Sometimes It Sure Is Easy To Hate The Phone Company
from the kicking-puppies-and-making-babies-cry dept
There's been a fair bit of uproar about the story of the 82-year-old widow who's been paying to rent a phone from her phone company for 42 years. At first glance, it looks like another case of everybody's favorite company taking advantage of an innocent customer, while acting like it's providing a valuable service, a view that gets strengthened by the woman's family claiming she's paid over $14,000 for the use of two rotary phones for 40 years. For one thing, that math is off by quite a bit -- the woman was charged $29.10 every three months, not every month, making the actual amount based on that figure about $4900 (Lucent, which manages the rental service, says she's paid $2,000 since 1985). Less, but still pretty steep. And some might argue that when mandatory phone rental was stopped in 1985, the woman wasn't exactly old, and should have been aware she was paying for the service. But all that seems a little beside the point, really: this woman paid several thousand dollars for the use of a couple of rotary phones, certainly paying for them many times over. Neither Lucent nor the phone company would want to cut off the service, since apparently 750,000 people nationwide still rent their phones. It's not clear they should necessarily have to, either, despite the venom being slung at them from online forums. That said, they certainly could run it a little more equitably, or at the very least, at much lower prices given the cost of phones these days. What's interesting to note, though, is that nowhere does the woman herself say she wasn't aware she was paying the fee -- all the indignation seems to be coming from her granddaughters, who weren't aware of the charge, dispute how much Lucent says it was, and claim "they were taking advantage of the elderly". And for what it's worth, the old lady says she liked the rotary phones better than her new ones to boot. Still, that doesn't let the phone company or Lucent off the hook, when $10 would pretty much buy you a new phone each month.
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750 *THOUSAND* people still rent phones?!
Anybody renting a phone should be shot in the head, because their brain obviously doesn't work.
These people know they're for sale cheaper, and if they don't, they should rent the phone forever... because the shock of changing from rental rotary phones to purchased phones is likely going to kill them.
My guess would be at least half those people are either comatose or dead, and the phone rental charges are just automatically deducted out of their account every month...
How many 150 years old are out there anyway? More than I thought, apparently...
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Re: 750 *THOUSAND* people still rent phones?!
If techdirt is to maintain and sustain respectabitility then people like this should be forbidden to contribute.
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Re: Re: 750 *THOUSAND* people still rent phones?!
While I'll admit it's not exactly the most PC comment in the world, I certainly am not advocating violence or anything of the sort.
For me, this forum is about expressing views... and yes, expressing them a little more plainly than I would at a polite cocktail party.
If this offends you perhaps you should consider going elseware... or they should ban me. It really is up to techdirt.
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Re: Re: Re: 750 *THOUSAND* people still rent phone
But I still think you're being oversensitive.
My MHO though.
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Re: Re: 750 *THOUSAND* people still rent phones?!
Inciting violence would only occur if the OP threatened to shoot you in the head. He was making a general statement about all people who rent their phones from the telcos (not that I agree LOL).
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Re: Re: 750 *THOUSAND* people still rent phones?!
"Please delete his/her comment immediately. This type of violent anger is beyond inappropriate, it is incitement to violence.
If techdirt is to maintain and sustain respectabitility then people like this should be forbidden to contribute."
The true weight of freedom and freedom of speech doesn't come from you being able to say what you want, it's you standing up for what others say EVEN IF YOU DON'T APPROVE OF IT. Be free.
I like techdirt, the ubernerd factor isn't as oppressive as slashdot. There isn't the cronyism of posting priority. No one is rating my shit "funny" "insightful" or any other pretention. The people that post here are posting to contribute, not to gain "karma points" with star trek references and linux suck-ups. People say what they think.
I like slashdot, too, but they're a microcosm.
In other words, I disagree, I find techdirt very respectable.
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Finally
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I used to work for a major UK telephone company...
I've had people who I EXPLAINED the payments to still decide to START renting a phone when they could buy the exact same model. Because if they rent they can pay through the bill. Sure it costs a lot more but apparently it's enough ease to make them happy.
It's insane. I'd finish the call gaping. But if someone fully in their right mind wants to spend their money that way, is it a company's job to stop them?
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Yes, it was usually little grey haired biddies that would come in every month to make that payment.
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It's not like she's being bankrupted or assaulted by the magical powers of the phone rental company, so who has the right to interfere?
Some people just need a nice warm glass of STFU. Her apparently overwrought or neurotic children need to be told one simple thing: This phone rental isn't any of your business or any of mine.
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People who rent phones
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the same phone?
dang.. now Thats reliable hardware.
can we get an injection of this old-school hardware durability into new products? cause I bought a phone last year, and threw it out this year when the plastic junker fell to pieces.
(might be because I spent maybe a dollar on it, but still!)
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Re: the same phone?
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Greedy Bitches...the Granddaughters!!!
Now that her family figures her death is around the corner, they are meddling into her finances. Typical.
Next, they will use this as the transition into claiming that she is senile so that they can takeover and write her will.
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I called the company and asked to buy it out figuring I would get a good deal since I had paid so much money already. Nope, just $200 off the new retail price. I negotiated a better deal with the owner, but still thought the price too steep so I went to the store and bought one and had a handy friend help me install it.
I wasn't happy with the company's practice, but in the end who do I blame other than myself?
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750,000 people nationwide still rent their phones
As for me, I believe the worst thing our government did was break up AT&T. Yes it was a monopoly but it was the best phone company in the world with the best service by far.
Look at the level of service we get today from our phone companies, like Verizon.
I actually had a Verizon service rep. tell me I was a problem customer because they did not install my phone cable correctly and I had to call three times to get it done right. result: I'm a problem customer. Right and running a cable 100 feet across my lawn on top of the ground to my house is correct installation.
As it turned out I installed my phone line and switched my service to AT&T local service. No more problems.
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Re: 750,000 people nationwide still rent their pho
As for the old gal that rented a phone, that would still be the case for everyone if Ma Bell still owned the network.
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Re:
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Re:
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Is Nothing Private?
In terms of what's a fair rate to pay in a free market (rather than a monopoly govmt or otherwise), well, that's what free markets are about. Your company decides what to charge. If everyone decides it's too much you're out of business.
I spent a number of years using a wheelchair after I lost my balance completely and had to re-learn it. I rented that wheelchair, eventually paying several times what it would have cost to buy it. My refusal to buy was a personal decision related to my single minded determination to stop needing it. I refused to own it for personal reasons. Was that a stupid financial decision? If I had died or become permanently disabled before being able to walk without it, would my 'stupidity' have become a matter for public scorn?
Ditto Tek'a's comment. :)
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A Dying Market...
The vast majority of the customers were obviously old people. You could tell by the handwriting on the checks and notes. The others were just confused what they were paying for. We would get notes from customers included with the payment asking what it was (but sent a check anyway) or asking to remove a long distance charge from another bill.
The product managers knew the handwriting on the wall - the market was a declining one. When the median age was as high as it was, eventually the customer base would die off.
But that didn't stop them from trying to make more money. And I see it continues today. If I recall correctly, most people were paying $14.90 every 3 months (it sinks in after you have processed the 5000th check that day). Looks like the product managers have jacked the price up to $29.10 every 3 months now. Not surprising giving they were trying to milk the last few dollars out of the program.
Funniest thing was the product managers came out to our office to talk up the service. Graphs were shown, product choices, etc. They even ran a video of a customer focus group (only the middle aged were shown in the video) where people spoke of the many benefits of leased phones. "No one can beat the reliability of a Ma Bell phone" and "I like knowing that I can return a broken phone and get a new one at any time". We were all amazed at the sheer stupidity.
No wonder spam email is profitable. Suckers exist everywhere...
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people want to rent..
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Renting a rotary phone. Heh heh... yeah, the customers have SOME responsibility.
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Re:
Yes, I think it is stupid for people to continue to pay to rent phones. I couldn't believe it when I heard about it several years ago. But from what they say, they clearly indicate on their bills that the customer can buy the phones or use other phones. What the customer is also paying for is the service to replace their phones or fix them if needed.
Many people pay money for this type of "insurance", which gives them peace of mind. And generally older people want more "insurance" and will pay more for it. Is it stupid that they charge people so much for this "insurance"? Of course.
But you have to realize that some people actually want this service and will pay "whatever" for it, as much as us young-uns think it is stupid.
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What Matt said
> the switches the telcos use to route your calls. It used to
> be apart of AT&T and the rental program transferred to
> them during the breakup (because they used to make the
> telephones).
Lucent is what remains of the once proud Bell Labs, the same place that brought us the Itegrated Circuit and other marvels of the 2oth Century. Its staff boasts a number of Nobel Luareats. Not that there's anything less proud, but its not what it once was. After the busting up of Ma Bell the Lab was "privitized" (in that rather than a pure research arm of AT&T if was mandated to make money for share holders) Bell Labs became Lucent Technologies and rather than produce electronic wonders it...? Supplies switches?
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Re: What Matt said
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SBC
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Re: SBC
> charging 40 cents a minute for "zone" We as customers
> have a right to put them out of business. This is by
> selecting other companies to provide the service we
> want.
English isn't your first language, is it?
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Old Reliable
Typical comment: "So what do I do if I just want to call someone ... or answer when they call me?"
Don't tell me this is an aging problem ... it's a manufacturing and design problem.
So, if my Mom wants to BUY her rotary phone, rather than rent it ... where does she go online to make that transaction?
If I remember correctly, the phone company allowed you to buy the phone you currently had, rather than rent it.
I bought ... and the damned thing broke about 2 months later, and I've been suffering from badly built phones for years.
Too bad AT&T had to come back thru SBC :-)
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The telephone monopoly was bad
So why are they being allowed to rebuild it by mergers of the same old pieces of it?
Big money spoke at the time of the breakup and it speaks again.
Our government does not act in the best interest of it's citizens.
All I can do is try to convince people to vote the way I do - and that is: ONCE AND DONE - If they are in office vote them out.
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Odds are slim
For pete sake people. No one calls the woman? Do they not have 911 in the area over there?? Fuck it if she likes rotary better this is the 21st century.
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Wow...
What I find really amazing is that there's $7.3 Million dollars a month to be made in the phone rental business. There's gold in them there hills...
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Cable modems = new rotary dial
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Re: Cable modems = new rotary dial
I remember when my folks bought their rental phone when the reg's changed. They were renting for like $12 every three months or something like that. They buy the phone... the phone co changes their policy that they only service the line up to the junction on the outside of the house. So now they have to pay a Union whiz-banger about $45 an hour to come in the house when the inside lines are screwed up.
I have no more problems with local phone co anymore. I "cut the cord" about three months ago and switched my home phone to a cell phone number. So now all my friends/ kids schools/ etc still have my same number and I can carry my phone everywhere. And with the switch, we bought a "Dock-n-Talk" by Phone Labs. So all the old wired phones in the house ring when someone calls the cell phone. Very smart, and saving $50 per month.
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Be glad they broke up the phone company. The process began in the late 60s, when sprint started. The phone company sued, they wanted to prohibit anyone from connecting anything to their lines that they didn't own.
They not only owned all of the lines in the country, they owned all of the phone wires in your HOUSE, your jacks, and the phones you used.
You were not allowed to own your own phone, only rent. You didn't own the wires in your house, so you had to get their permission to get another phone jack in another room, pay them to install it, and pay an extra monthly fee.
It was ILLEGAL to plug anything into the phone lines that was not phone company owned, approved, and rented from.
And they were incredibly conservative in what they themselves came up with and allowed to be used. That's why the same basic crappy phone design was around for over 100 years.
100 years without any real innovation.
Be damned glad they broke up the phone company - because if they hadn't there would be no internet. None. No internet for you to post your ignorant complaint on.
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Quite Complaning
most of australians are desperatly wainting for a rich american telco to buy telstra(as soon as its willing to sell) and destroy our line rentals
where im from(Tasmania) we have one real telco(wich is telstra ever over "telco" in australia rents off them) and one power provider NO gas provider and there romers flying around that the gov wants to start taxing up on "RAIN WATER" yes you heard me right RAIN WATER oh.. and some places are recicaling water so what that means is potentialy drinking your own urine.
in closing i have a few thing to say 1. be happy that at&t sold and for every over service you have because there are some places that charge the earth just to breath
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Bad marketing practice
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Math People....
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She didn't know. She can't be held responsible for not understanding. I don't think that means the telco is a big evil demon trying to steal an old lady's pension check either. It's just a situation that is unfortunate, but not really anyone's "fault."
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the telco
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Cable modems = new rotary dial
When my cable service goes down and I call Comcast, the first thing they do is blame it on the modem I bought.
Only when I can finally convince them them that it's their modem - that I rent from them - that they installed - on the wiring they put in - (you didn't buy one?) - then they'll discuss my problem.
I'm not a computer newbie - I'm an IT manager. With all the software and hardware problems that can cause internet access problems, it makes sense - for me - to let them run the wiires and own the modem.
Your mileage may differ. :)
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Needless to say, the didn't get the phone back or any money.
What is amazing nearly 7 years later we still get mail and credit card offers for her. I am still waiting on that Free power chair, maybe the shipped it to the Cemetary.
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Taxpayer Ripoff
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Renting Phones
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Ma bell taking advantage of rental phones
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