Bagel Company Sued For Claiming It Had Patented Process For Making 'Brooklyn Water'
from the rolls-with-holes dept
Way back in high school, my after school/weekend job was working in a bagel shop in New York. I learned pretty much all aspects of the bagel business, and ever since then I take bagels pretty seriously -- including the well known fact that you just can't make good New York bagels outside of New York. Often, it's because bagel shops elsewhere take shortcuts in how they cook their bagels, but the key reason is, of course, the water. Making a bagel (properly) involves boiling the dough before cooking the bagel, and for whatever reason, only the water in New York seems to have that perfect quality that makes a bagel into a bagel. Since moving away to California, I've never been able to find anything that comes even close to a New York bagel, and instead have to settle for vastly inferior "rolls with holes," that people around here think are bagels.So, this next lawsuit caught my attention not just because of the patent issues (the stuff that normally catches my attention), but also because it's about bagels and bagel water. Apparently, there's a company (based in Florida, not Brooklyn), called the Original Brooklyn Water Bagel Co., which claims to not just make New York-style bagels, but also to make its own "Brooklyn water," which is necessary for making such bagels, via a "14-step patented process." However, another Florida-based eatery, Mamma Mia's Trattoria is suing OBWB for false patent marking, saying the 14-step patented process is neither 14 steps nor patented:
Mamma Mia points out how often OBWB points to its "patented process" in its marketing and advertising campaigns, suggesting some sort of proprietary and exclusive advantage. However, Mamma Mia notes, it does not appear that OBWB actually holds any patents whatsoever. Oops. OBWB's claim for its "patented process," apparently comes from the fact that it licensed a bunch of patents from another company -- Aquathin (also from Florida), which makes water filtration systems. When Mamma Mia demanded to know what patents were being used, OBWB listed out seven patents from Aquathin.
The only problem? Four of the seven patents are already expired. Of the remaining patents, two are actually design, not utility, patents (which is more like a trademark, and not what people think of when talking about a patent, as it's about the design of a product not any "process"). That leaves a single utility patent (which is close to expiring), but if you look at that actual patent (5,147,533), it's about how to mount a water purification system under a kitchen sink -- which has nothing to do with the process of purifying the water itself.
So, there doesn't appear to be any actual 14-step-patented process here. There may be a 14-step process, and who knows if it actually creates anything close to Brooklyn water, but the patent claim appears to be highly questionable, at best. Even so, Mamma Mia's complaint notes, OBWB still threatened to sue Mamma Mia for infringing on its (apparently non-existent) "patented process," in offering its own "New York-style" pizza.
If the allegations are true, this does seem like exactly what patent marking lawsuits were designed for: to prevent a company from falsely claiming a monopoly on something it has no right to. Of course, this means that if it's actually possible to create a process to replicate New York water (that doesn't involve, you know, bottling water from New York and shipping it around), and that process is not patented, then perhaps there's still hope that we'll be able to get "real" bagels in California...
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Filed Under: bagels, false marking, marking, patent marking, patents, water
Companies: mamma mia, original brooklyn water bagel
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Plus...
That and the fact that, for some unknown reason, lox tastes a million times better in Gotham City....
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Re: Plus...
its the soot from the exhaust of the city buses ...
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Re: Re: Plus...
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Re: Re: Re: Plus...
*buses
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Re: Plus...
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Marking
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Re: Marking
Or each newspaper sold?
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Brooklyn Water...
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Re: Brooklyn Water...
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Re: Brooklyn Water...
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Great!
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Re: Great!
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Brooklyn Water ...
1-Filter Water
2-Distill Water
3-Add Trace minerals to match the Ashokan Reservoirs water
4-Adjust ph
simple ...
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Re: Brooklyn Water ...
It would be hard to replicate it. NYC has the best water.
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Re: Re: Brooklyn Water ...
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Re: Re: Brooklyn Water ...
Water meet mass spec
"NYC has the best water."
Actually it comes from several reservoirs in upstate ny
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Re: Brooklyn Water ...
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Re: Re: Brooklyn Water ...
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Stop unfair bagel taxes.
The biggest issue within the Bagel industry is that New York now collects an 8-cent tax on any bagel that's sliced, schmeared, or otherwise prepared. It seems racist.
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Re: Stop unfair bagel taxes.
Please explain
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Re: Stop unfair bagel taxes.
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Oy! Give me a Montreal Bagel!
You haven't had bagels until you've had them from these two places:
St-Viateur Bagel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St-Viateur_Bagel
Fairmount Bagel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairmount_Bagel
According to an article in the Christian Science Monitor:
"All are better than what you'll find in the United States."
While you're in the neighborhood, stop by Wilenski's for a 'special' or two (picture some of the scenes from "The Apprenticeship of Duddy Kravitz"), or by Schwarz's for what is, by far, the best smoked meat sandwich in the world.
Really.
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Re: Oy! Give me a Montreal Bagel!
Being on the left coast of Canada the closest I can get here is Segal's Bagels, which are made in the Montreal style (which is actual Romanian)
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Re: Oy! Give me a Montreal Bagel!
His father (born and raised in France) said it wasn't so much they weren't as good as it was they weren't what he expected. When is comes to food, good versus bad is easy. Good versus very good is usualy a matter of preferences and expectations. Who made it is more important than where it was made.
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Further insight required Mike...
For those of us poor schlubs that will never step foot in New York state, exactly what is the difference between your typical "California" bagel and a real New York Bagel?
Should I be eying that poly bag of eight bagel impostors lurking in my fridge with derision or pity?
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Re: Further insight required Mike...
I'm not Mike, but I travel a lot. And there's nothing like a NY bagel. It's impossible to explain why they're so good, but the packaged ones taste like bread with a thin crust and too much air.
A real bagel is heavy and chewy and hearty. It absorbs the butter, or lets the cream cheese sit on top for the perfect combo.
Dammit. now I'm hungry.
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Re: Further insight required Mike...
Nothing beats picking up a dozen while they are still hot!
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Patented...!
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Re: Patented...!
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The secret to NYC Bagels…
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Re: The secret to NYC Bagels…
http://consumerist.com/2010/08/new-yorks-water-filled-with-invisible-shrimp.html
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Re: Re: The secret to NYC Bagels�
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New York Water
Doesn't anyone else think this is a reasonable assumption?
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Re: New York Water
Water Fest Test.
Put the instructions on how to proceed and have people posting the results and showing up in a google maps LoL
That would be fun
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Thank God we live in a country . . .
Innovation at work. If someone hadn't patented that idea, nobody would have ever thought of a way to mount a water purification system under a kitchen sink.
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NYC bagels
The water is the least of it. A real bagel is hand rolled then boiled, broiled, and baked. Nobody is willing to put in the labor anymore. All you get these days are rolls with holes.
feh.
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Re: NYC bagels
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Brooklyn Water
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Eddie & Sam's Pizza in Tampa
I heard that a prominent dent in the tile was caused when water stored upstairs leaked through and caused the ceiling to fail.
Don't know if it's really true, but it's a good story, and they DO have great pizza!
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Well... maybe!
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Montreal Bagels
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Re: Lox
Cheers
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Owner of OBWB is a ScumBag
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Brooklyn Water
It is all in the Water.
I knew from the day the Brooklyn Water Co. Opened that someone was going to use that water for Pizza. Next is the Italian Bread.
I wish them Both best of Luck with their Law Suite
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Bagels
White River Junction
7 S Main St Map.eaedf11
White River Junction, VT 05001
These bagels are just like the real bagels of years ago. Tough, small, hand made, chewy, tasty. These are not rolls with holes. The owner learned in Queens and NJ. He knows his crumb. My mother-in-law takes these bagels back home to Manhattan after she visits us in Vermont. She's tired of the bread they sell in Manhattan that they call a bagel.
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