around here, speeds are measured in bits, because it's meaningful, but data caps are always in bytes, because that's what the data is measured in.
i get the feeling NZ has better advertising laws than the USA.
(odd fact: i'm told NZ is the only country other than the USA that allows direct to consumer advertising of medicines.)
Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
just so you know, northern Europe (Scandinavia and such?) cannot correctly have the term 'soviet' applied to it. it may or may not be accurate to call them 'socialist' in the more modern sense of the word, but not being run by small russian (or ex-russian-empire) local councils, nor being part of the Soviet Union (due to it no longer existing and never including Scandinavia in the first place) i'm pretty sure 'soviet' doesn't apply.
well, assuming i'm remembering the definition of soviet correctly.
Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
it should be noted that the company that owns the cables connecting NZ to the outside world is, to the best of my knowledge, not an NZ company. if it Were it would be under the same massive regulation that the other telecommunications companies are under.
Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
indeed. it only works in NZ despite the competition because absolutely everything going into and out of the country (most web traffic, who knows what else) must go through one of two cables, both of which are owned by the same company. That is where the monopoly kicks in, and it actually has very real physical limitations. thus, data caps.
which are actually mearly an assignment of Priority, not an absolute limit like the Comcast example here. once you hit the cap, your priority expires. your ISP then either puts you through the system at a lower priority than Every Other Signal that still has priority available (which is Crazy Slow at peak times and occasionally, through some screwy weirdness, briefly Faster at off peak times. not by much or for long though.) or buys the right to more priority allocation from further up the chain to assign to you. (my ISP does the latter. the bigger ones do the former, mostly.)
this is completely different from Comcast's stupidity in this instance.
Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
bandwith IS speed. speed is determined by what percentage of the available bandwith is occupied by your task at the time.
data Quantity is not bandwith. it is a useage cap.
1gig is 1gig is 1gig. a higher bandwith is not more gigs. it means you get the entirety of that one gig Sooner.
the impose a cap on how much Data you can have total, which is arbritrary. this is not the same thing as a bandwith cap, which is a limit dictated by the maximum their hardware can cope with divided by the number of uses attempting to employ it at once.
(i'm not explaining this very well, but your argument starts from an incorrect assumption.)
your attempt to say that connection speed and bandwith are different, or that bandwith and data cap are the same, are misleading mislabellings.
Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
certainly could here if they weren't careful.
though it wouldn't be so much 'sue' as 'report' at which point they get hammered by the government.
of course, Comcast and their ilk don't operate in New Zealand.
don't think they could handle the competition. or the massive government regulation in place specifically to keep telecommunications monopolies under control.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
... this baffles me.
i mean, i know lots of people use this much data.
i even know what services are involved in using it.
i still wonder how on earth it comes about that they use that much.
if i stop and do the maths it all works out, but at the same time i'm sitting here going 'you used How much? what the heck?!'
i have a 20gig cap that i share with 2 other people (one of whom is admittedly only here half the time and the other doesn't use much, but still), get charged extra if i go over, (the concern here is usual price and cap, not speed, as the speeds are fairly consistant unless you pay crazy amounts for the 'amazingly awesome!' plan.) and almost never go over. when i do, it's by less than two gig (data cap extentions are bought in 2gig blocks.) only exception being if i'm stupid enough to get conned into downloading a game off sony or microsoft's networks for the consoles. whatever moron is in charge of that needs to be forcibly introduced to the concept of Compression. also INSTALL FILES. if i'm downloading it, it has to be installed on the hard drive. meaning you can compress it, send it, then run an decompress/install process. there is No Bloody Reason for it to be a seven gig download. (this cost me money i was not expecting to pay and has thus become a pet rant.)
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
New Zealand mostly has option 1, and it seems to be working quite nicely.
recent reshufflings are, slowly, somewhat, sliding it towards option 2 as well. kind of.
('course, water here is covered by a tax ('rates', based on property value, mostly, so far as i'm aware), rather than being billed on usage, while electricity is billed based on metered usage but there's several different providers and that system's chopped up into generation, wholesale, and retail, chunks of which are owned by various cities and the national government and private entities and the whole things a mess and God alone knows how they determine their prices. though it's regularly stated that they're not allowed to reduce output/raise prices in summer when demand is low to compensate for the high demand in winter (water levels in hydro dams are an issue, apparantly) which is a problem.)
that said, it still baffles me that people can USE that much :S *shrugs* i mean, i can see how it might happen if you had enough people using the thing...
(oh, and i can see it happen Easily if people decided to download console games. seriously, what the hell is going on with sony and their games from their store? i don't care how big the game is, if it's going to install onto my harddrive there's no freaking way it needs to be a seven gig download! PCs use install files for a reason, this is not complex technology! their 'free' games ended up costing me something on the order of NZ$30 or more because of how massively downloading them threw off our data useage. still cheaper than buying the things, but i wouldn't have bought them even at that price.)
if i read this correctly, the issue is that one of these groups holds Mike up to a standard they're failing to meet here, and this is a comment on that, more than anything.
well, if by 'worse' you allow 'new shiny deal that you only get if you sign up as a new customer' that's better than the current contract, or 'if you sign up now you get this shiny thing free for X time' when already existing customers don't get it, there's a fair bit of that here. but only that sort of thing. (and i seem to recall they've got to be a bit careful about exactly how they do That, too.)
ya know, this kind of massive over reach, claim of jurisdiction in other people's areas, and general arrogant trampling of sovereignty in other lands... go have a look at history. this kinda thing has caused major wars over and over again. only thing that's different here is that it's the internet and even now the logistics of intercontinental war are... nightmareish.
most people wouldn't in the normal course of events, but some would, and then some who wouldn't otherwise would in revenge/retaliation/perfectly reasonable 'prevent it from happening again' logic...
which leads to people who had close ties to the origional murderer following the same logic... and few are rational enough to keep it to only the person responsible (which most people would Probably accept, if grudingly, if there was evidence. not all, but most) but usually go after a whole bunch of people they see as having some connection to it...
and you end up with feuds, which can rapidly escalate into wars ...
so... basically, without an over all law on the subject, you'd end up with the same basic law coming into effect either officially or sort of just by general consensus anywhere you had a tightly bound group with decent leadership... and an utter mess everywhere else.
and then you've got the issue that corporations are STILL large entities with a lot of money. without legal constraints preventing it you'd quite rapidly end up with a lot of their hostile takeover type manoeuvres being a lot more... hostile.
bullets are faster after all. and who's going to object to you dumpting waste in any meaningful way when you control your own armed forces and the surrounding area? maybe someone down stream could organise a large enough force and fight a War over it...
that said, any law that does not have general cultural acceptance is going to be ignored and thus completely pointless, it's true. the problem is that that cultural acceptance, or it's lack, Can be a fairly local phenomenon. ugh. my explaination's getting tangled. hopefully someone better at explaining gets my point.
no one of these posts is quite funny enough to really rate clicking the funny button... but the thread as a whole makes me wish there was a 'even more funny!' button :D
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Re: Re:
easy enough to make mistakes like this accidently.
which makes it easier to get away with doing it deliberately, i suppose.
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Re: Re:
around here, speeds are measured in bits, because it's meaningful, but data caps are always in bytes, because that's what the data is measured in.
i get the feeling NZ has better advertising laws than the USA.
(odd fact: i'm told NZ is the only country other than the USA that allows direct to consumer advertising of medicines.)
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Re: Can't agree on this one
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
well, assuming i'm remembering the definition of soviet correctly.
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
which are actually mearly an assignment of Priority, not an absolute limit like the Comcast example here. once you hit the cap, your priority expires. your ISP then either puts you through the system at a lower priority than Every Other Signal that still has priority available (which is Crazy Slow at peak times and occasionally, through some screwy weirdness, briefly Faster at off peak times. not by much or for long though.) or buys the right to more priority allocation from further up the chain to assign to you. (my ISP does the latter. the bigger ones do the former, mostly.)
this is completely different from Comcast's stupidity in this instance.
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
data Quantity is not bandwith. it is a useage cap.
1gig is 1gig is 1gig. a higher bandwith is not more gigs. it means you get the entirety of that one gig Sooner.
the impose a cap on how much Data you can have total, which is arbritrary. this is not the same thing as a bandwith cap, which is a limit dictated by the maximum their hardware can cope with divided by the number of uses attempting to employ it at once.
(i'm not explaining this very well, but your argument starts from an incorrect assumption.)
your attempt to say that connection speed and bandwith are different, or that bandwith and data cap are the same, are misleading mislabellings.
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
though it wouldn't be so much 'sue' as 'report' at which point they get hammered by the government.
of course, Comcast and their ilk don't operate in New Zealand.
don't think they could handle the competition. or the massive government regulation in place specifically to keep telecommunications monopolies under control.
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
i mean, i know lots of people use this much data.
i even know what services are involved in using it.
i still wonder how on earth it comes about that they use that much.
if i stop and do the maths it all works out, but at the same time i'm sitting here going 'you used How much? what the heck?!'
i have a 20gig cap that i share with 2 other people (one of whom is admittedly only here half the time and the other doesn't use much, but still), get charged extra if i go over, (the concern here is usual price and cap, not speed, as the speeds are fairly consistant unless you pay crazy amounts for the 'amazingly awesome!' plan.) and almost never go over. when i do, it's by less than two gig (data cap extentions are bought in 2gig blocks.) only exception being if i'm stupid enough to get conned into downloading a game off sony or microsoft's networks for the consoles. whatever moron is in charge of that needs to be forcibly introduced to the concept of Compression. also INSTALL FILES. if i'm downloading it, it has to be installed on the hard drive. meaning you can compress it, send it, then run an decompress/install process. there is No Bloody Reason for it to be a seven gig download. (this cost me money i was not expecting to pay and has thus become a pet rant.)
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Mike, how DO you reconcile your demands that
recent reshufflings are, slowly, somewhat, sliding it towards option 2 as well. kind of.
('course, water here is covered by a tax ('rates', based on property value, mostly, so far as i'm aware), rather than being billed on usage, while electricity is billed based on metered usage but there's several different providers and that system's chopped up into generation, wholesale, and retail, chunks of which are owned by various cities and the national government and private entities and the whole things a mess and God alone knows how they determine their prices. though it's regularly stated that they're not allowed to reduce output/raise prices in summer when demand is low to compensate for the high demand in winter (water levels in hydro dams are an issue, apparantly) which is a problem.)
On the post: Guy Kicked Off Comcast For Using Too Many Cloud Services
Re:
that said, it still baffles me that people can USE that much :S *shrugs* i mean, i can see how it might happen if you had enough people using the thing...
(oh, and i can see it happen Easily if people decided to download console games. seriously, what the hell is going on with sony and their games from their store? i don't care how big the game is, if it's going to install onto my harddrive there's no freaking way it needs to be a seven gig download! PCs use install files for a reason, this is not complex technology! their 'free' games ended up costing me something on the order of NZ$30 or more because of how massively downloading them threw off our data useage. still cheaper than buying the things, but i wouldn't have bought them even at that price.)
... sorry, side rant there.
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Re:
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Re: Re: Re:
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Re: Re: Re: Re: This is the way it should be
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Re: Re: Re: not that i agree
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Re: Re: U.S. - Lords of Creation
read it that way and it makes sense as well as being true.
On the post: Why PROTECT IP Will Fail: Cultural Acceptance, Not Fear Of Punishment, Makes People Abide By Laws
Re: Obvious things are.. not that obvious.
which leads to people who had close ties to the origional murderer following the same logic... and few are rational enough to keep it to only the person responsible (which most people would Probably accept, if grudingly, if there was evidence. not all, but most) but usually go after a whole bunch of people they see as having some connection to it...
and you end up with feuds, which can rapidly escalate into wars ...
so... basically, without an over all law on the subject, you'd end up with the same basic law coming into effect either officially or sort of just by general consensus anywhere you had a tightly bound group with decent leadership... and an utter mess everywhere else.
and then you've got the issue that corporations are STILL large entities with a lot of money. without legal constraints preventing it you'd quite rapidly end up with a lot of their hostile takeover type manoeuvres being a lot more... hostile.
bullets are faster after all. and who's going to object to you dumpting waste in any meaningful way when you control your own armed forces and the surrounding area? maybe someone down stream could organise a large enough force and fight a War over it...
that said, any law that does not have general cultural acceptance is going to be ignored and thus completely pointless, it's true. the problem is that that cultural acceptance, or it's lack, Can be a fairly local phenomenon. ugh. my explaination's getting tangled. hopefully someone better at explaining gets my point.
On the post: Funniest/Most Insightful Comments Of The Week At Techdirt
Re: I get no respect!
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