Dear Rotolight: The Internet Never Forgets Your Censorious Past, Even If You Deny It

from the look-at-that... dept

Fri, Aug 2nd 2013 6:32pm — Mike Masnick

So, you may have heard the story this week about Rotolight forcing down a video review they didn't like of one of their lights -- and then admitting publicly that they did it because they thought the review wasn't fair (and also claiming that they thought it violated their trademark, even though the DMCA doesn't cover trademark). That story got quite a lot of attention, and quite a bit late, Rotolight posted its official statement in response, in which the company sought to both apologize... but also defend the initial actions. There is also the odd statement that the video wasn't taken down for copyright reasons, even though the creator of the video, Den Lennie, clearly received a copyright takedown notice.

In this specific case, the video was not removed for copyright infringement reasons as has been widely reported. Rotolight received external advice with respect to this particular video that it was potentially misleading and unrepresentative. This advice resulted in the only request the company has made to have a video removed from any video sharing website in the last 3 years.

As Popehat notes, either Rotolight or Vimeo is lying here, and it's hard to believe that it's Vimeo. If they didn't send a copyright takedown, then why don't they say what they actually sent? Clearly, Vimeo received some sort of notification.

However, two more tidbits have popped up since then, thanks to the lovely internet. First, we have Jeepers Media pointing out to us that Rotolight's claim above that this is the "only request the company has made to have a video removed from any video sharing website in the last 3 years" does not appear to be true. CheesyCam has the story of how it had posted a YouTube video... and Rotolight had (you guessed it) taken it down:

That’s total bull, because this has actually been a practice of RotoLight for at least the last two years. Two years ago, I posted up a video about one user and a UFO camping light who may have mentioned he was making his own DIY RotoLight. Obviously it was a UFO camping LED light, and because of the camparisons, RotoLight commented on this blog and admitted to taking down the users YouTube video:

“FYI, the YouTube Video on which your article relates has been removed due its to defamtory nature, breach of our Registered Trademark and misleading information”.

Whoa wait a minute! The DMCA cannot be used for Trademark claims. That was two years ago, and who knows how many other YouTube or Vimeo videos were taken down in that time frame, but I can tell you the recent Den Lennie attempt was not the first. The fact that they are now playing dumb and backtracking as if this was the only DMCA they filed is a load of crap.

While CheesyCam doesn't link to the original post, it appears to be here. Oops. So, clearly not the first. Also, a commenter on Popehat points out that it's highly unlikely that Rotolight did not understand copyright or the nature of DMCA notices (or the difference between copyright and trademark), in part because the founder/president of Rotolight also runs one of the largest music publishing/producing businesses in the UK -- and his wife is an entertainment lawyer who wrote a book about copyright that was published not too long ago.

So, um, that's nice that you're a small business and you want to rehabilitate your reputation and all... but it might help to start out by not lying about the claim that this was the first such video you've taken down -- or about the nature of the takedown. As they say, it's often not the original bad deed that gets you in the end... but the attempted coverup.

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Filed Under: censorship, copyright, history, reviews, takedowns, trademark, videos
Companies: rotolight

23 Comments

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S. T. Stone, 2 Aug 2013 @ 6:50pm

Don�t you just hate it when facts get in the way of trying to propogate a lie?
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Anonymous Anonymous Coward, 2 Aug 2013 @ 7:45pm

Miranda and the Streisand Effect
I know this will never happen, well probably not, but what would happen if sending a DMCA notice required acknowledging a Miranda type warning about the Streisand effect? The self-centeredness of these bozo's (sorry Bozo) might actually help, if they actually take the time to understand.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 2 Aug 2013 @ 7:45pm

Does that apply to you ??
I hope so..
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 2 Aug 2013 @ 7:48pm

Who is "the internet"?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
This comment has been flagged by the community. Click here to show it

out_of_the_blue, 2 Aug 2013 @ 7:51pm

SO? What's your fix?
I wrote on the prior item, looks like a FINE test case, so let's see some calls for action. What's the exact charge? ... What? Can't specify? Then surely it's perfectly legal.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
That One Guy (profile), 2 Aug 2013 @ 8:15pm

Re: SO? What's your fix?
The charge would be 'Perjury', where the company, despite not owning the rights to the video issues a DMCA claim regardless, otherwise known as lying on a legal form.

Now while most cases this is as far as it goes, as the law requires the affected to prove the impossible, that the DMCA was in bad faith, in this case you've got the company pretty blatantly admitting that the DMCA claims have nothing to do with copyright, and everything to do with getting rid of criticism, so I agree, these would make perfect test cases, and hopefully set a precedent and add a real penalty to fraudulent DMCA claims.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 2 Aug 2013 @ 8:17pm

Copyright law's best and brightest.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Mike, 2 Aug 2013 @ 8:35pm

Rotolight Lectures about IP Enforcement HOT HOT
The "Claimed" owner of Rotolight is actually "Helen Gammons" on her linked In. ( Info at Bottom"

Her Twitter is all about Rotolight, lobbying for tougher IP Laws AND Her music Seminars
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons

� She Claims Stronger Copyight Laws are NOT about Silencing Speech LAST YEAR on Twitter
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/160896372667719681
"Scare mongering by social media sites is wrong, the bills are not to restrict anyones voice, just to stop digital theft. Issues can be resolved."

� https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/160897311004835842
"Why is theft in the digital domain different to stealing from a record shop?"

https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/160895549732687872
"Re: SOPA & PIPA digital piracy is not an acceptable social habit its theft. It stops working composers,producers & artists earning a living.

� She Launched and Runs a Music Distribution Rights Company, Her Tweet
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/31830267576455168
"Did I mention I'm launching "sync in the city" a music placement company for film and tv. Should be 'live' in a few weeks."

� The Music Publishers Will Gain Control, Her Tweet
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/31829978861535232
"Music Publishers have the upper hand if they control both the music and the master and it will bring great success (BMG Rights Management)."

� A Tweet about her "Music Copyright Seminar"
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/255386446633005059

� Anti Music Piracy Tweet
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/247622808300052480

� HUNDREDS of Rotolight Tweets Here's a Few to prove correct Account
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/361201052323815424
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gamm ons/status/324240614403211264
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/314062180804882432
https:// twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/303596159174332418

� One of her "Music Seminars" http://www.henley.ac.uk/mba/henley-mba-music-creative-dynamics.aspx

Helen Gammons actually LECTURES on IP Enforcement Learned from years as a Music Industry Leader and Co-owner in Several Music Publishing houses!

Tuesday 14 May 2013, 10:21 | By CMU @ TGE
Artist brands and the challenges of communicating copyright tackled at Great Escape IP-themed sessions

CMU Business Editor Chris Cooke will lead a debate on the challenges of �communicating copyright�, with Sentric Music�s Chris Meehan, Henley Business School�s Helen Gammons, First Column Management�s Phil Nelson and the Music Managers� Forum�s John Webster.

http://www.thecmuwebsite.com/article/artist-brands-and-the-challenges-of-communicating-c opyright-tackled-at-tge-ip-themed-sessions/

� A Technorati Article on her Music Lectures http://technorati.com/entertainment/article/henley-business-schools-new-mba-for/

Helen Gammons Linked In
Helen Gammons's Overview

Current
Programme Director at Henley Business School www.henley.com/mbamusic
CEO at Sync In The City
Owner / Director at Rotolight.com
Owner at Planet Video Systems Ltd
see less
Past
Creative Director. at Avex Inc
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Mike, 2 Aug 2013 @ 9:05pm

Rotolight is a "Little Family Owned Business"
Well, Here is there Address found at this link
http://www.rotolight.com/contact-us/
Pinewood Studios,
Pinewood Road,
Iver Heath,
SL0 0NH
Heres a Google Earth Pictures Below of the Tiny Quaint Address
https://twitter.com/JeepersMedia/status/363509783950680064
https://twitter.com/JeepersMedi a/status/363509783950680064/photo/1
[ link to this | view in thread ]
apauld (profile), 2 Aug 2013 @ 10:58pm

Re: SO? What's your fix?
seriously, it is time to see Neurologist, the tumor is soon going to be to big to save you.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
apauld (profile), 2 Aug 2013 @ 11:03pm

Re: SO? What's your fix?
ootb, it high time for you to go to a Neurologist, the tumor is about to be terminal.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 2 Aug 2013 @ 11:48pm

Genesis?
Are these the lights that were invented by or for the band Genesis in the '70s?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
mike, 2 Aug 2013 @ 11:57pm

RotoLight Tweeted Last Year that Copyright Laws Not about Censorship
Rotolight Owner gives Lectures and Seminars DISCUSSING IP Enforcement! Was a SOPA and PIPA Supporter.

Claims Copyright Laws NOT TO SILENCE Bloggers LAST YEAR!
All Proof Here! I have Tons More Now! Most here from Owner's Personal Twitter.

The "Claimed" owner of Rotolight is actually "Helen Gammons" on her linked In. ( Details at Botton of this comment )

Her Twitter is all about Rotolight, lobbying for tougher IP Laws AND Her music Seminars
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons

� She Claims Stronger Copyight Laws are NOT about Silencing Speech LAST YEAR on Twitter
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/160896372667719681

QUOTE: "Scare mongering by social media sites is wrong, the bills are not to restrict anyones voice, just to stop digital theft. Issues can be resolved."

She believes downloading music same as Physical Theft!
� https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/160897311004835842

QUOTE: "Why is theft in the digital domain different to stealing from a record shop?"

https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/160895549732687872

QUOTE: "Re: SOPA & PIPA digital piracy is not an acceptable social habit its theft. It stops working composers,producers & artists earning a living.

� She Launched and Runs a Music Distribution Rights Company, Her Tweet
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/31830267576455168

QUOTE: "Did I mention I'm launching "sync in the city" a music placement company for film and tv. Should be 'live' in a few weeks."

� The Music Publishers Will Gain Control, Her Tweet
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/31829978861535232

QUOTE: "Music Publishers have the upper hand if they control both the music and the master and it will bring great success (BMG Rights Management)."

� A Tweet about her "Music Copyright Seminar"
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/255386446633005059

� Anti Music Piracy Tweet
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/247622808300052480

� HUNDREDS of Rotolight Tweets Here's a Few to prove correct Account
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/361201052323815424
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gamm ons/status/324240614403211264
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/314062180804882432
https:// twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/303596159174332418

� One of her "Music Seminars" http://www.henley.ac.uk/mba/henley-mba-music-creative-dynamics.aspx

Helen Gammons actually LECTURES on IP Enforcement Learned from years as a Music Industry Leader and Co-owner in Several Music Publishing houses!

Tuesday 14 May 2013, 10:21 | By CMU @ TGE
Artist brands and the challenges of communicating copyright tackled at Great Escape IP-themed sessions

CMU Business Editor Chris Cooke will lead a debate on the challenges of �communicating copyright�, with Sentric Music�s Chris Meehan, Henley Business School�s Helen Gammons, First Column Management�s Phil Nelson and the Music Managers� Forum�s John Webster.

http://www.thecmuwebsite.com/article/artist-brands-and-the-challenges-of-communicating-c opyright-tackled-at-tge-ip-themed-sessions/

� A Technorati Article on her Music Lectures http://technorati.com/entertainment/article/henley-business-schools-new-mba-for/

Helen Gammons, Owner of Rotolight, "Sync in the City" Music Licensing Site (Conveniently Down for Maintenance at the Moment! )
Heres the Wayback Machine Home Page!
http://web.archive.org/web/20120305131309/http://www.syncinthecity.com/about-us
Web Link
http://www.syncinthecity.com/about-us

I Screen Capped and Posted Rotolight's Owners tweet from Last Year About how Copyright Laws are NOT used to Censor here;
https://twitter.com/JeepersMedia/status/363506126328832000
(Incase she Removes Original ) Here;
https://twitter.com/Helen_Gammons/status/160896372667719681

Helen Gammons Linked In
Helen Gammons's Overview

Current
Programme Director at Henley Business School http://www.henley.com/mbamusic
CEO at Sync In The City
Owner / Director at Rotolight.com
Owner at Planet Video Systems Ltd
see less
Past
Creative Director. at Avex Inc
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2013 @ 1:04am

I emailed them explaining the Streisand effect. I hope they listen because not one person or company has came remotely close to winning. In the end it's the same, when they're tired of being embarrassed & ridiculed by the internet they'll finally say sorry and/or let it go.

I have a feeling they're going to play the game a little longer. Oh well at least it provides some good entertainment lol.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
audiomagi (profile), 3 Aug 2013 @ 3:36am

Re: Genesis?
I think you are referring to products developed and sold by a company called Vari-Lite: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vari-Lite
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2013 @ 5:12am

Re: Miranda and the Streisand Effect
But then we would catch less of these asshats being assholes. I like knowing what companies are operated by assholes so I can avoid enriching them.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2013 @ 5:18am

Re:
Sorry is not sufficient, criminal prosecution and conviction for purgery would be a good first step towards redemption.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
antymat, 3 Aug 2013 @ 12:05pm

No.
It is just so much more funny that way :).
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Jeff, 3 Aug 2013 @ 12:40pm

Ouch
Well, I bet they will lose a lot of business with this terrible behavior.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2013 @ 7:36pm

How do you feel about censorship here on TD
It would seem TD is not opposed to censorship either, care to comment ?? or would you prefer to censor to stifle open debate ?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2013 @ 9:45pm

Re: How do you feel about censorship here on TD
Debates require coherence. You don't have that.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
jjmcubed (profile), 3 Aug 2013 @ 9:55pm

Re: How do you feel about censorship here on TD
The only censorship I agree with is if it is done to blathering idiots that bring nothing to the article. Or if they just want to bash the author in some misguided quest to "expose the wrong". Either way it seems to apply to you.
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Anonymous Coward, 4 Aug 2013 @ 12:11am

Re: How do you feel about censorship here on TD
Clean up Australia first, darryl. Your government encourages you to cheat at geolocation for cheaper Adobe.

You come from a den of pirates, darryl. You've no business criticising anyone.

Go fuck a solar panel.
[ link to this | view in thread ]