Reminder: Big Concerts Are Not All Of The Live Music Business
from the small-shows-are-doing-well dept
Whenever we discuss examples of successful bands who utilize live shows as part of their business model, or when we point to data about how live revenue is growing, people often focus just on the data available for "big concerts" in arenas and amphitheaters. For example, last year, we wrote about a research paper claiming that live revenue couldn't replace recorded music sales revenue. While an interesting bit of research, there were a few problems with it. First, we certainly have never claimed that live alone is the business model for musicians. Live is one component that seems to work well for many, but most of the business models we talk about involve a variety of revenue streams. Second, as we've shown recently, the "recorded music" revenue tends to go almost entirely to the record label, not the artist. So, from an artist's perspective, they're usually not "replacing" very much. But, most importantly, the data itself seemed to only focus on giant concerts: the kind that plays at arenas and amphitheaters. This sort of data is out there, but it's not everything. Yet, with various reports of financial problems at Live Nation, some critics are rushing around to claim that all the folks who said "live" would "replace" recorded music revenue were clearly wrong. In fact, we've had one critic submit about 30 such stories.But, of course, while Live Nation has something of a death grip on arenas and amphitheaters, that's not how most musicians play live. Ian Rogers points us to a wide-ranging, but quite interesting, interview with indie band booking king Tom Windish, where he notes that in the realm he's working in, things are fantastic. It's in the middle of the interview, where he's asked about whether the business is "hurting":
Are promoters hurting this year?There are two key points in there concerning live music. The first is that his business -- which represents a ton of top independent acts, isn't hurting. We've spoken to a bunch of musicians who fit into that same category, and keep hearing basically the same story. If you're in the range where you're performing clubs and small theaters at $15/$20 a head, and have a decent fanbase, you can do quite well.
We're not. It seems that Live Nation is. I don't really pay attention to the side of the business that is arena or amphitheatre driven. People are excited about seeing a lot of our bands. I hope more of them get popular. That would be great.
What's hurting the live business overall?
It's a combination of things. The price (of shows), and the surcharges; I think that's what is souring people the most. They are ridiculous.
Most of your roster works with cheaper ticket prices.
Yeah, I would say that most work in the $15 to $20 range before service charges are applied which are very high.
The second point, of course, is the sheer inefficiency of the ticketing process that has allowed middlemen to add all sorts of annoying fees and surcharges. It still seems like that's an area ripe for change.
Later in the interview, Windish makes another point that we've discussed in the past as well. "Live" doesn't necessarily mean having to go all the way around the country. It can really mean building up a really strong local audience, and gradually expanding it. That was a key part of Corey Smith's successful strategy, in that he kept touring locally, and kept slowly expanding his geographic footprint. Even today, his (massive) success is still located mostly in the southern US, and he's admitted that the next step is to slowly start to expand into the northeast. In the interview here, Windish makes a similar suggestion for bands. After talking about how many bands mistakenly just focus on playing big "festivals," the interviewer and Windish point out that building up a local audience (i.e., the old fashioned way of doing things) still works:
If a band doesn't land a festival, it can work within a region and explore opportunities.The point is, there are lots of interesting strategies that various acts can use to be successful well playing live shows -- and simply assuming that "live doesn't work" because Live Nation is having a down year sort of misses the point.
That's a good way to do it, too. That's kind of an old school way of doing it. We have a lot of bands, especially foreign bands, that will come here and focus on New York for a week. Then, they go home to France or the U.K. and keep playing where they live. Then they come back here, play New York more, add in L.A. and, maybe, add in Toronto. Then they will go back and work in Europe again. The buzz that is generated in Europe will trickle over here pretty much immediately.
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Filed Under: booking, concerts, fees, indie, tom windish
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Fans, don't mind paying money to see an artist. They do mind paying $20 or $30 in convenience charges. Live Nation will mail out your ticket for free but will charge you $2.50 to print your own ticket.
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Enter The Haggis!
Plus, they put on a great show. http://www.enterthehaggis.com
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reduction in surchagres has been needed for long time
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Local Live is great fun.
For another thing, you are not handing out your hard earned money to a bunch of crooks who add nothing (except disgust)to the experience.
BTW Greyhound has apparently taken lessons from those guys. On top of the basic fare they add what seems like an endless list of gotcha fees. They even have a "window fee" if you buy your ticket at the station.
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Hollistic is everything ...
Analysts (and Indies) need to keep everything in perspective and make sure they get the full picture of what's happened, what's happening and what's possible. Don't let any single piece of the puzzle represent the whole ...
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It's about the price
Now I don't know, but when I realize that for the total of one ticket at House of Blues I can get two tickets at Paradise club and still see the bands I like I almost always do the latter. It worked out great for me once. I wanted to see Dirty Projectors. The first concert they came through was at House of Blues. Tickets were closer to 40, so I opted out of the concert. A few months later they came to the Paradise Club. Paid $20 stood closer and had a much more enjoyable time I'm sure.
Another venue in Cambridge is the Middle East club. This probably panders to even smaller or less known bands, but typically it is $15-20, but includes 3-4 acts. The show I went to the band I liked performed 3rd and after they were done they stood in the audience with us...dancing and having a good time. I still remember the experience to this day.
Of course those are the prices before your booking fee, printing fee, and whatever other fee they decide to throw at you. I've thought about seeing if purchasing the tickets at the venue would avoid the price, but haven't done so yet. For paradise a $20 ticket usually gets an extra 5 or 6 added on per ticket. Still a lot cheaper as a total price then other venues, but I hate the fact that they do that.
Last thing to add. I also got free tickets to go to a U2 concert...normally wouldn't. Now this was at the Patriots stadium. The tickets were only 25 or 30, but we were like 3 rows from the top of the stadium. The sound was so horrendous with the echo that you couldn't understand a word he said...and if it weren't for the large screen's we wouldn't have been able to tell Bonno from any other spec dancing on the stage. We tried to move up, but yea they were bitchy about that whole thing. I really shy away from large venues as a result. Even if were a die hard fan of U2 in order to get good sound I'd probably have to shell out upwards of 80-100 just to avoid the echo. But for $20 I can see world class acts that I actually enjoy in a venue where bad sound isn't even an issue.
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Re: It's about the price
Price is definitely an issue for the big acts, but I'm also seeing bands in the smaller clubs lowering prices, too. What was once a $10 ticket is now a $8 or $6 ticket. So it is possible that economic conditions are affecting concerts at all price points. I haven't seen any industry-wide figures on what's happening to music in bars and small clubs, but I have seen ticket prices dropping even at the cheapest levels. And of course in cities with an abundance of musicians, getting no cover is often the norm.
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Will lower prices be pushed all the way to the club level?
As I said, I've noticed that there has been some softening of prices for local and smaller touring acts, but I haven't seen any research to confirm that industry-wide. Perhaps what was once a $30 ticket is now a $20 ticket. What was once a $20 ticket is $15. What was once $10 is now $8. Etc.
Summer Concert Ticket Sales Decline - NYTimes.com: For lawn tickets to the next Lilith Fair stop, at PNC Bank Arts Center on Saturday, for example, the regular price is $37.75. Live Nation was also offering a special deal of a pack of four lawn tickets for $75; with service charges they cost a total of $112.20. But on Wednesday, when the company's latest sale took effect, those same four lawn tickets were $40 flat."
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