RapidShare Ordered To Prevent Users From Uploading Certain Books... Or Face Fines And Jailtime

from the misplaced-blame dept

Fri, Feb 26th 2010 3:47pm — Mike Masnick

Having already been told by a German court that it needs to magically know what songs infringe and which do not, file storage locker site RapidShare was already facing some difficult legal issues in that country. And now that company faces another problem. It's been ordered by a German court to figure out a way to proactively block the upload of 148 titles. Of course, the company can try to do some fingerprinting, but there are always ways around things like that -- and that creates a huge problem for RapidShare. Because if one of its users figures out how to upload one of these books, RapidShare takes the blame -- in the form of $339,000 fine and 2 years of jailtime for execs for each instance that a forbidden work gets through. In what world does it make sense to hold the execs of a company criminally liable for something done by the users of the site?

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Filed Under: books, copyright, germany, liability, rapidshare, secondary liability
Companies: rapidshare

45 Comments

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Planespotter (profile), 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:06pm

In what world does it make sense to hold the execs of a company criminally liable for something done by the users of the site?

Obviously this one, or at least if you belong to the Italian and German judiciary!
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Grammah Correction Specialist, 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:11pm

Here's more errorz that need fixing:

1.)"needs to magically know" is a split infinitive. Consider replacing it with "must magically know."
2.) "its users figure" has a subject conflict with verb "figures." Replace "its" with "their."
3.) "in the form of" is wordy. Why not shorten it to "as"?
4.) Also, be sure to spell out numbers less than or equal to ten. You didn't spell out "two".

For grammah tips, tricks, help, and training, please visit mai Facebook group-
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#/pages/Taylorsville-UT/Daily-Grammar/36339933998
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:12pm

In what world does it make sense to hold Hitler criminally liable for something done by the citizens of Germany?
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:15pm

Re:
Much of it has to do with U.S. influence on these governments.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:18pm

Re:
What? I hope you aren't trying to argue that the executives should be held liable for what their users do? Seriously, if you are this is a terrible analogy.

A: Hitler actively encouraged his citizens to act the way they did. The executives are not doing so. Yes, webservers, guns, cars, etc... can all be used for illegal purposes but there is a difference between selling a car and telling those who buy it to use it to crash into buildings.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:18pm

Re:
Wrong yet again.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:27pm

Re: Re:
You are completely right and I would thank you for exposing my ignorance but I was trolling and accidently Godwin'd myself.
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Whicpox, 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:30pm

Agreed
I agree. Holding the execs personally liable for what the anonymous users of the site do is pure stupidity. Considering that all rapidshare users have to do is label it with a name other than the actual file, rar it up, and point to it from elsewhere, these guys will be doing some serious jailtime - that sucks.
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big al, 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:30pm

rs.de
rapidshare.de has announced that all it's servers will shut down as of march 1.. rapidshare.com will still be running as usual. it's in Switzerland i believe... so much for their german employees and taxes...
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Esahc (profile), 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:32pm

Re:
Really, "Errorz", "grammah", "mai"? Please tell me your doing this on purpose.
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Mike C. (profile), 26 Feb 2010 @ 4:49pm

Re: rs.de
I'm not sure where the announcement is, but it's front and center on the rapidshare.de main page. I guess that's one way to eliminate the liability.

Now if only Google could afford to cease operations in Italy, we'd see if these sorts of responses could wake the judiciary up.
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rick, 26 Feb 2010 @ 5:07pm

Re:
Your an ass
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 5:07pm

Re:
grammah please!
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 5:08pm

The true reason behind these cruel and unusual punishments to entities that do nothing wrong is to make the Internet look like everything outside the Internet, to stop people from sharing books released under a CC license. This is a another example of how copyright only hinders the progress. Because of copyright companies are afraid to allow people to freely host CC books in fear of facing ridiculous punishments for doing absolutely nothing wrong.
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Chargone (profile), 26 Feb 2010 @ 5:10pm

Re:
Split infinitive: normal English grammar. Failing to split it emphasizes the adjective. Splitting emphasizes the noun (or possibly nothing at all)

subject conflict: the users are doing the figuring. users is plural. company is a single entity with no gender, therefore its is correct for ownership(and is an adjective for the noun 'users' in this case anyway). That said, i believe 'their' is acceptable also, as a company is made up of many people.

'in the form of', 'as', i wish i could remember what the rule is covering this, but 'in the form of' is actually preferable. more worrying is the missing 'a' after this phrase and before the number.

generally one does spell out numbers ten or less, however measurements (such as grams, pounds, liters, etc) are often written as numerals regardless. years, not so much... that said, consistency and clarity are more important in this matter than whatever rule someone dug up out of a book somewhere. (especially considering that the most influential such book in the USA is, apparently, not only badly wrong but often contradicts it's rules in the explaination or examples for the rule in question)

on a distinctly more on topic note: i know NZ is weird, but seriously, what is With Europe? in some ways it's stranger to me than japan is, which is quite the achievement.

of course, the USA's no better, so meh *shrugs*
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 5:12pm

Re: Re: rs.de
The problem is that the limited liability is only intended to protect corporate leaders who intentionally do something wrong (ie: when Ford knowingly cut costs with their pinto knowing that it might be dangerous), it's not designed to apply to corporations that do nothing wrong (ie: Google execs who got jailed for no good reason). The corporate veil is a scam.

We as a society value IP privileges and their enforcement more than we value human life (as long as that human life is not within the top one percent that is, in terms of wealth).
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 5:21pm

"Now if only Google could afford to cease operations in Italy, we'd see if these sorts of responses could wake the judiciary up."

if google or other high profile companies were to do such a thing it could massivley backfire by making it look like they're running away from justice/above he law. its better to stay and fight and if you loose find a moraly corupt politician to change some laws for you.
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Alan Gerow (profile), 26 Feb 2010 @ 5:35pm

Re:
You don't really know anything about grammar do you?

You're giving spelling advice?!?
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Flakey, 26 Feb 2010 @ 5:50pm

Leave the country
If I were head of Goggle or RS, the first thing would be leave the country, the second to block the IP block of the country in its entirety.

It's all great and good to say stay and fight. If you were the head of either would you, facing jail time and fine?

We all know blocking a country's IP range isn't going to prevent people in those areas from accessing.

It would have the effect of having the people ask, "WTF", from their governments.
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Brian (profile), 26 Feb 2010 @ 5:55pm

Behind the scenes
I mean I have a feeling there are palms being greased behind the scenes and this is all just a way to try and force the website to shut down completely. There is no possible way they can figure out an fool proof plan to begin with aside shutting down completely or having some multimillion dollar operation in which all files are uploaded, individually reviewed, and approved.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2010 @ 9:59pm

Please don't feed the grammar troll.
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Another AC, 27 Feb 2010 @ 5:02am

Re: Re:
Source? Or are you speaking out of your ass?
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Big Al, 27 Feb 2010 @ 5:15am

liability
Would it be too different to ISPs facing enforcement of a 'three-strikes' rule? What legal ramifications would they face is they failed to act of the allegations of one of the MAFIAA members?
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btr1701 (profile), 27 Feb 2010 @ 7:15am

Re: Law
> it could massivley backfire by making it look like they're running
> away from justice/above he law

Not sure how that would work. It's just Google saying, "Hey, if that's what you want from us, if that's what your law requires, then we can't do business with you." Happens all the time in industries around the world.

You're saying that if I own a company, I *have* to do business in Italy or I'll appear to be above the law? Nonsense.
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btr1701 (profile), 27 Feb 2010 @ 7:17am

Re: Leave the country
> It's all great and good to say stay and fight. If you were the head
> of either would you, facing jail time and fine?

They're not really facing prison. So long as the Google execs stay out of Italy, they'll be just fine. There's no way the U.S. is going to start extraditing it's top-level business executives over nonsense like this.
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2010 @ 8:53am

Re: rs.de
rapidshare.de has announced that all it's servers will shut down as of march 1..

Which I believe is what the judge actually wanted anyway.

A game that judges sometimes play is to give a you a choice between two alternative actions:
1. Something that would be impossible for you to do.
2. Whatever it is that the judge actually wants you to do.
Then, when you of course choose action number two, the judge can (rather dishonestly) claim "I didn't make them do that, it was their own choice!"

In this case the judge obviously wanted RapidShare shut down and he's getting what he wanted.
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2010 @ 8:54am

Re: Re: Re:
Source? Or are you speaking out of your ass?

Says the ass.
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2010 @ 9:07am

Re:
its better to stay and fight and if you loose find a moraly corupt politician to change some laws for you.

Read the story above: Rapid share did stay and fight (they went to court). And they lost.

As to buying politicians, I don't know about Germany, but in the US they tend to go to the highest bidder. Do you think RapidShare could outbid the copyright industry? Really?
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2010 @ 9:09am

Re: Leave the country
If I were head of Goggle or RS, the first thing would be leave the country, the second to block the IP block of the country in its entirety.

Umm, what would that accomplish?
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2010 @ 9:11am

Re:
"Please don't feed the grammar troll."

That should have been: "Please, don't feed the grammar troll."
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2010 @ 9:17am

Rapidshare wants all of the benefits and none of the responsibility. How many millions do they make every year facilitating piracy?
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Marcus Carab (profile), 27 Feb 2010 @ 9:23am

Re: Re:
It's also worth noting that the spelling of numbers is a matter of typographic style not grammar, and those are two entirely different parts of English.
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2010 @ 10:06am

Re:
Just as many millions are the car dealerships make facilitating bank robberies, road maintainers make facilitating hit'n'runs, phone companies make facilitating fraud, email providers facilitating scams, gun dealers make facilitating murder, pharmacies make facilitating suicide and overdose, and the copyright industry makes facilitating stupidity like yours.
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2010 @ 10:35am

Re: Re: rs.de
More examples of how IP hinders innovation. Rapidshare is a huge innovation, IP is a crime, and yet this crime hindered a perfectly good innovation.
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Panoptes, 27 Feb 2010 @ 4:47pm

Re:
1: There is nothing wrong with splitting infinitives.
2: The grammar is correct as it stands.
3: This is a matter of style and personal choice.
4: The important thing is consistency of usage.
5: You know sweet FA about grammar.
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Panoptes, 27 Feb 2010 @ 5:05pm

Physician, heal thyself
"often contradicts it's rules"

it's = it is
its = possessive
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Anonymous Coward, 28 Feb 2010 @ 1:21am

so mercenary thugs can get away with gunning down civilians (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN0439965120071005) but let something that's completely out of your control happen on a site that gets thousands of hits per day and you get jail time
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techflaws.org (profile), 28 Feb 2010 @ 3:40am

Driving them out of business
Nice strategy. What's to stop content owners to anonymously upload some of those books and alerting the authorities about rapdishare being in violation of that ruling?
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matt, 28 Feb 2010 @ 8:25pm

Re:
Mike! please ban the IP address of the douche bag that keeps posting this crap... all it does is hijack the thread, taking away from the comments that are pertinent to the article.
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Helen, 1 Mar 2010 @ 5:05am

How are they going to enforce this
i mean , you could just as easily change the file format or compress or encrypt. How can they know what you are uploading?

Helen
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Pickle Monger (profile), 1 Mar 2010 @ 7:38am

Responsibilty
Better question is how the German courts are planning to assert jurisdiction in any potential criminal proccedings against the company execs since the German RapidShare site doesn't exist anymore? Maybe they could try invading...
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mccheever (profile), 1 Mar 2010 @ 9:17am

Rapid Share Kraut NONSENSE
That's because Germany is Once again Morphing into a facist Nation and My Heritage is German So I can say Anything I WANT about them NAH NAH NAH NAH ! !
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mccheever (profile), 1 Mar 2010 @ 9:19am

Re: Gramah
Love it Dude real Grammar is a B*tch but Cool to Know and Use
and I Would Love to Split Infinitives with anyone right about now better than Splitting or Spiting out hairs ! !
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Sarah Plumber, 16 Sep 2010 @ 1:30am

Well.....
People will always find a way around uploading the books; it's a never ending battle and a lot of hard work for RapidShare.
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steven, 19 Feb 2012 @ 7:43am

downloads
i think its nice to get a free download but copyright is there for a reason
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