Drug Websites Are Bad... Mmmmkay?
from the spying-is-the-only-way-to-teach-kids-drugs-are-bad? dept
It's always something. If you can't blame video games for bad behavior, how about websites? There's a fear mongering story in the Detroit Free Press talking about how kids these days are are getting hooked on drugs after looking at drug websites. There's all sorts of scary quotes suggesting that it just takes looking over these websites to turn kids into full-blown addicts (the anecdote at the beginning suggests exactly that). Then, there are all drug counselor-type folks quoted in the article who seem to say that the real problem is that kids can be sneaky online. To them, the only solution is to better spy on your kids -- because nothing makes a kid less likely to do something rebellious than thinking his or her parents don't trust him or her. The "experts" keep saying the problem is "unfettered and unmonitored" access to the internet. However, as has been pointed out over and over again, parenting isn't about watching what your kid does all the time, but teaching them right from wrong, so that they can make those decisions even if you're not around. Nowhere does the article or any of the experts suggest that, rather than spying on your kids surfing habit, you might be better off teaching them why drugs are dangerous and to be skeptical of some of the content they find online. Instead, they point to recommendations from the Office of National Drug Control Policy, telling parents to check their kids cell phone records, IM archives and web histories. Apparently, the folks who wrote that report learned their parenting skills from HP's board.
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Re: HP Comment
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the flaw in your idea...
this is interesting...
http://www.webmd.com/content/article/113/110805.htm
http://www.sciencenews.org/ar ticles/20051015/fob7.asp
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Re: the flaw in your idea...
Also, I'd imagine the parenting instinct compels parents to attempt to mitigate any potential threats to their offspring. If this includes just plain lying about something I think many will sleep soundly.
If parents taught their children about drugs the result could be worse than any piece of state-sponsored propaganda you've ever seen.
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Re: Re: the flaw in your idea...
Definitely not enough. Why? When was the last time you saw in ANY educational video or article an example of what happens to... say, a heroine addict going through withdrawals? Never. Why? My guess is because our society is hell-bent on shielding the populous from REALITY of life. Nobody wants to know because it's not an easy thing to think about let alone actually see - it's damn depressing. Education comes from promotion of the facts of life and we, as a society, apparently aren't interested in the reality of life. It's pretty sad actually.
...the parenting instinct compels parents to attempt to mitigate any potential threats to their offspring...
Absolutely. The sad part is exactly what I stated above. For some reason we think that shielding our offspring from the realities of the world makes them safer. That's pretty stupid. If you don't really educate your children about what is really out there in the world than when they grow up they’ll be terribly ignorant about dangers. If they make it long enough to have children of their own than they pass bad teachings to their kids - hrm... this is probably why the Darwin Awards have so much material.
If parents taught their children about drugs the result could be worse than any piece of state-sponsored propaganda you've ever seen.
That's just straight ignorant bullshit. Sorry, but I'll call it as I see it. It parents taught their kids EVERYTHING about drugs than we would see a generation of highly informed and intelligent people. Drugs, in small doses don't generally hurt anyone (assuming they aren't being totally stupid - like operating heavy machinery) but abuse is absolutely harmful - destroys lives and kills people. If we not only taught our kids about what drugs are but also about the potential dangers (and let's REALLY show them this time - like the first paragraph, haul your kid over to the local sanitarium or drug rehabilitation facility and show them what happens to many people who use dope and alcohol and see how effective that one is...).
IMHO the fact is that we need to stop coddling everyone in our society and start showing cold, hard, real life. Then maybe the Darwin Awards will find it more difficult to publish. Frankly, I believe we pretty much live in a society of pussies who don't have the balls to take a good hard look at what life really is.
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Re: Re: Re: the flaw in your idea...
We might see a generation of highly informed and intelligent people if parents inform themselves first but if they just parrot what they think they know and add in some of that modern phenomenon of shielding their children from reality then you could end up with some real ignorant bullshit.
Handing drugs education over to parents right now would be like handing anarchy over to the population of any "civilised" Western state. They wouldn't know what to do with it and would inevitably fuck it up really quickly.
I'm not saying parents teaching their children about ANYTHING is a bad idea - it seems to be mostly working so far - but parents also pass on their prejudices. We have to deal with these prejudices before any change in drugs education policy could be considered.
The current state of affairs really is that kids are probably better off going to some random website than seeking advice from the authority figures around them because on this issue these authority figures have some really fucked up ideas.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: the flaw in your idea...
The material is there is mass. If parents are really interested in knowing the dangers all they have to do is read. Nobody can force parents to parent - we've seen that one in overwhelming abundance with the whole, "my kid played GTA and committed crimes and it's GTA's fault" attitude.
Handing drugs education over to parents right now would be like handing anarchy over to the population...
Oh please. Drug education is ALREADY in the "parents hands" first of all. It's parents RESPONSIBILITY to educate their offspring - NOT THE STATES. The problem here is that our society breeds blindness through education. We don't tell parents to show reality. How many books in drug abuse education courses show video of alcohol abuse withdrawal? That's one is pretty nasty to watch - show that to your 12-year-old and see it they don't think about it before they start getting smashed at parties at the age of 15. We need to tell parents to show life - it's their responsibility, has always been their responsibility and they should be constantly reminded of their responsibilities. That comment is a simple cop-out to dealing with it.
I'm not saying parents teaching their children about ANYTHING is a bad idea - it seems to be mostly working so far...
Umm. either they are creating anarchy or they're doing a good job so far - which is it? This doesn't jive with your previous statement at all.
The current state of affairs really is that kids are probably better off going to some random website than seeking advice from the authority figures around them because on this issue these authority figures have some really fucked up ideas.
Where to begin? Kids are NEVER better off going to some random website for education - that's complete BS. Why do you think there are so many myths on the street surrounding the effects of drugs? Because of shit like that. If you really think that your child is better off going to some web site than you teaching them you're a sad, sad individual and I fear for the community around you with that kind of ignorant judgment. Authority figures are people - they are parents and grandparents in our society. Sure, many of them have twisted ideas of what it what but I don't buy for a second that MOST of them are that way. Fact is it's often their JOB to know the realities of the harmful effects of drug abuse. This is another cop-out and I really hope you go educate yourself and others around you instead of blindly complaining about it and then being another sheeple who doesn't think it's your responsibility to teach others in your society about what you've learned.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: the flaw in your idea...
Learn to read. If you can already read, practice comprehension.
Right now they are better off because, as I said, the authority figures they're supposed to rely on are completely full of shit.
There's the lesson, folks... Never argue with anyone who says "I calls it as I sees it!" and expects a medal for it - blustery, arrogant and doesn't fucking listen.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: the flaw in your idea...
Frankly, IMHO, there are way too many victims of Dr Spock's methods out there.
Kids NEED to be taught - about drugs & dangers thereof, and about Life.
That is the PARENT'S responsibility.
It would be nice if the State or Feds had a website that gave clear info on drugs (in this instance) that parents could easily use and understand.
NOT the overhyped attenpts at it they now have.
Curiosity was quoted as a major factor in trying / getting hooked on drugs. I believe that is probably correct, and several things that parents could say/do come to mind....but we'll leave those to your imaginations.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: the flaw in your idea.
I'm not sure, but it might be the fact that I was bullshitted for years about this very issue.
Pity they haven't got a clue and aren't inclined to educate themselves. This situation might change but while the state control of drugs policy and "education" brings in massive revenues the chances are slim.
That said, I don't think I'd provide a great perspective on drugs to any impressionable young mind with my experience... "Stick to mushrooms if you must trip - acid is a four day hangover, my young friend!"
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I have to say though, as someone who frequents drug bulletin boards and so on, I have probably tried, or become curious about, some drugs, in ways that wouldn't have happened if I'd never visited those sites. Even providing legitimate harm reduction information can have a downside.
Of course, I agree with Mike's comments about parenting and spying.
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Maybe not...
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Re: Maybe not...
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Re: Maybe not...
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LOL@MIKE
Pretext your kids, too funny.
I tend to agree here though, raising your kids is not about spying on them, making sure they never do anything wrong. Teaching your kids to know right from wrong, making sure they learn from their mistakes or wrong doings, and taking reponsibility for what they do is what raising kids is about.
My son attempted to steal something from Walmart and was caught by security. We made sure he learned a lesson from the entire ordeal. It was a trying time for all of us but we did not coddle him, get legal help to make it all go away, or deny he would do something like that.
I would like to think he has learned his lesson and from all apperances he did. Now we just have to trust he will get it right and watch as he applies these lessons. Spying on him 24/7 would do nothing for the lesson it taught him and drive us mad.
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In drug-related news
So how many people are going to assassinate the loud dogs in their neighborhood now?
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Drug influencing websites..
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Re: Drug influencing websites..
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Drug website veracity
It's sorta like telling kids that abstinence is only way to prevent pregnancy. You end up with a bunch of pregnant teenagers.
buck
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Blame Blame Blame
The problem here is too much government input and not enough parental input. The government wants us to believe that drug users are criminals and that they will never play sports or that they will let their baby sister go wander into the pool or that the druggies will drive a car into a crowd of people.
I know attorneys hooked on cocaine, business owners who smoke pot, engineers who take acid, and other upstanding citizens who are not criminals. Addiction is not limited to drugs, and should not be a criminal offense.
An unbiased report of the facts is what the government is scared of. If people find out that the "man" lies to us about how harmful certain chemicals are (not that the legal ones are any safer...) then that could cause a lot of questions that someone will have to be held accountable for. What if they lie to us about other things?
The government is trying to get complete control over us. Who the hell are they to tell anyone what right and wrong is. They are buried in corruption and are just trying to cover their asses. This is one more on the list of things to go in front of a judge about why the internet needs censorship and government control.
I personally feel that information, good or bad, should be available to everyone. If you want to know what it is you are about to put in your body, you should be able to look it up. Why are we not angry with the Encyclopedia Brittanica? Or the newspaper that printed this story? Information and the sharing of information is our right as humans.
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erowid
if people cant make an educatated decison about drugs after reading all the facts then they deserve to be steril and not infect our gene pool.
just remember weed isnt a drug, its an herb :-)
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mother
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Balance.
If and when your kids start getting bold and/or disrespectful, I think its pretty much bad parenting to simply grant your kids cart-blanche to be "little-adults" with all the privacy that implies. Parents need to have more responsibility than that or else we get more of the high school masacre's and deadly confrontations we wish the news didn't have to inform us about.
Whether its drugs or guns, parents should be parents, and not simply landlords, wardens, or roomates. If that involves a small amount of uncomfortable spying, then it does. I doubt the courts are going to appreciate respecting little Billy's boundaries in retrospect after he's hooked half the school on crystal meth or busted a cap in his 5th period math teacher. Sometimes kids have problems that aren't about your relationship with them, but who they are.
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right on
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the 'real' terror...
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hp comment again
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D.A.R.E made me do it
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so true
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A parent's view
I'm a parent of a lovely 4 1/2 year old child.
Like many other people who love to pretend otherwise, I experimented with drugs in college and high school. Without the information provided by Erowid and Hyperreal, I can remember several nights that may have had a much worse outcome.
The more information one has, the more likely they are to make better decisions. If someone had decide to take drugs, I would hope that there would be some source of accurate information that would allow them to do it "responsibly".
Some people are always going to feel that the only way to understand something is to experience it for yourself.
Trying to hide "undesirable" or "dangerous" influences only promotes curiosity; which without information makes even more dangerous situations probable.
Now I plan on talking to my child about the importance of tolerance, making good decisions and taking accountability for their own actions.
I think that you need to teach a child these things first before you start talking about violence, obscene language, underage sex, drug abuse, and crime.
If laws and enforcement were only focused on cases where people were actually injured either intentionally or through gross negligence, our courts would be a lot less crowded. We wouldn't need to be building more jails to institutionalize a growing segment of the population.
Drugs aren't necessarily the problem.
I think they facilitate poor decisions and those poor decisions are the real problem.
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Scare them straight before they're changed
Kid Turns 13 -teenager
-make them watch Requiem for a Dream
-make them watch Train Spotting
-make them watch Scanner Darkly
-ask them if they ever want to turn out like the people in those movies
-tell them then don't do drugs
if your kid says they do, you have worse problems than drug abuse in your future.
anyone that watches those movies and wants to still try taking serious drugs(natural stuff excluded, won't hurt you like those) has problems, and we don't need them populating anyway.
oh ya, and make them watch those movies once a year until they go to college. they might not be the most sane people out there, but at least they won't be wastes of life.
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Stop the madness!
The consistent theme that we must monitor in every possible way the behaviours and actions of our children is pure folly.
The bottom line is that you could implement the most sophisticated monitoring system in existence, but at some point, YOUR CHILD WILL LEAVE THE HOUSE. At that point, your abilty to CONTROL what the child does and what the child sees is out of your hands.
And your child will most likely find a way to circumvent any measures you take to insulate them from the ills of society. Sooner or later, they will be exposed.
The question is would you rather that exposure come from a parent or elsewhere.
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