Were We Smarter About Copyright Laws 100 Years Ago?
from the almost-certainly dept
A few months back, I wrote about attending an absolutely fascinating one-day conference all about the 1909 Copyright Act, which hasn't been the law of the land in about 33 years. And, yet, one thing became clear throughout the session: there was plenty in that law that made a lot more sense than what we have today. There were a few "old timers" who complained about the way it was before 1976, but their complaints were a lot more about the specific implementations (and, at times, oddly, a massive desire to keep content out of the public domain, which they found to be a fault of the 1909 Act). Law professor James Boyle has been looking over the legislative history that resulted in the 1909 Act and notes that we seemed to be a lot smarter about copyright law back then. Among the points raised: the recording industry was actually the one defending new technologies against being covered by copyright, noting that the innovation itself (in this case, the player piano) didn't actually take away anything from artists, but helped promote the goods that they sold (in this case, sheet music). But, what struck Boyle most was that unlike today, the legislators writing the law seemed to actually understand the real pros and cons of extending copyright, and didn't get sucked into misleading arguments about how copyright was "property." Even more amazing, legislators didn't automatically think that "more" copyright was a good thing -- but that it had potentially some benefits and some downsides. These days, of course, politicians have been taught that copyright is a universal good, and they rarely seem willing to recognize the potential downsides (or, even worse, the actual evidence of downsides) to extending copyright so far.Thank you for reading this Techdirt post. With so many things competing for everyone’s attention these days, we really appreciate you giving us your time. We work hard every day to put quality content out there for our community.
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Filed Under: 1909, copyright, copyright law
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Intellectual Property
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Re: Intellectual Property
Well, I'm paying property taxes on the assessed value of my real property. Why not apply that logic consistently?
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Re: Re: Intellectual Property
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Re: Re: Re: Intellectual Property
OK, that too then. Both taxes should be paid.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Intellectual Property
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Intellectual Property
Copyright is IP too.
So basically the labels should start paying taxes for their copyright. Let's see how long it'll take before they want none of it anymore.
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Re: Intellectual Property
Good idea actually.
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I think this has to do with tech and education
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Re: I think this has to do with tech and education
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Re: Re: I think this has to do with tech and education
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Re: I think this has to do with tech and education
But the underlying principles remain the same.
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Just another example....
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Re: Just another example....
Another example of a blind lemming following his favorite radio host. The government is creating all these new laws at the behest of the various industries that our dear representatives are beholden to. Get the industry and politicians out of their common bed, and you will have your smaller government.
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Less Lobbiests?
That seems very different than today
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Re: Less Lobbiests?
That's part of it. The other part is that there has been a consolidation of business and finances since 1909. The largest businesses have grown larger. A larger percentage of the people today work for either the government or the largest 5% of businesses. Hell, even most of the smaller corporations are subsidiaries of larger companies, or else have members of those larger companies representing them on the board of directors or advisors.
You couple that with the fact that today's politicians almost universally have big business ties (in fact, they don't even try to hide it anymore), and what you're left with is a govt./big business vs. the public mentality.
Amazing how the copyright extension vs. anti-maximalist sides of the debate seem to fall closely down those lines, no?
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Re: Re: Less Lobbiests?
Lessig has it right: you've got to go to the source problem, corruption.
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Re: Re: Re: Less Lobbiests?
Source of the problem = bank representatives sitting on board of directors.
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Re: Re: Less Lobbiests?
Could you elaborate your analogy of how big business vs public mentality has to do with copyright extension vs anti-maximalist(minimalist?)?
Your post reads more like an anti-capitalist rant than that of a comment to Mike's post. Also can I get a reference for the figures you quoted.
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In 1909, what was the chance that the junior senator from Montana would have a great knowledge of copyright, have available the comments of thousands of people "in the know", deep research, and just about instant access to the leaders of major corporations, artists groups, and free access supporters?
The congressional members are better informed than ever, not just on the direct implications of copyright and patent, but in the longer term financial and social implications of them, and almost without exception, they prefer extension to regression. That should tell you something.
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Re:
Money.
Oh, and Affluence. And re-election. They don't honestly care about consumers or long term financial implications. Look at the boondoggles they've been rushing through from both sides of the aisles. Nope, they care about good publicity and corporate sponsership.
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Re:
But they are none the wiser.....
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Re:
That lobbyists are very, very good at their job?
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Re: Re:
Just because they are better informed does not make them more knowledgeable.
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Re:
Wrong - they have MORE information than ever - but most of it comes from sources that have (or believe erroneously that they have) a financial interest in a particular outcome.
The quantity of information may be larger - but its quality is inferior to what was available in 1909.
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Re:
Congressional members don't actually read the bills they pass, so I doubt they even bother to do a Google or Wikipedia search on the matter beforehand. There's all this great info, but they aren't actually utilizing it.
Why else would no one be interested in supporting the Read The Bills Act? Other than none of them want to actually be informed on what they're voting on. They get their information from the lobbying organizations and on mutually beneficial voting lines where one congressman will support other congressional bills in return for support from those sponsors.
None of that has to do with actual information or better informed congressmen.
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Re:
Are you really that unfamiliar with the concept of bias? How about moral suasion? Bite the hand that feeds you? Self-interest?
When a senator is very informed about an issue, but most of the information comes from the well-funded, large corporate side of the debate, they come out with strongly-formed, yet biased opinions. This does not lead to better legislation.
No thanks.
Give me Mr. Smith Goes To Washington, or your 'tabula rasa' 1909 junior Senator from the great state of Montana over what we have today!! At least Mr. Smith would be open to both sides of the debate. And, even better, he would deliver his filibuster in a distinct Jimmy Steward warble.
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Interesting read.
Today, though, "sheet music" is a plastic disk/mp3 file, yet industry execs can't seem to make this correlation, but instead, find ways to charge for "public performances" (re: ringtones).
It's really nothing to do with copyright law, but more with stupid business decisions to create a monopoly towards music (discussed in detail as well).
Copyright is just their way of leveraging this idiocy in their favor, hence its abuse.
But nothing will change as long as people continue supporting these decisions through sales. When consumers stop buying, then will real change be made.
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Taxing IP
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That has got to be the most hilarious thing I have read in a long time, awesome sarcasm.
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Fixed
Fixed that for you.
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Information Overload
This is not to say that their is no corruption... certainly some specific people have made a fairly strong showing that they have been paid off. That's just not the only factor, and likely not even the biggest factor (though the fact that anyone who HAS been paid is likely to be more "passionate" about the issue does play a big role, as well).
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Re: Information Overload
- payoff with bribes and paid influence, which is definitely illegal. Politicians who get their kitchen remodeled, free flights, etc. provided by some entity are also guilty of accepting bribery.
- payoff with free dinners, parties, influence, meeting famous people, face time. This is not illegal, but over time politicians hear a message repeated to them over and over by people who appear to be their 'friends'. This has a real effect on perception of issues.
- payoff with campaign contributions, which is legal, and used fully. Then also abused by making front organizations to continue contributing beyond the limits - but this is not seen as a big crime.
- payoff simply because of the nature of industry in the home district. For example, Alaskan politicians will always vote in favor of resource extraction over environmental causes because most of the state is employed in that industry. Fat chance that a Hollywood senator will want to scale back copyright. This is not a crime, or even shady...but it does lead to sub-optimal outcomes.
Yep, that and more. All kinds of bribes and influence. Not too much opportunity for the average Joe to be represented. You could write a letter to your rep, and they would have an aid send a form response (maybe the aid will even read it) and add yours to a pile. How many letters would it take to equal influence like the four bullets above?
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not far enough
Copyright demonstrably stifles creativity by (a) allowing wealthy, successful artists to rest on their laurels, and (b) preventing lesser-known artists from creating derivative works.
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I have some bad news.
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just less corrupt
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