Tiffany CEO Admits That It's Suing eBay Because It's Too Hard To Find Real Counterfeiters

from the lawsuits-don't-work-that-way dept

Mon, Nov 26th 2007 10:15pm — Mike Masnick

Three and a half years ago, famed jeweler Tiffany sued eBay because people were selling counterfeit Tiffany goods on the auction site. As we noted at the time, it doesn't make any sense at all to sue eBay, since it's not eBay who's doing anything wrong. Tiffany's CEO has now basically admitted that, but doesn't seem to mind. At a hearing in the lawsuit, CEO Michael Kowalski admitted that the firm was suing eBay because it was hard to find the actual sellers. That may make sense in the mind of a Tiffany exec, but the way laws work is that you don't get to sue the person or company who's easy to find just because those actually responsible are hard to find. When a robber holds up a Tiffany store, does Kowalski sue the maker of the getaway car, because the robber can't be found? The company does admit that it sues the individuals when they can be found, but the CEO refers to them as "phantasms" and claimed it made more sense to just focus on eBay, saying that the real fault is "the distribution network, not the seller." Next thing you know, Kowalski will be suing the internet itself. After all, it's "the network, not the seller."

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Filed Under: counterfeit goods, luxury goods, safe harbor
Companies: ebay, tiffany

35 Comments

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dirk, 26 Nov 2007 @ 10:55pm

ebay and counterfeiters
I once had my ebay account hacked and the dude listed a bunch of fake counterfeit tiffany jewelry. That is, using my account, he put up fake auctions for clearly counterfeit jewelry.

I was pumped.
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Al Gore, 26 Nov 2007 @ 11:49pm

i invented the internet
If Tiffany sues the internet, I will vigorously defend myself against all charges. Instead, Tiffany should sue the Google. Where would eBay be without the Google.
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- John Q Public, 27 Nov 2007 @ 3:31am
  
  Re: i invented the internet
  "The Google" ????? My Friend you are just what the internet needs another ID10T. Why don't you go and play on the google and leave the internet for the smart folks
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  - Oh Come On, 27 Nov 2007 @ 4:48am
    
    Re: Re: i invented the internet
    John Q, you need to get a sense of humor and read a newspaper from time to time.
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  - Sheesh, 27 Nov 2007 @ 5:10am
    
    Re: Re: i invented the internet
    Whoosh - the sound of a comment going over your head.
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- Wizard Prang, 27 Nov 2007 @ 6:28am
  
  You forgot about...
  ...the tubes.
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Anon, 27 Nov 2007 @ 12:34am

This is so weird
It's so strange. I was just looking for a Tiffany's charm bracelet on eBay and decided to have a look on Techdirt - and here this is.

Oh, and it's very stupid to sue eBay for this - although I don't think the people who shop at his stores are really going to care if he sues eBay for a bunch of incorrect reasons or not - it won't hurt their image.
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- PaulT (profile), 27 Nov 2007 @ 3:56am
  
  Re: This is so weird
  Not to mention that they're probably not losing money over this - the people who can afford Tiffany stuff will go there regardless. People buying fakes on ebay know that they're fakes, but don't care because they're so cheap.
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Max Powers, 27 Nov 2007 @ 3:15am

Sue Everyone
We could start a diagram that starts with Tiffany, then to Ebay, then to Google, then to .....all the way down the line.
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Danny, 27 Nov 2007 @ 5:43am

Wow at least the RIAA occasionally tries to find the actual offenders (albeit with weak and sometimes outright false information)...
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Ray, 27 Nov 2007 @ 5:52am

I support Tiffany as eBay is out of control with fakes. My wife bought a Tiffany item on eBay and it was a fake so she notified eBay and they did nothing. We sent the item to Tiffany and they confirmed it was a fake. Still eBay did nothing. We contacted the seller who then gave my wife a bad comment on her record! Yes, the criminal dinged us and still eBay did nothing, not even remove the ding! eBay knows about these fakes and does nothing. I hope Tiffany sues the hell out of eBay and wins.
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- hautedawg, 27 Nov 2007 @ 6:11am
  
  Re:
  When you buy something at a lower price, you can be assured that it was a fake, or stolen. You purchase a $1000 item for $50, you know that there is large chance that it is not a genuine Tiffany. Just like buying something that "fell off the back of the truck", you know the price is too good to be true, but you want to make a silk purse from a sow's ear. You get what you deserve, ding and all. Sorry to be so blunt, but come on, be honest with yourself.
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Some Dude, 27 Nov 2007 @ 6:15am

Re: Re: i invented the internet
Wouldn't it be kind of funny if John Q was really doing reverse super sarcasim? I sometimes look at 'that kind of persons' comments in that way. It makes me less depressed about humanity.
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Security, 27 Nov 2007 @ 6:19am

How much has the suit costed Ebay so far
Even if Tiffany has a revelation, how much has eBay spent so far?

Can any of the money be reclaimed?

Can Tiffany be fined for an inappropriate lawsuit?

It is no wonder why some companies become so paranoid.
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Wizard Prang, 27 Nov 2007 @ 6:29am

Following that train of logic...
We should all be able to sue the Post office for Mail Fraud.
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chris (profile), 27 Nov 2007 @ 6:39am

it's called caveat emptor
or "let the buyer beware"

meaning that if you are shopping for something, and you see it for a significant discount on ebay, it's probably a fake, or stolen, or both.

you wouldn't buy a $500 television on a street corner for $50, why would you do it on ebay?
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Nov 2007 @ 6:56am

Ray
Why not sue the seller then? This is your right. Or, make sure Tiffany's sues them.

But, Hautedawg has a point. You are an adult (I would hope any for being married) and should have known better. I don't go on e-bay and look for cisco routers and buy the $50 3800 series model. I know it will be a fake, or dead. Especially since they start at 3k easy. Actually, I don't use e-bay at all. But, I'm wise enough to know when I'm being had.
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Darius, 27 Nov 2007 @ 11:12am

seriously
as much as i love ebay, people should still use common sense.

i couldnt agree anymore with the comments made in the article.

it makes me doubt Tiffany's credibility.
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Nov 2007 @ 11:49am

If the buyer should know that an underpriced item is fake, why can't eBay?
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sean, 28 Nov 2007 @ 8:15am

Christies, anyone?
I briefly looked but I can't find... haven't people sued Christies and Sothebys for auctioning stolen art, particularly that taken off Jewish families in Nazi-era Europe?
If they've been successful, would this not set the precedent that the dealer or auction-house is indeed liable for facilitating the sale of fake or stolen goods?

Pls don't flame me for comparing faked Tiffany stuff to Picassos and the Holocaust, it's the legal PRECENDENT I'm wondering about.
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Adam, 29 Nov 2007 @ 5:16pm

But what if the getaway car was the only thing...
that allowed the person to rob Tiffany's...

just playing devil's advocate...
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- Wizard Prang, 3 Dec 2007 @ 9:09am
  
  Re: But what if the getaway car was the only thing
  That might work... if the car had a button on the dashboard clearly labelled "Rob Tiffany's"
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Canada Topix Editor, 17 Jan 2008 @ 9:20am

Daily ebay rip Offs Going on Unreported by Many as
Good for this guy...
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Jules, 28 Feb 2008 @ 10:14am

Tiffany is stupid
Tiffany is stupid. All you have to do is a search on Google and you will find hundreds of websites that say they are selling fake Tiffany jewelry. All they sell is fake Tiffany jewelry, but they go after Ebay. They are just lazy and greedy. They thought they could get some easy money from Ebay. I think they are losing business because so many people make sterling silver jewelry in better designs than them. I wouldn't wear their stuff cause it looks like their logo says TACO from a distance. Yeah, I want to wear a choker that announces that I love to eat at Taco Bella, but hey they've got that 4th meal thing going on. (Great marketing idea, like Americans need a 4th meal...sheesh!)
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joan thomas, 2 Jul 2008 @ 2:14am

refake items from ebay
ebay allows the sellers to scam the buyers because after claim are filed they continue to sellebay is just as responseable as the seller is y is it they get the our money b4 well get the item it should both be sent to ebay ebay check it out then once the item clears as was posted online ebay sends item and payment and the sellers areinsured if like me its embarresing i b told that i the buyer is scamiing my friend and it cost er time and money the sell should fill orders as they are list or paypal give the max per item 2000. i have alot in this oh one more thing why would ebay wipe the items i orderd i cant even view this in my e-mail like they dont want someone to seewat they have allowed
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joan thomas, 2 Jul 2008 @ 2:16am

refake items from ebay
ebay allows the sellers to scam the buyers because after claim are filed they continue to sellebay is just as responseable as the seller is y is it they get the our money b4 well get the item it should both be sent to ebay ebay check it out then once the item clears as was posted online ebay sends item and payment and the sellers areinsured if like me its embarresing i b told that i the buyer is scamiing my friend and it cost er time and money the sell should fill orders as they are list or paypal give the max per item 2000. i have alot in this oh one more thing why would ebay wipe the items i orderd i cant even view this in my e-mail like they dont want someone to seewat they have allowed
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Really surprised to still come across this issue after all these years. I remember back then lots of people had different opinions about how to go with this. From a business point of view I relate to ebay's position. Interesting though
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