Blackmail/extortion, theft, character assassination....
So far it appears that the only actual anti-terrorist activities of the NSA is to track the cell phones of known members of foreign anti-american organizations so that Obama can have his crack joy-stick pilots fly drones into whatever building the cell phone happens to reside, in the hopes that their target will be among the corpses of those killed in the building - basically anti-terrorist terrorism.
All the rest of their time and effort and expense (paid for by American tax payers) is concerned with spying on, extorting and destroying the reputations and lives of Americans they don't like and foreign allies, stealing corporate secrets, and running errands for the entertainment industry.
One has to ask the question: who does the NSA really work for?
It is obviously not working for Americans, since the "adversary" it is attacking most often happens to be American citizens.
hmmm - didn't our ancestors actually believe at one point that diseases were caused by aethers(sp?) entering the body - same sort of spiritual ephemeral matter that ghosts are supposed to be composed of... wasn't that the reason that some "healers" used a candle under a glass laid upon the chest? To suck out the aethers... you could say that they thought germs were ghosts in that case.
If VAC is Evil, Gamers do what? Demand less security??
" social engineering might be a cheaper way to attack the system than continuing the code arms race"
While this explanation sounds legitimate on the surface, I would like to know exactly how "social engineering" - ie making folks distrust VAC and Valve via scare stories about snooping on clients habits, is in any way effective in making cheating easier, or in making cheat coding easier or more effective for the cheaters.
Its not as if the non-cheating gamers are going to go elsewhere to play where security is less stringent, or demand that VAC be made less effective against cheaters.
The users of these anti-cheat policing system game-shops have no say whatsoever in how the security wares operate - I would guess that most of the users are unaware of the anti-cheat system software altogether, or at least are generally unconcerned about it.
How would attacking people's trust in the system make it easier to cheat the system, or easier to write better cheat codes to game the system??
I just don't see the connection that Newell is trying to make here, nor does he spell it out at all in his post. He simply makes the claim and leaves it at that.
Call me overly suspicious, but I can't help but wonder how much this decision by the members of the New Zealand appeals court had to do with email, telephone, snail-mail and travel surveillance by the NSA.
And you wondered what they were collecting all that data for if they were not after terrorists... wonder no more.
and we know the Fed never listens to the demands of terrorists...
Methinks we have just been told, in a round-about way, that absolutely nothing that the US public says or does will have any effect on the way the Fed does what it does... ever, unless its to demand "more of the same".
I would say that this is - in a round-about way - an admission that the US Fed is now simply a department of USA Inc., under the Joint Chiefs of Commerce.
It has pretty much admitted that it will, from here on in, only listen to and consider as valid, commentary and actions by citizens who support its actions 100%.
Anyone who considers the actions of the Fed to be anything but perfect is considered to be an adversary or terrorist and is "on the list".
“Now, we’re all familiar with Congress’ most dramatic oversight failure,” said Ben Wizner, the director of the American Civil Liberties Union Speech, Privacy & Technology Project and a legal adviser to Snowden, in a recent debate over Snowden with R. James Woolsey, a former director of the Central Intelligence Agency. “And this was in the notorious exchange between Sen. Ron Wyden and Director of National Intelligence James Clapper. Wyden had asked, did the NSA collect any type of data on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans? Clapper’s answer was, ‘No, sir.’ Now, this brazen falsehood is most often described as Clapper’s lie to Congress, but that’s not what it was. Wyden knew that Clapper was lying. Only we didn’t know. And Congress lacked the courage to correct the record—allowed us to be deceived by the director of national intelligence.”
Not much that one can do if the law of the land prevents criminals from facing prosecution and prevents investigators from disclosing evidence. Methinks it might be a good idea to also remember that these laws were created by the Legislative Branch with "apparently" the best of intentions, but were in reality designed to protect the guilty. Its simply another "for the children" fake-out.
I don't think any Branch of the US government is working for the people any more, no matter how much a few individuals appear to be trying to expose the crooks in office.
"A lot of these are about Senator Ron Wyden trying to expose the intelligence agencies..."
According to what I've read, Wyden and Udall and perhaps others were actually aware of what was going on behind the scenes, and suspicious of much of what is now being called illegal and unconstitutional activities, but their hands were tied because of the gag order they agreed to when taking the position they hold. Their efforts were extremely limited by the laws which were; and still are, actually protecting the rogue agencies from exposure.
However, I remember nothing about their attempts to expose the NSA criminal activities prior to Snowden's document leak. If they were indeed attempting to get the agency investigated pre-Snowden, they must have been doing so through standard channels - which as we have all now seen, was a total waste of time and energy, since that route is populated entirely by cover-up specialists, NSA and Surveillance State cheerleaders and repeat deceivers like Feinstein.
"It's part of the judicial branch."
I had not realized that the Judicial Branch was separate from the Legislative Branch.
How many branches of government are there?? Can you list them for me, or post a link that does?
"The issue is "drones", so the question still stands. Provide a specific instance where innocents were purposely targeted without any high value individual know or strongly and reasonably suspected to be within the targeted group."
Methinks you just admitted that innocents are purposely targeted.
"suspected to be within the targeted group."
Those are your words. The suspected terrorist, in your scenario, only needs to be reasonably expected to be among the targeted "others", for those "others" to be considered as acceptable collateral damage.
Since there is obviously no way to know who all of those "others" are, that group can and must often, if not always, contain "targeted innocent civilians".
Under such conditions and especially since we now know that the targeting process itself is entirely done through collected cell-phone meta-data by the NSA, which only points to the probability of a single individual's cell phone being "within the targeted group" inside the blast radius, it is my opinion that EVERY DRONE ATTACK deliberately targets all innocents within the explosive radius, in the hopes that one of the people killed "in the targeted group" is the individual the US Federal Government Assassins want killed.
It is by far the most cowardly, and most expensive form of mass-murder I've ever heard of. Methinks Hitler would be proud. Godwin be damned.
Since I see no effort by the Legislative Branch of government to do anything about the runaway Executive Branch, I assume they are getting their extra pay from the same source.
Until such time as the Legislative Branch of government decides to actually do their job, I will continue to view them as merely another gang of rich dudes feeding at the public trough while depositing their graft checks in the offshore account for that retirement in Switzerland.
I'm curious however as to what you mean by;
"It's members of the legislative branch that have helped bring that problem to light."
I had assumed that the only light being brought to bear on this was from Snowden.
Is the FISA court not a part of the Legislative Branch??
Please explain how a set of laws that have a separate and different interpretation made in secret by the same lawmakers that created the original laws in the first place, is NOT a set of laws made in secret.
I must have missed something there.
As to it becoming quite clear, you may also notice that my comments are easily ignored. :)
Most of the visible Republican Party members are kept in the dark about most of this also, simply to insure that the truly rabid ones who hate blacks and democrats and the poor get to spew their best vitriol without interference. This also insures that every step Obama takes will be met with a wall of irate republicans, truly sincere in their hatred and anger.
This is primarily a corporate program, but includes people from both parties - mostly leaders - as well as numerous members of american and multinational corporations.
"It's not as though they can secretly work together to pass legislation without anybody finding out about it while publicly looking as though they're at loggerheads."
And why specifically is that impossible?
All it would take is the simple rule that all such negotiations take place at one of the private millionaires clubs that dot the country-side. Its easier to get into Fort Knox with a bazooka than it is to breach security at one of these places. And if everyone involved in the negotiations will profit from the successful outcome of these plans, who would tell the public??
You should also take into account the propensity of politicians to propose helpful sounding legislation - "for the kids" - that once enacted, can be re-interpreted to provide another means for millionaires to become billionaires.
You can probably now understand why I seldom receive positive responses. :)
"why are they fighting to block every single thing he's trying to do?"
Its really simple actually.
First however, note how often their efforts have succeeded in actually blocking anything Obama has proposed.
Now consider for a moment how it would look if the Republican Party DID NOT "appear" to be blocking Obama - a Black Democrat - at every step.
Its called showbiz.
Everything Obama has done may not be in the best interest of all the members of the Republican Party, but it is certainly in the best interest of the corporations that financed Obama's rise to the throne.
Actually, I was thinking more along the lines that by filing so many fake DMCA takedowns that the number of persons involved would preclude charges being laid, while insuring that a bit of public information on the subject might reach the media and thereby embarrass the government into policing the system properly.
I'd think that if 200,000+ individual DMCA notices were filed against abusers like Disney, Warner Bros, and their ilk, over a one week period, it would be obvious that it was simply the public trying to send a message.
If it failed to make Law Enforcement and the Courts start to do their jobs, perhaps it would at least send the message to the abusers that the tables can be turned if they continue to abuse the system.
I have to admit though, that the rogue US Fed is now so unpredictable that it might just arrest and incarcerate half a million US citizens, simply to protect the DMCA system and its abusers - many of whom appear to be pulling the strings of government from behind the scenes.
It is indeed difficult to play poker with a cheat who holds all the cards.
Although I do not remember which TechDirt article it was in, I do recall a comment by Obama that he was unaware of something that was done by some branch of government. In response to that comment and the posts that followed, a forum-stuffer demanded we all understand that the President cannot possibly know what every government employee was up to. Naturally, nobody had mentioned at any point that he should, or could be aware of every government "employee".
Mister Obama is little more than the best man for the job, and the job is to "convince" the American Public that everything is just fine and that there is no need for them to get upset, or involved, and that they should go back to the football game and get a fresh beer.
He was selected for the position of POTUS by the Billioniares Cartel because he's rich, so his loyalties are to those who rule, and because he's black and would fool all the blacks into cheering for him, so the results of the election fix could be blamed on them, and because he is an orator of the highest quality and can talk the skin off a snake.
The Republicans knew that they could not convince the public that the vote process wasn't fixed if they selected one of their own as next POTUS, so they simply ran their selection as a democrat.
If you go back to the days of his first running for office and look at who was funding his campaign, you will find mostly republican donations.
I suspect that after 9/11, the fascists began a simple blackmail campaign to insure that the Democrats would play ball their way. Nothing like receiving night-time pictures in the mail of your kids in their own beds with armed men in masks standing over them, to scare the bejeezus out of any parent.
Obama has literally concluded all of the projects that George Bush Junior and Senior had begun.
In my opinion, he is nothing more than a con-man hired to finish the process of re-writing American laws to suit the multi-national billionaires who currently operate the USA like a business, allowing them to strip America of its wealth in broad daylight with the blessing of the new laws and the courts.
Nothing that has happened in the last 5 years has altered that opinion, but everything that has happened in the last five years has fortified that opinion.
"So... do you have any reading material for number 2?"
Do you mean like an email from POTUS claiming he knew all about it or that he personally ordered it done??
Nope. I'm not on his mailing list.
But I'm sure if you wait long enough, Snowden will post something incriminating concerning this action, written by the Prez his-self.
Why? Do you have an email or document that proves he did not participate in, or know about this action??
If the opposite scenario - the one you seem to desire - is true, and he was oblivious to the actions of the IRS, then he is far more likely what I've been saying all along - just another corporate employee - who has no idea what the other branches of government are doing and no control at all over what his employers decide to do in his name.
What I like to refer to as "The President Select", or the CEO of Public Relations for Amerika Inc..
Certinly they need'nt be nefarious, in a world where government members are honest people working for the betterment of the people of their respective nations.
That however has nothing to do with the reality of the situation when dealing with actual real life people in real life cases, right here on earth, where closed door negotiations are carried out to prevent the public from knowing what is being done in their name.
============
"Paranoia breeds paranoia."
Says you. Care to post a reference to this silly "factoid"?
=============
"If states have to negotiate in public, they won't negotiate."
Then they're negotiating with criminal intent, else they would have no problems with the public watching them. Honest states have no problems negotiating in public.
=============
"If they don't negotiate, they will bicker."
Oh dear! Bicker! Mustn't have our governments bickering! Quick, get the public out of the room, so the crooks can make their deals safely!!! That is the silliest comment so far, but I'll bet you can do better.
===============
"If they bicker, they will arm."
These "outofyourass" assumptions are getting sillier. Just in case you really do live in a box on the moon, states are always armed. No bickering needed.
======================
"If there's arms races, said states will use said arms."
Oh certainly. After all, just look at how many nuclear wars we have had so far since the start of the Nuclear Arms Race.
=================
"Even pre-emptively strike. (now who's paranoid)"
Pre-emptively strike...., you mean like strike before they get armed or before they start an arms race???....and, yeah, with an outlook on the world like the one you just posted, methinks you would have to be paranoid, neurotic, or simply suffering from a sports injury to the head.
Thankfully, the rest of us don't live on Barsoom. But thanks anyway, I needed a good laugh.
On the post: New Snowden Doc Reveals How GCHQ/NSA Use The Internet To 'Manipulate, Deceive And Destroy Reputations'
Re:
On the post: New Snowden Doc Reveals How GCHQ/NSA Use The Internet To 'Manipulate, Deceive And Destroy Reputations'
Blackmail/extortion, theft, character assassination....
All the rest of their time and effort and expense (paid for by American tax payers) is concerned with spying on, extorting and destroying the reputations and lives of Americans they don't like and foreign allies, stealing corporate secrets, and running errands for the entertainment industry.
One has to ask the question: who does the NSA really work for?
It is obviously not working for Americans, since the "adversary" it is attacking most often happens to be American citizens.
On the post: Awesome Stuff: Everything Old Is New Again
Re: Re:
On the post: Valve: No, Our Gaming Anti-Cheat System Isn't Tracking Your Voracious Porn Habits
If VAC is Evil, Gamers do what? Demand less security??
While this explanation sounds legitimate on the surface, I would like to know exactly how "social engineering" - ie making folks distrust VAC and Valve via scare stories about snooping on clients habits, is in any way effective in making cheating easier, or in making cheat coding easier or more effective for the cheaters.
Its not as if the non-cheating gamers are going to go elsewhere to play where security is less stringent, or demand that VAC be made less effective against cheaters.
The users of these anti-cheat policing system game-shops have no say whatsoever in how the security wares operate - I would guess that most of the users are unaware of the anti-cheat system software altogether, or at least are generally unconcerned about it.
How would attacking people's trust in the system make it easier to cheat the system, or easier to write better cheat codes to game the system??
I just don't see the connection that Newell is trying to make here, nor does he spell it out at all in his post. He simply makes the claim and leaves it at that.
On the post: Appeals Court Reverses Previous Decision That Found Warrants Used In Kim Dotcom's Arrest 'Invalid'
all the mail that's fit to steal...
And you wondered what they were collecting all that data for if they were not after terrorists... wonder no more.
On the post: NSA Targets Pirate Bay And Wikileaks Despite 'Inadvertent' Collection Of US Data According To Latest Leak
On the list...
and we know the Fed never listens to the demands of terrorists...
Methinks we have just been told, in a round-about way, that absolutely nothing that the US public says or does will have any effect on the way the Fed does what it does... ever, unless its to demand "more of the same".
I would say that this is - in a round-about way - an admission that the US Fed is now simply a department of USA Inc., under the Joint Chiefs of Commerce.
It has pretty much admitted that it will, from here on in, only listen to and consider as valid, commentary and actions by citizens who support its actions 100%.
Anyone who considers the actions of the Fed to be anything but perfect is considered to be an adversary or terrorist and is "on the list".
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
when the branch breaks
“Now, we’re all familiar with Congress’ most dramatic oversight failure,” said Ben Wizner, the director of the American Civil Liberties Union Speech, Privacy & Technology Project and a legal adviser to Snowden, in a recent debate over Snowden with R. James Woolsey, a former director of the Central Intelligence Agency. “And this was in the notorious exchange between Sen. Ron Wyden and Director of National Intelligence James Clapper. Wyden had asked, did the NSA collect any type of data on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans? Clapper’s answer was, ‘No, sir.’ Now, this brazen falsehood is most often described as Clapper’s lie to Congress, but that’s not what it was. Wyden knew that Clapper was lying. Only we didn’t know. And Congress lacked the courage to correct the record—allowed us to be deceived by the director of national intelligence.”
Written by Chris Hedges
==================================================
Not much that one can do if the law of the land prevents criminals from facing prosecution and prevents investigators from disclosing evidence. Methinks it might be a good idea to also remember that these laws were created by the Legislative Branch with "apparently" the best of intentions, but were in reality designed to protect the guilty. Its simply another "for the children" fake-out.
I don't think any Branch of the US government is working for the people any more, no matter how much a few individuals appear to be trying to expose the crooks in office.
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Zillionaire's Club
According to what I've read, Wyden and Udall and perhaps others were actually aware of what was going on behind the scenes, and suspicious of much of what is now being called illegal and unconstitutional activities, but their hands were tied because of the gag order they agreed to when taking the position they hold. Their efforts were extremely limited by the laws which were; and still are, actually protecting the rogue agencies from exposure.
However, I remember nothing about their attempts to expose the NSA criminal activities prior to Snowden's document leak. If they were indeed attempting to get the agency investigated pre-Snowden, they must have been doing so through standard channels - which as we have all now seen, was a total waste of time and energy, since that route is populated entirely by cover-up specialists, NSA and Surveillance State cheerleaders and repeat deceivers like Feinstein.
"It's part of the judicial branch."
I had not realized that the Judicial Branch was separate from the Legislative Branch.
How many branches of government are there?? Can you list them for me, or post a link that does?
On the post: Rep. Mike Rogers Angry That 'Red Tape' Is Preventing More Drone Bombings Of Innocent People
Re: Re: Re: High Tech Mass Murder
Methinks you just admitted that innocents are purposely targeted.
"suspected to be within the targeted group."
Those are your words. The suspected terrorist, in your scenario, only needs to be reasonably expected to be among the targeted "others", for those "others" to be considered as acceptable collateral damage.
Since there is obviously no way to know who all of those "others" are, that group can and must often, if not always, contain "targeted innocent civilians".
Under such conditions and especially since we now know that the targeting process itself is entirely done through collected cell-phone meta-data by the NSA, which only points to the probability of a single individual's cell phone being "within the targeted group" inside the blast radius, it is my opinion that EVERY DRONE ATTACK deliberately targets all innocents within the explosive radius, in the hopes that one of the people killed "in the targeted group" is the individual the US Federal Government Assassins want killed.
It is by far the most cowardly, and most expensive form of mass-murder I've ever heard of.
Methinks Hitler would be proud.
Godwin be damned.
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
Re: Re: Re: Re: The Zillionaire's Club
I make no distinction between the two.
Since I see no effort by the Legislative Branch of government to do anything about the runaway Executive Branch, I assume they are getting their extra pay from the same source.
Until such time as the Legislative Branch of government decides to actually do their job, I will continue to view them as merely another gang of rich dudes feeding at the public trough while depositing their graft checks in the offshore account for that retirement in Switzerland.
I'm curious however as to what you mean by;
"It's members of the legislative branch that have helped bring that problem to light."
I had assumed that the only light being brought to bear on this was from Snowden.
Is the FISA court not a part of the Legislative Branch??
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
Re: Re: The Zillionaire's Club
I must have missed something there.
As to it becoming quite clear, you may also notice that my comments are easily ignored. :)
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
Addendum.
This is primarily a corporate program, but includes people from both parties - mostly leaders - as well as numerous members of american and multinational corporations.
It is in effect, a business venture.
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
Re: Re: A really good actor
Have you ever heard of a group called A.L.E.C.?
The actual meaning of the abbreviation escapes me at the moment.
GOOGLE it. :)
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
The Zillionaire's Club
And why specifically is that impossible?
All it would take is the simple rule that all such negotiations take place at one of the private millionaires clubs that dot the country-side. Its easier to get into Fort Knox with a bazooka than it is to breach security at one of these places. And if everyone involved in the negotiations will profit from the successful outcome of these plans, who would tell the public??
You should also take into account the propensity of politicians to propose helpful sounding legislation - "for the kids" - that once enacted, can be re-interpreted to provide another means for millionaires to become billionaires.
You can probably now understand why I seldom receive positive responses. :)
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
Smoke and Mirrors
Its really simple actually.
First however, note how often their efforts have succeeded in actually blocking anything Obama has proposed.
Now consider for a moment how it would look if the Republican Party DID NOT "appear" to be blocking Obama - a Black Democrat - at every step.
Its called showbiz.
Everything Obama has done may not be in the best interest of all the members of the Republican Party, but it is certainly in the best interest of the corporations that financed Obama's rise to the throne.
On the post: What The DMCA System Is NOT For: Shutting Down Twitter Accounts You Don't Like And Sending Anonymous Tips
Re: Re: Public Action
I'd think that if 200,000+ individual DMCA notices were filed against abusers like Disney, Warner Bros, and their ilk, over a one week period, it would be obvious that it was simply the public trying to send a message.
If it failed to make Law Enforcement and the Courts start to do their jobs, perhaps it would at least send the message to the abusers that the tables can be turned if they continue to abuse the system.
I have to admit though, that the rogue US Fed is now so unpredictable that it might just arrest and incarcerate half a million US citizens, simply to protect the DMCA system and its abusers - many of whom appear to be pulling the strings of government from behind the scenes.
It is indeed difficult to play poker with a cheat who holds all the cards.
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
A really good actor
I'm unaccustomed to positive responses. :)
Although I do not remember which TechDirt article it was in, I do recall a comment by Obama that he was unaware of something that was done by some branch of government. In response to that comment and the posts that followed, a forum-stuffer demanded we all understand that the President cannot possibly know what every government employee was up to. Naturally, nobody had mentioned at any point that he should, or could be aware of every government "employee".
Mister Obama is little more than the best man for the job, and the job is to "convince" the American Public that everything is just fine and that there is no need for them to get upset, or involved, and that they should go back to the football game and get a fresh beer.
He was selected for the position of POTUS by the Billioniares Cartel because he's rich, so his loyalties are to those who rule, and because he's black and would fool all the blacks into cheering for him, so the results of the election fix could be blamed on them, and because he is an orator of the highest quality and can talk the skin off a snake.
The Republicans knew that they could not convince the public that the vote process wasn't fixed if they selected one of their own as next POTUS, so they simply ran their selection as a democrat.
If you go back to the days of his first running for office and look at who was funding his campaign, you will find mostly republican donations.
I suspect that after 9/11, the fascists began a simple blackmail campaign to insure that the Democrats would play ball their way. Nothing like receiving night-time pictures in the mail of your kids in their own beds with armed men in masks standing over them, to scare the bejeezus out of any parent.
Obama has literally concluded all of the projects that George Bush Junior and Senior had begun.
In my opinion, he is nothing more than a con-man hired to finish the process of re-writing American laws to suit the multi-national billionaires who currently operate the USA like a business, allowing them to strip America of its wealth in broad daylight with the blessing of the new laws and the courts.
Nothing that has happened in the last 5 years has altered that opinion, but everything that has happened in the last five years has fortified that opinion.
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
Re: Re: Re: picky picky....
You mean like TPP? :)
On the post: GCHQ Has Entire Program For 'Dirty Tricks' Including Honeypots, Using Journalists, Deleting Online Accounts
Re: Re: picky picky....
"So... do you have any reading material for number 2?"
Do you mean like an email from POTUS claiming he knew all about it or that he personally ordered it done??
Nope. I'm not on his mailing list.
But I'm sure if you wait long enough, Snowden will post something incriminating concerning this action, written by the Prez his-self.
Why? Do you have an email or document that proves he did not participate in, or know about this action??
If the opposite scenario - the one you seem to desire - is true, and he was oblivious to the actions of the IRS, then he is far more likely what I've been saying all along - just another corporate employee - who has no idea what the other branches of government are doing and no control at all over what his employers decide to do in his name.
What I like to refer to as "The President Select", or the CEO of Public Relations for Amerika Inc..
On the post: USTR Finally Realizing Its All Encompassing Secrecy May Be A Problem, Calls Frantic Meeting For All 'Cleared' Lobbyists
re: nigh eve it tay
Certinly they need'nt be nefarious, in a world where government members are honest people working for the betterment of the people of their respective nations.
That however has nothing to do with the reality of the situation when dealing with actual real life people in real life cases, right here on earth, where closed door negotiations are carried out to prevent the public from knowing what is being done in their name.
============
"Paranoia breeds paranoia."
Says you. Care to post a reference to this silly "factoid"?
=============
"If states have to negotiate in public, they won't negotiate."
Then they're negotiating with criminal intent, else they would have no problems with the public watching them. Honest states have no problems negotiating in public.
=============
"If they don't negotiate, they will bicker."
Oh dear! Bicker! Mustn't have our governments bickering!
Quick, get the public out of the room, so the crooks can make their deals safely!!! That is the silliest comment so far, but I'll bet you can do better.
===============
"If they bicker, they will arm."
These "outofyourass" assumptions are getting sillier.
Just in case you really do live in a box on the moon, states are always armed. No bickering needed.
======================
"If there's arms races, said states will use said arms."
Oh certainly. After all, just look at how many nuclear wars we have had so far since the start of the Nuclear Arms Race.
=================
"Even pre-emptively strike. (now who's paranoid)"
Pre-emptively strike...., you mean like strike before they get armed or before they start an arms race???....and, yeah, with an outlook on the world like the one you just posted, methinks you would have to be paranoid, neurotic, or simply suffering from a sports injury to the head.
Thankfully, the rest of us don't live on Barsoom.
But thanks anyway, I needed a good laugh.
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