Online Auctions No Longer Fun?
from the just-not-worth-the-hassle dept
Lately, whenever we post about eBay, a huge crowd of folks shows up to complain about eBay. Many of the changes that eBay has implemented over the past few years haven't gone over well -- but a Business Week article suggests something else is up also: buyers just aren't interested in the "auction" model as much as they used to be. Personally, I know that's true for me. I remember bidding on a variety of auctions on eBay, but I doubt I've done so in at least five years -- mostly because I can find whatever I'm looking for a decent price and just buy it elsewhere, without the hassle of the auction. When it first came along, the auction process was novel and fun -- and it offered up products that just couldn't be found elsewhere. But, these days, that's very rarely the case. The auction process seems like a pain and most of the products are available in a more convenient manner.That certainly doesn't mean the end of eBay, or even the end of auctions (as Mathew Ingram notes, auctions are good for a certain class of products). And, as the original article notes, eBay's business has been shifting increasingly to fixed-price sales rather than auctions. But many people still do think of eBay as an auction site, and its biggest near-term challenge may be convincing people that it's more than that.
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Filed Under: auctions, e-commerce, novelty
Companies: ebay
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Online Auctions No Longer Fun
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Re: Online Auctions No Longer Fun
My gripe has always been the outrageous shipping charges some charge. Example - I was looking to purchase a baseball bat a while back. Knew the model I wanted and what it was selling for locally and online. I find a guy offering it for nearly $25 less than everyone else. I read what he's charging for shipping - a four-pound package via the USPS - he was going to charge $40! Only one problem - I managed a shipping department and knew all the carrier rates intimately.
I wrote to the guy, explained I could arrange shipping at my expense and he responded by saying I would be scamming him. So, to show my appreciation, I filed a complaint about him to eBay. Nothing happened of course, but I never did any business with him either.
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Re: Online Auctions No Longer Fun
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Too many cheaters
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Re: Too many cheaters
Simply put, if you want to win an auction, don't make a half-assed bid.
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Re: Re: Too many cheaters
There's two basic ways to look at an auction. From the seller's perspective, the goal is to extract the highest price possible. From the buyer's perspective, the goal is the pay the lowest price possible. So while it's true that you can simply put in a "maximum bid" and let the system automatically up your bid, it's also true that such a system is highly biased towards the seller's goal. If the starting bid for an item is $10, and two people have put in maximum bids of $30 and $35, then the bids will almost immediately jump to $31 (assuming the auction uses $1 increments). Whereas if both buyers played their cards a little closer to the vest they could wait until very late in the auction to up the bid from $10 to $11, and then take turns outbidding each other. Depending on how much time is left and how closely the auctions are being watched, it's possible that someone will be able to get a lower sale price using this method than if they had specified a maximum bid. So while the "maximum bid" feature is billed as a way to make things easier for buyers, it actually favors the seller by increasing the price more quickly than would otherwise normally happen. Of course, this also favors eBay as well since they get a percentage of the sale too.
Sniper bots are essentially the same thing, but they're designed to be smart enough to wait until the end of the auction to put in the bid. That might help keep the sale price down a little bit, but if your goal is the win the auction rather than get the lower price, it's probably more efficient to use eBay's maximum bid tool.
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Re: Too many cheaters
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Trend of Buyer Beware????
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Trend of Buyer Beware????
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ebay, love/hate you
2. whats dishonest about using a program to buy items online through your computer? ebay should incorporate snipping capabilities directly into their interface. it'll automatically come down to the last few seconds of the auctions, when the bots start incrementing bids by minimum values until times up.
3. would email lose its marvel if your email account got hacked?
i think the 1st comment was partially right. prices are no longer competitive on ebay for many items. that with the required wait for the auction to end makes for an amount of impatience that nobody is willing to endure. but lets not ignore that people were willing to wait the extended periods of time when the item-prices were low. it all comes down to speed and, more so, price when it comes to consumers. can there exist an auction model that tackles these obstacles? yes, but ebay is too bloated to afford to offer it.
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Re: ebay, love/hate you
You'd have to be an idiot not to think that wont drive people away from wanting to buy auction items anymore.
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Re: Re: ebay, love/hate you
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Re: Re: ebay, love/hate you
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Cure for sniping
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Re: Cure for sniping
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Re: Re: Cure for sniping
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Re: Re: Re: Cure for sniping
Even if you really did want to prevent the situation where two bots would continue to outbid each other (despite an escalating price no doubt well beyond market), you could say that an auction's maximum extension would be 24 hours.
Frankly, I expect it would rarely exceed 30 mins.
Remember, an auction is traditionally MEANT to enable bidders to agree that no higher bids are forthcoming. The auctioneer slams his gavel down when such agreement is evident - not because he's decided time's up.
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Re: Re: Cure for sniping
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Re: Re: Re: Cure for sniping
That would be great, let the seller set a minimum time for the auction (perhaps with an upper limit) rather than a max. After that, high bid wins unless outbid within x minutes, or reserve not met. Don't let the seller set x, make that a constant. There could be no sniping, because if you bid at the last minute, your opponent (and everyone else), then has another x minutes to rebid.
Would that reduce final auction prices? If so they'll never do it.
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bleh.
It's just not fun. People set up bots to automatically bid higher than the last bidder on the final minute of the last day of the auction...etc
Most of the time I'll just buy things in bulk and combine shipping, this way I at least know what I'll be getting. There's nothing worse than bidding for 5 things hoping to merge shipping, and then win only 1 or 2 of them and have to pay shipping separately on the 3 other items later down the road.
Much of the time the Buy it Now price is only a few bucks higher than the final auction price depending on what you buy. Most importantly, there are so many people on eBay now that you have an absolute ZERO percent chance to ever get lucky on winning an auction at a really low price.
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Re: bleh.
Thats what really has taken the fun out of it. These days I treat Ebay as just another store, but back when I first joined years ago it was fun too! I remember going back and forth with some people bidding on a 40" LCD TV back when, I lost it buy only a few dollars and it went for about $60! Nowadays, there are so many people on there, who all start bidding right away, inflating the price and setting very high maximum bids that the fun is all gone. Everything sells for closer to retail prices and auctions are won in far less bids.
Good for really rare stuff, but not much of anything else.
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I Really Like Ebay
I don't know why anyone would use it for anything you could probably pick up at a local store for a comparable price (when shipping is counted in).
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And I have seen items that I was outbid on and lost almost immediatley relisted by the seller. On more than one occasion I have reported a seller to eBay for this but as far as I know no action was ever taken.
I used to know people who spent all day bidding on eBay and if they got outbid they'd bid again and end up paying more than retail for it but they got the 'fun' of being the winning bidder. Nobody cares about the 'fun' part anymore.
All I can say is if you do bid on eBay, figure out what your maximum bid will be BEFORE you bid, and if you get outbid, don't jack up your bid just so you can win. Chances are the same item will be available again in a few days if not immediately.
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Re:
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Need it Now
But I am not a collector on the "hunt", when I need something I don't want to go through an auction and then wait a couple of days to find out I didn't win it and have to start over again.
Mostly these days I use Buy it Now to just get the item I need and be done with it.
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OOP Books
Here's a tip: you can create an RSS feed from any search or keyword term to notify you when an item is added to the listings.
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I only use ebay now for looking for hard to find items. And those are getting easier to find elsewhere.
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What ruined it for me was all the fixed price stuff I have to sift through to find the actual auctions. I go to eBay for auctions. If I want a fixed price, I'll go to NewEgg or Amazon.
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Sniping is my life
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Re: Sniping is my life
You put in your maximum bid and forget about it. If someone else comes in and pays more after you, then shouldn't they win? After all you didn't want to pay more than your max right? You can still get items for lower prices because it doesn't bid your max, just enough to beat the next highest.
Example:
Widget A is listed
You are willing to pay $37 for Widget A... ideally you want it for less. You put in your max bid of $37
Buyer 2 comes along and he is willing to pay $22 for Widget A, he puts in his max bid of $22
eBay that automatically ups your bid to $23, assuring you'll still win, and below your max.
Buyer 3 comes in 2 seconds before the auction ends and bids $30
eBay automatically ups your bid to $31 and you STILL win, even though he put in a "snipe" bid at the last second using software.
If someone put in a bid of $38.. they win because its more than YOU said you are willing to pay.
I don't see the problem here.
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Re: Re: Sniping is my life
And to everyone complaining about losing auctions to snipers, just remember this - the sniper didn't win because he bid last, he won because he had the highest bid.
What I suspect is really the case is that these people are wanking because the sniper's late bid didn't allow them enough to incrementally up their bid "one more time". But if you don't understand how the eBay proxy bidding sytem is supposed to work, don't complain about the snipers.
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Re: Re: Sniping is my life
You aren't showing your hand by bidding before the last second.
At times you are. If you try to bid at the last second but the current bid is already over your maximum, then you will never bid. By not bidding at all, nobody knows you are interested in that item.
It's not really a big deal generally, but it might be if you are bidding on rare items. If you lose at $X, then other people might assume that's what you are willing to pay the next time, and bid just a little bit higher.
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the buyers are my problem...
It was a total waste of time.
Now I use crag's list.
...dave
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Re: the buyers are my problem...
I've never sold on ebay, but I have used craig's list to sell stuff many times with perfect results. I get my money, the guy gets his stuff, and no one gets screwed by ebay and PayPal.
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eBay is it's own decline
If I wanted to do business with a business, I'd go to their store, and not eBay. I want auctions on eBay, and I basically just swim through the Fixed Price bs.
That said, as a seller, I have different complaints. I've sold in the neighborhood of $10,000 worth of things on eBay in the past five years.
Their rates continue to rise, especially on the low-to-mid price segment. If you think that $125 on $2000 hurts, think about the $.25 I paid to sell a $.99 item.
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I used to collect certain rare and outdated items. Now I am back to going to thrift stores and garage sales. More fun, better chance to actually inspect the item, and the price was always right.
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Ebay
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I'm one of the
eBay was also the reason I switched from Netscape 4 to IE5. I was sick of Netscape's random crashes, which once happened during an auction checkout that I didn't finish and consequently lost. At the time, IE rarely crashed (or at least wouldn't crash on pages with legit HTML and JS).
About 2004 I lost interest in eBay, it's still good for selling items and to find rare/collectible things but for purchasing new products, the prices really are better elsewhere.
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Re: I'm one of the
I don't get how that is beneficial. Simply give the highest bid you'd be willing to make. As new bids come in your bid will be increased until you win it or until someone outbids your maximum bid.
Exactly how does spending the time to sit and wait until 30 seconds before the action ends make the process easier to win? If the other guy outbid you in my example, his maximum bid would still outbid you if you waited 30 seconds before it ended.
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Re: Re: I'm one of the
The idea is to wait until so close to the end that the other person does not have time to outbid, even automatically. So if their current bid is $10, and maximum is $20, you can snipe it for $11 if timed correctly, even though they would have been willing to pay more. I don't know how close to the end you have to bid to do that, but obviously that number has been figured out by a lot of people.
The problems with sniping are 1) it makes the final price even less clear because you never know how many people are planning to snipe and for how much, 2) you're hosed if you don't like doing it, because with enough snipers around that becomes the only way to win an auction, and 3) the person willing to pay the most doesn't necessarily win.
The much bigger problem IMO is with fraudulent bids by the seller (directly or by proxy) on their own items. This causes people to pay more than they otherwise would have, and eBay has an incentive to ignore it because they make more money that way.
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Shills
an item and having a shill bid up the price.
I use Murdock's approach so sometimes the
shill outbids me. Then the seller contacts
me direct by email saying the winning bid
was no good and I have the chance to purchase
the item for my maximum bid. Now it's outside
of eBAY, I don't know if the seller is on
the up and up.
Other than the actions of a few dishonest
people that ruin it for everyone else
I don't see a problem. I wish eBAY
would be more agressive in its enforcement
against dishonest seller and buyers too.
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Ebay is the best
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online auction
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Sellers
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Fun? Get your kicks elsewhere
Sure, blame Ebay for some of the things (reserves, etc.) but let's not forget about the stupid Ebayers that are willing to pay more than retail just to win. Recently, I was bidding on a REFURBISHED 8GB iPhone. My max bid was $250. Brand new, they retail for $399. The winning bidder ended up paying $475. He could have bought a new one and saved $75 plus shipping.
IMO, these are the f#ckers that are screwing it all up.
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Ups and downs.
As a seller I've found that eBay is a pain in the ass. They keep changing policies... I've had a few items canceled - after the auction was over and the item was already sent to the buyer! Luckily those items were only a buck or two, but if it was a high ticket item - I would have been really upset! I've even argued with eBay about it, they don't care!
Back in the day when eBay first started, it was about the average Joe posting things for sale out of their homes... What in the hell happened?
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eBay is out
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ebay - up and down - my fix on it
which leads me to buying on ebay,
the best way to buy on ebay is to look diligently utilizing the searches. most newbie sellers are never at the top of the list of "best match" (ebays newest default search method) or if you have pissed ebay off - they put all your stuff at the bottom of the list. they can hold your items and not release them to search for over 24 hours if they so choose so you have to put up with ebay or they sabotage you. So if I am looking for an elusive car part or some otc medicines, or a specific necessity - I search via ending soonest and try every search word I can think of to get what I need or want, you can always find the item you need, and judging from the fact that I know how some sellers can chip away at the price of item by padding the shipping cost, I always look for the shipping cost, then I email to see how they do their combined shipping rate, I also eliminate a lot of low sales items just from the fact that the seller will not disclose their shipping nor how they do their combined shipments. If they answer my email and I feel confident that they have more than one item I need, I go ahead and purchase or place a watch and / or a bid.
I have noticed as of late however, if I place a bid early it seems I always win, no one seems to be bidding anymore, unless like its an item that is really a hot seller.
it seems that any bids placed on sellers who are not power sellers and might be fairly new don't pick up many bids until they get known better on ebay and their items hit the searches better, because most people think the power sellers have the best items for sale. But I have found that not to always be the case. There are those out there who are still trying to list as many things they can a week that they purchased thru local sell outs of new or reclaimed merchandise, so they start the bid low, but I also know with the new hidden bidder markings on listings, it seems there are less shill bidding going on.
But I have noticed that if an item has went several days and no bids, and I place a bid, the person who mentioned this already is right, a lot of times if that item receives a bid within a few minutes after you bid, its because they have shill bidders, I always report them for that.
If you sell something and someone purchases it and then says it was broken in shipment and they will not send it back or send you a picture, its because I have an invisible marker that marks my stuff, before it leaves my place, if they say its broken, they have to pay for shipping it back before I will give them their money back because I want to see that it was my item that got broke or one they simply want replaced for free. so its a dog eat dog world on ebay and paypal - both have faults - because ebay owns both, mostly their fees are the problem. I hate the fb system without the opportunity to neg a buyer now, unfair feedback usually comes from someone new on ebay. that feedback score hurts your fee rate, your final value fee rate, and potential future business. too much to digest all at once, but believe me. ebay is pushing for more fixed price store type listings. they make a monthly fee for the store plus each listing fee, plus a HUGE final value fee after you sell an item. Yes it is nice to list an item and then not worry about it for a month, unless it sells, but its also not on searches as much as auctions and my store things sell twice as slow as auction items. the only saving grace on the whole ebay scheme is auctiva. they have free picture hosting, the cheapest shipping insurance on the web, and so many great features- free listing templates to decorate you listing, their own listing page that downloads your listings to ebay at a set time that you don't have to pay for it to be a set time on auctiva like you do on ebay. they save me over 50.00 a month over what I used to pay ebay. so it was worth the relearning process to put everything over on auctiva and then I buy a store website thru them too that lists my ebay items and my blogs etc. so there are some great sites out there that help you if you have the time to find them.
paypal free shipping label printing service is the best too. its better than the USPS site because if you are shipping in USA you can print labels for first class parcels, media mail, parcel post, and get a del conf for .18 and with priority the del conf is free - just like it is if you use click n ship on USPS - but USPS won't let you print up anything but priority labels on their website. so there are some advantages to using the paypal shipping label printing service. provided you have a working printer, and you use the paypal funds you have available to pay for the shipping at the time of printing the label. also you can set how you want the label to read as well.
well thats my experiences on this subject, hope I have helped someone else.
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eBay is out
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Online Auctions Not Fun Anymore!
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Re: Online Auctions Not Fun Anymore!
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Forget about ebay..
Either we want to sell something or we want to buy something. And why do we go online? Well because we can compare prices and it's pretty convenient too.
So if best price is what we are looking for, then what eBay offers may not be suitable for you. Simply because things could get a little rigid here.
Instead, I would personally recommend you to try an alternative method to online bidding or auction. It is a quicker and much more interesting way to buy and sell stuffs online.
This method is known as Live Online Negotiation or sometimes known as Live Online Bargaining. This is where a potential buyer selects a certain product posted online and started to bargain with the seller until a satisfactory price is reached, all done online, LIVE !!.. something no online bidding system can do.
But care need to be taken though because there are many unsafe websites out there in the internet today, preying on unsuspecting victims. You know malicious hackers are getting pretty creative nowadays.
However, after going through the internet for more than a decade, I have to say the safest website that offers such system is www.bzhub.com. Not only it is equipped with the usual security features such as SSL, etc but the method it employs for users to buy and sell, is in itself a very effective "Anti-con artist" tool.
So I think you guys ought to check it out.
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Been to bzhub.com.. it's cool
What I did was I bargained with the seller until the price is satisfactory before I buy. What's cool is that if the seller is also online, I can bargain with him in realtime!!
I think you guys should check this website out
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Ebay
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