Don't Be A Jerk To A Minor In Louisiana Or Say Anything Sexually Suggestive In Scotland

from the controlling-behavior dept

Tue, Jul 13th 2010 10:43am — Mike Masnick

Back in May we wrote about how Louisiana was the latest state to try to pass overly broad anti-"cyberbullying" legislation, that would make it illegal to say anything online that might "embarrass" anyone under 17. With a few modifications that law has now been passed. They (thankfully) removed the "embarrass or cause emotional distress" part, but still left in that it's illegal to communicate "with intent to torment or intimidate" which seems pretty broad. No more trash talking on IM, kids.

Meanwhile, Glyn Moody points us to a new law in Scotland that outlaws "indecent communication" online. The law says you can't say anything sexually related to someone without first getting consent. While, the intentions are good, the reality is that this will almost certainly lead to problems:

In our culture, it is not normal to ask people for permission to say something sexual during the course of a facebook chat or a conversation in a bar. "Do you mind if I deploy an innuendo" just wouldn't sound right. And quite frankly it shouldn't.

Whether people get off with each other in bars, or engage in mundane msn conversations that degenerate into bad internet sex, people frequently make the transition from polite conversation into something more erotic. And this very often necessitates somebody saying something on a whim, somebody communicating some sexual feeling in the hope that it will be reciprocated. And sometimes that means saying something under circumstances that don't quite match up to a "reasonable belief in consent".

The more and more governments try to regulate how people talk to each other online, the more and more ridiculous it's going to look.

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Filed Under: cyberbullying, free expression, louisiana, scotland

31 Comments

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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 10:59am

Scotland
I'm about to break the law in Scotland by writing something sexually related without first getting consent.

"Norman is a boy cow."

I am now a criminal.
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Chronno S. Trigger (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:01am

Re: Scotland
Is that a banana in your kilt, or are you just happy to see me?

Sorry, I couldn't stop myself.
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:21am

Something funny about bag pipes. (sorry there were so many potential jokes there I couldn't choose just one...
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:25am

I mean really, while a cool instrument in its own right, it is basically a sack with some phallic-esque things attached and guys (typically) walk around in skirts blowing on one of the phallic extensions and squeezing the sack.
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Hephaestus (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:32am

Re: Re: Scotland
Its a Banana ... ;)
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:33am

Scotland Depraved (by The Tartan Terrors)
[SCOTLAND DEPRAVED]
Bring me my whiskey, mother!
I'm feeling frisky, mother!
Bring me my sheep,
For I am lonely tonight.

Gosh knows I'm really randy.
Good thing I'm very handy!
England is prim and proper.
Scotland's Depraved!

Chorus:
Bah bah bah-da bah bah bah
Bah bah bah-da bah bah bah
Bah bah bah-da bah bah bah
Bah bah bah-da
Bah bah bah-da bah bah bah
Bah bah bah-da bah bah bah
England is prim is proper.
Scotland's Depraved!

Bring me a lover, mother!
No, not my brother, mother!
Bring me my sheep,
For I am lonely tonight.

No, not my sister, Mary.
Her legs are very hairy.
England is prim is proper.
Scotland's Depraved!

(chorus)

I'm as a horny as a clansman!
I will even take a Saxon!
Bring me my sheep,
For I am lonely tonight.

Gunmen wear their kilts all day:
Zippers scare the sheep away...(so I've heard)
England is prim is proper.
Scotland's Depraved!

(chorus)

One More Time!

(chorus)
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interval (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:38am

Re: Re: Re: Scotland
Some times a banana is just a banana...
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:41am

Good thing I can still be a jerk on techdirt
TAM - tell your mom hi for me
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DanVan (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:44am

I agree that the law sounds too broad but I also applaud the state for trying to get the internet under control mocking wise

Many stories of kids being tortured online is heartbreaking

I hope kids understand that they cant do anything and get away with it
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interval (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:44am

Did you people hear about this:

http://www.smh.com.au/world/mother-jailed-for-sex-with-son-she-gave-up-for-adoption-2010071 3-108ts.html

Apparently this woman gave up her son for adoption 16 years ago. Last year (or the year before) located him on Facebook, and knowing exactly who he was seduced him. In other reports I understand she's facing hospitalization assuming she's found guilty.
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bishboria (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:48am

I leave
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bishboria (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:51am

Re:
Bloody iPhone keyboard!

I meant to say: I leave Scotland for 6 months and this is what they do!
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 11:56am

Re:
God please forgive us...
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 12:02pm

Re: Re:
Why bring God into it?

Mephistopheles: "Why, this is hell, nor am I out of it."
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Old Jarhead, 13 Jul 2010 @ 12:04pm

What a hoot! Many (many) years ago, I enlisted in the US Marines at age 16 - with the help of a recruiter who "aged" me one year (w/parental consent). Anyhow, talk about being on the receiving end of rude, embarrassing comments!! In the end however, I survived and probably benefited (beyond my 4 year enlistment). However, I am somewhat like the cartoon figure in an old Larson cartoon drawing, where slaves are chained to a Viking ship, as rowers - all looking frazzled, except one (reminds me of myself) who, bright-eyed, raises a hand and says, "Oh yoo hoo, I think I have a blister!"
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jjmsan (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 12:09pm

I herd one
I understand sheep are a popular subject.
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A Dan (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 12:22pm

Re:
How is that a good idea? The state is directly impinging on free speech. That should never be applauded.

Mocking should not be illegal. There is no right to not be offended. Trying to make one puts the incentives on being offended; the people who benefit the most are those who are most easily or most greatly offended. That's a strange structure to encourage.
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Bas Grasmayer, 13 Jul 2010 @ 12:23pm

...
Eh, I'm sure some people might find it offensive if I ask them for consent to mention something sexually related... especially if what I was intending to say was harmless. They might actually feel much more (sexually) intimidated by the request for consent, than whatever the content might be.

There are exceptions of course.
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 12:55pm

Aren't a lot of takedown notices sent via the internet inherently "intimidating"?

Be interesting if someone uses this law against them.
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Free Capitalist (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 1:03pm

Thank You, Pedantic Fucking Parents
The Louisiana law FTA addressed in subject.

Regarding the outlawing in Scotland of "sexually suggestive conversation" without consent...

I'm sure it was the few seriously degenerate men (and the two women) who throw trash around all the time that brought this law about. But, what the fuck?

Is this some new form of population control? If we brought this bullshit to the U.S. it would immediately become a cash-farm for lawyers doing "civil follow-up" to specious criminal charges, and the chilling effect would immediately extend to everyone's pants
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iamtheky (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 1:16pm

"The law says you can't say anything sexually related to someone without first getting consent."

What about overtly sexual advertising? say in the form of an avatar, pseudo-chat window, or forum bot. Which third party is going to get sued first for obscene communique?
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Rose M. Welch (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 3:03pm

Re: Re: Re: Re: Scotland
And sometimes it's a cigar.
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Rose M. Welch (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 3:04pm

Re: Scotland Depraved (by The Tartan Terrors)
You forgot the part about the sheets of rubber and peanut butter. :)
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 5:30pm

People are living in an Islamic state and don't even realize it LoL
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Anonymous Coward, 13 Jul 2010 @ 6:19pm

"Do you mind if I deploy an innuendo" just became my new auto-sig!
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BentFranklin (profile), 13 Jul 2010 @ 8:26pm

Isn't asking someone if you may raise the subject of sex raising the subject of sex?
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Anonymous Coward, 14 Jul 2010 @ 6:25am

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Scotland
... and sometimes it's just a McNugget.
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Anonymous Coward, 14 Jul 2010 @ 6:28am

UR MOM !!.... no more :(
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Niall (profile), 14 Jul 2010 @ 7:36am

The specific reasons that this is an offence are:
(a) obtaining sexual gratification,
(b) humiliating, distressing or alarming B (the other)

I'm not sure how a) will go unless it is some private titillation directly related to the sharing, rather than just a general part of conversation, but the second is somewhat clearer.

To an initial reading it makes sense. The trouble becomes in how broadly these will be interpreted (and what evidence is needed to 'prove' these motivations).

As a resident of Scotland, I wait with mild trepidation!
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vivaelamor (profile), 14 Jul 2010 @ 1:32pm

Re: Re:
"Bloody iPhone keyboard!"

The iPhone has a what now? *fondles his N900*
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vivaelamor (profile), 14 Jul 2010 @ 1:39pm

Next on Mock the Week
I can't wait for this to be brought up on Mock the Week, my guess: "Isn't a Scot asking for permission to say 'fuck you' rather like an Englishman asking for permission to comment on the weather?"
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