Reprogramming Your ATM For Fun And For Profit (Mainly For Profit)

from the not-so-hard-at-all dept

Thu, Sep 21st 2006 4:11am — Mike Masnick

There was some buzz last week after CNN showed a video of an ATM machine that had been programmed to believe it had $5 bills instead of $20s (so any withdrawal actually gave you 4X the money you asked for). The guy who did this just walked in and knew the code to reprogram the ATM. He then left the ATM programmed that way, and the ATM gave a lot of people extra money for nine days before someone pointed out the problem. So how easy would it be for anyone else to do this? Apparently it's ridiculously easy. With a bit of hunting online, it's not too hard to obtain a copy of the manual for the type of ATM machine used, including instructions on how to switch it to diagnostic mode. You do need a password, but the manual lists the typical default passwords that it seems likely many of these ATM owners failed to switch. Hopefully, this new burst of publicity over the issue will encourage owners of the machines to change their passwords -- but if you happen to see certain ATMs with unusually long lines in the near future (and don't mind committing fraud), you might want to withdraw some money.

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81 Comments

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dorpus, 21 Sep 2006 @ 5:22am

Turning $20's into Orange Jumpsuits
You mean a little basic algebra by the bank won't allow them to figure out when the machine started giving out too many $20's?

Nothing like the long arm of the law, when thugs in black body armor come smashing through your door, so you get to wear an orange uniform for the rest of your life.
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- Anonymous Coward, 15 Oct 2006 @ 6:24pm
  
  Re: Turning $20's into Orange Jumpsuits
  your a faggot bitch mate get hard and make sum money not every1 is a pussy little boy scared of the feds lol
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- shutup, 12 May 2010 @ 11:51am
  
  Re: Turning $20's into Orange Jumpsuits
  it was a prepaid debit card. virtually untracable
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Kilroy, 21 Sep 2006 @ 6:20am

But who is really at fault
The person who uses the information that is publically available to defraud the bank (which usually has its fist up their butt) or the people who are silly enough to not change the default passwords?

Sigh
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- Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 6:35am
  
  Re: But who is really at fault
  Duh, both.
  
  The Bank is guilty of not taking adequate measures to secure their assets, and they will be judged and punished by whatever activity is responsible for making sure they are taking adequate measures to protect their assets, be it their insurance companies, board of directors... yada yada. But they have not done anything criminally wrong, not to my knowledge, at least (IANAL).
  
  The jackass who is tampering with the atm is responsible for stealing from the bank. Every dollar that the ATM gave out "extra" is given out because the tamperer caused the machine to give out extra. HE effectively stole the money, whether or not he ever touched it or benefited from it. His crime was a criminal act. I jsut hope no dumbass judge thinks this case is somehow different because it involved technology.
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MissingFrame, 21 Sep 2006 @ 6:36am

Both at fault ...
The homeowner for leaving the door open (negligence), the robber for coming in and stealing everything. Neither is excusable by the other's actions.
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- Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 6:55am
  
  Re: Both at fault ...
  good analogy
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 6:54am

SWEET! Thats REALLY REALLY AWESOME. *goes online to try and find these manuals*
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Charlie, 21 Sep 2006 @ 6:56am

I bet a lot of people get letters
While they don't seem to have a good lead to trace the criminal (prepaid debit card), the vast majority of people using the ATM used personal checking accounts and they know exactly when/where. I would almost certainly bet the ATM owner will be able to have the bankds deduct the extra money from these accounts, and at least a few people will get hit with nasty overdraft charges.

Failure to secure ones assets doesn't excuse criminal behavior. If I see someone drop cash I am going to give it back to them. To simply take the cash would be dishonest.
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- Guru80, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:10am
  
  Re: I bet a lot of people get letters
  Had something similiar happen when my girlfriend worked for one of the companies that serviced the machines a couple years back. For whatever reason the machine was giving out 20's like they where 10's and was nearly 2 weeks before it was caught. As far as my knowledge though they never did go after the people who withdrew from it but I am assuming they very easily could have. I think in this case it was company negligence however so they decided to bite the bullet.
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- jay, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:13am
  
  Re: I bet a lot of people get letters
  I agree, but I don't think everyone sees it like that. The minute a bill hits the ground, some folks think its looking for a new owner - even if they saw the previous owner drop it. It's a different mind set. I've known otherwise honest people who truly felt this way.
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  - four00100, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:56am
    
    Re: Re: I bet a lot of people get letters
    "Bank error in your favor, collect $200." That's probably how those people from the nine days afterwards felt. How often is the error in the customers' favor anyway?
    
    Taking all that additional money out of ppls accounds and charging them overdrafts would cause more trouble to the bank than its worth. Those customers would go from pleased to pissed real quick with a simple mindset of "How are they gonna make a mistake and then charge me for it?"
    
    And while the argument is that these customer has an obligation to inform the bank, most wouldn't. Would you? Honestly.
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    - ebrke, 21 Sep 2006 @ 8:09am
      
      Re: Re: Re: I bet a lot of people get letters
      Would I tell them? Yes, of course I would--I also tell someone when they give me too much change. You're either honest or you're not honest, there's no middle ground.
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- Rick Bunker, 21 Sep 2006 @ 10:09am
  
  Re: I bet a lot of people get letters
  I certainly agree. The most disappointing part of the article to me had nothing to do with the bank not being careful with passwords, nor with one aberrant soul reprogramming the machine. It is that not a single person who was given too much money reported the issue to the bank for more than a week. This must be several hundred people who have no problem stealing someone else's money. And not ONE who did not. This is terrifically shameful.
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:05am

A problem
You'd actually need to start with a balance for this to work. That leaves most of you out
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:06am

Isolated
Most, if not all other manufactueres / middleware applications don't allow you to reprogram anything from the customer side. There are supervisor activities that can only be initiated from inside the machine. Shame on them for not updating their software.
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- Guru80, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:12am
  
  Re: Isolated
  Go to any run down area of town that has ATM machines and 99% (caution, made up statistic, caution) will appear to have the first generation of ATM machines still in use.
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Fool, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:39am

Give the $$$ back
The electronic log will know every account that received the wrong denominations and they WILL be responsible to return the money. It is illegal to keep monies gained through bank error, regardless of what the chance card in Monopoly says.
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- Rubin Ferziger, 21 Sep 2006 @ 10:17am
  
  Re: Give the $$$ back
  Actually, it is perfectly legal to accept the gains from a bank error. Perhaps you should not pretend you know the law so much?
  Rubin Ferziger
  Law office of Rubin Ferziger 212-490-8585
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- Ih8banks, 17 Jul 2007 @ 7:04am
  
  Re: Give the $$$ back
  it's wrong for us to keep monies gained thru bank error, but when the bank errors are in the banks favor (overdraft fees) it's ok for the banks to steal the money from us?
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Sanguine Dream, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:40am

All I have to say is...
Diebold makes ATMs...
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- Diebold Hater, 21 Sep 2006 @ 8:15am
  
  Re: All I have to say is...
  HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (you win!)
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Steve, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:42am

The manual.
This should take you straight to my article which includes a link to the actual manual in PDF.
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kbj, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:42am

What about those who stole the money?
Everyone who used it is guilty of theft, they new they were getting more than they were supposed to and no one said anything? "They gave me too much, ah well their problem not mine." If the machine was giving out 4x too little - now that would have been reported right away.

Sad state of the world - honesty is now considered a handicap not a necessity.
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:55am

Automatic Teller Machine Machines!
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Teilo, 21 Sep 2006 @ 7:59am

The ATM manufacturer is at fault
for not forcing the installer to change the default password. I mean honestly, that's just a basic security measure, and why an ATM manufacturer would allow the machine to operate WITHOUT a password change is beyond me. Unless of course it's made by Diebold, in which case no one should be surprised.
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- No way!, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:48am
  
  Re: The ATM manufacturer is at fault
  My friend, you could NOT BE MORE WRONG! It's a sign of this current "someone else to blame" culture to say something so dumb. Why should anyone FORCE anybody to do anything? It is ABSOLUTELY not the manufacturer's fault or responsibility to FORCE the installer to this. Any fool working in IT who does not immediately think to change a password to a device as security-critical as an ATM should be fired for professional incompetence, and as this was most unlikely to have been someone under the age of 18, they are, quite correctly, responsible for their own actions, and the bank employing them is by extension liable for their employees' actions. Still NOT the fault of the manufacturer.
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  - Teilo, 21 Sep 2006 @ 1:21pm
    
    Re: Re: The ATM manufacturer is at fault
    You are right that the Installer is also to blame, but if I am the producer of a high-security device, I am an idiot if I allow that device to be used while the default password is still in place. Security-101.
    
    Sorry, but the ATM manufacturer is still at fault, even if the fault is shared.
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Corey, 21 Sep 2006 @ 8:06am

Nine Days??
I just can't believe a) That it took nine days for the bank to figure out something was askew. b) That it took nine days for a customer to report that they got more money than requested. Maybe I'm being naive but I would have had more faith that my fellow human beings would do the right thing in a case such as this. I guess I can always take solace in the likely fact that the bank will likely have logs of the transactions, account for them and debit accordingly. But then again, it did take the bank nine days to realize that something was wrong. I have officially lost all faith in the cognitive abilities of human kind entirely.
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- Jim, 21 Sep 2006 @ 11:46am
  
  Re: Nine Days??
  The issue isn't that the bank will be out of money, it will be the owner of the ATM. The owner of ATMs are not always banks, but often, in this situation, the owner of the ATM is the owner of the gas station. What happens is the person requested to withdraw $20, and the misprogrammed ATM spit out 4 $20 bills. The user's back only got a request to transfer $20 from the user's account to the account of the owner of the ATM. The bank deducted $20, the owner recieved $20. However, it cost the owner $100 worth of cash. The user's bank doesn't care how much cash was actually released to the user. It was asked for $20, and obliged. The owner of the ATM will be the one that is out the money. It took 9 days for someone to report it to the gas station. The person/company that stocks the ATM just gets a request to stock the machine with the standard bills. The stack of bills cost the owner x amount, but the cost of the bills and the income from the transfers from the user's bank would probably only be reconciled once a month. Until the reconcilliation the owner would probably not notice something was wrong.
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tiki toc toc, 21 Sep 2006 @ 8:10am

Good for you...
i quess you really can find anything online now a days... i think thats funny.. ok if you got back four times the money an it didnt show up on your account that it was missing?? you wouldnt keep it??? come on!!! everyone now a days its about money and so on an so on........be evil take the money... you could do great things with it like buy me stuff... and plus if there stupid enough not to change the codes there fault..... how safe are they being then...
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- Informed white male, 9 Oct 2012 @ 4:46pm
  
  Re: Good for you...
  You're an idiot nigger.
  1.) kill yourself for using "q" for "g"
  2.) don't say "like buy me stuff". That makes your race seem even more ignorant.
  3.) please for the love of god don't get an idea from this thread. Knowing you jiggaboos. You'll probably try it and get caught.
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 8:14am

Nice reference
to Smashing the Stack
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 8:25am

Not a major bank
Alot of these machines are owned by private people. Either the store owner or someone who pays the store for space and elevtricity. Most of the time these are only checked once a week or every other week depending on how quickly its depleted. So 9 days is not at all unusuall.
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Eyes on you, 21 Sep 2006 @ 8:34am

Big Brother
Most ATMs are equipped with a camera in addition to recording the account accessed. Just because they don't come after you doesn't mean they don't know who the theives are.

As an earlier commenter said, either you are honest or you are not. Justifying your actions doesn't change that.
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Annoying Bastard, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:01am

And here's the manual
http://www.wegrowbusiness.ca/manuals/Tranax_MB_Operator_Manual.pdf?GCE=489d2476c9728ab16cbde0a2acc43 8a5#search=%22Tranax%20Mini%20Bank%201500%20manual%22

WAY TOO EASY.
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- Freak poster, 31 May 2015 @ 1:02pm
  
  Re: And here's the manual
  Got dat since how can I acess denominations menu
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:02am

the guy who programmed is a criminal. the bank is at fault for not ensuring the security of their systems.

the "users" aren't at fault. when you see 5 bucks on the ground, do you take it to the cops, or do you pocket it? when you go to your local burger joint and order 2 cheesburgers, and get 3, do you take one back? does the burger place come after you for the extra $1.50 for the "extra" burger? what's the difference if you go to a human teller and withdraw $200, but the 20s are stuck together and you get 300? you drive home, or go shopping or on vacation or what not, not realizing the extra you have. you take it from the bank envolope, and place in your purse/wallet and go on your way. now, the teller is out thte extra money, and has no way of tracking it. you use your money, and have no record there (threw away cash reciepts) so what's going to happen now?
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- Burger their, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:24am
  
  Re: Honesty
  "He that is faithful in what is least is faithful in what is greatest." ie, honest is honest, dishonest is dishonest, I agree. Some situations allow for some thought, though: Your illustration of an extra burger... you can't give it back, they have to trash it if you do, because they can't re-stock food another customer has touched (sigh because people are freaky and do weird things), so in that case, yes, I might give it back if I noticed it immediately, but not if I noticed later.
  Your teller giving out $300 instead of $200 is incompetent and will be fired (I did this job: You have to be REALLY bad or stupid not to notice 5 stuck bills. But, yes, I've given back a few cents given in error. Once, to give $196 back to a bank for six months, finally gave up & kept it - they wouldn't take it!
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- John, 21 Sep 2006 @ 11:23am
  
  Re: The difference is
  If you seen someone drop a bill, pick it up and take it then you're comitting a crime. You know where it belongs (not in your wallet) but you don't give it back. If you find a bill on the ground, having not seen who dropped it, there's no one you can give it to. Plus your choosen denomination is irrelevant, $5??? The Pope wouldn't turn in $5 to the police. Now, $500 or $5,000 that should go to the police, no one claims it and it's yours by right.
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- Jamfish, 18 Jul 2007 @ 12:39pm
  
  Re: Users aren't at fault?
  Excuse me, but in this case they are. Whether you knowingly or unknowingly remove more money than authorized, you are responsible. What's going to happen now? You can make it right and return the item/amount/equivalent in $$ (eaten/spent or not) to the bank/burger joint/etc.
  
  It's called honesty and restitution. I know... two concepts slowly becoming foreign here in the land of the free and the home of the brave.
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xxl3w, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:08am

Ohh my.
This is really offtopic, but i really don't feel like signing up for this site to post a disussion about this. Link. OK, did these guys ever consider the tattoo means Grand Theft Auto? which is the CRIME he's committing, and not the videogame?
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jrock, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:10am

I bet they blame MySpace...."Damn you social networking sites...damn you!"
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:25am

BTW the IP addresses of all the readers of this site have been recorded. You will be recieving letters from the FDIC.
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satan, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:34am

9 days
9 days and nobody said anything? They are all guilty
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Comboman, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:52am

Get off your high horse.
From reading the responses here, I must assume that everyone in the world is a crook with the exception of Techdirt commenters. I'm not at all surprised that it took 9 days to discover the error and I don't question the honesty of the customers that used the machine. Do you actually count the cash that comes out every time you use an ATM? Do you look at the printed recept? Based on the number of times I've seen recepts from previous customers still in the slot when I go to use an ATM and the number of people that just grab their money and toss the recept without looking at it, I'd say the majority of people fall into this category. Even if they did notice the extra bills, they probably just assumed that they pressed the wrong key on the machine at withdrew more than they wanted to. Twenty years ago, people were distrustful of ATMs and double-checked everything, but this is a mature technology now and people take it for granted that it always works. Kinda like UPC scanners at the grocery store; everyone complains about the little old who holds up the line by double-checking her bill but have you ever checked yours? They are frequently in error (usually in the store's favor).
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wolff000, 21 Sep 2006 @ 9:55am

Can't wait
WOOHOO Free money. I would do this in a heart beat if i did not have an all consuming fear of jail. i have neen there once on a drunk in public. I have no plans on ever going back. This is just another example of how much an illusion security is in corporate America.
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kbob88, 21 Sep 2006 @ 10:03am

Who's at fault?
If the ATM is owned by a bank, they may be unwilling to go after the customers for the money. It's at least partially their fault, and banks are usually very publicity-shy. They won't want to draw attention to the fact that they screwed up. A bank's primary asset is its image as a secure place to store money after all. An article in the local paper about how their ATM gave away money is not in their best interest.

If the ATM is owned by someone else (as most of the small ones at convenience stores are), they may have no way of retrieving the money. They'd have to get the individual's contact information from the customers' banks, because all they're likely to have is the account number and the bank's routing/ABA number. The bank, for privacy concerns, may be unwilling to hand over their customers' information (unless subpoenaed).

Then, what's their claim? The customer asked for $100. The bank authorized them to give out $100. They gave out $200. And can they prove it? The machine's logs all state that it gave out $100! What's their proof that it actually gave out $200? The customer can insist that he received $100, and I'm not sure how the machine owner can prove otherwise. He may have a log from the armored car service that fills the machine showing that they only put $20s in. Then we have the battle of the conflicting logs and the customer's version of events.
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chris (profile), 21 Sep 2006 @ 10:11am

re: both at fault
that's an easy question to settle, ask any insurance company. if you are negligent, they won't cover your loss. insurance companies aren't exactly pillars of morality, but the reality of the situation is that of you don't take every measure to protect yourself, then you are out of luck.

it seems pretty stupid to not take every measure there is to protect it since someone is going to try to crack it. it's a little bank that no one is guarding. people rob these machines all the time. or just steal the machines outright.

this is a game being played between the people that make the machines and the people that break into them. it's been going on since some guy in the 50's figured out how to get a payphone to give him money.
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mr. hmmm, 21 Sep 2006 @ 10:33am

What happens if I withdraw $200 dollars from ATM and I don't even count my money because I believed the ATM "should" have given me the right amount.

Being unaware of things can be a crime as well?
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- Jamfish, 18 Jul 2007 @ 12:46pm
  
  Re: Yes...
  ...you are correct. Ignorance of the law is not a defense. Ask any lawyer, CPA, etc.
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anna, 21 Sep 2006 @ 10:40am

If a cashier or teller hands me the wrong change I will point out the error. That's another human being who could lose their job or get the overage taken out of their measly paycheck at the end of the week.

If a Brinks truck crashed in my neighborhood, and bundles of money flew out, I'll be damned if I'd turn in the cash. Ironically I wasn't always this way. I once believed that honesty pays. The ONLY reason that I would give money back from an ATM mistake in my favor is that I know damned well the bank always wins and I'm not going to wear the proverbial orange jumpsuit or take part in the initiation of old Martha Stewart.
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Temporarily Rich, 21 Sep 2006 @ 10:44am

ATM Story
About twenty five years ago, an ATM gave me $20 too much. I parked the can and walked into the bank to try to give it back to them and they denied that it happened. A week later, I received a terse letter from the bank telling me that it was going to debit my account for the $20. No mention of the fact that I had tried to immediately fix the problem.

Slightly OT: I just heard a commedian talk about how he used an ATM to buy $20 of his own money for $1.50...

You gotta love progress!
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Beth, 21 Sep 2006 @ 11:02am

Who got Screwed?
that's the real question. Everyone keeps talking about banks. kbob88 points out that often in convience stores it is not a banks' ATM, it is a privately-owned ATM. I worked for a bar that didn't take credit cards so they got a lease-to-own ATM. We were responsible for setting it up and putting money in ourselves. There was not an armoured Briggs truck from MegaBank coming to fill it up. When the machine was empty every week or so, we opened the bar safe and put more money in in the machine. Every month we would get a percentage of the service charge deposited into the bar's checking account. It would take a long time for us to realize that we were going through an abnormal abount of money (assuming people were coming back for more). Who would get screwed in this case? The company that was putting money into the machine, not the bank, they don't own the machine and are not responsible if it gets reprogrammed. Does screwing a convience store owner change anyone's opinion if it's wrong or not?
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- Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 11:19am
  
  Re: Who got Screwed?
  In that special case, I would say the restaurent would be guilty of not accepting credit cards, and forcing people to do things the absurdly difficult way.
  
  For their punishment, they would be out the money.
  
  (Also, if a bar-type restaurant didnt "hear" the customers getting all excited over free money, then they should be punished for that stupid mistake as well)
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digdug, 21 Sep 2006 @ 12:01pm

what's the difference if you go to a human teller and withdraw $200, but the 20s are stuck together and you get 300?
Do you mean to tell me that you don't count your money on the spot when getting $200 from a bank teller?
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ReaderRick, 21 Sep 2006 @ 1:02pm

Looking at the manual [section 3.28-3.29], you can easily see that if someone wanted to they could have changed the $20's slot to "25 free coupons" ($500) and emptied the ATM. They could have also reset the password which - if he wanted to make a point, would have been the "proper" thing to do. Telling the owner that you can reprogram their ATM would likely end with you in handcuffs, but reset their pwd and a change the rotating advert to announce the owner's ignorance...priceless.

Is the guy a criminal for accessing a public machine and playing with it's settings? Yes, his crime would be criminal mischief. Although intent of damage is not apparent, pecuniary (monetary) loss has occurred. Whoever set up the machine is negligent and also shares in the guilt.
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 1:16pm

Re:9 days?
If the atm is not owned by the bank, the customers might not even have known who to contact. We have no way of knowing how many customers called to report an atm error to their bank, or possibly the company who made the machine or whatever company whose name happened to be on the machine somewhere. Those companies don't care and discard the report and it never gets to the owner.
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Anonymous Coward, 21 Sep 2006 @ 1:33pm

well, when i get money from the bank teller, they count it out infront of me, making nice stacks of 100 or so. if 2 20s are stuck together, we both miss it because we both can't see it. then, i think i have the right ammount because it was counted for me so i spend.

what about if it wasn't a bank teller, but a cashier from a retail store. i sold my books baack in colege and was supposed to get 45 bucks. i ended up getting close to 70 because the girl just anded me an extra 20. did i tell her? nope. if they are gonna rape me on text book prices, i'm gonna let them rape themselves with refunds.
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Ex NCR ATM Guy, 21 Sep 2006 @ 3:48pm

It's the ATM Manufacturers Fault
Unless there is a hardware interlock on the money safe door, safe door has to be in the "OPEN" position before ANY passwords will work to get into the ATM configuration, the Manufacturer is at fault. Now if someone has the combination to the safe, now that's another issue. Can you say "Inside Job" or "let's read the combination off of the wall"

As far as ATM's in general dispensing the wrong denomination of cash, it can be the fault of the Teller, ATM machine, or the Network.

The New NCR and Diebold ATM's are Overpriced Microsoft Windows Boxes. That should make you feel REAL secure.
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Rabid Wolverine, 22 Sep 2006 @ 3:12am

ATM Theft, You bunch of morons...
Gee, lets see now, who is at fault, the bank or the crook?

One my favorite little test of friendship, especially someone I've just met, is to leave a $20 bill laying out on the kitchen table or somewhere that I know my new 'friend' will notice it.

I then leave them alone with it for about 10 to 20 minutes and come back. If the bill is still there then they have passed the test. If not I don't confront them about it, I just never have anything to do with them again. It's worth the $20 to find out up front whether or not they are a thief and/or they have that much disrespect for me.

Now, whose fault is it, mine for leaving the $20 laying around or theirs for taking it?

The same with the bank, whoever reprogrammed their ATM is at fault and should be prosecuted.
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buckminster futt, 22 Sep 2006 @ 3:51am

Do you people honestly believe....
.
.
for one minute that this bullshit ATM story is true!?

Oh yeah, your brother-in-law that works at the corner store sez he saw it happen. Or rather he knows someone who saw it or something similar.... Sure.

Maybe we should go check on snopes.com, the urban ledgends and see what they have on it
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- BillyRayCyrus4EVR, 22 Sep 2006 @ 9:51am
  
  Re: Do you people honestly believe....
  Whaddya mean "this story is bullpoop"? The video is on YouTube man. That's good enough for me.
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- user, 12 May 2010 @ 10:41am
  
  Re: Do you people honestly believe....
  Have a friend who went to jail for this exact scam. It is true.
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mark, 22 Sep 2006 @ 7:32am

First - the guy prob cant be caught because he prob did not withdraw from the bank but only change the configuration.

2nd - the bank would need to prove you got that money and that is something they cannot do. They have no witnesses, the cameras do not take pics of the bills, so they can only speculate that the machine gave out more money than the paper trail shows relative to a specific withdrawal.
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Noldo, 22 Sep 2006 @ 9:04am

They DO know who you are, but pretty much all banks have a limit as to how much you can actually withdraw, and we all know its not that much money so I think the bank evaluated this case, and dismissed it probably because it will be more expensive to identify and rebalance accounts, than the actual loss they had through the ATM.

Another thing, I used to work in a bank for about 4 years, and I noticed sometimes people get overcharged for some reason (system error they said) the accounts balance only had a difference of no more than a dollar, but if you think about this same situation happening on I don't know 40,000 ppl?
Now THATS stealing, so I guess there wouldn't be that much guilt in stealing from a bank through ATMs... it would be somehow like a Robin Hood situation. Steal from Thieves
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- ReaderRick, 22 Sep 2006 @ 11:25am
  
  Re: Shaving pennies
  A college friend was exiled from NYC because he was basically doing what the banks do themselves - shaving the half-pennies. Banks round account balances to the nearest penny by default. My friend was doing this but instead of the percentage going towards the bank, he had it diverted to his account. After a month or two of his program running he'd racked up over $100k (this was back in the late '80's). As a minor, he was offered jail time or exile. He was allowed back in NY several years later.
  
  The point is that yes, banks do steal from customers on a daily basis. Most people consider it trivial, but spread out over 100,000 or more accounts it adds up. So, yes customers often feel justified when a bank error favors them.
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  - FAH-Q, 17 Jul 2007 @ 9:23am
    
    Re: Re: Shaving pennies
    Ya right.. was he in the superman movie?
    You know thats the whole story plot of one of the original superman movies right?
    Your a fool to have listened you friends tall tale.
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Anonymous II, 24 Sep 2006 @ 5:15am

RE: Do you people honestly believe....
I have been following this for the last two days. The online copies of ATM manuals are being removed from the web at a great rate - damage limitation by ATM manufacturers. No question that this is for real. I am waiting to see how log before some idiot tries a copycat and gets caught
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JOhn Doe, 1 Apr 2007 @ 6:04am

ATM Reprogram
Its not that easy to reprogram the machine. The guy was an ex-employee who knew a master code that was never changed by the owner. It was the owners fault, shame on him. Also the guy used a prepaid VISA debit card that was untraceable. He was eventually nabbed and is in jail as we speak. Crime doesn't pay.
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Anonymous Coward, 17 Jul 2007 @ 5:55am

oh yaa, and bank fee are really justified? How does it cost them $3.50 to do a transaction when its all automatic? people need to regain their rights
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Anonymous Coward, 12 Apr 2008 @ 12:00pm

i will have loved to be part of this shit man
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gurmeet, 8 Sep 2008 @ 8:56am

Technical specification of NCR ATM machine Year of Mfg. 2001
Dear Sir, Please send me technical specification of ATM machine, Year of Manufacturing : 2001
Regards
G S Bhurjee
Prompt action over the matter will be highly appriciated
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skynet, 2 May 2009 @ 5:46am

WANT A CODE TO CHEAT ATM
Just email me and i shall explain.
email: skynetal@yahoo.com
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ANONYMOUS STRANGER, 10 May 2009 @ 1:31pm

CASH MACHINE HACK
Just a few days ago a guy at my local townhall literally emptied two cashmachines with some funny software card. He simply placed the card in a magnetic and chip reader of some kind and downloaded a malicious software and it emptied the cash machines....does anyone happen to know what the hell he did coz i am stone broke and if i see this guy again god...lets jus say i will be one rich S>O>B
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paris, 3 Sep 2010 @ 4:21pm

Here is what I make of the whole situation, fuck banks and their initiative. You would think they are there to help, like loan you money and whatever, however as soon as you go over on your account they stick you with a 35 dollar overdraft fee. There is always some kind of fee that you have to pay monthly, and the only one it is benefitting is the bank. So, if an ATM were to give me a lil extra... fuck it, I'm gonna spend it as soon as possible, and tell the bank to eat shit. They should pay closer attention.
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enkryp, 5 Oct 2010 @ 1:50pm

i have the manual :)
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Roger Smith, 19 Oct 2010 @ 11:55pm

I love it.
Only on the Internet would a bunch of armchair lawyers second-guess AN ACTUAL LAWYER (comment #40). Loss due to negligence sucks, but it's not in any form illegal; however, this doesn't excuse the single bad actor who knew about the machine's vulnerability.
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Anonymous Coward, 22 Jul 2011 @ 5:16am

i think is what i call information freedom
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Evil genius, 18 Aug 2013 @ 9:03am

Politicians steal taxs payers money all the time the bank steals money from people all the time either way when the system has a loophole to get extra why not take it you practically stealing your own money back
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george warren, 5 Feb 2015 @ 8:37am

Who in the hell is going to point out that an atm gave them too much money i swear some people are just dumb they should make him pay back all the money since he is so concerned about it. If the atm gave me more money then it should have im going to thank god for the blessing not cry to the atm co or store clerk.
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