The Changing Way That Math Is Taught To Children

State Department Spokesperson Says Bradley Manning Is Being Mistreated

from the they-just-noticed? dept

Fri, Mar 11th 2011 5:24pm — Mike Masnick

We've written a few times about how we believe Bradley Manning's treatment in prison is horrifying. It goes beyond what's reasonable, and in recent weeks has only gotten worse, as he's now being stripped naked every night.

However Glenn Greenwald points us to the very surprising news that State Department spokesperson P.J. Crowley has now come out to say that he believes Manning is being "mistreated" in prison. This is a huge surprise. After all, the State Department has taken the brunt of the leaks that Manning is accused of facilitating. And Crowley has been the State Department's go to guy for massively exaggerating the leak's impact on world affairs. For him to come out and say that Manning is being mistreated is a huge surprise. I'm curious if the folks in our comments who were vocally defending the treatment of Manning as perfectly normal are still willing to defend it, when even one of their biggest allies is backing down.

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Filed Under: bradley manning, pj crowley, treatment, wikileaks
Companies: wikileaks

49 Comments

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Skeptical Cynic (profile), 11 Mar 2011 @ 4:38pm

Please...
Lets be rational.
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ChurchHatesTucker (profile), 11 Mar 2011 @ 5:32pm

Disgusting
I'm appalled that he's being treated this way, but not, alas, entirely surprised. This seems part and parcel of the 'race to a banana republic' that the US appears to be engaged in right now.
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RD, 11 Mar 2011 @ 5:47pm

Of course they will
"I'm curious if the folks in our comments who were vocally defending the treatment of Manning as perfectly normal are still willing to defend it, when even one of their biggest allies is backing down."

Of course they will. The state is ALWAYS right, after all. According to the previous defenders on this subject, accusation equals guilt, and the guilty deserve whatever they get, and damn the constitution, law, human rights, and anything else that gets in the way.

They will rebut by attacking Manning even MORE. Watch.
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JC, 11 Mar 2011 @ 6:25pm

If Manning is gulity,
And I believe he is, then he has the right to trial. However, that does not excuse any mistreatment by those holding him in custody. If an investigation reveals wrong doing by those in charge of him, then they too need to be punished.

Unfortunately, most of the reporting you quote comes from Glenn Greenwald. I consider him to be an unreliable source.
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Anonymous Coward, 11 Mar 2011 @ 7:02pm

This supposedly the full remark..

"I spent 26 years in the air force. What is happening to Manning is ridiculous, counterproductive and stupid, and I don't know why the DoD is doing it. Nevertheless, Manning is in the right place." There are leaks everywhere in Washington - it's a town that can't keep a secret. But the scale is different. It was a colossal failure by the DoD to allow this mass of documents to be transported outside the network. Historically, someone has picked up a file of papers and passed it around - the information exposed is on one country or one subject. But this is a scale we've never seen before. If Julian Assange is right and we're in an era where there are no secrets, do we expect that people will release Google's search engine algorithms? The formula for Coca Cola? Some things are best kept secret. If we're negotiating between the Israelis and the Palestinians, there will be compromises that are hard for each side to sell to their people - there's a need for secrets."
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RD, 11 Mar 2011 @ 7:04pm

Re:
"The formula for Coca Cola? Some things are best kept secret."

Already released about a week ago. Confirmed based on comparisons to an old diary/log book from the foundation of the coca cola company.
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The Original Anonymous Coward (profile), 11 Mar 2011 @ 7:21pm

P.J. Crowley says "he believes" Manning is being mistreated
It will be interesting to see if the State Department has another one of it's PR folks walk this one back. According to to TFA, Mr. Crowley says that "he believes" that Manning is being mistreated. It doesn't mention him giving any more information than just his opinion.

Secretaries Clinton and Gates seem to normally be pretty much in sync so this would seem to be a departure from that situation if Mr. Crowley was indeed authorized to make that comment.

We'll have to see how this turns out...
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ChurchHatesTucker (profile), 11 Mar 2011 @ 7:22pm

Re:
It was a colossal failure by the DoD to allow this mass of documents to be transported outside the network. Historically, someone has picked up a file of papers and passed it around - the information exposed is on one country or one subject. But this is a scale we've never seen before.

But it's still more of the same, at heart.

If you've got a west wing office, you can leak to your heart's content. If not, you're doing naked inspection.
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Adam Wasserman (profile), 11 Mar 2011 @ 7:42pm

Re: Disgusting
Race to a banana republic, or race to replace the Soviet Bloc?
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DV Henkel-Wallace (profile), 11 Mar 2011 @ 8:21pm

Re: Disgusting
I don't think banana republic is really the right term (who would be the colonizer?). This is more like the kind of behavior that people in Egypt or Tunisia have been complaining about by the ousted regimes there...
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aperson (profile), 11 Mar 2011 @ 9:03pm

hate to be the one to break this to all you bleeding hearts, but his treatment is not only not out of the ordinary, it's actually SOP within the penal system.

23 hour lockdown- standard in any max security facility
no clothes/handcuffed to a bunk- standard for harm prevention, suicide watches (and the inmate doesnt get to decide if he is or isn't a danger to himself)
solitary confinement- standard for a prisoner in danger from other inmates, which for that guy, in a military brig is pretty much everyone.

If you want to get offended, get offended because this is all NORMAL. not because of Manning.
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Anonymous Coward, 11 Mar 2011 @ 10:52pm

Re:
They made a bunch of rules that are related to specific situations yet enforce them all against this one guy. He's being treated inhumanely, period.
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iveseenitall, 11 Mar 2011 @ 11:09pm

Look around. Society is demonstrating an amazing capacity to not only tolerate but indulge abuse and exploitation. To accept lies. Subvert truth. Milk the middle class. Replace rights. Equate wealth with integrity. Accept a phony two party/blue blood only political system.
Consider that Bradley Manning has yet to be charged with a crime.
Try stewing on that one for seven months in a 6ft x 6ft concrete room without a book or other personal article with which to pass the time. Without the ability to even perform the simplest of exercises because permission has been denied by officials under false and misleading pretenses.
Maybe a better question is what's it gonna take to get people pissed off?
We the people... ya right.
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TheTharms (profile), 12 Mar 2011 @ 1:36am

When is our day of rage?
Are we finally getting clear on the fact the Obama is a closet neocon and that America was snookered by bunch of corporatists who figured out a way around the constitutional limitation on Bush's third third term? America, we should be furious?
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Mar 2011 @ 1:52am

We've written a few times about how we believe Bradley Manning's treatment in prison is horrifying. It goes beyond what's reasonable, and in recent weeks has only gotten worse, as he's now being stripped naked every night.

What is with these government agencies and their irrepressible need to see naked people? First everyone travelling by airplane gets seen naked, then they start buying vans that show passersby with their clothes off, now they've got prisoners doing involuntary stripteases?
They should get their porn online like everyone else, rather than going to these ridiculous lengths.
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fritz43, 12 Mar 2011 @ 3:45am

Bradley Manning
There is a heavy price to pay for making the government look like the herd of idiots they actually are.

Never mind that the sum total of damage that all these leaked documents has caused has been...what, exactly? Exactly.
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Pixelation, 12 Mar 2011 @ 6:13am

Next up...
"However Glenn Greenwald points us to the very surprising news that State Department spokesperson P.J. Crowley has now come out to say that he believes Manning is being "mistreated" in prison. "

Next up...P.J. Crowley fired, I mean asked to resign.
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DCX2, 12 Mar 2011 @ 6:30am

Re:
Is it normal to put people on POI watch or suicide watch when several medical personnel have claimed that he is not a danger to himself or others? Or is it punitive pre-trial punishment, in violation of Article 13 of the UCMJ?

What about his Article 10 right to a speedy trial? In United States v. Thompson in 2009, a 145 day detention was sufficient to trigger an Article 10 hearing. I believe Manning has now been detained about twice as long.

Is it normal to restrict exercise for the detainee to figure eights in a room while shackled?

Why was it a scandal when we stripped foreigners at Abu Ghraib, but it's not a scandal when we strip US soldiers on US soil?
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DCX2, 12 Mar 2011 @ 6:34am

Re:
What is with these government agencies and their irrepressible need to see naked people?

I imagine the motivation is similar to that of a rapist. It's about the exercise of power over others. Stripping you down to your naked body while they keep their clothes on demonstrates that they have the power.
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R. Curtis, 12 Mar 2011 @ 7:38am

Who Cares
Little Traiter deserves it.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Mar 2011 @ 7:44am

Re: Who Cares
wutz a traiter?
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vivaelamor (profile), 12 Mar 2011 @ 7:48am

Re: Who Cares
I care.
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abc gum, 12 Mar 2011 @ 8:16am

Re: If Manning is gulity,
"If an investigation reveals wrong doing by those in charge of him, then they too need to be punished."

But that report will be classified and leaking it would cause the opening of a vortex which would swallow the entire known universe, so - yeah - investigating the allegations is probably not such a good idea. Everyone now cover their eyes, ears and mouths like good citizens.
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abc gum, 12 Mar 2011 @ 8:22am

Re: Re:
"Stripping you down to your naked body while they keep their clothes on demonstrates that they have the power."

and yet we all know the emperor has no clothes.
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abc gum, 12 Mar 2011 @ 8:27am

Re: Re: Who Cares
"wutz a traiter?"

I think it is someone who has traits, you know certain characteristics.
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coldbrew, 12 Mar 2011 @ 8:55am

Re: Re:
"In this world, they are two kinds of people, my friend. Those with loaded guns, and those who dig." - Blondie The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Mar 2011 @ 10:17am

Re: Re:
Because, it's the USA. They can dumb it down and make the media ignore and/or spin it the way they want. Wake up, The USA is corrupted to its core. It can only get worst, not any better. I hope all the Obama sellouts are crying now.
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deane, 12 Mar 2011 @ 10:39am

my opinion
to the person calling bradley manning a "traiter" what you mean is a traitor, but who is the traitor here? I personally believe in the constitution and would support the government if they tried and sentenced him but what are they doing? nothing so far but illegally holding a man for crimes that he hasn't even been charged with yet. as a US citizen and as a military personnel he has the rights same as the rest. if you want my opinion the people responsible in the DOJ,along with his prisoners are the traitors here. we live in a society that respect our own laws and let the government get all nice and cozy with big business. we are fascist now!
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PrometheeFeu (profile), 12 Mar 2011 @ 1:19pm

Re:
And being make to stand naked during an inspection is also standard?
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PrometheeFeu (profile), 12 Mar 2011 @ 1:21pm

Re: Re:
"I imagine the motivation is similar to that of a rapist. It's about the exercise of power over others."

When I read that line, my first response was to be annoyed at an exaggeration. Then upon thinking about it some more, I realized that the exaggeration was only slight. And now, all I feel is sadness and anger. There are a lot of people who should go to jail for their abuse of power.
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Big Bill, 12 Mar 2011 @ 2:09pm

Mistreatment
Let's see, blacks say they are mistreated in prison, terrorist say they are being tortured(mistreatment) in Gitmo, The State Department says a prisoner is being mistreated in prison, and it's supposed to be a surprise. Only when it happens to you.
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Chargone (profile), 12 Mar 2011 @ 2:27pm

Re: Re: Re:
whatever the hell an obama sell out is...

an awful lot of people seem to forget that the only true difference between democrats and republicans, is entirely who they pick to blame for all the country's problems.

(on a random unrelated note, someone seems to have broken firefox's spell check. it doesn't even recognize 'only' as a word at the moment)
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Chargone (profile), 12 Mar 2011 @ 2:31pm

Re: When is our day of rage?
ya know, technically conservatism is supposed to be about slow and pragmatic change only when necessary, as opposed to progressivism which is about change entirely because the thing being changed to is 'new' and thus 'better', and reactionism (reactionaryism? is there even a word for this in this form?) which is about change back to how things 'used to be'(usualy they weren't actually like that exactly, but who cares?) because that was somehow 'better'.

lots of people like to forget that.

and it amuses me how utterly most americans miss that their entire political spectrum is massively right-shifted compaired to the rest of the world, economically speaking.
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Mar 2011 @ 8:12pm

Re:
I concur with this comment!
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Mar 2011 @ 8:34pm

Re: Who Cares
For bringing transparency? Bullshit!! No American should be punished for presenting the truth! As Americans WE are the ultimate authority, NOT the government. Unfortunately, there is too much complacency and not enough backbone. It is sickening to see people know more about celebrities and what they do than the U.S. Constitution or what is truly important to us as Americans.
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Nehmo, 12 Mar 2011 @ 8:51pm

23 hour lock down
I oppose mistreatment, including solitary confinement. But I'd like to point out that Manning isn't the only one getting this treatment. In Wyandotte Jail in Kansas City, Kansas, everybody is on 23 hour lock down. Many of these people are legally innocent awaiting trial. The jail claims this is necessary because of the large population.
The problem is that some people make money from other people being in jail. So the more people, the more money.
~~ Nehmo
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Christopher (profile), 13 Mar 2011 @ 7:47am

Re:
Correction: a small fringe amount of society, who unfortunately have all the power because they have snookered the rest of us into thinking that it is 'bad' to violently speak out against our country, have all the power.
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Christopher (profile), 13 Mar 2011 @ 7:52am

Re: Re:
Excuse me, but most cases of rape are not about power. Most times, they are about someone being so sexually deprived in regards to their libido's level, that they have a 'bent' moment and rape someone.

It's extremely rare that rape is solely about power or even majorly/half about power.
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Christopher (profile), 13 Mar 2011 @ 7:55am

Re: Mistreatment
The fact is that blacks are mistreated in prison, the ACCUSED (key word there) terrorists are being mistreated, and Manning is being mistreated.

Prison is supposed to be about redemption. Hell, I don't understand why Manning is even being held in prison in the first place. They could put a ankle bracelet on the guy, take away his internet access in his home, and leave him in his home until the trial.

Just no legitimate reason for them to be holding him in a cell until his trial.
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abc gum, 13 Mar 2011 @ 9:20am

Re: 23 hour lock down
"The problem is that some people make money from other people being in jail. So the more people, the more money. "

And this is a good example as to why certain functions should never be run by the private sector. Barney Fife would have us all locked up by the time Andy returns from Mount Pilot.
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The Original Anonymous Coward (profile), 13 Mar 2011 @ 10:33am

This just in - PJ Crowley is out
"Crowley is abruptly stepping down as State Department Spokesman under pressure from the White House." (CNN)
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abc gum, 13 Mar 2011 @ 5:03pm

Re: This just in - PJ Crowley is out
The truth carries a high price.
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The Original Anonymous Coward (profile), 13 Mar 2011 @ 5:21pm

Re: Re: This just in - PJ Crowley is out
None of us plain old ordinary blog readers know the truth and I'm not certain that Mr. Crowley does either. He was just voicing his opinion.

I would say that if a person has a job spinning the corporate line to the media and wishes to keep that job, it may be better to keep personal opinions personal.

If Mr. Crowley sincerely disapproves of Manning's current situation, then maybe his resignation is a sign that he is sticking to his principles. If this indeed the case, good for him.
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abc gum, 13 Mar 2011 @ 9:31pm

Re: Re: Re: This just in - PJ Crowley is out
The truth is - this situation is stupid.
He simply said, in public, what others refuse to admit.
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Shon Gale (profile), 14 Mar 2011 @ 8:20am

Isn't this the same way we in America treat our prisoners in Guantanamo? Strip them naked. Humiliate them. I saw Criminal Minds. Looked like business as usual to me. Totally justified my thoughts that the government is not to be validated in any form. They are out of control and don't answer to me or anyone else in this country. With Homeland Security doing whatever they feel like to whoever they feel like, whenever they feel like. I am afraid and went and loaded my gun and am going to pack it with me wherever I go. Stay away from the Government. Don't even go near their buildings, I want nothing to do with any party of thieves. They do not represent me or the people of the United States. They have become incredibly dangerous to their own citizens and need to be stopped. But the population of America is so apathetic and wrapped up in their little apples they don't have a clue. Their very laws and actions make the common man a criminal.
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Miso Susanowa, 14 Mar 2011 @ 11:05am

Overton Window
Noise, noise, noise - all the comments of "what damage did this leak do anyways?" and the focus on the diplomatic cables releases. If not bungled and mishandled by Wikileaks itself, it stinks of collusion or kowtowing on their part to swamp the relevant information which caused this whole witch hunt to begin with with the cables-noise: The release of tha Apache gunsight film showing the deliberate targeting of civilians and medical personnel, along with Reuters reporters, by military forces. The Overton Window shifting is almost complete - most of the talk, text and debate is about the embarrassing but irrelevant diplomatic cables releases. This has nothing to do with Manning being pilloried and everything to do with first shifting, then obscuring the real issues. Mission accomplished.
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nasch (profile), 14 Mar 2011 @ 4:50pm

Re: Re: When is our day of rage?
progressivism which is about change entirely because the thing being changed to is 'new' and thus 'better',

Where are you getting this definition? Or were you just trolling?
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nasch (profile), 14 Mar 2011 @ 4:58pm

Re: Re: Re:
Excuse me, but most cases of rape are not about power. Most times, they are about someone being so sexually deprived in regards to their libido's level, that they have a 'bent' moment and rape someone.

I think both of you may be overstepping in your claims. Particularly your claim that rape is not about power would require a strong citation to be credible.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motivation_for_rape
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kkmartin, 26 Nov 2012 @ 6:01am

Response to: Anonymous Coward on Mar 11th, 2011 @ 7:02pm
Except when governments are doing completely stupid and irrational thing... I can see how coca cola has anything to so with deaths of innocent people by a government that if the people don't hold responsible no one else will.
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