Back In The Days When Skywriting Was Patented

from the glad-those-days-are-gone dept

Wed, Mar 23rd 2011 6:20am — Mike Masnick

Eric Goldman alerts us to the news that, back in the day, skywriting was patented (see patent below) and that there were advertisements warning people not to infringe. This particular ad was published in 1924 in Aviation Magazine.

If you can't read the warning, it states:

Warning: The process of forming Morse or written signals in the air by means of smoke or other visible trails emitted from an aircraft and the apparatus used in connection therewith are covered by Patents issued and pending in America and abroad. Vigorous action will be taken against infringers.

It seems some things just never change.

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Filed Under: patents, skywriting

33 Comments

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Richard (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 6:43am

Native Americans
They used smoke signals didn't they?

Wouldn't that have counted as prior art?
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Rabbit80, 23 Mar 2011 @ 6:44am

Re: Native Americans
Dammit - you beat me to it :(
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Hephaestus (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 6:45am

Re: Re: Native Americans
Patents are all smoke an mirrors anyway ...
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 6:45am

Was innovatin hurt here?
What are you complaining about Mike? How exactly did a skywriting patent hurt innovation?
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Michial, 23 Mar 2011 @ 6:47am

Native Americans
Nope Smoke Signals don't count as prior art, they were not emitted from an Aircraft.
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 6:47am

Was innovatin hurt here?
What are you complaining about Mike? How exactly did a skywriting patent hurt innovation?
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 6:47am

Was innovatin hurt here?
What are you complaining about Mike? How exactly did a skywriting patent hurt innovation?
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 6:53am

Today's jets emit a trail caused by the cooling. They would be infringing by spelling a long i. Or a double lowercase l
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 7:03am

Re: Native Americans
Exactly. All this post proves is that what is obvious today wasn't obvious at some point in the past.

It's a good patent, and in it's day was innovative and unique.
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Richard (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 7:03am

Re: Native Americans
But if a group of Native Americans had patented smoke signals in (say) 1921 they could have used it to block the Skywriting Corporation - creating a patent thicket.

Also I think that the amoke signal prior art would still have invalidated the rider about morse code etc - since that doesn't require the aircraft to manouevre in order to create the message - the aircraft is therefore irrelevant in that case.
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Sean T Henry (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 7:08am

Re: Native Americans
It said that "written signals in the air by means of smoke or other visible trails emitted from an aircraft" then just do not have it come from the aircraft but a tow behind smoke machine. :)
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Richard (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 7:09am

Re: Re: Native Americans
No - it was an obvious patent even then.

I think the idea that "it was not obvious then - even if it is obvious now" is incorrect. The point is that these things are obvious to anyone who has the right background knowledge (and remember the patent test requires the idea to be non-obvious even to someone "skilled in the art" - not just to Joe public).

This patent is far too broad. A sensible application of the patent process would be to some of the details (eg the method of finding the correct height to do the skywriting - which must have required some thought and effort at the time.
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E. Zachary Knight (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 7:23am

I wonder if these guys sued the Wicked Witch of the West. She violated their patent when she sky wrote her threat to Dorothy.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0032138/
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 7:24am

Re: Re: Re: Native Americans
So what you are saying is that they should have applied for multiple patents, to create a patent thicket?

Right.
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CommonSense (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 7:29am

Re: Re: Native Americans
In it's day, it was innovative and unique.

It is still not a good patent.
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The eejit (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 7:30am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Native Americans
You must be bored today. Here, hace a nice cup of chai, to soother your mind and increase your brainpower.
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Chronno S. Trigger (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 7:54am

Re: Re: Native Americans
The "aircraft" was their version of "on the Internet".
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Richard (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 8:00am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Native Americans
So what you are saying is that they should have applied for multiple patents, to create a patent thicket?
No - I'm saying that if they could have encapsulated their method for finding the right altitude into a device - then they could have patented the device - it would have been easy to work around - so no thicket.
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Pixelation, 23 Mar 2011 @ 8:18am

What if they wrote it in C++?
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 8:28am

Re: Re: Re: Native Americans
It was obvious to Joe public even then. It's only non-obvious before the technology that makes it possible existed. Once airplanes with smoke trails exist, it's obvious. No R&D costs required to think up the idea.

Aren't patents supposed to be on specific designs, not general ideas? I can sit around and come up with ideas all day long, why should someone a patent on every idea that anyone can possibly come up with? Ridiculous.
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 8:28am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Native Americans
Why should someone get a patent on ... *
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Greg G (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 8:30am

Re:
The Wicked Witch didn't use an aircraft. She flew on a broom. I think even a moron in a hurry would recognize the difference.
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 8:35am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Native Americans
Here is a website that explains it a little better

http://ideas.4brad.com/archives/000061.html

The problem is that the ability to create smoke trails was a new problem that arises with the advent of Airplanes. New solutions to new problems make for bad patents. A better patent would be if someone found a new solution to an old problem after many years were given to solve that problem. The question that should be asked is, how long has something been a problem and how long have people been looking for a solution. Smoke trails is a relatively new problem because the technology that enables them is new. Now, having a patent on an airplane maybe a different issue, but the airplane example itself is another example of how patents are harmful to innovation (ie: the wright brothers delaying advancement resulting in other countries advancing before us until the government decided to step in and prevent patents from delaying advancement).

Overall, though, I tend to be mostly against patents, I think they're just another abuse that only hinder innovation and invention and serve to create more income inequality and lost jobs.
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Anonymous Coward, 23 Mar 2011 @ 8:49am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Native Americans
I think the question that should be asked here is, would contrail signals likely have been invented if it weren't for patents? I think the answer is yes, so a patent shouldn't have been granted on it. If patents are to exist they should only be on things that wouldn't otherwise exist.
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Skyhawker, 23 Mar 2011 @ 9:18am

Backwards message?
Lucky strike anyone...?
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Michael, 23 Mar 2011 @ 9:58am

Accidental infringement
So you the engine of the airplane billowing out smoke as it fails constitute a patent violation?

I mean, smoke pouring from your airplane engine is clearly saying "Help", "I'm crashing", or "Oops! Forgot the oil again.", so it is sending a message via smoke from an aircraft.
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Billy Wenge-Murphy, 23 Mar 2011 @ 11:28am

Re: Native Americans
Just another thing the white man took from them

Too bad they had no concept of (intellectual) property
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Billy Wenge-Murphy, 23 Mar 2011 @ 11:35am

Re: Re: Re: Native Americans
Innovative in the sense of "hey look at that isn't that neat" (unpatentable) not in the sense of "solves a legitimate technical problem that would have been unlikely to get a solution if we didn't have a system that grants temporary monopolies on such solutions"
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Billy Wenge-Murphy, 23 Mar 2011 @ 11:36am

Re: Re:
A broom is just an aircraft powered by magic and children's dreams
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6 (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 3:02pm

Re: Re: Native Americans
"creating a patent thicket."

Somebody in this thread doesn't know what a patent thicket is.
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6 (profile), 23 Mar 2011 @ 3:04pm

"So you the engine of the airplane billowing out smoke as it fails constitute a patent violation?"

Did anyone here tell you that it would be? Did you read the claims of the patents mentioned?
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abc gum, 24 Mar 2011 @ 6:14am

It's a good thing that The Skywriting Corporation of America was issued that patent because it initiated an avalanche of innovation in the field of skywriting from which we have all benefited immensely. I don't know where we would be today if it weren't for this patent.
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staff, 24 Mar 2011 @ 8:49am

on notice
It puts infringers on notice which is required. Please leave these matters to those who understand it.
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