DHS Boss: 'Very, Very, Very Few People Get A Pat Down'; Reality: ~1.8 Million People Per Month
from the ministry-of-truth dept
With all of the talk about the TSA airport gropings, Homeland Security boss Janet Napolitano has been a bit on the defensive about the procedure. In answering questions at a press club lunch, she claimed specifically that "very, very, very few people get a pat down," and that it only happens in "under very limited circumstances." She also joked that whenever anyone does get groped, those "tend to get on YouTube."The obvious suggestion here is that people are making a big deal out of nothing, and very few people are getting "legally" sexually assaulted by our government. Of course, when you claim "very, very, very few" people are getting this kind of "service," it seems you ought to be able to back that up. The folks over at Politifact decided to dig in, and while no one was particularly forthcoming, they got enough info from enough sources (including some data from the TSA) that suggested approximately 1.8 million people per month are getting groped for their own safety. That doesn't sound like very, very, very few. Hell, it doesn't even sound like very few.
Of course, it's unlikely that there will be any ramifications for Napolitano out and out lying to the press concerning government mandated groping. Instead, plenty of people will continue to believe this is an issue that doesn't really affect that many people. Until they get groped.
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Filed Under: dhs, janet napolitano, pat downs, tsa
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Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
So, he should have said "Only around 0.03% of people get groped."
The best way to misrepresent something is to place it out of context. If you see a news show that says "1200 people dying from 'insert stupid thing there'!" and you do a little digging, it's 1200 people a year across the entire US--or something like 0.00000017%. Who cares?
If the percentage can be more shocking, then they'll user a percentage--especially if the source data is wrong.
"In our survey of 100 people paid to say something controversial, there was 99% controversy with a margin of error of +-1%!" Which, of course, is also utter lies and BS.
What am I saying here? I forgot. Kinda got lost in the rant. Need more coffee...
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Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
Cheers.
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5 additional responses to correct the math...
/yawn
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Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
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Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
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Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
Janet Napolitano is a woman.
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Re: Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
Citation needed
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Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
There are about 7billion people in the world so only .025% of them are getting groped. No one would argue that this is a large percentage.
In fact, by some estimations, there will be 20billion people by 2020 or so. That puts it down to .009% of the people of the world being groped by the TSA.
This is a favorable trend. Why are people complaining?
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Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
(1,800,000 / 60,000,000 = .03 = 3%)
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Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
1)As others have stated it's 3% not .03%
2)In otherwords, that's just short of 1 out of 30
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Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
1.8 million out of 60 million is about 3%.
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Re: Lies, Damn Lies, Statistics.
I appreciate your comments about percentages vs. absolute values, but let's not be off by a factor of 100.
And even if it is 0.03%, when the activity is wrong, useless, and sensationalist, who cares how small the number? It doesn't need to be happening, and already DOESN'T happen in far "hotter" places. Go read up on security at Israeli checkpoints -- they don't do very many random pat-downs because they know how to screen folks properly and accurately with more suitable means.
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Though last time they did swipe my sealed water bottle and then drank it in front of me. Guess being male middle class and white means I am not a threat, regardless of the suspicious amounts of electronics in my bags, though that factory sealed water bottle must have been a high security risk.
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Reading Comprehension
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Procedural?
This seems like a bit much to go through however it stipulates that this only happens when you set off an alarm or request it. Sounds to me that there may be a few people out there that don't mind being touched so much.
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Re: Procedural?
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Re: Procedural?
And even if you submit to the naked scanner, you STILL will get a pat down if they have an anomaly on the scan. This can happen even if you just move slightly at the wrong time or accidentally leave something in your pocket or whatever.
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Re: Procedural?
No alarm or request needed.
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Oh yeah, and there's that lil' thing...
Imagine if instead of groping they shot people. "We only had to shoot very very very few people, most comply and go through the 4th Amend. stripping machines." ;)
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Re: Oh yeah, and there's that lil' thing...
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Re: Re: Oh yeah, and there's that lil' thing...
"....and by voluntarily[emphasis mine] being searched, nobody's rights are being stripped."
Perhaps you would have a point if it was in any way voluntary. I have yet to hear about any airline traveler that said; "Please Mr. TSA man touch me in a morally inappropriate way." and then went on to complain about it.
If you enter the screening area the TSA reserves the right to 'screen' you. Don't even start with the, '... well you volunteered when you decided to fly." nonsense. Because if you go to fly and they say they want to assault you, even if you change your mind and decide not to fly they still reserve the right to assault you.
So the original poster did have a point, it's your response that I found rather pointless.
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Re: Re: Oh yeah, and there's that lil' thing...
Thanks!
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Define: voluntarily
#define "voluntarily" = TSA whim (at the moment)
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Re: Re: Oh yeah, and there's that lil' thing...
It's like someone giving you the choice of being raped or killed. Ether choice doesn't qualify as voluntary.
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Re: Re: Oh yeah, and there's that lil' thing...
Or are you saying taking an airplane is voluntary? Sure, I suppose. You could also ride a bus for ten days to get to your destination, or take a boat to get to the other side of the continent.
Common sense = UnAmerican, though, so you will obviously forget about something called "feasibility".
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Further comment
She followed that up by saying, "And another thing, can we get over the whole Holocaust thing? So a handful of people died. No biggie."
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What a liar
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Re: What a liar
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Re: What a liar
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This little exercise has made me very suspicious of the 1.8 million estimate anyway. I hate the ideas of getting groped as much as the next guy... but these numbers don't seem right.
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That being said, this isn't a question of scale, it's a question of principle. The government should not be allowed, according to our Constitution, to just pull you aside at random and frisk you. It doesn't matter if it only happens ten times in a year, it shouldn't happen at all.
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makes it look more like 300-400 Commercial Airports(ones that actually have the TSA presence). You seriously think that there is an airport for every 2,200 people in the United States(300 million/14,000 airports)?
I agree with your second point though, I just don't understand why you'd need to make such ridiculous accounting errors to make it. That's my whole issue, don't let exaggerations deter people from the whole point, just let the real facts(which are probably still compelling) and actual issue do the talking, not misinformation.
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The point of my post was the "it shouldn't haoppen at all." If 1.8mil/14000 is unacceptable, then 1.8mil/400 is VERY unacceptible.
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Bullshit, TSA is bullshit
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Re: Bullshit, TSA is bullshit
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I REFUSE to bow down to the government that tries to fool us into believing that they are "protecting" us and that this all somehow makes me feel safer.
I want to see EVERY government politician go through these interrogations with their children and wives, husbands, etc. and see what they think. Oooops I forgot,....they are exempt from that.........they fly around on million dollar jets for just one or two of them.
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And when the lawsuits start...
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Backscatter and Cancer
http://healthfreedoms.org/2010/01/05/cancer-danger-in-airport-backscatter-x-ray-machines/
What that article doesn't mention is that ionizing (penetrating) radiation exposure is also cumulative. Every single time you pass through one of those scanners, you increase your risk of cancer. It never goes away.
If I had the option, I too would avoid airline travel until both the backscatter machines AND the "enhanced" pat-down stop being used (one or the other) on each and every citizen.
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Random question
The question got some validity when I saw that Sherry got a pat-down on every trip and AC didn't, but his blond wife did (always).
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Permission granted
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Re: Permission granted
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Make the most of it
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It means that the person saying this does not want to discuss actual numbers and would rather spew bullshit.
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Thankfully, I flew home for the last time right before they started the "enhanced patdown."
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