At the end of the video he had DELIBERATELY RUN OVER someone ... quite a bit more provocation there don't you think? And let's put it in perspective .. yes he got beat up, no it was not justified ... but he went home with minor injuries and they guy re ran over is likely crippled for life.
Angry mob of criminals? Is this an ex post facto determination? Or are you making the same knee-jerk assumption that Mr Lien evidently did ... that they're bikers ergo they must be criminals.
Moving violations in traffic is hardly criminal (or everyone who drives is a criminal!) and riding a motorcycle is not a crime either
And what point in the video (time index please!!) did it become "clear" he was going to be forced out of his vehicle?
Nope same one i'm guessing, since that's exactly what I saw too, the guy on the bike was being a careless, cretinous, dick, no question and undoubtedly deserved getting knocked on his ass for his stupidity.
I said Mr. Lien hit the motorcycle, which he did. I never once implied or stated that it was Mr Lien fault. His fault comes after the initial accident (caused by the dick on the bike!) when he saw the other guys approaching, panicked & deliberately ran over one of them.
The reasonable response in his position would have been to throw the truck in park and jump out to see if the guy was injured, call the police and report the accident. If he's feeling really intimidated, then close the windows, lock the doors and call the police, don't flee the scene, running over people in the process.
ever think that Lien (ha a banker named Lien - too funny) escalated the situation to the point of violence by DRIVING OVER a person ??
He didn't just "drive away" ... he was involved in a traffic accident (rear-ended a motorcycle - all things considered possibly not his fault) then overreacted to the natural response of the other members of the group by DRIVING OVER one of the guys that stopped to help his friend (that was hit), precipitating a violent response by some of the rest of the group.
Based on what he KNEW at the time that he PERMANENTLY CRIPPLED a dude, he was as far out of line as the guys that beat him up (possibly more so) ... and consider, Lien was treated for minor injuries and released ... the guy he RAN OVER who did NOTHING WRONG is in critical condition and will likely never walk again.
So you've jumped to a conclusion (that the bikers intent was initially intimidation) and used that conclusion to justify assault with a deadly weapon (SUV).
Tell me if I was walking down the street and you and a bunch of your male relatives came up from behind me and surrounded me as you passed (i walk pretty slow!), would it be ok if I assumed you (Mr. Tanaka & associates) were a Yakuza gang and reacted to protect myself by pulling out my (CCW) 9mm semi-auto and gunning you all down ? Would that be ok ?
Lucky for you. in my mind feeling intimidated is not justification for assault...
So from what I saw in the video ... a bunch of guys on bikes passed and surrounded the Liens' SUV, one of those bikers slowed down and was hit by the SUV( let's not play semantic games here ... being "tapped" by an SUV when on a motorcycle transfers more than enough kinetic energy to knock the bike over and injure the rider!). The group stopped (reportedly to help the fallen rider), and Mr Lien panicked and DROVE OVER the biker that stopped in front of him and fled the scene.
Regardless of what happened after this, Mr. Liens' action was not justified by the circumstances, he should be charged at the very least with fleeing the scene of an accident, more likely hit and run, and if there was any justice, aggravated assault.
Justifying it by saying that he was surrounded by a "gang of bikers" is like justifying gunning down an unarmed African American teenager because you were surrounded by a gang of African American teenagers.
Now don't get me wrong ... while i understand the motivation s of the men that assaulted Mr. Lien (and even empathize to a certain extent) his actions by no means justify their actions ... but six+ bikers are being charged and 0 bankers!! That's "justice" in America today ?
Now spool forward a decade or so and imagine a Director of the NSA, a charismatic 'securocrat' imbued with a mission to protect the United States from terrorists and whatever other threats happen to be current at the time....
Actually rewind 1 year and then tell me that lawmakers(at least those "in the know") are not as scared of that person as their predecessors were of Hoover. Sure explains the NSA defenders and apologists, don't you think ?
According to traditional religious perspective ...
is all about your soul ... not society.
if it harms your soul it's sin. Thinking "impure" thoughts harms your soul, Indulging in fantasies of killing harms your soul... so these things are sins. This is why they burned witches at the stake ... not for the good of society but for the purification of their souls ... so that they would go to Heaven.
So in a traditional religious sense that religious nutbag is correct.
calls them apostates and heretics ... and treats them more savagely than the ignorant pagans because the heretics and apostates are far more likely to erode the established support of the one true religion ... be it Islam, Christianity, Liberalism or Conservatism ...
for essentially political reasons, the US government chose to sit on the bulk of it's oil reserves, choosing instead to exploit the oil reserves of others that had no other exportable resources.
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
Re:
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
Re: Re: I'm curious ...
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
Re: Re: I'm curious ...
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
Re: Re: Self defense
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
Re: Re: Re:
Moving violations in traffic is hardly criminal (or everyone who drives is a criminal!) and riding a motorcycle is not a crime either
And what point in the video (time index please!!) did it become "clear" he was going to be forced out of his vehicle?
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
I'm curious ...
I said Mr. Lien hit the motorcycle, which he did. I never once implied or stated that it was Mr Lien fault. His fault comes after the initial accident (caused by the dick on the bike!) when he saw the other guys approaching, panicked & deliberately ran over one of them.
The reasonable response in his position would have been to throw the truck in park and jump out to see if the guy was injured, call the police and report the accident. If he's feeling really intimidated, then close the windows, lock the doors and call the police, don't flee the scene, running over people in the process.
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
Re:
He didn't just "drive away" ... he was involved in a traffic accident (rear-ended a motorcycle - all things considered possibly not his fault) then overreacted to the natural response of the other members of the group by DRIVING OVER one of the guys that stopped to help his friend (that was hit), precipitating a violent response by some of the rest of the group.
Based on what he KNEW at the time that he PERMANENTLY CRIPPLED a dude, he was as far out of line as the guys that beat him up (possibly more so) ... and consider, Lien was treated for minor injuries and released ... the guy he RAN OVER who did NOTHING WRONG is in critical condition and will likely never walk again.
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
Re:
Tell me if I was walking down the street and you and a bunch of your male relatives came up from behind me and surrounded me as you passed (i walk pretty slow!), would it be ok if I assumed you (Mr. Tanaka & associates) were a Yakuza gang and reacted to protect myself by pulling out my (CCW) 9mm semi-auto and gunning you all down ? Would that be ok ?
Lucky for you. in my mind feeling intimidated is not justification for assault...
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
Re: Re: I'm curious ...
Regardless of what happened after this, Mr. Liens' action was not justified by the circumstances, he should be charged at the very least with fleeing the scene of an accident, more likely hit and run, and if there was any justice, aggravated assault.
Justifying it by saying that he was surrounded by a "gang of bikers" is like justifying gunning down an unarmed African American teenager because you were surrounded by a gang of African American teenagers.
Now don't get me wrong ... while i understand the motivation s of the men that assaulted Mr. Lien (and even empathize to a certain extent) his actions by no means justify their actions ... but six+ bikers are being charged and 0 bankers!! That's "justice" in America today ?
God help us!!
On the post: Off-Duty NYC Cops Watched, Participated In Assault Of SUV Driver By Enraged Bikers
I'm curious ...
On the post: Ohio Zombie-Man Confirmed Dead By The Court He Personally Attended
probably not
On the post: Ohio Zombie-Man Confirmed Dead By The Court He Personally Attended
More to the point
On the post: James Clapper Says 'Peace Of Mind' Trumps Effectiveness In Evaluating NSA Surveillance
how the hell is James Clapper still employed as the Director of National Intelligence?
On the post: Charles Carreon Finally Drops Appeal, Admits Whole Thing Was Dumb... But Still Blaming Pretty Much Everyone Else
Re: Re:
On the post: NY Times Doesn't Think That NSA Sharing Raw Communications With Israel Is Newsworthy
if it bleeds it leads ...
The lack of any oversight on the use of data collected by the NSA isn't news any more ... it's just information now.
The NYT knows it's important to share this info with the... Squirrel!!
On the post: Why The NSA Must Be Reined In -- For Democracy's Sake
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Actually rewind 1 year and then tell me that lawmakers(at least those "in the know") are not as scared of that person as their predecessors were of Hoover. Sure explains the NSA defenders and apologists, don't you think ?
On the post: Pat Robertson: Murder Committed In Video Games Is No Different Than Real Life Murder
According to traditional religious perspective ...
if it harms your soul it's sin. Thinking "impure" thoughts harms your soul, Indulging in fantasies of killing harms your soul... so these things are sins. This is why they burned witches at the stake ... not for the good of society but for the purification of their souls ... so that they would go to Heaven.
So in a traditional religious sense that religious nutbag is correct.
On the post: Now That The Intelligence Community Got Away With Lying, How Can You Trust Anything They Say?
Re:
On the post: Staffers For Rep. Mike Rogers Apparently Claim They Could Sue Me For Defamation
The church has always done that ...
On the post: Ecuador Tells US To Take Its Trade Agreement And Shove It, After Threats Relayed Over Snowden
The United States imports oil because...
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