New Zealand Author Claims Libraries Are Involved In Grand Theft By Loaning Books
from the this-has-to-be-parody,-right? dept
Via Family Holloway, I came across a short opinion piece by Brian Edwards bitching about how libraries are facilitating book theft. At first, I honestly thought it was a joke or a parody, to make fun of those who complain about online "piracy," but I actually think he's serious. I'd never heard of Edwards, but apparently he's a big media personality and author in New Zealand. And, boy, does he hate the fact that libraries don't pay him every time someone checks out a book:What pisses me off as an author is that for every person who buys your book, dozens of other bludgers get to read it for nothing. Let me give you an example. A few years back I wrote a biography of Helen Clark. It took about six months to write and during that time I had effectively no other income. The book retailed at $45. On the standard author's royalty of 10%, I got $4.50 for every copy sold. Helen, Portrait of a Prime Minister sold 9,000 copies, a reasonable if not spectacular figure in the New Zealand market. So I got $40,500 before tax for my six month's work.While he later admits that not all of those people (and he made up the numbers anyway...) would have bought the book, but them immediately follows that statement up with this doozy:
I'm not complaining about that either. But...
Every public library in New Zealand bought at least one copy of Helen. And they lent each of those copies to other people to read for... nothing. Last year there were still 227.4 copies of the book in New Zealand public libraries. If each of those copies was taken out by one person a month, that's 2,729 people who read but didn't pay for my book -- my six month's work. At $4.50 per unsold copy, that's a theoretical loss of income to me in one year of $12,280.
But there's a principle here: when one person buys a book and lends it to another person to read, they effectively become an accessory to theft. Their generous act amounts to little more than stealing the author's work. When a public library buys a book and lends it to thousands of other people to read, it's grand theft copyright and really no different from illegally downloading music or movies or copying CDs or DVDs on your computer.For someone who positions himself as an expert, he seems to have almost no understanding of the purpose of copyright law or of the public library systems. In the end, he says that libraries should pay him 1/4 of the usual book sale royalty per loan of his book. So, in his case, $1.13 every time the book is loaned out. Apparently, he doesn't quite realize that he's basically asking the public libraries, funded by public tax dollars, to subsidize him. The original Holloway link above does a nice job schooling Edwards, and then discusses things in more detail with Edwards in the comments -- though Edwards seems unwilling to budge on his claims of libraries being theives, or to understand basic common sense. Someone points out to him that if he bought a chainsaw, it would be ridiculous to stop him from lending it to someone, and his response is: "There is no intellectual property in a chainsaw."
Edwards also seems fully enamored with the myth that copyright law is based on some sort of "labor theory" -- that the more time you put in, somehow the more money you deserve to get out. While I'm unfamiliar with New Zealand copyright law, in the US, such theories have been widely discredited in the courts repeatedly. And, of course, they make no sense when viewed alongside the actual purpose of copyright law. Edwards seems to believe that copyright is welfare for creators, rather than an incentive to create.
In the meantime, perhaps the public libraries of New Zealand can do Mr. Edwards a favor next time he publishes a book: don't buy it. Ditto for anyone who might think of lending it... er... I mean, being an accessory to a crime in distributing copyrighted materials.
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Filed Under: brian edwards, copyright, libraries, new zealand
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pay the library first
Why didn't him "pay" the library for all the books that he read and all the resource he used first before bitching about the library not paying him?
Oh wait, you say that your tax covered that? But it's not enough for paying the "royalties" for the "authors" of the books that the library stocks. I say about 50% of your new book's usual royalties to cover the library's cost would be about right. Don't forget they have to manage the books, not just store them, and also they have to provide all the other materials, not just books.
When you pay your dues, then we'll talk about your "book borrowing royalty".
PS. Judging from his opinion, his intellect must be quite poor. No good books is going to come out of a poor mind like that. Kind of reminding us of another not-so-intelligent author, yeah, I am looking you, Helprin.
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Wait, What?
Which library had forty percent of his book?
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Re: Wait, What?
"Well, we don't have the entire book due to wear-and-tear, but we do have the first two and last six pages. Oh, and the back cover."
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Re: Wait, What?
Judging from the shite this bloke writes, I would say that is the best use for his book
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Re: Wait, What?
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Pray for an update
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Re: Pray for an update
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Re: Re: Pray for an update
Sucks to be him. I wish I could make $40,000 for 6 months of work. Hell, I wish I made $40,000 a year. But no, I had to go and live in reality, where I'm not payed nearly what I'm worth (hell, who is?).
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Re: Re: Re: Pray for an update
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Re: Re: Re: Pray for an update
In this hypothetical world that I've painted, the rest have to struggle for a share of the leftovers.
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Apparently he's ignorant about patents too.
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Re:
"There is no intellectual property in a chainsaw, unless someone is going to steal the design or patent"
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Re: Re:
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Re: Re:
What he's basically saying is that there is a consumption/use right associated with copyright. That he should be paid for every use of his copyrighted material.
Why should patent holders not have the same right?
When you buy a chainsaw you've paid your patent use right. If you let someone else use those patents, the patent holder should should be paid again for that additional use.
Basically, the guy borrowing the chainsaw is using someone else's patent without paying a dime. That's grand theft, right?
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No different
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No different
Exactly - which is why there really isn't anything wrong with downloading either.
The problem is the slippery slope of copyright thinking which is why my feeling is that it's best not to get on the slope in the first place!
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Re: No different
the deal with Piracy is that you're making a copy of it and keeping the original while giving away the copies. Here you're loaning out the original one at a time. It's not like they're photocopying the thing or something
Just like you SHOULD be able to loan out or sell a video game to another person, you should be able to loan out or even sell an already bought book.
This is why DRM pisses me off to no...freaking....end.
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And it is not that unusual people naturally think that the more work they put on to something the more it should be valued by others and create unrealistic expectations about the value of what they produce or how they should be viewed.
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Re:
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Pay Per View World
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Re: Pay Per View World
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Re: Pay Per View World
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Must be a joke...
I wish Filesharing would be looked at the same way as libraries because it is a very similiar situation.
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While he's at it...
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Ben Franklin
Solution: Attempt to educate. If education is impossible; remove capability of passing on genes & ideas.
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It doesn't mean that the total sum of money necessarily needs to grow or shrink with the lending, just that the available money is distributed according to the interest of the people lending the books. I mean, why compensate authors whose books nobody reads?
This is how the system works for example here in Sweden. Basically, authors get 11 cent for each copy lended - a system that only applies to Swedish authors (or if it's language dependant - I'm not sure which). The politicians are however very clear about this being a subsidy for the cultural sector and not a compensation per se.
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Re:
What? The cultural subsidy is the copyright monopoly. Why would you add another one on top of that?
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Re: Re:
Coming from a smaller economy, I can tell you that there are rational arguments for subsidizing the local culture above and beyond US levels.
The reasoning is that in Sweden they have, what, 10M peeps? Many of whom speak English and can consume English media. An agument can be made that if they want to incentivize domestic, local language artists, the 10M global audience for Svenska lit is probably not the goldmine that the Anglo market offers. The Olga Book Club probably pales to the Oprah Club.
So they decide to throw a little sweetener in the mix. If that's their choice, and it is presented as a deliberate subsidy, so be it.
English authors, with a massive global reach, require no similar additional stimulus. Hope that answers "Why would you add another one on top of that?"
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Re:
That sounds kind of racist to me. You must be so proud.
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Re: Re:
No it's not racist. It's nationalistic. I think it's quite common for small countries to susidize the people who write books and produce movies in the native language. Of course one may feel that this if unfair too, but remember that it's not a compensation but a national subsidy. Can you give any examples of where a state uses their tax money to subsidize other countries? The whole system of subsidies is of course both very nationalistic and protectionistic, and I think it is in your country too.
One can object to that on liberal grounds, but calling it racist seems like hyperbole to me.
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Re: Re: Re:
Racism and this type of nationalism are very similar. Both are based on the idea of discriminating against people based on some group they were born into.
Can you give any examples of where a state uses their tax money to subsidize other countries?
Except, that's not what were talking about, is it? We're talking about Sweden discriminating against people withing it's own borders based on national origin. Your attempt to spin it otherwise makes me think you know it's wrong.
And by the way, you should check out the amount of foreign aid the US provides to other countries. Sweden? Ha! What a joke. No wonder you think no country does.
The whole system of subsidies is of course both very nationalistic and protectionistic, and I think it is in your country too.
Copyright laws in my country apply equally to everyone regardless of race, creed, religion, gender or national origin.
One can object to that on liberal grounds, but calling it racist seems like hyperbole to me.
It still sounds similar to me.
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Re: Re: Re: Re:
Now, like most swedes I'm a very unnationalistic guy. I value traditions to a certain degree, but I don't see any point in linking it to the nation or tossing around silly nationalistic symbols.
"We're talking about Sweden discriminating against people withing it's own borders based on national origin."
There's no such discrimination in this area. If you are a Swedish citizen you can get a share of these susidies irrespectively of where you were born. The same goes for foreign citizens writing in the Swedish language. A big part of the money also goes to translators.
"And by the way, you should check out the amount of foreign aid the US provides to other countries. Sweden? Ha! What a joke. No wonder you think no country does."
That's hilarious. The one who needs to check it out is you. According to this Wikipedia-article Sweden's foreign aid is 5 times (!!) as large than that of the US expressed as a share of GNP. A bit south of Stockholm there is a small Swedish city that has received more Iraqi refugees than all of the US and Canada combined - and now we're talking absolute numbers. Surveys show that Sweden is one of the EU countries whose citizens are most positive about including Turkey in the European Union (just compare it to France and you'll realize that this says quite a lot about my people).
"Copyright laws in my country apply equally to everyone regardless of race, creed, religion, gender or national origin."
They do in my country to. The culture subsidies are something else and have nothing to do with copyright. They just happen to be based on lending statistics.
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Re: Re:
"Swedish" refers to a nationality and also a language, but not a race.
A government offering incentives that only apply to its nationals is not racist.
Thus, neither Tor, not the Swedish government can logically be accused of racism from what is written above. Find something real to get angry about. No need to invent incidents of racism when credible ones can easily be found.
...
You argue below that the US would not discriminate in such a manner.
Isn't there some kind of current debate here in the US about providing subsidized health care? And one of the hot-button issues is whether the country should provide health services to non-citizens (Mexicans)? As I recall, almost nobody (D or R) is in favor of government money being used that way. Ergo, by your logic, most Americans are racist.
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Re: Re: Re:
Now I don't see any reason to call that racist. It's certainly nationalistic and protectionistic and it hurts free trade which is bad for all of us in the long run, but it's not that surprising.
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Easy solution
Clearly, there's a market for such a service.
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To Brian Edwards:
Your gift of stating an ill-informed illogical idea in an impassioned manner--almost as though you believed such tripe--is astounding!
I beg you, please do not let this gift of yours go to waste; we need more satire illustrating just how asinine the present 'entitlement' beliefs about copyright have become.
Thank you.
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I love you, Brian Edwards
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Re: I love you, Brian Edwards
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WOW
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It's About Time!
I, for one, applaud Mr. Edwards for touching on a topic that, I'm sure, many of his fellow authors feel is important to them: maintaining the elitist class.
See I agree with Mr. Edwards that educational and cultural pieces of art in all its forms should be limited to those who can afford to pay for it. The freeloading and theft perpetrated by libraries & museums across the globe must stop now.
I submit to you that it is perfectly normal to exclude the non-payers from receiving any educational or cultural experiences. Can't afford all art? Too, bad. Can't afford any one piece? Sorry. In fact, I suggest that society as a whole is better off NOT having the very young, the very old, and the poor - who generally can't afford culture such as the kind Mr. Edwards is attempting to bestow on us rich elite who clearly recognize the value in paying for such artistry - because they might learn of human rights some say are inalienable. Should they read more than they should, they might rise against us and force us to give things away for free against our will!
I believe those who would consider enjoying a book for free are the worst kind of person; "libraries" are guilty of crimes against humanity. When we live in a world where those who can't pay for culture, don't get to enjoy it, I'll be happy just like Mr. Edwards.
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Perhaps 'author' is not the right career for this guy.
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humor is not his long suit
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Re: humor is not his long suit
+10
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Re: humor is not his long suit
While I haven't seen it much lately, the "fire" example has been presented here on Techdirt several times over the past few years. OH MY GOSH! DID LORE STEAL THAT IDEA FROM HERE?!?! THIEF! THIEF! GET A ROPE!
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Of Chainsaws and Chumps...
So, let's see...As a writer, I know that you may have taken 6 months to research and write that book, but you sure as hell didn't work 10 hours a day, 5 days a week. I know too many people who work HARD jobs, putting in 50 hours a week to get $40,000 A YEAR, not every 6 months. I can see you sipping tea half the time TALKING about the book you are writing and patting yourself on the back.
Give it a rest. If you are too stupid to understand the value of the Library system to society, then I can't imagine your books have much worth reading.
Sorry.
CBMHB
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You know what, I will never buy anything with this guy's name on it. He's just an international jack-ass.
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"I only go to one library, the Leys Institute, where the Auckland library has sent the books I’ve ordered. It’s a wonderful service. I reckon I’m getting back just a small part of the royalties, library readers of my books owe me"
as a comment to an article speaking out against libraries.
douchebaggery much?
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Hope Dewalt doesn't sue me
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Re: Hope Dewalt doesn't sue me
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Whenever you create something, invent something or have an idea, you either:
A) share it with the rest of humanity, thus becomming a part of our collective knowledge and all that has brought us, such as housing, proscription drugs and television, or
B) be an ass, keep it to yourself and go live in a cave, eat mushrooms and look at charcoal drawings.
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New business model
2) Scam local library into buying it.
3) Check the book out every week.
4) Get royalty check in the mail.
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People will pay for good product
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Re: People will pay for good product
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Understanding the secondary market and the purpose of copyright
Clearly he doesn't understand how removing possibility to resell a product would affect the price of the new product.
Here's another interesting respond by Brian Edwards to someone who didn't feel Edwards understood copyright:
"You really are an arrogant bugger. Not only have I been involved in publishing for more than 40 years, I have written and lectured on the subject of copyright. I know what it is. And for all your high-minded rationalisations, the principal function of copyright is to vest in the originator of a work the sole right to reproduce (or perform) that work or to authorise others to do so. I already agreed that what public libraries do is not technically a breach of copyright. But the effect is the same as reproduction."
So he seems to think that the primary function of copyright is to... give authors copyright.
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Pay per Read
Or I read half of it and it sucks?
I think he is profiting of Helen Clark also... talk about a thief!
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This guy is also ignorant
Does he not know about this?
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He should shrink wrap his book
Problem solved!
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Re: He should shrink wrap his book
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10K+ Years of theft
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Bad Comparison
A library lending a book to someone is no different from me lending a CD I own to a friend. It's mine, I paid for it, and I can sell it/loan it/trade it if I wish.
To make his comparison with illegal music-sharing valid, the library would have to be making photocopies of his book to lend.
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Re: Bad Comparison
I'm not sure how this works in the US, but at least in my country copyright law covers both copying, renting, and lending. Take for example the companies that let you rent videos. They need a special deal in order to do that, they cannot just go out in the store and buy a DVD and use that in their store.
The libraries have an explicit exemption from these rules.
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He knew the score
So at this point the author has a choice. Decide to invest their time writing a book knowing that the income they get from it will only come from those who actually purchase it. Some people who will have read that "loaned" copy will be happy having read it once and will never read it again. Others will want to buy a copy. So sometimes a "loaned" copy hurts their sales, sometimes it helps their sale.
If they don't think they will make enough money from the sales of their book. They can spend six months digging ditches, flipping burgers, or writing a book that would generate the kind of revenue they would like to see, even with "loaning" happening.
Any author living since the time of Benjamin Franklin knows the score. In addition to friends loaning a book to friends, they have to deal with libraries loaning out books. Again, some read it at the library and never feel a need to buy it. Others won't buy it but recommend it to friends who do.
If you don't think the book will turn a profit at this point. Don't write it. He knew from day one this is how the system works. If he does not want patrons of the library "freeloading" off of his work and research. Then he should not have written the book in the first place.
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Copy- Privilege not Copyright
If he is claiming that his intellectual property - his writing - is in some way different to the intellectual property of a patent holder I'm not sure how he can explain his reasoning.
He has sold his intellectual property to a publisher (regardless of the terms) and they have produced a product exactly the same as the chainsaw has been produced from the intellectual property of the patent holder/s.
That's the simple reality of the situation. What happens to the product after that is none of his business as far as I'm concerned. I can understand that most authors and other creative individuals have very strong feelings about their work but it doesn't change reality, it just makes it hard for them to accept it.
Think of how many authors get upset by the movies made from their books. Some won't even allow the rights to be sold and that's their right but you just can't hold onto an 'idea' for ever which is why copyright should be called 'copy-privilege'!
It's reward for your effort, yes, but it doesn't infer that ideas (no matter how well expressed) exist without external inspiration and therefore don't exist in a vacuum.
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What a cock-knocker
Sheesh.
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Re: What a cock-knocker
I'll ignore the fact that over $1,000 of his $40,500 in sales came from libraries purchasing his book.
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NZ Public Lending Right
See
http://www.creativenz.govt.nz/Funding/PublicLendingRightforNZAuthors/tabid/3522/language /en-NZ/Default.aspx
The Public Lending Right for New Zealand Authors scheme was established by the Public Lending Right for New Zealand Authors Act 2008.
The act set up a statutory scheme to provide annual payments to New Zealand authors in recognition of the fact that their books are available for use in New Zealand Libraries. The scheme replaces the now disestablished New Zealand Authors’ Fund and transfers administration from Creative New Zealand to the National Library of New Zealand.
The purpose of the Public Lending Right scheme is to compensate New Zealand authors for the use of their books in public libraries.
Authors are entitled to receive annual compensation based on the number of copies of their title/s determined to be held in New Zealand public libraries.This is determined by a survey undertaken by The National Library.
An author must register with the scheme each year in order to be eligible for payment. The registration period is between 1 January and 30 April each year, any payment owing is made in mid December.
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Re: NZ Public Lending Right
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is he serious?
http://brianedwardsmedia.co.nz/2009/09/why-public-libraries-are-just-a-form-of-theft/
>'BE
September 24th, 2009 at 13:33
"Do Rita Angus or Dick Frizell complain that their work is up on display at Te Papa? I don’t even have to pay them a cent to enjoy what they’ve made, but I guess Te Papa spends quite a bit to acquire them on my behalf.
Most of this seems reasonable, Timothy. Two points, however.
When an artist sells a painting, it seems to me that he/she transfers ownership of that painting entirely to the purchaser, who may do with the painting what they think fit - show it to lots of other people, exhibit it, lend it to others to exhibit, re-sell it, hide it in the basement, destroy it. The price of the painting reflects this. This one sale will or hopefully should reimburse the painter for his work. The author requires volume sales to survive.
As to whether reading a library book encourges the reader to buy copies of the author’s other work, I think it’s much more likely that that library-user will look for the author’s other books in the library. I went through a Thomas Keneally phase some years ago and read virtually everything he’d written. Got them all delivered by the Auckland Central Library to the Leys Institute in Ponsonby. Wonderful. Cost me a dollar though. Shocking!"'
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Re: is he serious?
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Re: Re: is he serious?
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I don't bitch that I'm not paid for my book
So, I self-published it online as a free ebook, even putting it on The Pirate Bay and Mininova as a torrent. It's been downloaded more than 6000 times and I have received no money from it. Naturally it would be nice to make some money but I feel it's more important to share the knowledge and give back to the Internet community where I learned to program in the first place.
Maybe when I revise the book I will set up some way to make it financially beneficial to me. But, I certainly don't think people are stealing from me; I borrowed plenty of ideas from other programming books and web sites.
And that's where Mr. Edwards runs into a vicious cycle: in his world, would I be responsible for paying the authors of my research data, especially web sites? Obviously any library books should be providing a cut to the authors but what about all the "free" tutorials on the web? I would suspect that Mr. Edwards feels that ad-supported sites aren't enough and anyone that gained knowledge from a site should chip in with a donation, just to ensure the author can make a living.
I wrote my book on my own time; I have a "real" job in the military. As a matter of fact, I wrote my book while deployed to Iraq; I didn't have a nice, cozy little house to stay in while writing. It may not be a professional book with paid copy editors, but it was a work of love, if you will, not greed.
It would be nice to be paid to spend just a couple hours a day writing and then do whatever I wanted for the rest of the time, because that's exactly what I did while writing my book. I'm not a professional but there is simply no way someone can spend a full work-day writing. In reality, Mr. Edwards probably made $40000 for 4-6 hours a day of work for 6 months. Not that bad.
Simply put, I feel no sympathy for these so-called "struggling artists". If you aren't making enough money, then get a real job and write in your spare time. I did, in a war zone even, so it can be done.
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Re: I don't bitch that I'm not paid for my book
that is complete b.s. that there's no interest for a beginnners guide to programming or an intro to programming. i was at the library last week searching for books because i don't have a starting point. i found a couple of books and the dummies guide to programming and i will read it when i have time, but i went to the library because i don't know where i need to start off, and i can't just go to the bookstore and buy a book. if this dummies guide is good (will probably skim it b/c i'm busy)i will go and actually purchase it because i need to own it. i also worked at a big bookstore and yeah the market is saturated (lots of programming books) and that publisher is right in that aspect but if your beginners book is good, then it can't be just like all the other books on intro to programming or getting started or w/e titles authors use.
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Re: I don't bitch that I'm not paid for my book
Check your link.
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Re: Re: I don't bitch that I'm not paid for my book
http://python-ebook.blogspot.com/
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Re: Re: Re: I don't bitch that I'm not paid for my book
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Re: I don't bitch that I'm not paid for my book
When the libraries purchase their books, obviously the publisher gets the money and then doles it out to the author. Whatever the author's contract states is what he is paid; no "double dipping" by having extra cash every time someone borrows a book.
I believe libraries have the same sort of contracts as movie rental stores: they pay a different price vs. standard retail, usually more to compensate for the payback in rentals. Hence, I suspect authors actually get a larger paycheck when libraries buy their books.
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Re: Re: I don't bitch that I'm not paid for my book
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that said, i don't read biographies much and have no interest in stuff about Helen Clark, nor a good memory or names.
that aside, most libraries in this country are owned by either city or district councils. local government. we also have a unitary system, functionally they can only do what the national government lets them [but the national government doesn't interfere with them much most of the time].
if you're not from the appropriate district, there IS typically a fee of some description to use the library.
most people who buy your book? probably never heard of it before encountering it at a library.
the libraries are payed for by the rates [local utilities and amenities taxes, basically], there for, technically, what's actually happened is that every citizen of that district owns a part share in the book. they can go read it whenever they like because they're part owner.
some of them then go buy their own copies so they don't have to share.
the way i figure it, the authors should LOVE libraries. libraries = almost guaranteed sales [to the libraries themselves] as long as you make them aware your book exists [or it seems that way, given the amount of utter garbage that floats around there with the good stuff]. they also = free advertising.
this argument annoys me no end. books on my shelf? the vast majority that is not manga i found via a scanlation site or random gifts by relatives when i was a kid? found at the library.
libraries do not cost yous sales. they result in people who couldn't afford your book anyway or have never heard of you actually becoming aware of it's existence, and yours, and ensure the information contained there in is available and accessible as part of the local knowledge base.
you know, all the arguments people put forward against libraries periodically,here at least, can often be answered with 'so... you're rather they DIDN'T pay you for the books?' hehehe.
yay for big rant.
I'm a fan of books, libraries, and so on. True education is Win.
i am not a fan of stupid people, ignorance, or avoidable error.
thus the above.
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Public libraries are taxpayer-funded institutions. Every time a library owns a book, the public is collectively giving money to purchase it. Everyone in the community ALREADY owns the book.
Screw copyright law, and screw anyone who supports this.
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For this book, over the estimated duration of time I'd own it, we're looking at a value of $0.013 per week. He's complaining that he's not getting paid $8.74 for the same time period.
That's a 650x markup over the value of the book. If he gets his way that's possibly the best markup I've ever seen.
To bad the anonymous commenter is right when they say that, because these books are payed for with taxpayer money, we already collectively own them. In which case charging for lending would be pretty much the same thing as requiring all home bookshelves be converted to pay-per-use vending machines.
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What's next - pay a fee everytime you open his book?
I'm glad he does not write reference material.
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In fact, it's unlikely that Edwards' own book would have even found a publisher if it weren't for the fact that libraries make regular orders of books like his, which in turn means that publishers can afford to publish them. If he -- and most other authors for that matter -- had to rely on the book-buying individual to make up their numbers, they'd be truly sorry.
This is also why cutting library acquisition budgets is such a serious problem. Not only does the library lose the ability to serve its patrons, it also loses the ability to play an important role in the publishing industry -- that is, to provide a market for books that should be written and read but otherwise wouldn't be profitable and to buy books so that people who cannot afford to read them can.
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Who?
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Deleted it? - Not so much
Cache of Edwards' Post
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