With The LimeWire Mole Wac'd, Up Pops Plenty Of Other Options... Including A New Limewire

from the oh-look,-another-mole dept

Tue, Nov 9th 2010 4:44pm — Mike Masnick

It's not like this wasn't easily predicted, but following the judge's order to shut down Limewire, and the recording industry's immediate and premature declaration of yet another "significant blow," anyone who's followed this space for any amount of time had to know that most users would just move on to other options. And, of course, they have. But perhaps even more interesting, is the fact that a group of anonymous developers have jumped in and resurrected Limewire by creating their own "pirated," version -- the Limewire Pirate Edition (LPE). They actually claim that the new software works better than the old software (and has no adware either). We've pointed out that those who think they're "winning" the battle against the distributed nature of the internet really don't know what they're up against and this is just one more example. Whether you agree with the efforts or not, these sorts of things are becoming more common and each time this happens, it takes users to offerings that are less and less interested in working with the existing entertainment industry. Napster, Grokster, Streamcast and Limewire all tried to work with the music industry -- and all were sued out of business. The next generation of file sharing offerings was still somewhat open but definitely less interested. And these days, the folks involved simply have no interest in working with the industry at all. All the industry has done is driven consumers further and further and further underground.

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Filed Under: file sharing, limewire

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sophia smith, 9 Nov 2010 @ 6:04pm

Psy Students need you!!
Hi! We are students at Smith College in Massachusetts taking a Research Seminar. We invite you to take a survey assessing gender attitudes and behavior. The survey should take between 30-45 minutes to complete and is completely anonymous. To thank you for your participation, you will be entered into a raffle for a $50 ...gift card on Amazon.com http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/NVG3CBG
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ChimpBush McHitlerBurton, 9 Nov 2010 @ 6:19pm

Re: Psy Students need you!!
Hey Sophia!

Thanks for the opportunity to give you my gender's attitude and behavior!

This man's attitude is that you suck donkey dick! And not very well at that!

Keep the $50!

CBMHB!
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John Johnson, 9 Nov 2010 @ 6:22pm

Hi Sophia! I'm a Single Montreal College student taking a research seminar in your pants. I invite you to assess the differences in our pants and he attitudes and behaviors when different genders copulate. The Survey should take between 10-15 minutes to complete and is completely anonymous. To thank you for your participation, you will be entered in a raffle for a $5 gift card on HotTopic.com
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Ryan Diederich, 9 Nov 2010 @ 6:32pm

Hi Sophia!
I have been forced to take so many surveys about treating women equally that I actually lament female existence.

Your cause is meaningless to me. I treat women equally, unless they are ugly or stupid, in which case I treat them like crap.

I am interested in the survey in your pants, as there is a neat nosering at hot topic I have had my eyes on.
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roland985, 9 Nov 2010 @ 6:34pm

Haha
Its like a dieing animal, a last violent thrashing of its body before it starts to rot. They need a new business model, fast.
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Anonymous Coward, 9 Nov 2010 @ 6:40pm

Hi Sophia!

You have a pants survey that you need to check in my what?
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Spaceman Spiff (profile), 9 Nov 2010 @ 7:19pm

Enough's enough, already!
Ok gang, IMO we've slimed these asshats sufficiently. Now for some pertinent comments about the original posting... :-)

1. I don't purchase major label records/cd's any longer for the obvious reasons - they (the labels) exist solely to screw the talent and the consumer.
2. I purchase a LOT of music, directly from the artist as much as I can. Between me and my wife, we have 2-3000 cd's that we have purchased over the years and not one is from a major label.
3. When I am interested in an artist I search the web for examples of their work. I download and listen to it. If it is to my liking, I will go to their web site and buy it directly if I can. If I can't, then I send them an email and explain why I won't buy their work. Eventually they will get the message (I hope).
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Anonymous Coward, 9 Nov 2010 @ 7:35pm

Re: Enough's enough, already!
I do something similar, except i don't pretend that i haven't already downloaded their music. If i like them, after i recommend them to friends i'll happily go donate 10 or 15 bucks,
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out_of_the_blue, 9 Nov 2010 @ 8:57pm

"Distributed nature" is no match for concentrated force.
I doubt that it'll be long before draconian measures are phased in; one strike and you're jailed. If so, "file sharing" will plunge to near zero. As I've mentioned, doesn't take any deep packet inspection to locate; amount of traffic up is enough to focus attention to your IP, then they *might* look at the traffic before they kick in the door.

You can muse on whether gov'ts actually would use draconian measures next time you're standing with your shoes off at the airport, waiting to be X-rayed.

(By the way, you guys think that you may have just taken -- and failed -- the survey? That it was nicely crafted with a sex bait to elicit response, period, and you bit on it? I know it's difficult to resist bait when a suitable bit of "wit" pops into the brain, but *any* personality traits revealed on the web are of value to "researchers".)
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Anonymous Coward, 9 Nov 2010 @ 9:18pm

Napster, Grokster, Streamcast and Limewire all tried to work with the music industry...

Please correct me if I am mistaken, but did not each of these try to work with the music industry only after lawsuits had been filed against each?
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bdhoro (profile), 9 Nov 2010 @ 10:31pm

Better than...
A great phrase I recently discovered for google searches:
"better than..."

Just try typing "better than limewire" and anyone who's looking for an alternative will be more than satisfied with the results.
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Mike Masnick (profile), 9 Nov 2010 @ 11:53pm

Re:

Please correct me if I am mistaken, but did not each of these try to work with the music industry only after lawsuits had been filed against each?

Most of them (Napster especially) approached the industry before getting sued.

Either way, not sure why that would matter. The industry has shown that its "negotiating strategy" has been to sue first, as a part of the negotiation.
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Richard (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 4:16am

Re: "Distributed nature" is no match for concentrated force.
I doubt that it'll be long before draconian measures are phased in; one strike and you're jailed. If so, "file sharing" will plunge to near zero. As I've mentioned, doesn't take any deep packet inspection to locate; amount of traffic up is enough to focus attention to your IP, then they *might* look at the traffic before they kick in the door.

A few reasons why this won't happen

1) It's unaffordable. States that try to spy on their citizens to this level (eg E. Germany) collapse financially - and these days it will happen much quicker.

2) They copy stuff themselves

3) The bad publicity that will inevitably flow from the "innocent martyrs" will ruin the businesses that are supposed to be benefitting.

4) People will be driven more effectively to those artist who embrace "free" business models.

5) Effective encryption strategies already exist. They are not deployed by most filesharers because they are marginally inconvenient. Effective enforcement would immediately trigger the deployment of effective countermeasures.
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mike rice (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 5:01am

Getting around downloading. from Limewire
Using a peer to peer network is now passe anyway. The simplest way to get tunes is to subscribe to MP3 email lists where people trade 'information' suggesting where entire CDS or even multi-CDs are available. The CDs or multi-CDs are then placed on website platforms under names that don't reveals the CD or the artist. The package is downloaded as a rar or a zip. It seems to me one of the downloading programs which typically have free versions and paid for versions to download, is actually under attack by the riaa and selected record companies. The one that is under attack isn't even the biggest uploader/downloader out there. In the space of the two years since this variation got going, people's song collections has boomed to where personal tune collections go over 100,000 tunes and beyond. Downloading one song at a time is so hopelessly 1999, one has to be clueless to bother doing it. But if a tune at a time is what thrills one, the easiest way is to go to youtube and find a good stereo version of the song you're looking for - and youtube has located most of the seriously rare tunes by self selection, maintaining the fiction of a 'video' that is often nothing more than a video of an old style record player playing, or even a still of the artist. With software like free video recorder or a couple of programs that simply record the sound from a video automatically, getting them one song at a time is simple, and the Youtube process can find the rarest stuff on the net, all under the seemingly 'action-proof' youtube rubric umbrella.
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Anonymous Coward, 10 Nov 2010 @ 6:36am

Re: Re:
Good grief, Mike. Do you really blame the industry for not wanting to work with those groups? Perhaps if they hadn't enabled piracy on a massive scale they might have found the industry more receptive. Ya know?

It's ridiculous to think the industry would want to work with them after what they did. They burned that bridge as clear as day. And yet you blame the industry... Your bias towards piracy is just embarrassing. It's next to impossible to take you seriously.
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Anonymous Coward, 10 Nov 2010 @ 6:39am

Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
You know how I get around LimeWire? I pay for my music.
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bdhoro (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 6:53am

Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
Well I hope it makes you feel really good about yourself when you pay for stuff that most people get for free. You don't really expect to fill an iPod with your paid for library though do you?
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Anonymous Coward, 10 Nov 2010 @ 7:17am

Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
"Well I hope it makes you feel really good about yourself when you pay for stuff that most people get for free."

Well I hope it makes you feel really good about yourself when you pay for stuff that some people, perhaps many or even most, get for free illegally?

Fixed that for you.

BTW, suggesting that one who plays by the rules of law is a "schmuck" is quite telling, and a sad commentary on the state of "ethics" practiced by those who readily dismiss and ignore such rules.
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Mike Masnick (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 7:23am

Re: Re: Re:
Good grief, Mike. Do you really blame the industry for not wanting to work with those groups? Perhaps if they hadn't enabled piracy on a massive scale they might have found the industry more receptive. Ya know?

Good grief? No. It's about a simple decision:

Do you work with actual companies who are willing to work with you and help you make money... or do you push all file sharing to underground networks from which you will make no money.

I'm not sure how anyone with firing brain synapses could think the latter is a better solution. But, apparently there's you.

It's ridiculous to think the industry would want to work with them after what they did. They burned that bridge as clear as day. And yet you blame the industry... Your bias towards piracy is just embarrassing. It's next to impossible to take you seriously.

Huh? The only bridge that was burned was when the RIAA sued these companies out of existence. Before that, all of those companies were willing to work with the industry to help them make money.

Only a total fool would think that it's better to sue the companies who want to work with you out of business, and drive all the usage to those who don't want to work with you.
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Mike Masnick (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 7:24am

Re: Re: Re:
Your bias towards piracy is just embarrassing.

I have no "bias" towards "piracy." I'm not a fan of "piracy" at all and don't participate.

My "bias" (if you must call it that) is towards reality. Yours appears to be towards fantasy.
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jproffer (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 7:30am

not clueless
I don't think they are clueless about what they are up against. I think they have a very good idea, and actually DEPEND on it.. they don't want piracy to go away because it enables their business model and opens industry doors for them (e.g. changes in law, DRM, ACTA).

Their publicizing of "winnings" is probably actually feather-ruffling and targets potential clients who're the ones who are actually clueless.

That's my 0.02 on it anyway.
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Richard (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 7:41am

Re: Re: Re:
It's ridiculous to think the industry would want to work with them after what they did.

So you think the industry is right to let injured pride get in the way of making a living. Successful companies in truly competitive markets do not work that way.
Most record company executives would not last 5 minutes in (say) the oil industry.
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Hephaestus (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 7:45am

Re: Enough's enough, already!
Spaceman Spiff ...

Its funny, but I have been seen the same horrible attitude (from a corporate perspective) from sizable number of people online. I like it, and it seems to be spreading. People making choices to walk away from specific corporations or industries. Keep it up ...
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Jason, 10 Nov 2010 @ 7:48am

Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
"I pay for my music."

Well, that's sort of silly if it's your music.
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Hephaestus (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 7:54am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
"Most record company executives would not last 5 minutes in (say) the oil industry."

Yes they would same monopoly mentality. Same pushing for laws to outlaw or stop what is clearly a trend. Think the oil companies prop 23 in CA -vs- the labels ACTA, DEA, Hadopi, etc. They are a perfect match.
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Hephaestus (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 7:57am

Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
So how is that $10,000 USD iPod working for you?
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Jason, 10 Nov 2010 @ 8:13am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
Surely you know that copyright as expressed in the US Constitution is a statutory right, which must at times be submitted to natural rights.

You may as well question the ethics of speeding to the hospital in an emergency.
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PRMan, 10 Nov 2010 @ 8:23am

Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
Expect to fill my iPod with stuff I have purchased? Try "Have filled my iPod with stuff I have purchased."
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PRMan, 10 Nov 2010 @ 8:24am

Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
My wife was a mildly successful self-published recording artist. Believe me, you pay FAR MORE for your music.
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PRMan, 10 Nov 2010 @ 8:30am

Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
Actually, it's closer to about $5000 over a span of about 25 years, so at $200/year, not too bad.
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Jason, 10 Nov 2010 @ 8:41am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
...said the music executive.

With the exceedingly upward expansion of the proliferation of the exchange of ideas today, an original idea is about as realistic as an original breath of air:

GUY: Woh, what are you doing?
OTHER GUY: What?
G: You just breathed my air.
OG: Yeah, so?
G: That's my air. You can't breathe it after I breathe it.
OG: I'm just breathing. That's kinda what I do.
G: Yeah, but you're stealing. That's my air, I instantly gained breathing rights when I breathed it.
OG: Whatever dude, I'll just go over here next to this guy.
G: No good! I own his air, too. Bought the rights last week.
OG: Okay, dude if you're so concerned about getting enough good air, then why don't I just open the window?
G: WHAT? FILE SHARING!!! PIRATE! HEY! THIS GUY OVER HERE IS A PIRATE!!
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Anonymous Coward, 10 Nov 2010 @ 9:00am

The music industry has made themselves an enemy of the people. They are the bad guys.
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Jason, 10 Nov 2010 @ 9:11am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
:)
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Gwiz, 10 Nov 2010 @ 12:05pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
Where were you getting digital music from 25 years ago? For that matter where did you get an Ipod 25 years ago?

Home Ipod filling is killing music you know.
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Jason, 10 Nov 2010 @ 12:22pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
Don't you know by now? iPod filling shilling is only killing the willing.
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Anonymous Coward, 10 Nov 2010 @ 12:42pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Wow! You're serious, aren't you?

After what Napster, Grokster, Streamcast and Limewire did to the industry, do you think the industry should have welcomed them into the fold? That's just delusional. And you seem to be completely ignoring the fact that the "sharing" services dug their own grave.

Were these services really created with working with the industry in mind, or were they built from the ground up on piracy? You know it's the latter.

They didn't try to play by the rules until it was too late. They had no intention of working with the industry until they realized that was their last resort.

And yet, of course, you sympathize with them. So typical, Mike.
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Anonymous Coward, 10 Nov 2010 @ 12:44pm

Re: Re: Re: Re:
Um, no, Mike. I understand that piracy has been and always will be a reality. So will murder. Should we not have laws against murder if people are just going to kill anyway?

And you are one of the biggest fanboys of piracy I've ever met. I love that you pretend that you aren't. That's half the fun of reading your silly blog.

Tell us more about how Napster just wanted to play by the rules. LOL! OMG! LOL!
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Anonymous Coward, 10 Nov 2010 @ 12:47pm

Re: Re: Re: Getting around downloading. from Limewire
Actually, my iPod and iPhone are completely full with my paid for music. I rip every thing lossless. MP3's suck.
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Jason, 10 Nov 2010 @ 3:00pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
You do know that the US Constitution establishes copyright as a statutory right and that any civil infringement or criminal piracy with respect to copyright is malum prohibitum and not mala en se?

Aside from a statutory imposition, your argument is more wrong than piracy, Mike's views notwithstanding.
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Christopher (profile), 10 Nov 2010 @ 3:13pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Anonymous.... try making a ACCOUNT here and we might take you a little more seriously.
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Richard (profile), 11 Nov 2010 @ 4:01am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
Nah, the point is that the oil industry cares first and formost about making money - whereas the recording industry spends all its effort on maintaining its privileges.

The oil industry has spent a ton of money on alternative energy technologies - to make sure that they can adapt to the post oil world - if the recording industry paid the same level of attention to the internet - then they would not have been in their current fix.
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Anonymous Coward, 11 Nov 2010 @ 4:33pm

Take a baby, decide its going to be an music artist, lock it in a small black box, do not give it any input, nothing but darkness..

Then when that baby is an adult, and they are released from that box, their mind will be full of "original" ideas that they can copyright..

If your not willing to do this.. Then you have to accept that the "original ideas" that are awarded copyrights are not actually original ideas, but the result of the collective input of an entire culture.

EVERYONE owns EVERY piece of media/art/music/video ever created, because their very existence in the world helped to shape and mold the culture that media was created from..

You know it to be true.
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