores as i can watch on my time. and no matter what the blowhards say that is what all the tech of todays age are geared for is doing leisure type things on your time. would you like it if you go to the rental store and rent a movie and they require you to bring it back in wsay 4 hrs cause what i read here is that "you only should get a movie when you plan to watch it".

this new process is lame and unreasonable in todays environment imo.
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sliderule43, 20 Oct 2009 @ 8:47am

Direct TV expiration date on free programs.
Free VOD shows expiration dates. Expiration dates don't show until you are downloading. I downloaded a free 2 hour movie, late at night, only to have it expire 3 hours later. Never saw it. I just spent 12 hours of Bandwidth downloading Dexter, Season 1, only to notice that 6 of the episodes expire in 2 days. What a waste. Makes DTV VOD somewhat worthless. I just joined Netflix, and plan to change my DTV membership to the bare minimum. Thanks to their VOD expiration policy.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
jeremiah, 22 Oct 2009 @ 8:27pm

Dumb Ass
If you record a ppv off direct tv and dont watch it you dont get charged idiot
[ link to this | view in thread ]
ZerosInfinite, 28 Dec 2010 @ 8:13am

Re: i disagree
Don't be the only child of a troll and a tool...please... If you payed to see it once and it enters your brain ...you have a human right to reference that material for yourself or anyone in your home while they are in your home...for as long as you are alive...and upon death you can part that material to another via a will. It is unethical to hand out copies as gifts..(gifts should be an individual purchase) as if everyone did this in theory, one person could purchase the movie and eventually everyone would have a copy which would bankrupt the creators. But thats about it.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Steve, 26 Jul 2012 @ 8:23am

DIRECTV and DISH NETWORK
Directv has an awesome services on sports packages while
Dish Network is better on entertainment packages. On the other hand they are pretty similar, both are better than cable.
To know more about the between DIRECTV and DISH NETWORK just visit: http://www.thesatellitecompany.com/
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Cadcam, 2 Jan 2015 @ 5:25pm

Directv.com
We just switched from Dish to Directv.com, and although at least for now it is cheaper, God we all hate it. You can only play only one PPV movie at a time? We made a mistake of spending $6 for a dam movie (actually 2 of them), only to we thought pause for a second to make sure we where downloading the second movie - only to lose the entire movie and have to restart the original movie. The worst part is we had guests over. We are dead, everybody is pissed.

It is called Greed. This will be the last PPV we ever - ever - buy from Directv.com.

We are embarrassed.
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cookie, 12 May 2015 @ 8:22pm

Smh at the things ppl complain abt
You are an idiot, it's called PAY PER VIEW, not pay to view as many times as u want. Common sense is definitely not common,it's a legal thing ppl, smh
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Donald Wilson, 8 Mar 2019 @ 1:23pm

Help needed with getting DVR!
Hi, guys can someone guide me about getting a DVR. I am a die-hard football fan but owing to my odd working hours, i miss out on a few games. I am seriously considering about changing my Cable provider and getting services from a service provider that offers DVR and internet in affordable prices. TIA
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Max Payne (profile), 11 Mar 2019 @ 8:07am

Re: Help needed with getting DVR!
You can look into variety of providers in US. For DVR, I would recomment Xfinity deals since they give a lot of benefits with a reasonable price, plus some of their DVRs support up to 2TB of storage which means you can save your favourite shows

Here is the link: http://www.localcabledeals.com/

You can also opt in for DishTV if your area doesn't support cable services

Here's the link
https://www.directv.com/
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Donald Wilson, 12 Mar 2019 @ 10:50am

Re: Re: Help needed with getting DVR!
Thanks Max,
Is there a way i can combine TV, internet, and phone and get a single bill at the end of the month?? Also, can someone please recommend a service provider offering a feature where i can see whose calling while watching a TV show?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Natalie beau (profile), 27 Nov 2019 @ 5:42am

Re: Re: Re: Help needed with getting DVR!
Hi Donald Wilson, Spectrum Triple Play Silver is an answer to your wording. here is a link from you can get more information about spectrum internet plans and many more.
https://internetproviders.tv/providers/spectrum/
[ link to this | view in thread ]

Of All The Reasons To Say No To Internet Voting, Wouldn't Porn And Beer Be Near The End Of The List?

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