Hmmm, ever try to unsubscribe to Techdirt? Now that is a quagmire of dead end streets if I have ever seen one. Google unsubscribe techdirt, and you will be presented with numerous articles on how hitting unsubscribe in emails is dangerous. Among others. But unsubscribing to Techdirt, hmm, is so unfathomable that when I email'd the tech people here they were agast. Well to unsubscribe from our reporting service, oh, I see you have already done that, or to unsubsc.....
The question was, remove my account, permanent like, flaming users, paranoid, and misunderstanding all that they see....
Remember when open source is here to free you from being watched or soothes your paranoia, just when you feel it is ok to go back into the water, comes WIRESHARK. One of the best packet sniffers I have used, and it's open source, and chock full of things to 'watch' what you do on your own workspace/Network. Remember no matter what it is, there are good uses, and bad use, dependent on the person(s) behind the wheel. Best of all, it's free. Pick one, Free, Good, Fast, one but only one...
If only he had something other than Intel to run on, oh wait, he does.... OOPS does Linux run on a mac, I forgot? Is this about ME chips or open sores?
Yes this is what I would expect to hear from a troll laden set of comments, if I were so paranoid, that if I had any malware whatsoever, and were 100 percent sure that nothing (i mean nothing) was hijacking my browser (I dunno, BHO's i guess??), and were a professor of Philosophy, Electrical Engineering (I.E.E.E), Programmer, and all around bad nerdy boy with too much time, or something else on his hands, would say. But LO, I am waiting for intel to knock at my door. I would work for them in a Heartbeat. As for open source projects to rid the world of nefarious computer backdoor products - more power to them, they are the hearlders of the future, spelt wron on puipose. Nhay Nyak Nyak, 1 stooge.
Then this post is wrong, it is not on the cpu, and you can buy a motherboard with 'other than intel chipsets'. I don't understand this paranoia, do you work in IT? Have you used it? The software for the AMT is available to everyone, download it and test it. Oh that is right, to test it you have to turn it on, but before you do, use one of these documented compromises to break into it. After that doesn't work enable it and see what you can do. Manuals for it, and it's operation are online, and the software is geared towards a corporate IT, but if you have this engine in your system, you can download the software to utilize it. Until you 'play' with it yourself, all these posts are hilarious. Using wording like On the CPU, May pose a threat, possibly compromise a system. The Chipset, may pose a threat, and many consumer grade gaming boards do not have it, or would install it on a non corporate designed system. You have choices, I already shown you how to look for it, and if you find it woe is me, if you are the owner of a bank I would be worried, but joe blow?
I can give legit websites that will tell you which boards support it and which do not, it is a co-processor in the chipset, if you know co-processor means one set aside, like do you have a math co-processor or not?
But of course if you have your mind made up, love a good conspiricy, and believe the 'testor' did not set up the hole, then there is no changing of mind, but I am going to show these posts to my friends. As we laugh, we will be glad you are 'anonymous' if you gave your info, ridicule would abound, behind your back of course.
I joined this site thinking it was about tech, I am sorely disappointed. Believe what you wish, no matter how flimsy it is, or who it appears to be from. I am nobody. And I typically try to spread misinformation, instead of information. This process was not 'just discovered' I have been using AMT for years. If you 'just heard of it' then you speak volumes to your ignorance. 'Sorry' Could not resist. Let me know if you need links...
Remember younger padiwans, if the ME is in the chipset, it dont matter what OS you place onto the machine, ME is still there, waiting for you, breathing, taking note of your secrets. Linux, well if it is installed onto a motherboard that supports ME, yes it is in Linux, so all the dual booting in the world wont help. MAC, would have to be one of the Intel systems that run windows and MAC OS side by side. IBM AS/400 and Power7's well, nuff said.
My wall of text does not have pointers to information sources - with words like, "May" or "Possibly", Nor do I take a tech giant like Google and place a feeble pdf online that is Well it is what it is. Or even the one story if you do read, has a retraction at the bottom over the misinformation that they tried to represent as fact.
Maybe it is a wall to you, but it is the least jargonated wall of information I thought I would leave, To be helpful, not simplistic, or condescending to those who simply do not understand. I have no stake in Intel or AMD, since it is the Chipset, not the CPU. But that is just being nit picky, chipset or CPU, it's all the same YA ?
Wanna see your intel ME??? In windows 10, type a search for 'device manager', and open the local systems device manager, you will be awarded a screen with all kinds of installed devices on your system. Swell. Should work on 7 too. In Device manager, Expand system devices. Scroll down through until you reach the Intel devices. Look for Intel(R) Management Engine Interface. Yep there it is hidden for all to see. So nefarious and dripping with, well you know what eh? Oh I also have a High Precision Event Timer, do you? Oh well, not all systems are the same.
For something that is so well hidden, hard to find, or even disable on a system - well looks like you been had my friend (or not).
IT workers who will most likely be implementing the 'secure' (as secure as you can possibly be with tech) Intel Active Management Tech, in any healthcare setting-- Will have signed and understood HIPPA Rules. This includes signing of confidentiality agreements with, Employers, Hospitals, and any patient pertinent information systems. Most of the signed agreements are explained 'in detail' the Fines, and/or Jail Time associated with the breach of patient confidentiality.
I mean be real, is there IT at your hospital? I would hope so. These IT people do they need Intel's ME to view systems? No. When they are called to repair a database, fix encrypted email, or any other 'information' they will see in the daily performance of their duties, they certainly do not need Intel ME to view patient data. Fines are huge, jail time is looming.
After going through most of the links provided in this article, can you spot the one using and arduino hooked up to a bunch of wires that is going to re-firmware a system, hysterical. Or the google pdf that looks like a poor power point presentation? How about the pictures of the unit on a quilt, in a room that looks like it is a kids bedroom that has no parental direction (like clean it up dude).
If you go through this article with a critical eye, some of the amateurish evidence, the big words thrown in for some good measure, like explaining this to a user: We are so sorry but it seems osi layer 1 is responsible for your pc not connecting to or talking with the server. You sent packets out, but they are not being received by the remote system. We implemented the layer 1 fix and now you are back online.
Just enough jargon, eh? The true meaning of the above statement? User Calls> IT help me I cant reach the internet. IT shows up, looks it over for a minute and replaces the broken cable. OSI layer 1 is the physical layer of the network, Cables etc.
The first explanation makes the IT person feel superior of their knowledge regarding networked systems. But knowledge of one system in the business infrastructure does not make you a genius, no matter how many big words you know. Talk to me like a lawyer, I will be lost in a second.
The second explanation is geared to the user, it is what they want or need to know - without having to go online and look it up.
Wired is usually a good source of information and I have read it on occasion, but what they are saying, what you are worried about, and who can gain access to a system with Intel ME disabled?? I know horror story's that hold water, with respectable intel backing up the story, from respectable names in the industry.
PFSense, a respectable name in the routing/firewall industry is riding on top of FreeBSD, Warning, warning, cough, cough, ugh.
Intel ME can be turned off in the Bios (and is shipped to suppliers with it off) on most modern computers, it is mainly used in larger corporations that provide services to users during downtimes or low usage time (like when PC is asleep or off). Sure it can be nefarious, but you would protect your systems just as you protect your network. It does require password, and setup if you do decide to use it. Vanilla out of the box, it is not too scary.
When you have a user you cannot bump off of the system (like at a Hospital, in the ICU) how would you get in to update, make changes, or check problems reported? This service allows you to do all of the above. If you are in a hardened, firewalled computer network, there is usually not much to worry about with this setup. Even at home, the ability to wake up your computer, remotely while it is turned off, is a godsend to some who VPN in for whatever reason (work, information retrieval, etc.). So now if you leave your house with your system off, you have the chance to send a 'magic packet' to communicate with your device at the most basic level, issue a command 'turn on'.
For Network Admins, the ability to make changes behind the scenes is critical, if you are in New York, and have to change a system in Chicago (that is turned off) then you have the ability to make changes, without user intervention.
Plus no talk of the fact that Intel ships processors with this ability turned off, and you can make the change permanent. It is funny how this 'advanced' service can be misconstrued as a government backdoor, because incorrectly implemented, it essentially is. All this functionality is unavailable to a system that is disabled, believe me when I try to access a system that is off, and ME is off, No amount of 'magic' will tamper with that system.
The bios is a scary place for some, and mucking around in it is more of a concern, because you can essentially make a system or break it in there. Most users 'I' find, do not even know it exists or have been into it imho, except by accident. That is why it (ME) is off, at the start. No need to muck around,, find the right thing there (bios wise) and shut it down.
Paranoia abounds around any tech, heck there were more problems with XP (OS) than any ME implementation. Imagine at the end of life for XP getting a critical update for a flaw? Does that mean for the entire run of XP that flaw was there and being accessed by nefarious parties?
Intel ME allows you to make remote changes to your PC, or a corporate 'company' pc, which you have no control over anyways. Worry about if you must, but that will not make it go away 'magically' Ha could not resist.
You can install updates and troubleshoot a system without user intervention, or even the user knowing you are there. As above in a Hospital ICU this is important, but on your home system not so much. But if you set it up, read the 'manual', even at home it can be useful. The network admins toolkit has even more 'nefarious' tools than ME, and if used, still the user has no idea changes are being made while they are happily typing away, are you on a network? Behind a router, on the internet, firewalled? Why?
There are so many other easier ways to compromise a system than using 'intel's' ME, I would be much more afraid of them, oh yeah, that is why you do use a firewall, to harden, NAT, the perimeter of your home network. And even after finding that the WPS2 the defacto standard router security software has been hacked, all routers are now suspect.
So, pick your poison, Intel ME, Your own O.S. (what are patches for, sure enhancements, but closing doors too), Your personal router which you have hid behind forever, how long has the WPS hack been there without your knowledge, how many times was it used before it was eventually found, or noticed?
Hackers do not yell, look what I have found, they will have that door closed as soon as possible if they did. So it is good for them to keep their findings under wraps for as long as possible, and this includes all software (Office back orifice) for example. These are not security people these are the one's (hackers) who want what they can glean from you (bank info, credit cards, etc.). Right now at this time, what zero day flaw is being exploited on your own personal system - at home or at work??
In this age, you would think that the U.S. has some of the best, fastest internet available. But, this is not so, I have a friend in Australia, and their internet speed is unfathomable when you compare it to ours. Why, I wondered. When the I-net was young, MA-Bell said, if it runs over cable it is ours (loose quote maybe).
Every since it has been regulated and handled by the large 'Phone' companies of the past merging and morphing into the quagmire we have today. Yes we could enjoy the surprising speeds of other countries - we are far down the list for speed - but that would be counter to the profit schema and iron fisted controls Ma-Bell's use to generate revenue (mass revenue).
So, if Net Neutered is an issue, price and speed should be included, since there is no reason we should not have had gigabit speeds a very long time ago, but it is doled out by providers with small chunks going for huge profits.
Don't get me wrong, the local small isp's are being charged a huge fee for bandwidth and pass this cost along to users. It makes soo many the 'bad guy' while the source of this problem is overlooked, or unknown, by the masses. IF you look at Mbs vs Cost, places like Australia whip us, and when we finally do pay for this gigabit, we probably will use their tried and true technology to support it.
Hmmm, a tech giant like the U.S. getting whipped up on by a bunch of smaller players (Countries)? What a setup, for those Ma-Bell's, doling out what they consider theirs because the shortsightedness of a few a long time ago (If it runs on the wire, it is ours).
Well think of dial up, dsl, cable, now even microwave - not many gigabits yet, and it will be at a premium (I am sure). We are backwards in the world because history did not see this coming, and set a few up to be extreme winners in the 'coming field'.
Net Neutrality should be a far reaching concept, which includes de-monopolizing 'my opinion' the stranglehold that larger companies have on a 'service' that never was meant to be a telephone based tech, yes pay for the minutes on your phone bill, but not pay for speed of Inet connection. Inet providers that throttle customers, may do so not to throttle users, but to dole out evenly the limited bandwidth they possess to resale to the public (some may just to make you pay for more but Mbs vs cost?).
But if the system was not rigged - perhaps you would not be buying speed, but have some other schema involved, one that does not 'limit' a privileged few to make or break our speed with outlandish costs for precious speed.
Think of the big players you know of, and think if they are getting richer on the backs of all who are downstream - time warner, comcast, spectrum - as you go the list gets harder to see the major players, and the minor one's are too many to list. And the small ones, try to offer what they can, but usually in a close-in-market cannot compete with the Mbs/Speed provided over the wire, or fiber (wire of sorts).
So smaller providers are the outliers who provide to people where a cable is not viable. Hmmm, Revamp the system, I think not!
Techdirt has not posted any stories submitted by CISP029.
Buy only linux based phone os, eh?
Sell your Data?
The question was, remove my account, permanent like, flaming users, paranoid, and misunderstanding all that they see....
Open Source
Stall Man
Monitoring
Parting Shot Boom
Door In Open
Re: Re: Paranoia extreme edition
Re: Use or Not
Re: Re: Use or Not
Manuals for it, and it's operation are online, and the software is geared towards a corporate IT, but if you have this engine in your system, you can download the software to utilize it. Until you 'play' with it yourself, all these posts are hilarious. Using wording like On the CPU, May pose a threat, possibly compromise a system. The Chipset, may pose a threat, and many consumer grade gaming boards do not have it, or would install it on a non corporate designed system. You have choices, I already shown you how to look for it, and if you find it woe is me, if you are the owner of a bank I would be worried, but joe blow?
I can give legit websites that will tell you which boards support it and which do not, it is a co-processor in the chipset, if you know co-processor means one set aside, like do you have a math co-processor or not?
But of course if you have your mind made up, love a good conspiricy, and believe the 'testor' did not set up the hole, then there is no changing of mind, but I am going to show these posts to my friends. As we laugh, we will be glad you are 'anonymous' if you gave your info, ridicule would abound, behind your back of course.
I joined this site thinking it was about tech, I am sorely disappointed. Believe what you wish, no matter how flimsy it is, or who it appears to be from. I am nobody. And I typically try to spread misinformation, instead of information. This process was not 'just discovered' I have been using AMT for years. If you 'just heard of it' then you speak volumes to your ignorance. 'Sorry' Could not resist. Let me know if you need links...
Paranoia extreme edition
Well
Unconvincing or not
Maybe it is a wall to you, but it is the least jargonated wall of information I thought I would leave, To be helpful, not simplistic, or condescending to those who simply do not understand. I have no stake in Intel or AMD, since it is the Chipset, not the CPU. But that is just being nit picky, chipset or CPU, it's all the same YA ?
Wanna see your intel ME??? In windows 10, type a search for 'device manager', and open the local systems device manager, you will be awarded a screen with all kinds of installed devices on your system. Swell. Should work on 7 too. In Device manager, Expand system devices. Scroll down through until you reach the Intel devices. Look for Intel(R) Management Engine Interface. Yep there it is hidden for all to see. So nefarious and dripping with, well you know what eh? Oh I also have a High Precision Event Timer, do you? Oh well, not all systems are the same.
For something that is so well hidden, hard to find, or even disable on a system - well looks like you been had my friend (or not).
IT working in Health
I mean be real, is there IT at your hospital? I would hope so. These IT people do they need Intel's ME to view systems? No. When they are called to repair a database, fix encrypted email, or any other 'information' they will see in the daily performance of their duties, they certainly do not need Intel ME to view patient data. Fines are huge, jail time is looming.
After going through most of the links provided in this article, can you spot the one using and arduino hooked up to a bunch of wires that is going to re-firmware a system, hysterical. Or the google pdf that looks like a poor power point presentation? How about the pictures of the unit on a quilt, in a room that looks like it is a kids bedroom that has no parental direction (like clean it up dude).
If you go through this article with a critical eye, some of the amateurish evidence, the big words thrown in for some good measure, like explaining this to a user: We are so sorry but it seems osi layer 1 is responsible for your pc not connecting to or talking with the server. You sent packets out, but they are not being received by the remote system. We implemented the layer 1 fix and now you are back online.
Just enough jargon, eh? The true meaning of the above statement? User Calls> IT help me I cant reach the internet. IT shows up, looks it over for a minute and replaces the broken cable. OSI layer 1 is the physical layer of the network, Cables etc.
The first explanation makes the IT person feel superior of their knowledge regarding networked systems. But knowledge of one system in the business infrastructure does not make you a genius, no matter how many big words you know. Talk to me like a lawyer, I will be lost in a second.
The second explanation is geared to the user, it is what they want or need to know - without having to go online and look it up.
Wired is usually a good source of information and I have read it on occasion, but what they are saying, what you are worried about, and who can gain access to a system with Intel ME disabled?? I know horror story's that hold water, with respectable intel backing up the story, from respectable names in the industry.
PFSense, a respectable name in the routing/firewall industry is riding on top of FreeBSD, Warning, warning, cough, cough, ugh.
Just in case,
Use or Not
When you have a user you cannot bump off of the system (like at a Hospital, in the ICU) how would you get in to update, make changes, or check problems reported? This service allows you to do all of the above. If you are in a hardened, firewalled computer network, there is usually not much to worry about with this setup. Even at home, the ability to wake up your computer, remotely while it is turned off, is a godsend to some who VPN in for whatever reason (work, information retrieval, etc.). So now if you leave your house with your system off, you have the chance to send a 'magic packet' to communicate with your device at the most basic level, issue a command 'turn on'.
For Network Admins, the ability to make changes behind the scenes is critical, if you are in New York, and have to change a system in Chicago (that is turned off) then you have the ability to make changes, without user intervention.
Plus no talk of the fact that Intel ships processors with this ability turned off, and you can make the change permanent. It is funny how this 'advanced' service can be misconstrued as a government backdoor, because incorrectly implemented, it essentially is. All this functionality is unavailable to a system that is disabled, believe me when I try to access a system that is off, and ME is off, No amount of 'magic' will tamper with that system.
The bios is a scary place for some, and mucking around in it is more of a concern, because you can essentially make a system or break it in there. Most users 'I' find, do not even know it exists or have been into it imho, except by accident. That is why it (ME) is off, at the start. No need to muck around,, find the right thing there (bios wise) and shut it down.
Paranoia abounds around any tech, heck there were more problems with XP (OS) than any ME implementation. Imagine at the end of life for XP getting a critical update for a flaw? Does that mean for the entire run of XP that flaw was there and being accessed by nefarious parties?
Intel ME allows you to make remote changes to your PC, or a corporate 'company' pc, which you have no control over anyways. Worry about if you must, but that will not make it go away 'magically' Ha could not resist.
You can install updates and troubleshoot a system without user intervention, or even the user knowing you are there. As above in a Hospital ICU this is important, but on your home system not so much. But if you set it up, read the 'manual', even at home it can be useful. The network admins toolkit has even more 'nefarious' tools than ME, and if used, still the user has no idea changes are being made while they are happily typing away, are you on a network? Behind a router, on the internet, firewalled? Why?
There are so many other easier ways to compromise a system than using 'intel's' ME, I would be much more afraid of them, oh yeah, that is why you do use a firewall, to harden, NAT, the perimeter of your home network. And even after finding that the WPS2 the defacto standard router security software has been hacked, all routers are now suspect.
So, pick your poison, Intel ME, Your own O.S. (what are patches for, sure enhancements, but closing doors too), Your personal router which you have hid behind forever, how long has the WPS hack been there without your knowledge, how many times was it used before it was eventually found, or noticed?
Hackers do not yell, look what I have found, they will have that door closed as soon as possible if they did. So it is good for them to keep their findings under wraps for as long as possible, and this includes all software (Office back orifice) for example. These are not security people these are the one's (hackers) who want what they can glean from you (bank info, credit cards, etc.). Right now at this time, what zero day flaw is being exploited on your own personal system - at home or at work??
Ma Bell and the disservice of service
Why, I wondered. When the I-net was young, MA-Bell said, if it runs over cable it is ours (loose quote maybe).
Every since it has been regulated and handled by the large 'Phone' companies of the past merging and morphing into the quagmire we have today. Yes we could enjoy the surprising speeds of other countries - we are far down the list for speed - but that would be counter to the profit schema and iron fisted controls Ma-Bell's use to generate revenue (mass revenue).
So, if Net Neutered is an issue, price and speed should be included, since there is no reason we should not have had gigabit speeds a very long time ago, but it is doled out by providers with small chunks going for huge profits.
Don't get me wrong, the local small isp's are being charged a huge fee for bandwidth and pass this cost along to users. It makes soo many the 'bad guy' while the source of this problem is overlooked, or unknown, by the masses. IF you look at Mbs vs Cost, places like Australia whip us, and when we finally do pay for this gigabit, we probably will use their tried and true technology to support it.
Hmmm, a tech giant like the U.S. getting whipped up on by a bunch of smaller players (Countries)? What a setup, for those Ma-Bell's, doling out what they consider theirs because the shortsightedness of a few a long time ago (If it runs on the wire, it is ours).
Well think of dial up, dsl, cable, now even microwave - not many gigabits yet, and it will be at a premium (I am sure). We are backwards in the world because history did not see this coming, and set a few up to be extreme winners in the 'coming field'.
Net Neutrality should be a far reaching concept, which includes de-monopolizing 'my opinion' the stranglehold that larger companies have on a 'service' that never was meant to be a telephone based tech, yes pay for the minutes on your phone bill, but not pay for speed of Inet connection. Inet providers that throttle customers, may do so not to throttle users, but to dole out evenly the limited bandwidth they possess to resale to the public (some may just to make you pay for more but Mbs vs cost?).
But if the system was not rigged - perhaps you would not be buying speed, but have some other schema involved, one that does not 'limit' a privileged few to make or break our speed with outlandish costs for precious speed.
Think of the big players you know of, and think if they are getting richer on the backs of all who are downstream - time warner, comcast, spectrum - as you go the list gets harder to see the major players, and the minor one's are too many to list. And the small ones, try to offer what they can, but usually in a close-in-market cannot compete with the Mbs/Speed provided over the wire, or fiber (wire of sorts).
So smaller providers are the outliers who provide to people where a cable is not viable. Hmmm, Revamp the system, I think not!
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