NSA Working With Denmark, Germany To Access 'Three Terabits Of Data Per Second' From Overseas Cables

Another Registrar To Avoid: Internet BS Pulls Down Website Based On Confused Understanding Of The Law

from the bs-indeed dept

Thu, Jun 19th 2014 4:06pm — Mike Masnick

It seems that many in the anti-piracy world are moving up the chain a bit in their quixotic fight against anything they feel must be illegal (even if it's not). From targeting the sites directly, to then focusing on hosting firms, they're now going directly to registrars and ordering them to pull domain names or face liability. And while many of the better web hosts have learned to be familiar with the law here, many registrars are confused (thankfully, there are a few exceptions).

The latest example of a registrar folding the second someone freaked out is the aptly named Internet BS (or Internet.bs), which apparently suspended Bittorrent.pm's domain, after a company called Rico Management claimed it was hosting infringing files. Of course, it's not hosting any infringing files, because it's an index site, rather than a hosting site. Rico complained, and Internet BS told the site's administrators that it had to take action or face liability, and then it also complained that Bittorrent.pm didn't have a contact page on its website. Of course, as Torrentfreak notes, there's some irony in the fact that the complaining company, Rico Management, doesn't even seem to have a website at all, let alone official contact information.

Either way, the idea that a registrar might be liable for infringement stretches the bounds of secondary liability to ridiculous lengths. Remember, the direct infringement is done by end users. At best, Bittorrent.pm might be found for secondary liability. You could argue that its hosting provider might have (already ridiculous) tertiary liability, meaning the registrar would be at the level of quaternary liability, which is taking the concept of third party liability to extreme and ridiculous levels. And, of course, that doesn't even get into the fact that neither Bittorrent.pm nor Internet BS are in the US, and yet Internet BS seemed to be relying on an extremely strained reading of the US's DMCA to make this argument.

If there's actual infringement going on, the focus should be on holding those actually responsible liable, not twisting liability rules to make everyone else potentially liable. When you go down that path, you guarantee easy and widespread stifling of perfectly legitimate speech and innovation.

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Filed Under: dmca, registrar, secondary liability, takedowns
Companies: bittorrent.pm, internet bs, internet.bs, rico management

30 Comments

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Anonymous Coward, 19 Jun 2014 @ 4:12pm

The names couldn't be any more apt...
RICO Management using Internet BS to shutdown Bittorrent.pm. I mean, with that one sentence, you don't really need any editorial; it's all right there, both literally and figuratively.
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ChurchHatesTucker (profile), 19 Jun 2014 @ 4:15pm

Re: The names couldn't be any more apt...
This just validates my plan to rent twelve year olds out to businesses to vet any ideas they have.
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 19 Jun 2014 @ 4:25pm

Interestingly, internet.bs is my preferred registrar: they didn't rat me out to Prenda, so...
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That One Guy (profile), 19 Jun 2014 @ 4:29pm

Another standard rule of Copyright Maximalism
'If the law doesn't agree with your demands, just lie and make laws up based upon what you want the law to be.'
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That One Guy (profile), 19 Jun 2014 @ 4:37pm

Re:
They must not have used the magic words, 'Copyright infringement', which, much like 'Because terrorists/National Security', causes all the normal rules to be thrown clear out the window.
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PRMan, 19 Jun 2014 @ 4:49pm

RICO?!?
Is this the MAFIAA admitting that they are engaging in RICO practices (even as a joke)?
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Anonymous Coward, 19 Jun 2014 @ 5:00pm

Looks like a list is developing of Registrars you don't want to use.

In the days running up to trying to get the DMCA passed, the RIAA made the comment they would not abuse this law. We see today how that has went. Search bots that can't tell the difference between parody and an offical song want everything off the net for their payday from the RIAA.

Today it might be copyright issues, tomorrow it may be political issues. Since these people can not follow the rules laid down by ICAAN on what does or does not qualify for block or removal of a domain are ignored, perhaps it is time to consider an Iceland domain or one from EasyDNS. I sure wouldn't want Godaddy nor the other four as my registrar.
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Anonymous Coward, 19 Jun 2014 @ 5:03pm

RICO Management? Really?

I smell a troll.
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Anonymous Coward, 19 Jun 2014 @ 5:28pm

This must be more of the "on the internet" magic how else is a registrar different to a phone book or a map ?
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Anonymous Anonymous Coward, 19 Jun 2014 @ 6:02pm

Re: Another standard rule of Copyright Maximalism
They are just following examples set by DOJ, NSA, FBI, CIA, Executive Branch, etc..
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Anonymous Anonymous Coward, 19 Jun 2014 @ 6:06pm

Re:
So...(lousy start), you admit your complicity to being human?
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Anonymous Coward, 19 Jun 2014 @ 9:17pm

Breach of contract
IANAL, but it seems like RICO have coerced BS into breaching contract. It seems like bittorrent.pm may have a civil case against one / both...
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Domainer, 20 Jun 2014 @ 1:15am

Too extreme..
I think the world has gone over extreme with copyright laws... too much politics around it. You have to be paranoid all the time. Not a great way to run a website business or brand your domain name.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Jun 2014 @ 2:39am

Re:
"I sure wouldn't want Godaddy nor the other four as my registrar."

Of course not, given that the GoDaddy strongly supports spam, forgery, phishing, carding, child pornography, and other things, while happily bending over and 'servicing' any requests from the MPAA and RIAA without question.
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DannyB (profile), 20 Jun 2014 @ 5:57am

Stretching Exercises
It is a stretch that secondary, tertiary, etc liability might extend to domain registrars. But stretching is good for you. So let's get to it. First we'll do some simple stretching of copyright length. Then we'll do the DMCA stretch with a few super quick take downs. After we catch our breath, then we'll stretch the subpoena power of the courts to send extortion settlement letters. Then we'll stretch the concept of liability to include secondary liability. Stretch sanity to believe that Google hosts infringing files because it controls the entire internet. We'll stretch politicians' pockets by stuffing them with too much money to try to pass insanity like SOPA, which is quite a stretch. Then we'll stretch and get law enforcement to believe that it is copyright owners' private police force. Then after a breather, we'll think about stretching this to include the military. After all, is it too much of a stretch to think that innovation and creative commons licensing causes terror? It's really a stretch to get another government to have an almost military style raid and to seize servers and destroy a business based on just a feeling, and at the behest of a foreign private interest.

Whew! That's enough of a workout for now. But come back tomorrow. With practice we'll see how easily we can stretch more and more each day.
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Quiet Lurcker, 20 Jun 2014 @ 6:37am

Re: Re: The names couldn't be any more apt...
Twelve-year-olds???

I believe the term you are looking for is 'five-year-olds'. See here for clarification, specifically item 12 of the list shown.

Besides, based on my (admittedly limited) experience in business, using a 12-year-old in this application seems to attribute ENTIRELY too much intelligence to the client(s) in question.
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Dan G Difino, 20 Jun 2014 @ 6:43am

Groping
If there's actual infringement going on, the focus should be on holding those actually responsible liable, not twisting liability rules to make everyone else potentially liable. When you go down that path, you guarantee easy and widespread stifling of perfectly legitimate speech and innovation.

Not only does that become widespread, but you become something your mother warned you about.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Jun 2014 @ 7:12am

Re:
you might want to re-adjust your preferences... it used to be that Internet.bs was a nice place a few years ago but this piece of news together with the HUGE LETTERS at the top of the page of internetbs.net that spell out:

"CENTRALNIC ACQUIRES INTERNET.BS"

should be a dead-giveaway that the new owners are getting in the business with steel-toed boots on and stomping on all the (sort-of) good name that the place used to have.

quote from their linked page:
June 17, 2014
The ICANN accredited Bahamian registrar business of Internet.bs Corp. (IBS) has been acquired by CentralNic Group PLC(�CentralNic�) in a move that is intended to provide IBS customers with continued and expanded leading-edge, personalized registrar services.
/quote

CentralNIC as a company is based in both USA and UK... so better say hello to NSA and GCSB/MI5. They are already browsing through your accounts :p

The Bahamas dream is dead.
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One Arrned Bandit, 20 Jun 2014 @ 7:22am

Re: RICO
Aren't there laws surrounding this RICO? Strong arm tactics immediately come to mind when I hear that name for some reason.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Jun 2014 @ 7:49am

Re: Re:
"continued and expanded leading-edge, personalized registrar services"...
i think this comes from the same book that describes a CIA extraordinary rendition airplane as "a leading-edge, personalized transportation service".

/sarcasm
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sophisticatedjanedoe (profile), 20 Jun 2014 @ 7:51am

Re: Re:
Thanks for the heads up.

What would be recommendations then? I want to stay relatively anonymous: I don't hide from authorities, but from dirtbags that are capable of turning my life to hell. I want a registrar that doesn't honor US civil court subpoenas, or, at least gives a fight.
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John Fenderson (profile), 20 Jun 2014 @ 8:10am

Re: Re: Re:
Fortunately, registrars only have a very limited ability to invade your privacy. All they're doing is associating a domain name with you and the IP address is resolves to. The registrar is not in a technical position to spy on you in any way that isn't available to any other random entity.
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Anonymous Coward, 20 Jun 2014 @ 9:30am

Re: Re: Re: Re:
except for the fact that some (most?) registrars have a "feature" called automatic renewal... you just have to let them save your credit card info.

that info usually is not available to just any other random entity.
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John85851 (profile), 20 Jun 2014 @ 5:26pm

Re: Re:
Yes, but did they use the magic words "for the children"?
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Jun 2014 @ 5:02am

But. Terrorism!
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TtfnJohn (profile), 21 Jun 2014 @ 9:37pm

Re: Trolls Anonymous
What's even more suspicious is that RICO Management doesn't even have a web site not to mention any way to contact or check up on them. But to prove they aren't all that bright they have a Facebook account complete with name, address, contact number, and a little slice of Google Maps that shows exactly where they hide. Not a single "like" of course, and a lot of really nasty messages :-) Yeah, they are trolls .
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TtfnJohn (profile), 21 Jun 2014 @ 9:41pm

Re: Re: Trolls Anonymous
ooops: Here's their facebook info: https://www.facebook.com/RicoManagement
They also appear to be brainless idiots but who knows :-)
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Jan 2015 @ 5:37pm

Just took down 8chan.co for unfounded cp claims
Anti- #GamerGate ers mad because one board of hundreds on 8Chan.co is /gamergate/ and have been DDoS-ing the site for days and have submitted false "child porn" claims to CloudFlare and Internet.bs has suspended 8chans domain, and put up adds for "jailbait chans" and "barely legal" links... see @infinitchan on Twitter for details

Internet.bs should be exposed as a crappy domain provider.
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Jim, 12 Sep 2015 @ 6:07am

Internet.bs suspended my domain
Internet.bs suspended my domain and claimed it was a phishing website. There were no complaints about the content of the website, they just somehow determined it was a phishing website.

The website was one page of text and did not collect any information or anything like that. My website did not contravene their terms and conditions.

It took a few weeks to get this sorted. In the meantime, my website was inaccessible. Internet.bs eventually agreed to let me transfer my domain to another registrar.

Their abuse department takes a week to respond to emails on average. They do not have a phone number.

Avoid Internet.bs is my advice.
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Another pissed customer, 11 Sep 2017 @ 6:14am

They hold your domain hostage
"Dear [redacted],

Recent activity in your account has triggered an alert within our systems. For your protection we kindly ask you to send us a copy of a government issued ID matching the name used for your account, along with proof of address.

Please send the required documents within 3 days to risk@internet.bs. Your account will
remain locked until the documents are supplied.

--Best regards,Internet.bswww.internetbs.net"

Fuck those bastards.
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