Why Would The US Gov't Get Involved In Taking Down Foreign Music Sites?
from the seems-a-bit-out-of-their-realm dept
With all of the bills that have shown up in Congress lately that are all about protecting the entertainment industry's increasingly obsolete business model, it's no surprise to find out that that the US government often seems to have little trouble taking orders from the industry. Last week, when the Pirate Bay went down (and, yes, it's now back up) there were rumors that the US government had pressured the Swedish government to take down the site. Now, we're hearing something similar about AllofMP3.com, which the recording industry desperately wants shut down. According to the NYTimes, US officials are telling Russia that the site needs to be shut down if they want entry into the World Trade Organization. If either of these stories are true, it should raise serious questions about why the US government is involved in what is a private dispute. In both cases, the sites have decent claims to being perfectly legal. The Pirate Bay doesn't host any infringing material on its own, but is simply a search engine. Allofmp3 claims to hold the correct licenses in Russia -- and some have claimed that even if you buy from them while in the US, it's no different than importing the music from Russia. Whether or not either claim to legality holds up, it seems like it should be a local matter dealt with inside each country without interference from the US -- especially since that interference is solely for the benefit of a single industry's business model.Thank you for reading this Techdirt post. With so many things competing for everyone’s attention these days, we really appreciate you giving us your time. We work hard every day to put quality content out there for our community.
Techdirt is one of the few remaining truly independent media outlets. We do not have a giant corporation behind us, and we rely heavily on our community to support us, in an age when advertisers are increasingly uninterested in sponsoring small, independent sites — especially a site like ours that is unwilling to pull punches in its reporting and analysis.
While other websites have resorted to paywalls, registration requirements, and increasingly annoying/intrusive advertising, we have always kept Techdirt open and available to anyone. But in order to continue doing so, we need your support. We offer a variety of ways for our readers to support us, from direct donations to special subscriptions and cool merchandise — and every little bit helps. Thank you.
–The Techdirt Team
Reader Comments
Subscribe: RSS
View by: Time | Thread
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re:
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
It is the purpose of the government to support US
You may debate the validity of the US position on a given trade initiative etc, but it is important to try and represent US industries abroad. Make no mistake, any other country in the world will use every opportunity to take advantage of US companies, to the detriment of their employees, without some measure of defense by US trade negotiators.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: It is the purpose of the government to support
So let me understand: all those Bush's talk about free world trade and removal of import levies, duties and so on in the foreign countries' import of U.S. stuff only applies to stuff that the U.S. exports?
Russia's copyright laws were fine as long as they only impacted on Russia's internal market. As soon as some Russia guy sees a new business opportunity that extends world-wide (and that is legal againts those same laws) there U.S. starts crying and moaning and fighting back below the belt.
Mmmh. Not nice.
BTW, if ever AllOfMp3 gets permanently down, there's a new site called mp3sugar that does pretty much the same thing (and yes, it is Russian and legal in Russia).
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Same old, same old
Why WOULDN'T they get involved? They've got the power to act with impunity, and the need to keep the campaign donations flowing.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
What's not to understand?
And for all the complaints, I've still yet to hear a substitute "business model" offered that's anything more than about how "they" should charge "fair" prices for their products.
Of course, they could drop their prices to less than the cost of creation and production, and half the people out there would still think "that" price is too high, and rationalize their theft accordingly.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: What's not to understand?
Then you don't read here enough. I've pointed out plenty of business models for the industry... many of which are being put into practice.
Of course, they could drop their prices to less than the cost of creation and production, and half the people out there would still think "that" price is too high, and rationalize their theft accordingly.
It's not the cost of production, it's the cost of reproduction (as your basic economics lessons would have taught you). And that, obviously, is zero. The trick to understanding the new business models is recognizing that the actual music or movies aren't the product, but the promotion for something else.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Re: What's not to understand?
I honestly can not think of any.
Reproduction equals zero is only viable when saturation of the market can be accomplished over the defined media, in this discussion the internet, requires no physical process. As you have pointed out many times, broadband has not reached that point. There simply are not enough broadband connections, and of those fast enough ones, to rival the number of DVD players in U.S. homes for movie delivery, much less HD movie delivery.
Assuming you mean DVD delivery and not internet, there are still reproduction costs. People all along the chain get paid for those reproductions, the actors get a portion of media sales for example. Not to mention shipping, artwork, and other assorted costs. Don't get me wrong, paying Jennifer Lopez $12 million for a movie that made less that $8 million is a large portion of their problem. However it seems that you are marginalizing the costs associated.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Re: Re: What's not to understand?
I still think movies are the promotion for getting people to go to the movie theater. Of course, for that to happen, the movie theater experience needs to improve significantly...
In the DVD space, there are plenty of things that can be done, from opening up immediate access to extra features or directors cuts or whatever. Sure, some people will act as freeloaders, but the ones who care about the content are usually willing to pay to be associated with something they like.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: What's not to understand?
Their business model was the manufacture and distribution of plastic discs. Now nobody needs the manufacture and distribution of plastic discs. Nobody needs this middleman anymore. (Itunes works)
Their business model is dead, gone, obsolete, finished. We can offer a thousand alternative business models for them, or we can offer none, and neither changes the reality. ITS OVER.
Was it incumbent on trolley riders to find new jobs for the trolley conductors and trolley company presidents once the riders bought their own cars? Of course not.
Was it necessary for governmetn to force people to ride trolleys, or at least still pay trolley fares even as they drove themselves to work? No.
Did the trolley companies need to find a new business model for the use of the trolley? No.
Trolley companies went under, their employees found new jobs. So can record execs.
Law doesn't matter, morality doesn't matter - the manufacture and distribution of plastic discs is OVER. Essentially, record companies are trying to force us to still pay for manufacture and distribution of plastic discs - and now we don;t even get the freaking DISCS.
Paying a trolley fare to drive ourselves to work.
Record companies also served another role - promotion. Advertising. Well, they can still do that - but when Chrysler pays someone to advertise their cars, they don;t give the ad agency 98% of their profits.
So the record execs can have a little downsizing - a little pay cut. Artists can sell directly, and the RIAA can keep their advertising part of their business... only for a fare rate.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Re: What's not to understand?
Asinine statements like this is why laws continue to be passed and enforced ever more strongly.
You have decided their business model is over, because you don't like it. There are not enough broadband enabled households in the US for the business model to be over. Do you know how I can tell this? Millions of the plastic disks still sell.
You are a thief, you will steal it, you will not pay. You don't care about business models, you care about not paying.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Re: Re: What's not to understand?
You are a thief, you will steal it, you will not pay. You don't
care about business models, you care about not paying.
uh, what are you talking about?
of course hes not saying its *literally* over, right now, today. but just that its doomed.
and he also said "iTunes works" -- so why is he a theif? we're talking about online distribution vs plastic discs, foo!
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Re: Re: Re: What's not to understand?
"Law doesn't matter, morality doesn't matter"
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Re: What's not to understand?
here, here! nice post.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: What's not to understand?
I consider 99c/track unacceptably high for DRM-laden poor-quality downloads. Let me count the ways...
Purchased CDs are cheaper, more versatile and come with extra goodies.
The RIAA pockets 70c of the 99c. Talk about money for nuthin'...
The Artists get LOWER royalities from downloads
I have never purchased 99c downloads. I have never purchased DRM-protected CDs.
Personally I think that allofMP3 has the right idea. Give the consumer what they want, how they want it, and make it cheap enough that it ain't worth piracy.
Nobody is suggesting that they take a loss - personally I think AllofMP3 is a little too cheap - I would consider 40c/track for high-quality DRM-free music. At that level I would happily consume $10-$20/month of music. That's money that the RIAA is _not_ getting right now.
Anything more than that and I vote with my feet.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Re: What's not to understand?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Governments Job
You know , this is actually what the government does when it doesn't fight wars/poverty/crime etc .It is in the interest of citizens (stock owners or record labels) to get that site removed , and it acts accordingly .
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Governments Job
You're missing my point. This isn't about protecting a business' interests. It's about protecting a particular business *model*. Those are two different things.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Re: Governments Job
It sometimes does , but I assure you , it is not in our best interests for it to do so .
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Governments Job
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
It's normal...generally
Because it improves bank balances of US citizens/corporations?
It's pretty common for governments everywhere to get involved in promoting/improving worldwide markets for their own industrys, actually in many cases it's a good thing like countries putting presure on others to drop subsidys to sectors like farming as it creates unfair marketplaces
The problem here is more that the US government is putting presure on other countrys to impliment policys that the US government should not be putting on even their own people never mind others
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Lobbying
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Why wouldn't they?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
liars and thieve
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
what are you all thinking
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Its a basic trade policy
Governments influence each other for trade concessions all the time - not just the US.
Why would the US government stand by and not even ask foreign governments to shut down sites which are bleeding millions out of the the US workers who created the art and deserve to get paid for their work *just like anyone else*?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
I dare the RIAA to try to stop me from exchanging CDs that I own with other individuals.
Lala.com is in beta. If you want an invitation, email me at buried dot bodies at the standard gmail domain.
i am in no way affiliated with lala. i just think that they kick the RIAA in the balls and i love that.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re:
Herein lies the difference, if you have a large network of friends you will still only affect a small number of people by swapping CD's. Putting music in a torrent exposes it to millions of people you have never and will never meet.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
And I'm sorry, but people resent that.
They also recent overpaid people. That includes actors, musicians, athletes, and high level executives (who I will argue, nonetheless, earn they pay better than the rest in that list).
I have infinitely more respect for someone who works 12 hours a day in a coal mine to keep his family going than some tart parading around like an imbecile on tv.
The cost of entertainment will go down when entertainers and their industry of overpaid, spoiled brats start earning realistic salaries and when they all, as a whole, start doing what they do because they love it and not because it pays well.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Back on topic...
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
[ link to this | view in chronology ]