HD DVD Bets Big On Super Bowl Ad... Yeah, That'll Do It
from the great-moments-in-wasting-money dept
In the biggest standards battle most people couldn't care less about, most folks are assuming that Blu-ray has finally won the battle. However, the HD DVD folks aren't totally giving up yet. After hanging their heads and canceling a party and press conference at CES, it appears that Toshiba believes the way to revive interest in the HD DVD standard is... to spend $2.7 million on a Superbowl ad. As if that's going to make a difference. It brings to mind various dot com startups from the last bubble who put their entire marketing budget into a Super Bowl ad. In the meantime, it may be time to start watching HD DVD's other backers. Microsoft still insists it's strongly behind HD DVD but have opened the door to finally giving it up. Meanwhile, Intel has a long history of jumping ship after it realizes it backed the wrong horse in various standards battles. The company seems to have learned when to cash out and move on. Last year it moved closer to that position by supporting both standards (while still officially backing HD DVD). If the trend keeps moving towards Blu-ray, then expect to see Intel jump more fully to the other camp. Now, if only this had been worked out four years ago, before people had moved on to online video. Blu-ray can still do well, but it missed its biggest opportunity to take over the market a few years ago.
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Filed Under: blu-ray, hd dvd, super bowl
Companies: intel, microsoft, toshiba
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Not quite...
Also, I have known Very few people (none actually) who have purchased a blueray player, but several who have HD DVD players. So I would say the jury's still out over the standard... at least in my community. Do your have hard data that shows one standard is winning, or are you inferring this from the multi-platform support? Keep in mind, Microsoft lost in an anti-trust lawsuit for installing only their browser with operating systems... multi-standard supports could be then way of avoiding another legal battle.
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Re: Not quite...
It doesnt matter if the player is more expensive, as said below if there are no HD-DVD movies to buy the format will die.
You can even go to wikipedia and read sales figures and who is supporting which format.
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Blue Ray Winning? Since When?
In the meantime the on-demand features at your locall cable tv company are expaanding offerings on HD programming. By the time this battle is over and the smoke clears Blockbuster(movie rental stores) will be out of business and Comcast(your local cable company) will be the sole source of any HD programming because you can't rent any movies for the player you just bought.
I don't know about you but I think the Amercian Public has had an overdose of stupid regarding BR and HD DVD.
Final Note:
Blue Ray players $600+
HD DVD Players $300
I think the American consumer will choose as they normally do.
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Re: Blue Ray losing? Since When?
Blue Ray Players = 150$
Hybrid (bluray/HDDVD players) = 300$
what I will purchase: neither, I'll hold off till the next format.
what people I know have purchased: Blue Ray
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Re: Re: Blue Ray losing? Since When?
Where? I can't find one for less than $240 and that's for a PC (good luck if you don't have vista). The stand alones are $400+. I found HD-DVD for $150 and I found one at Walmart for $100.
We are talking about USD correct?
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Re: Blue Ray Winning? Since When?
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Re: Blue Ray Winning? Since When?
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Re: Blue Ray Winning? Since When?
Its unfortunate though for these formats, because they will be very short lived, I would say that in 4 years Physical Mediums like these will be obsolete, when everyone makes the switch to online video.
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This whole format war was stupid to begin with
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Does it really matter?
I think the real loser is the failure rate on the 360, when my 360 dies my HD-DVD drive is useless.
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Re: Does it really matter?
I agree with this. The main reason that the DVD was so quickly and widely adopted was all the extra features that it allowed. Better audio and picture even on your standard TV, Multiple audio tracts, interactivity, special bonus content.
HD-DVD and Blue-Ray only add 7.1 surround and 1080p picture, and you have to get a new TV and speakers. How many people do you know with an HDTV? How many people do you know with a 7.1 surround sound setup? I know plenty of people who have HDTVs, I know more who don't. I know no one who has a 7.1 setup.
I'm still rooting for HDDVD since I have a 360 already (on it's way to RROD), but I just want one to win so I can actually get one. plus I have about 550G to backup and DVD just doesn't cut it.
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Re: Re: Does it really matter?
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Re: Does it really matter?
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Re: This whole format war was stupid to begin with
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Re: This whole format war was stupid to begin with
"Personally, I can't believe anyone's foolish enough to buy any version." - Not so. People do get attracted to crisp pictures. That's why they say "seeing is believing".
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They both lost
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Re: They both lost
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Re: They both lost
You also have to take into account the fact that this format war like all others is not being decided by the general public... it's mostly people with a fair bit of disposable income. They have extra cash to spend on new technology and want the best.
Blu-Ray has the potential to offer more features and better quality since the discs are larger 25 GB compared to 15 with HD-DVD.
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erg
Lesson learned.
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Now I must get back to watching my dvd....
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I'm the proof
BTW, I'm also a good contra-indicator for stocks. Short any stock I buy - you will make money.
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Re: I'm the proof
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Wtf?
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Re: Wtf?
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HD-DVD vs. Blu-Ray
As for the original story, it was proper marketing that made VHS the winner in the 80's, so why is it a bad thing that Toshiba is trying to market the format?
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HD-DVD is only "mostly dead"
HD-DVD has bounced back slightly in week 3, but is still selling well short of Blu-ray. It also appears that a few major retailers are planning to abandon HD-DVD, as shown by both Circuit City and Best Buy clearancing their HD-DVD players.
As far as disc sales go, Blu Ray passed HD-DVD in disc sales back in February, and has since gone on to outsell HD-DVD by a ratio of approximately 2:1 since. Blu ray is also cleaning up shop in Japan on both the hardware and software fronts.
The current HD-DVD exclusive studios are Universal, Paramount, and the Weinstein Company. Universal's contract ran out and was not renewed,and Paramount apparently has a clause in their contract that would allow them to end their deal. There are also rumors that the Weinstein Company is re-evaluating their commitment to the format.
HD-DVD isn't dead, but it sure isn't looking healthy either. They are losing the sales game, just lost a major studio, and apparently have no contractual hold on their remaining exclusive partners.
It's a shame really, because I like the HD-DVD spec more than the Blu Ray. The HD-DVD spec, in my opinion, is more consumer friendly since it gets rid of the outdated region coding method, and has fewer levels of DRM. Blu Ray beats out HD-DVD on disc capacity, but since video and audio quality are essentially the same due to the same codecs being used, it doesn't really mean much.
I'm still not buying either format, because my tv sucks, so I don't really have the impetus to join in the HD rush. Maybe when one of the formats is truly dead and buried, but not before.
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Blu Ray Has Already Lost.
The HD spec is a more consumer friendly spec in my opinion.
With all this talk about Blu Ray "winning" the war, people forget to mention that they have, in fact, already lost. Or should I say, consumers who have already purchased Blu Ray players have lost. (not including the PS3, which is upgradeable) Sony's response is that you knew what you were getting into by being an early adopter.
How can you support a company like that?
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Re: Blu Ray Has Already Lost.
This would normally be true, but it isn't really happening in this format war because the average consumer is bypassing the it altogether and sticking with standard dvds.
The reason HD-DVD player sales tanked is because of the Warner Bros. announcement. Your average consumer isn't paying attention to those announcements, the enthusiasts are.
"I think the price drop was very smart on Toshiba's part."
It was a smart move, but it's also a desperation move. It also doesn't appear to have made any significant impact. HD-DVD player sales are still lower than Blu Ray, despite the lower prices. Appearances are more important here: HD-DVD, with the defection of Warner Bros., appears to be (and is) a dying format.
"With all this talk about Blu Ray "winning" the war, people forget to mention that they have, in fact, already lost. Or should I say, consumers who have already purchased Blu Ray players have lost."
I can only assume that you're referring to the new 2.0 profile Blu Ray players that are coming out. From everything I've read, a profile 2.0 disc will play in an older player, but features requiring the new profile will obviously not work.
"How can you support a company like that?"
Um...early adopters always get screwed over. They want bragging rights for being the first on their street with the newest toy, and deal with the consequences.
The exact same thing has happened with HD TV's, computer video cards, actually just about any high end electronics period. It's not just a Sony thing.
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Re: Blu Ray Has Already Lost.
But right now only people with disposable income are buying and they want the best (and not most cost effective) so blu-ray is winning.
Now that hd-dvd players are going on clearance and some stores are not stocking the movies they cant keep it alive long enough for the average consumer to decide to make the switch to hd movies.
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Blu-Ray Players
Now, if you try to say a certain number of xbox 360's have been sold, it tells you nothing, as you have to buy the hd dvd player separately for the xbox.
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I bought a
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Therefore, the only thing left to drive is the content availability. Currently, Blu Ray seems to have locked down more studios and the Time Warner announcement certainly set things back for HD DVD. Sony's battle is costing them a significant amount of money. The deal with TW must have cost a very big chunk of cash. However, the license fees will certainly make up for it in the end if they do win the format war.
As to d'loading HD content or PPV HD, this is certainly one way to get content that will pose a threat to hard copy media, but I doubt it will ever fully replace it.
People like to have hard copies that they can move from player to player easily or take on the road. D'loading and PPV HD does not really facilitate this model just yet. It can be done by the tech enthusiast today, but not by the average user. DRM issues further complicate things here as well. Therefore, it will be a long time before we see the death of physical media.
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Re:
Advantages:
1 - NEVER lose another DVD to scratches, dirt, dust .. etc. (my biggest beef with DVDs and CDs)
1 - NO STORAGE space Required for storing 60 + DVDs (I have cleared out an entire section in my living room that previously contained all these dvds)
2 - NEVER lose another DVD. Or find the DVD cover, only to find no DVD in the sleeve. (Damn Kids!!)
3 - Never have to worry about people borrowing DVDs and never returning them.
4 - And you literally have your entire collection in one tiny box that you can carry with you to your friends house, cottage, etc. (not that I recommend you watch TV when you are supposed to be out in nature)
5 - Never have to drive to blockbuster, or abide by Dates to return your rental. (PPV, On Demand, blah blah should replace movie rentals)
6 - You can easily download a YouTube clip and watch it on your drive with the right tools
Now, I'm not saying the average consumer can do all that, but with the right technology and implementation, this process can be idiot-friendly, just like the iPod, iPhone, iMac are idiot-friendly (no offence to Apple enthusiasts, I'm an admirer of their Interface and User Friendly Designs)
Maybe In the past people preferred having something Physical in their hands, but this is a whole new world, and the average consumer is getting a lot smarter and more tech savvy, the old rules don't apply anymore.
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for watching movie - DVD quality is more than enough.
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"Editor's note, January 5, 2008: Because of the recent news that Warner Bros. Entertainment will be exclusively supporting Blu-ray, CNET recommends refraining from purchasing an HD DVD player in the near future. Exclusive support of Warner Bros. Entertainment gives Blu-ray a large advantage in terms of studio backing, leaving only Paramount and Universal as major studios releasing movies exclusively on the HD DVD format. This guide will be overhauled after CES to reflect this and any other news announced at the show."
And will all know what happend at CES with HD-DVD... enough said. Oh and lets not forget Microsofts plans for the Xbox360 Ultimate that has the HD-DVD drive.... oh wait, thats right! THEY SCRAPED IT! HD-DVD is going to fail for one reason and one reason only. It's not the quality of sound or video because it is the same as a Blu-Ray disk. The storage capacity is more desireable for gamers than an HD-DVD and anyone who developes on a Blu-Ray disk will have alot more flexibility with the content they can include.
I agree with everyone else about the formats though, who cares when we are going to be downloading everything anyways in the next couple of years? The only thing I care about is that my PS3 and Xbox360 (pray for no red ring!) keep on runnin.
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Sony won't lose again
Google "last days in the HD bunker" for a laugh.
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Format War
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A *Physical* Format War
My understanding is that HD movies are largely in the same format on either media.
Fat bandwidth really sidelines either physical format.
I find that the price of BD's seems to be creeping up as the format becomes more dominant. Less sales, specials, etc.
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For a history of the HD war
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Wait a minute...
One of the recurring themes here at Techdirt is how the penetration of high-speed connections in the U. S. is over-reported, yet a lot of the responses to this article assume that physical media are going to be replaced by digital downloads within four or five years. Seems to me that's a bit optimistic.
It also presupposes that everyone who now buys or rents DVDs is going to be willing (or able) to pay for broadband internet service. I don't know about you, but where I live broadband runs $70 a month. Then add the cost of the movies. I know a lot of people who just can't afford to spend that kind of money, but could spend $100-200 for a player and rent a few movies during the month.
So between the unavailability of service and the costs involved, I don't see discs going away anytime in the foreseeable future.
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And for me, I will always go to the movie store just to see the pretty girls that work there.
For movie buffs that collect movies, it would take alot of TBs to store all thier movies. And at 500.00+ dollars per drive, where is the cost savings. And one small disk failure and all that media is gone. So instead of your kids spilling his kool-aid on one physical disc. He/she just ruined your entire collection in one fail swoop.
And mainstream DL content is alot more then 4 years in the future. There will be atleast one other physical media format before it happens.
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Re:
However, the reality is that I have a whole closet FULL of CDs and DVDs that... Well, they really only take up space right now. I have most of my CDs "backed up" on my hard drive, so I theoretically don't really even need them now. I'd do the same for my DVDs too, if it wasn't for the fact that it would take more time than I feel like investing in the project.
That said, I think that a lot of the younger folks out there are starting to look at CDs and DVDs in much the same way that my generation look at 8 Tracks and LPs... This is to say as quaint relics of a bygone era. There is no real attachment to CDs, at least not in the same way. Who the hell wants to go buy physical media that's just going to take up space once it winds up on their iPod? I don't, and that feeling is only going to get stronger as time goes by.
Given ample bandwidth and selection, streaming video and/or downloadable content is going to kill the DVD and CD. You'll one day be able to pick up someone's collection at a garage sale for pennies on the dollar like you used to be able to do for LPs.
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really?
-for now, i dont care which format, because I can download ripped movies from either! ;)
-downloadable movies may suffer if the broadband guys start implmenting pay-per-data formats, like time warner is starting to...
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HD-DVD vs. Blu-
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HD-DVD vs. Blu-ray
I'm just one of those stupid consumers some of you guys are always dissing. But I'm smart enough not to fall for another DVD format. Save a tree and a fossil, up with downloads!
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Begun the format war has...
Do or do not.
There is no try.
-Yoda
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Predictions
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to Matt
But your last paragraph is dead on. Digital content is so much more enviromentally desirable than hard copy.
And Bill Samson, hope we don't have to wait ten years for your prediction to come true.
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Going Digital
While this is only occurring on a small scale at the moment, moving to a digital standard will put a strain on the current DRM schemes, and with current mindset of the MPAA, the response will be to make them even more complex. And the recurring trend with DRM is that the more complex it gets, the more it alienates customers and creates compatibility problems.
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BR vs HD DVD
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No commercial
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Closure
It's over now lets all buy Blu-ray players, its been fun!
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