Although we might bicker on some of the minutia, I think there are probably enough of us here, who agree that the laws should be changed, to formally petition for a change in the laws. Yes, I realize that we are all spread throughout the country and/or world, but those few legally-minded (not me) should be able to draft something up that could be easily edited to apply to respective local laws....
Just a thought.
AHA!
Anyone who has ever lived in VA --and has also actually LEFT VA-- knows how screwed up they're commonwealth laws are. No, I'm not on a soapbox, I'm just saying that maybe it's a contributing factor.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
I will wholeheartedly admit that the difference is a gray area.
However, the difference is also definable, which, as I've said lies in the GOAL of the action. I'm not talking about ends justifying means, though.
A terrorist ONLY cares whether or not people are afraid. Unlike terrorists, we do understand that there are people who view it as you've said, and we take action to try and calm people's fears.
A terrorists TARGET is the civilian population. Unlike terrorists, our only target is other militaries; a part of our job as troops is to go out of our way to avoid civilian casualties.
A terrorist doesn't care who gets hurt as long as their goal is acheived. Unlike terrorsts, when civilian casualties occur, we feel it ourselves.
Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
Umm everyone involved in the Times Square thing acted correctly. In case you didn't notice:
A) the bomb did not detonate
B) no one died
It's also worthy of noting the the guy involved is a US citizen (legal immigrant) and was granted his rights as such. Admittedly, I say that with certainty solely based on the ABSENCE of any reports about his rights being violated; not even trumped-up reports.
"Pile enough opinion up, and others will refer to it as fact."
While I'm sure that is an easily-observable phenomenon, and while people do sometimes form opinions based on someone else's opinion, most people like to have at least an inkling of fact first.
My point? If there's a link provided and you want to know more, click on it. Even if that one doesn't take you straight to the facts, there's likely to be one or two more that will. So if you don't like the opinion, you can look at the facts for yourself and form your own.
Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
One of my favorite quotes.
Another is:
When the people fear the government there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is Liberty.
-Thomas Jefferson
Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
NO NO NO NO NO.
I'll spare you the definition, but a terrorist is someone whose goal it is to subjugate others by way of fear (terror). In other words their GOAL is for the general population to be afraid of them.
With soldiers, fear is (sometimes) a side-effect, for which we have people whose entire job it is to alleviate that fear. US troops NEVER get used to terrorize the masses; yes, sometimes we are used for "shock and awe" and other such tactics, but our target is MILITARY and NEVER civilian.
I'm disappointed. Usually you're the one to get the facts straight before you make such a blanket statement.
"I won't cower behind a mistake when so much we do is for the betterment of the world"
I stopped reading there for the following points:
1) I am a citizen of the United States of America, and, while I do care about people abroad, I care more for my fellow citizens.
2)The ends DO NOT DO NOT DO NOT justify the means. They never have. They never will.
3)The simple fact that my government has done some ill things means that they need to STOP DOING THESE THINGS. We are a nation of laws and not of men (paraphrased). Which means your very first sentence -- prior to the hyphen -- is correct; after the hyphen is so very very WRONG.
I have now read the rest of your statement, and, for brevity's sake, all I will say is there is so much more that is severely misguided --at times accidentally correct.
"The US has a history of ignoring treaties, when it doesn't like what they say. This is seriously going to come back to haunt the US."
So, IMHO, the biggest "treaty" the Federal governemnt is currently violating is it's own: The Constitution.
Many people are being arrested nationwide for voicing opinions that others find "offensive": First Amendment violation.
Millions of travelers are subjected to unlawful search and seizure of their persons: Fourth Amendment violation
Or how about all the laws restricting weapon(not just gun) ownership? "Congress shall make no law..."
There are certainly more, but these are just off the top of my head. Once again we need to pay more attention to what's going on at home than overseas.
Wait. Are you seriously trying to turn this into a racism discussion? Or do you mean something else by "race-based"?
If the former, you need to wake up and take your everyone-is-a-racist-but-me glasses off.
If the latter, please explain.
aha! I think that does answer my question (above), but only partially.
If they are paying less in overhead, but showing less net gain due to decreased sales, where's the business sense?
On the other hand was the decrease in sales volume slight enough that the decrease overhead gives them an increased net gain?
On the post: US Copyright Group Finally Files Some Other Lawsuits... In Minnesota
Ya know...
Just a thought.
On the post: Gibson Can't Resist, Sues Another Video Game For Infringement, Despite Being Smacked Down By Court Last Time
Re:
On the post: Letting Famous People Interact Online? Patented! Twitter Sued
Virginia law
Anyone who has ever lived in VA --and has also actually LEFT VA-- knows how screwed up they're commonwealth laws are. No, I'm not on a soapbox, I'm just saying that maybe it's a contributing factor.
On the post: Is Figuring Out A Slot Machine Software Glitch & Making Money From It A Crime?
Re:
Allow me to respond to your argument by using Mike's own argument (hopefully you'll see the irony in even arguing that point)
"Given that he was knowingly abusing this glitch, the fraud claims seem much more reasonable"
Moral: don't argue with someone who agrees with you; it just confuses people.
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
So basically what you said could be paraphrased as:
I think you'll find most people who don't vote in US elections haven't changed US law.
Duh
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
However, the difference is also definable, which, as I've said lies in the GOAL of the action. I'm not talking about ends justifying means, though.
A terrorist ONLY cares whether or not people are afraid. Unlike terrorists, we do understand that there are people who view it as you've said, and we take action to try and calm people's fears.
A terrorists TARGET is the civilian population. Unlike terrorists, our only target is other militaries; a part of our job as troops is to go out of our way to avoid civilian casualties.
A terrorist doesn't care who gets hurt as long as their goal is acheived. Unlike terrorsts, when civilian casualties occur, we feel it ourselves.
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
A) the bomb did not detonate
B) no one died
It's also worthy of noting the the guy involved is a US citizen (legal immigrant) and was granted his rights as such. Admittedly, I say that with certainty solely based on the ABSENCE of any reports about his rights being violated; not even trumped-up reports.
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
Answer: The Geneva Convention.
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
While I'm sure that is an easily-observable phenomenon, and while people do sometimes form opinions based on someone else's opinion, most people like to have at least an inkling of fact first.
My point? If there's a link provided and you want to know more, click on it. Even if that one doesn't take you straight to the facts, there's likely to be one or two more that will. So if you don't like the opinion, you can look at the facts for yourself and form your own.
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
Another is:
When the people fear the government there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is Liberty.
-Thomas Jefferson
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Re: Re: Re: USA no different than any other Government
I'll spare you the definition, but a terrorist is someone whose goal it is to subjugate others by way of fear (terror). In other words their GOAL is for the general population to be afraid of them.
With soldiers, fear is (sometimes) a side-effect, for which we have people whose entire job it is to alleviate that fear. US troops NEVER get used to terrorize the masses; yes, sometimes we are used for "shock and awe" and other such tactics, but our target is MILITARY and NEVER civilian.
I'm disappointed. Usually you're the one to get the facts straight before you make such a blanket statement.
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: Curses! Foiled again!
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
Re: USA no different than any other Government
I stopped reading there for the following points:
1) I am a citizen of the United States of America, and, while I do care about people abroad, I care more for my fellow citizens.
2)The ends DO NOT DO NOT DO NOT justify the means. They never have. They never will.
3)The simple fact that my government has done some ill things means that they need to STOP DOING THESE THINGS. We are a nation of laws and not of men (paraphrased). Which means your very first sentence -- prior to the hyphen -- is correct; after the hyphen is so very very WRONG.
I have now read the rest of your statement, and, for brevity's sake, all I will say is there is so much more that is severely misguided --at times accidentally correct.
On the post: Wikileaks Reveals That The US Won't Comply With Treaty Obligations Concerning Investigations Into CIA Rendition
It already has....
So, IMHO, the biggest "treaty" the Federal governemnt is currently violating is it's own: The Constitution.
Many people are being arrested nationwide for voicing opinions that others find "offensive": First Amendment violation.
Millions of travelers are subjected to unlawful search and seizure of their persons: Fourth Amendment violation
Or how about all the laws restricting weapon(not just gun) ownership? "Congress shall make no law..."
There are certainly more, but these are just off the top of my head. Once again we need to pay more attention to what's going on at home than overseas.
On the post: Expedia Against 'Search Discrimination'... Unless It Gets To Do The Discriminating
Re:
If the former, you need to wake up and take your everyone-is-a-racist-but-me glasses off.
If the latter, please explain.
On the post: Expedia Against 'Search Discrimination'... Unless It Gets To Do The Discriminating
Re: Re: Why Orbitz Can't Show AA Fares
If they are paying less in overhead, but showing less net gain due to decreased sales, where's the business sense?
On the other hand was the decrease in sales volume slight enough that the decrease overhead gives them an increased net gain?
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