Should A Toy Plane Get More Intellectual Property Protection Than A Real Plane?
from the just-wondering dept
There are all sorts of weird anomalies that come up when you realize the boundaries between certain areas of intellectual property law can get pretty fuzzy. Take, for example, a recent ruling in a case involving two toy companies, Lanard Toys and Novelty Inc. Lanard, a Chinese company, made knockoff toys of Novelty's offerings, including toy planes and helicopters. One of the issues was whether those toys were covered by copyright. Lanard argued they should not be, as copyright is only supposed to apply to non-useful items. The court, however, found that toys weren't actually useful (tell your kids!) and therefore could be covered by copyright. However, as Ray Dowd at the Copyright Litigation blog points out, this creates a bizarre situation where the inventor of an actual airplane might only get 20 years protection via a patent... but the maker of a toy knockoff of that real airplane? Well, he can get life plus 70 (or whatever it might be going forward) for the toy. As Dowd notes:It seems anomalous that the poor inventor who made the real thing gets only twenty years of protection, but the clown who made the silly imitative toy gets life plus forever protection for his "original work of authorship". Query whether such protection promotes the purposes of the Copyright Act.
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This is why people don't take copyright seriously
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I should know as I'm an intellectual property lawyer and know more about the sciences and the useful arts than any other non-intellectual property lawyer out there.
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Adobe would be very interested in that little tidbit......
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Different scopes of protection
For what it's worth, toys (and toy planes in particular) are a favorite of law professors when discussing the useful article doctrine of copyright, particularly because they play on difficult issues of physical and conceptual separability. I wouldn't take the fact that this case came out in favor of copyrightability as support for the general proposition that toys or toy planes are always copyrightable. The court here even points out that it's a case-by-case, fact-intensive inquiry.
I also think you're being a bit disingenuous to suggest that someone could knock off a patented plane design with a toy and get a copyright of longer term than the patent. This case was about knockoffs of other toy planes, not patented plane designs, as a patent functionally dictating the shape of the plane would be strong evidence against copyrightability. Additionally, to the extent that the patented plane contained copyrightable elements, the knockoff toy maker wouldn't be eligible for copyright protection because he would be violating the exclusive right of the patent holder (who in this case would also hold a copyright in the copyrightable elements) to prepare derivative works (like toys).
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Re: Different scopes of protection
but isn't a patent only supposed to cover a specific design/implementation and not a general idea? Or are you admitting that this isn't the case?
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"C'mon, Mike. The theoretical patent protection for the actual airplane is much broader than the copyright, as it allows the patentee to prevent anyone from building many types of planes, whether direct copies or not, depending on the breadth of the patent."
So you are admitting that broad ideas can be patented.
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There is nothing not to understand. It's a basic simple question. It's just that you don't want to answer it because the answer is an insult to our broken patent system. But you already answered it with what I already quoted. Patents can be based on broad, general ideas and not merely specific implementations/designs.
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Ha Ha
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Re: Different scopes of protection
But, according to patent supporters, such a lock-up will support innovation, help the transportation system and help planes spread, in addition to giving incentives for creating planes, so where is the problem?
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And who best to limit access than the person who first speedily made the investment in time and significant money to formally tell the USPTO about said idea?
And what better way to ensure no one steps out of line than to give the author of the patent application monopoly power for 20 years against any and all that attempt to leverage that idea in any way in any product for whatever reason and no matter how long they had that idea in their mind or how natural it was from their perspective?
We should not mock the United State's idea anti-proliferation system.
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Re: Different scopes of protection
So, keeping it simple for you. Do you not find it ironic that the copyright system offers life + 70 years of protectionism for a person who looks at a REAL airplane, COPIES the design, and makes a toy out of it when the guy that actually designed the airplane itself gets 20 years of protection on his design?
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I would find it ironic if what you were describing was actually possible.
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How much broader? Can you quantify how much broader? Copyrights can provide broad coverage for a book or piece of art. If I took a picture, made a copy of it, and changed a few pixels to the point that one would have to look hard to tell the difference, it will still likely be copyright infringement. So how is a patent different? How much more coverage does a patent provide? Do you have numbers? Are there any specific quantifiable amounts?
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In particular, if I make a toy plane that so happens to look a lot like your real plane, but I've never seen your real plane, then I haven't infringed your copyright. But if your patent reads on my toy plane, it doesn't matter if I've never seen your plane or read your patent - I'm still an infringer.
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the toy airplane would be covered for a single design, layout, appearance, etc. it isnt a copyright on model airplanes, just on a single model of airplane. very narrow.
making a comparison with a full size aircraft, which has parts and pieces subject to various copyrights and patents, isnt exactly the same. it is a huge reach.
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If I owned the patent on ANY vital piece of airplane equipment, I sure as hell wouldn't put up with some smart-mouth commentator saying that my invention deserves 50 less years of protection than a plastic toy.
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oh yeah, the airplane part maker may also have copyright on a name, a logo, or similar. but that is a different story, one the masnick isnt telling here.
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So which is it, are patents notably broader then copyrights or not?
and what about the look of a specific part or when the look is influenced by its designed.
and in this specific copyright, no one can produce the specific design of the toy either because it'll violate copyright.
"the masnick is intentionally trying to mislead by grouping together different sets of rights. very typical."
"oh yeah, the airplane part maker may also have copyright on a name, a logo, or similar"
You accuse Masnick of misleading people yet you don't even know the difference between a copyright and a trademark. Nice.
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But copyright on a toy is not a huge reach ... typical.
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Airplane Type Certificates.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_certificate
There are Supplemental Type Certificates for things like accessories. At a very rough estimate, the certification requirements increase the cost of an electronic box by a factor of about twenty over a consumer device of comparable complexity. One of these patent-troll-type outfits simply couldn't afford to own a type certificate. You can put a piece of paper in a drawer. If you don't pay a craftsman every month, he goes elsewhere, and it may be that he is the only one who can answer the FAA inspector's questions.
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