Glee Cast Members Claim They're Being Stiffed On Royalties From Glee CD

from the sing-a-song-of-copyright dept

Tue, Sep 7th 2010 11:14am — Mike Masnick

AdamR alerts us to the news that a bunch of castmembers from the hit TV show Glee are apparently quite upset that they're not seeing royalties from the super successful CD from the TV show.

After their latest record, "Glee: The Music -- Journey to Regionals" landed at No. 1 on the Billboard 200 chart in June, star Mark Salling said he'd seen "not a dime" of royalty payments from label Sony Music.

Co-star Corey Montieth told Toby Knapp's DC 99.5 radio show: "I got 400 bucks from it going No. 1. But you know what, that's OK, because if I'm patient, and if this thing does really well, maybe I'll see another 400 bucks."

... "The 'Glee' cast is furious because they feel they were misled by Sony," a source said. "They have all complained to Ryan that they want a bigger share of the royalties."

Well, that's how RIAA accounting works. Though, amusingly, the article notes that this is leading castmembers to make sure not to sign directly with Sony for recording deals, choosing to work with competitors instead (of course, with the major labels, they all cut deals like this). Either way, with the cast suddenly learning about music royalties, it makes you wonder if the show will stop ignoring them.

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Filed Under: glee, royalties
Companies: sony

36 Comments

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Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2010 @ 11:22am

This reminds me of a UserFriendly strip:

http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20070115
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Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 11:28am

Maybe that'll teach them for claiming Madonna's music is "public domain"

Okay fine that was the writers not the cast. Still really bugs me though. The show could actually be quietly educating people about the ridiculous restrictiveness of copyright instead of perpetrating the false impression that copyright doesn't apply if you're just having fun. Or it could at least ignore the issue entirely. But calling Madonna "public domain" the same week you are cutting her a massive cheque is just wrong...
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- Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2010 @ 11:42am
  
  Re:
  Wait? Madonna's music isn't in the public domain? After I heard that on Glee I thought it was true and downloaded her entire discography!
  
  Why would Hollywood lie to me!?! Why!?!
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  - Modplan (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 11:54am
    
    Re: Re:
    Don't worry, at least we have the Beatles and Mickey Mouse.
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    - Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 11:56am
      
      Re: Re: Re:
      and Happy Birthday
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      - Danny, 7 Sep 2010 @ 12:38pm
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re:
        What's the verdict on The Electric Slide? The dance and song.
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        DS, 8 Sep 2010 @ 11:02am
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
        The RIAA has stipulated that you:
        
        Can't see it.
        Can't hold it.
        Can't resist it.
        Can't do without it.
        Don't want to lose it, while not being able to choose it.
        Regardless if it exists everywhere or not.
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  - Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 11:55am
    
    Re: Re:
    After I heard that on Glee I thought it was true
    
    Yes, yes, I know it's ridiculous, but frankly your sarcasm is unwarranted. The fact is that most people don't know how restrictive copyright law is -- and it actually DOES seem sensible that a group of high-school kids with an amateur glee club would be allowed to perform popular songs without licensing them. It's not at all hard to imagine a lot of people believing a ridiculous statement like "Madonna is public domain."
    
    But in reality, any glee club that did what they do on the show would have to have millions of dollars in the licensing and lawsuit budgets. Few people realize this. It would actually be really nice for the show to remind everyone that it is a fantasy and that in real life you would be sued into the ground for doing what they do.
    
    That's one of the biggest problems with copyright law. People very much do think that it's not so bad, because they can't believe that our shared culture is a locked up, restricted resource. They sing Madonna in the shower, so they assume they can sing it anywhere.
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    - Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 11:58am
      
      Re: Re: Re:
      I had a feeling Techdirt already had something on this:
      
      http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20100608/0254339727.shtml
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    - CoCo Was Screwed, 7 Sep 2010 @ 2:33pm
      
      Re: Re: Re:
      Actually no. In a worst case, they would need a Compulsory License but only if they plan on recording and distributing the performance.
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      - Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2010 @ 3:45pm
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re:
        That is not the worst case, the worst case is being sued for infringement and being dealt a million bucks sentence and also being sued by ASCAP and other collection agencies and being handed another sentence in the ten's of thousands of dollars.
        
        On top of that the school could declare bankruptcy, I'm not certain what public schools would do though.
        
        That would be the worst that can happen.
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      - Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 3:49pm
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re:
        You are potentially right. But the show also features a lot of mashups, which complicate things by being derivative works. It also deals with YouTube videos, and public performances in a variety of places that wouldn't have performance licenses.
        
        The point is, at the very least, the club in the show would definitely need a lawyer in real life. But the show doesn't just ignore that aspect (which would be fine -- lots of writers leave out the boring realities of something in order to make a good show) but actively contradicts it by saying dumb things like "Madonna is public domain, you can't stop us" when in fact a lot of people definitely could stop them or at least make it prohibitively expensive.
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      - Karl (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 4:15pm
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re:
        No. If they did any public performance of those works, they would have to pay the PRO's (ASCAP, BMI, possibly SEASAC) for a license, or they could be sued.
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        Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 5:20pm
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
        Typically venues pay those organizations, so CoCo is still somewhat right.
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        Karl (profile), 8 Sep 2010 @ 5:34am
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
        True. For what happens in most episodes, the school would have to pay. I guess it depends on who you mean when you say "they."
        
        That would make a good episode, actually.
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        Marcus Carab (profile), 8 Sep 2010 @ 7:18am
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
        Yeah the schools would all need licenses, as would whatever auditoriums they have their contests in (presumably those do) -- then there's also the various public places they break into impromptu song. I believe at one point they record a video of them singing some pop song or another for a mattress commercial on TV which is of course an even bigger deal.
        
        Your final point is the important one: it would be great for them to do an episode, without getting too intense or complex, that points out some of the legal bullshit these kids-having-fun-singing would have to face in the real world.
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Common Sense, 7 Sep 2010 @ 12:06pm

Apparently they didn't get the welcome package explaining how royalties work in the music business... One can only hope that they make a big enough fuss about this to draw some real attention to the criminals that are the RIAA....
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Hosermage (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 12:14pm

no money for a bunch of ripoff artists...
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Thomas (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 12:21pm

Alrighty Then ..
This obviously proves that we need even stronger and more restrictive copyright laws to protect the income of these artists, which is being decimated by file sharing.
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Anon, 7 Sep 2010 @ 12:27pm

Too bad they believed the songs,
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- Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2010 @ 12:27pm
  
  Re: Too bad they believed the songs,
  and didn't stop believing.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2010 @ 12:54pm

Rather than whine about royalties, perhpas these cast members might consider giving their agents and lawyers the heave-ho since it appears the latter were asleep at the switch. Maybe next time they will hire someone who can actually read, understand, draft, and negotiate such agreements.
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- average_joe (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 5:54pm
  
  Re:
  Agreed. They should have known ahead of time what kind of royalties they could expect. It's not a secret. They should have asked questions before signing.
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  - PaulT (profile), 9 Sep 2010 @ 5:05am
    
    Re: Re:
    So, it's OK to rip off the people actually creating the product they're selling, so long as it's hidden away enough in the language for them not to have questioned it? The label can do whatever they wish as long as the artists' representation isn't competent enough to protect them?
    
    I'd never have guessed you were pursuing a career in law...
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Rekrul, 7 Sep 2010 @ 12:55pm

You don't understand! They didn't get royalties from the CD because all the songs were originally by other artists! So those artists are the ones who get the bulk of the royalties.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2010 @ 2:09pm

"They didn't get royalties from the CD because all the songs were originally by other artists! So those artists are the ones who get the bulk of the royalties."

Yep. What exactly were they expecting to get? And weren't these kids nobodies before glee? I'm sure they are locked into crazy contracts...so sing and dance....sing and dance. lmao
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- Marcus Carab (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 3:51pm
  
  Re:
  Just like how orchestras don't get paid, right? And how studio musicians are all volunteers?
  
  I'm not sure where I stand on this issue as a whole (I mostly agree with the AC who says they should get better agents) but the crux is definitely not the fact that they didn't write the songs themselves.
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Karl (profile), 7 Sep 2010 @ 2:15pm

Surprise!
Anyone who has studied major label contracts in any depth will not be surprised by this at all.

The performers only get performance royalties - and then only after the recording, producing, and mastering costs have been taken out. Probably half of the promotional costs as well. If the cast went on tour (did they?), then tour support would also be taken out of royalties.

This is standard operating procedure for all recording contracts, regardless of label. So it doesn't really make a difference that they're on Sony, the other "big three" work exactly the same way.

The songwriters, on the other hand, get mechanical royalties (sans deductions), and all the royalties from airplay. This is the only way most musicians have ever made money off of recordings.

A lot of those songwriters (e.g. Maddonna or ABBA) licensed their music to use for free on the show. Kind of puts a new spin on their "generosity," doesn't it?
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BruceLD, 7 Sep 2010 @ 6:52pm

Subject
I'm unsure how this is a surprise. The corporations have been ripping off artists for years, and then they place the blame the rest of us.
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Anonymous Coward, 7 Sep 2010 @ 11:52pm

Well Lea Michelle is the only one who can be regarded as a top-class singer. She has the right to complain, the others on the show are no better than a good casual singer in the family that sings at get togethers.
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- Vincent Clement, 8 Sep 2010 @ 6:29am
  
  Re:
  It is irrelevant who is a top-class singer and who is casual singer. Record companies are two-faced greedy bastards. When they file an infringement suit or file a take-down notice, they claim to do it in the name of the 'artist'. When said artist asks for their fair share, the record company says 'ha ha, too bad you signed this contract'. And they wonder why their business model is crumbling.
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Tamara, 8 Sep 2010 @ 10:59pm

Most can'
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Tamara, 8 Sep 2010 @ 11:03pm

Most can't sing
As Anonymous Coward said a few posts up. Lea Michelle is the only one who is good enough to secure a record deal without the show. She is a brilliant singer and would succeed no worries without the show behind her. The others whilst good singers aren't good enough to be a success without the show behind them. They won't sell many CDs.

So Lea has every right to complain. The others don't. They're getting far more money than they would otherwise. If they don't like it they can quit and then they won't even get $400.
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- average_joe (profile), 9 Sep 2010 @ 6:10am
  
  Re: Most can't sing
  Mercedes, Kurt, and Mr. Schu are all better than Rachel, IMO.
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- Anonymous Coward, 9 Sep 2010 @ 6:54am
  
  Re: Most can't sing
  You know...we can tell that you are the Anonymous Coward a few posts up.
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  - Anonymous Coward, 10 Sep 2010 @ 7:33am
    
    Re: Re: Most can't sing
    Anonymous Coward here. I'm not Tamara
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