Congressman Angry At The Daily Show For Sharing His Views On Video Games
from the in-the-ghetto... dept
Last month, we noted that politicians from both parties were getting together for some unconstitutional election-year fun, in blaming violent video games for all sorts of youth problems (conveniently ignoring, of course, that youth violence continues to drop as these games get more popular). The Daily Show had a spot on segment pointing out some of the more ridiculous statements from some of the politicians. Now, Dual writes in to point out that one of the Congressman called out by Jon Stewart, Joseph Pitts of Pennsylvania, is angry at the Daily Show and Comedy Central for the way they "portrayed" his words. The problem, though, is that all the Daily Show really does is let the Congressman speak for himself, suggesting that inner city kids are less able to tell the difference between video games and reality, but that "a wealthy kid from the suburbs" would have no problem recognizing it's just a video game. In fact, they let him speak for quite some time, and his words are pretty clear. It's hard to see how his words were portrayed incorrectly. In complaining about it, he then goes on to say that various tragedies, such as Columbine, help prove his point that these video games are a problem. Of course, as has been pointed out repeatedly, the problem here isn't video games, but children with serious problems. It's not the video games that make children do bad things. Most people understand the difference between reality and video games. People who can't separate the two have much bigger problems than what type of video game they're playing. Whether or not Jon Stewart portrayed this Congressman's words out of context, it seems Joseph Pitts has no clue what he's talking about -- but that won't stop him from trying to pass some legislation on the matter.Thank you for reading this Techdirt post. With so many things competing for everyone’s attention these days, we really appreciate you giving us your time. We work hard every day to put quality content out there for our community.
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Mumra saw his reflection and was so terrified he fled in fear and hid in his coffin. Whenever something like Columbine happens that is in essence America getting a nice look in the mirror. But instead of dealing with the problem of levels of dysfunction in our culture, we bury our heads in the sand and blame videogames and movies. Damn shame that politicians choose to grandstand on the misery of others and hide their racism in pseudo-intellectualism.
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from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thundercats - "Lion-O - The Lord of the ThunderCats."
Lionel makes toy trains.
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people
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Don't commit violent crimes IRL.
Learn the characters in Thundercats.
Become a well rounded human.
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Of course its Lionel....
Of course it does.. and those new fangled train toys are corrupting our youth and causing them to shoot each other. Columbine proves this
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Life's hard out here
We are far to busy with the whole running-the-counrty thing to be bothered with such trifles as "facts" and "public opinion". It is my job to impose my personal beliefs on the public, especially with constitutional Law.
For a supposed comedy program to make light of my "unconstitutional" political maneuvers by incorrectly failing to mis-quote me, can not be tollerated, and will be reinforced at election time- wait and see who lasts longer Daily Show: you or Democracy.
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Re: Life's hard out here
Maybe you really are a politician .;)
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Re: Re: Life's hard out here
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Re: Life's hard out here
Oh... wait...
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If you've ever played GTA:SA then you would know that this is exactly what happens in the game as well. Now there is an extreemly small posibility that an extreemly sheltered "wealthy kid from the suburbs" might think that running back inside your house would get you safe from the cops but would "a poor kid who lives in a neighborhood where people really do shoot cops" think that the cops couldn't follow you inside?
The only kids might possibly believe GTA:SA for real life are those who have serious mental problems to start with or possibly are victims of the overprotective fervour that these polititions seem to be trying to instill in parents.
Beware the danger of listening to polititons!
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Anyone ever notice
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I'm old and Republican, and strangely enough, I know that video games don't cause you to go out and shoot your classmates, any more than comic books, Rock & Roll, long hair, bell-bottoms, or whatever.
Congressmen are presently looking to pass a law about something so they have something to brag about in their next election campaign. They don't want to handle real issues like illegal immigration until after the campaign because they might lose votes from one demographic or another if they take any effective action.
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How does not being spoonfed entertainment equate to having "no imagination". The definition of imagination is "magination is, in general, the power or process of producing mental images and ideas. The term is technically used in psychology for the process of reviving in the mind percepts of objects formerly given in sense perception. Since this use of the term conflicts with that of ordinary language, some psychologists have preferred to describe this process as "imaging" or "imagery" or to speak of it as "reproductive" as opposed to "productive" or "constructive" imagination" - . That's very different than being fed images, scenarios, thoughts through some external medium. Other than that, I completely agree with your post.
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Actually, he grew up before video games were invented. Many people of his generation have trouble operating an ATM, much less working a game controller.
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even better...
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Re: even better...
yeah, one of them said he loved pong. i'll bet they like to "rock out" to the occasional patsy cline album.
those old rich white guys are totally in touch with todays inner city youth.
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Pundits all around
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Congressman Angry At The Daily Show For Sharing Hi
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People kill people. Regardless of the reasons.
We all have the ability to kill, most of us have even had the desire from time to time (I know I have).
Most haven't.
Why?
Who really knows, but I do know this, a game / movie or other outside influence shouldn't be held against the rest of us because someone with a screw loose goes on a rampage and kills a bunch of people.
People need to stop making excuses for bad behaviour and deal with the bad behaviour.
End of story.
Also, the integrity of all politicians are in question in my book.
Imagine, spending your adult life trying to win a perpetual popularity contest...that shit was supposed to end in grade/high school from what I remember.
No wonder nothing gets resolved, everyone in office is too interested in pleasing everyone that they never do anything of substance.
As food for thought, go back the last 30 years and check out the US presidential election platforms.
NOTHING has changed, so why does everyone blink when a politician talks himself into a stupid position?
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I'm guessing if those kids didn't have some type of gaming system in their house, some type of even game, and had tons of "good wholesome" movies in their house...it would turn into...
"well maybe he was just picked on and bullied around in school!"
Yeah...sure...whatever...
How about Politicians dealing with real things instead of just finding the newest thing and riding the political wave of popularity.
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And I also don't see how someone could deny the fact of being recorded that they are biased from inner city kids who work hard to help their families and themselves to stay alive...as opposed to little kids that are spoiled brats that don't know what it means to appreciate what they have.
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People neglect to look at how violent games and sexual games are in other parts of the world and they don't have the same problem? Why because their justice system isn't a joke and they don't have to come up with some lame excuse for bad behavior.
It isn't about democrats/republicans it is about rich/poor. You have some rich congressmen you wants to feel like he is doing something for the poor so he can sleep well at night.
If anything, all this started going down hill when they took religion out of schools, you have to teach kids morals.
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When video games are outlawed only outlaws....
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Old republicans my ass
Yeah because Hilary Clinton, Joe Liberman, and Jack thompson are all old republicans right?
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Re: Old republicans my ass
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Re: Old republicans my ass
Seriously guys, this isn't a party issue. there are retards on both sides of the aisle griping about the woes of video games.
secondly, senators and congressmen are old. That's what makes them soooo angry at new things that they didn't grow up with. video games are a change from the old ways. change is different. different is scary (for old people). scary is bad. therefore, to old people, video games are bad.
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People are idiots
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Damn Hollywood
i remember when MOVIES were the biggest source of sex and violence.
Now it's all "disney amusement park ride movies" and CGI.
Damn. What ever happened to the good ol' days? American werewolf in London, the Thing, and Bloody Valentine?
Nowadays, you need at least one Premium channel package and to stay up past 11 on a Saturday to see some lame soft porn on Showtime.
--or a high speed internet connection.
THAT'S IT! the INTERNET is to blame!
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the Nanny State
These kids are then labled and slotted into a particular niche. The kids don't understand and do what they are told. The parents don't understand/care and do what they are told. Bobby/Susie is "special" and requires special needs. They are told this enough times that after a while this is all they know and can't or won't break the cycle.
After that little rant, my point is this: politicians want/need to be able to place people in a niche. Once there, they (politicians) can either 1) legislate for/against the symptom or 2) throw money at it. Either way, to the electorate, it APPEARS that they are doing something, when they really aren't doing anything. They aren't looking for the root causes of the issue(s). That's too hard and takes too long to get results.
Another tangent of this is that the gov't believes it knows what's best, for everyone. I am not naive enough to think that I or any one person has all the answers, but what scares me the most is that these people get into positions of power/influence and it's difficult to get them back out.
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Umm.....
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The problem is not that they are highly educated..., it is that we, as voters, don't look at who we are voting for. The recognize a name from a sign we saw on the street, and select them. Unfortunately, we don't take the time to see who these people are and what they stand for, we just go by name recognition. Why do you think Kinky Friedman and Carole Keeton Strayhorn want "Kinky" and "Grandma" on the ballot. It's so people will remember they saw the word "Grandma" somewhere and vote for them.
So basically, we are the idiots that elect the idiots that make these statements.
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When I get in trouble.....
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forgetting
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Inner city kids?
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I'm Frustrated
CJ: Where'd you get that?!
Cesar: Same place I buy my pants holms. This is America.
Also a big part of the game is about a uinderground war on some of the harshest illegal drugs, with the main character on ocasions refusing an offered bong.
I have heard statistics that in the US there is 1 gun for every man, woman and child which is helped along by almost anyone being able to get a licence for a gun. Here in Australia after one masacure about 10 years ago (I believe the man was about 22 - definately not a teenager) there was a huge cutdown on guns and a tightening of restrictions. Now you basically have to be a gun club member (clubs are struggling to maintain membership levels) or a farmer to own a gun. Even then a gun, by law, is required to be stored unloaded in a loched cabnit with any amunition stored in a seperate also locked cabnit. The only people that I know of that own a gun are farmers and I don't have a clue as to where it is kept.
For some strange reason, since this incident we don't seem to had any masacures, I wonder why that is? I know we mustn't play as many computer games! The 24 hour computer gaming night that I go to every 2 months must be the odd one out, they must never have things like that in the cities, only the one in our small country town!
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Re: I'm Frustrated
http://www.geoffmetcalf.com/aus.html
As far as massacres go, were they really that common before the ban?
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Re: I'm Frustrated
http://www.geoffmetcalf.com/aus.html
As far as massacres go, were they really that common before the ban?
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The World
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Voting...
And if voting actually made a difference, I'd agree with you.
Voting is useless for two reasons:
1)How many politicians came around saying exactly what we wanted to hear, promising everything we wanted to have... only to see them not follow through?
"But they won't get re-elected if they do that". And? They're still doing that for the term that they're in office. Anyone else think it wouldn't be unreasonable to see the Parties asking for "suicide players" to step up in support of the agenda and take a career dive if the party promised to support them after? Yeah, it's a little tinfoil-hat-ish, but meh... I can see it happening.
2) The electoral college does not have to cast their vote in accordance to the majority of their state. So every single person in the state could vote for Joe Bob and the EC could cast that state's vote for the other guy. And guess what. There's no legislation that prohibits that from happening.
I'm not saying don't vote. If we don't vote, they will by default. All I'm saying is let's go into this thing with our eyes open. Remember that playing by their rules gets nothing done. So, let's change the rules.
Who else sees a major revolution within the next couple of decades?
... oh and as for the Cheetara comments... ::shudder:: furrys. ;)
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Re: Voting...
Oh, sooner than that, perhaps? How long until we run out of oil? How long until this culture war we're sitting on really gets out of control?
I hope to be lucky enough to live through a revolution in this country, if it really happens. But my only worry is what will be left afterwards - not all revolutions are progressive.
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Really old guy says "I remember when"...
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Re: Really old guy says "I remember when"...
The real cause of teen violence is
1) Lack of parenting.
2) Hormones.
Comics, D&D, Movies, TV, video games are not the cause of violence. I imagine that back in the day there were politicians that wanted to peg societies ills on Billy Shakespeare . I mean most of his plays are violent. Especially that immoral celebrating Hamlet.
Regicide, incest, murder are the big ones with tons of little things like taking back to authority figures, drunkeness, ect.
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voting doesn't matter
the incumbency rate in congress is 98%.
that means that IF you get elected, you are virtually guaranteed re-election.
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no one is listening
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The problem is YOUR congressman IS the problem
If you want to make change in Congress, don't expect others to vote out their Congressmen. Do your part. Don't vote for an incumbent.
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Re: The problem is YOUR congressman IS the problem
Cheers,
Turbo
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goes to show
they think we actually WANT more laws against video games.. they could care less what we want most of the time, ill tell you what, it isnt more laws for DRM, it isnt more laws against stuff like online gambling/gaming..
personally i think there should be laws against half the shit congress does
peices of shit like tom delay, who is actually STILL RUNNING! ofcourse all the laws in the world are worthless if no one actually enforces any of them, there were already laws against Gerrymandering but it didnt stop tom delay.. arent there also laws about conflict of interest issues? i dont know but just about every politician in office right now is a corrupt peice of shit, and the half honest ones are terrriibly out#ed and thus completely impotent
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Video game = simulation = training for reality
The truth is that violent video games impact our perception - kind of like military simulations teach them how to fight/respond with instinct. It is proven fact that part of the brain emotionally percieves the video game as "real" - on a smaller scale than real killings - but the same emotional cores are touched. Over and over and over and over....often by kids with other problems (social isolation, absent parents) that result in their willingness to sit in front of a game all day. And night.
It is not the single most important factor in who loses touch and who doesn't - but it is one factor of many. And as games become more real - the impact on our children's minds becomes more real.
There is a reason the military uses simulations. There is a reason they do it over and over. Eventually it overrides your past training until pulling the trigger becomes automatic (with a strong emphasis on target selection....).
Well what is a video game if not a simulation?
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Constitutional Right?
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Video Game / Reality
Am i mistaken or does the congressman say that poor kids cant tell reality from video games and rich kids can?
Id think the poor city kids would be more likely to have mental problems because of poverty and issues at home than rich kids that barely care.
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If y'all are so goddamned vocal now ...
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Except... that's not even remotely true. Youth violence has continued to drop at somewhat drastic rates over the last decade or so.
It may get more play in the media, but in terms of numbers, you're wrong.
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Want some proof?
Chart showing violent crimes from 1970 to 2004, courtesy of the Bureau of Justice Statistics.
Property crimes over the same period, again from the Bureau of Justice Statistics.
The FBI website also has vast quantities of .pdf files documenting the same general decrease in crime from the 1970s onward.
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Just another scapegoat for what is wrong with kids these days.
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hmm
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Heres a good paper
http://culturalpolicy.uchicago.edu/conf2001/papers/funk1.html
There are always other factors (besides a video game)that would cause a child to commit violent acts.
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(and BTW the columbine kids WERE rich kids from the suburbs)
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What harm would it cause to not sell violent video games to children, whether you believe it to be a cause or not? If a law is created that forces an adult(hopefully the parent) to purchase a video game for the child then what is the problem? If the parent is forced to make the purchase, then we at least accomplish the parent seeing the purchase before the child gets it. Otherwise you are arguing that we should allow kids to purchase violent games because theres no conclusive evidence that it leads to violent behavior. Of course theres no evidence that it hasn't
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Columbine
They were pretty clear in it why they were sick of life and wanted revenge.
Our society looks the other way when children are bullied and taunted into having pretty terrible lives in school, and they couldnt take it anymore.
Obviously no one impressed upon them how worthless all the things you think are important in High School are later on. They obviously felt they had nothing worth living for.
Failure of society or just some fucked up kids?
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What really leads to viloence and crime
Take a kid who's been trying and trying to make things happen for him, but at every turn he gets told his skills are inadequate. His entire life has been nothing but one frustration ordeal after the other. Trying to prove to a society that's so disconnected from reality that his potential is worthwhile to consider. Then to get the cold sholder and his belifes confired by anything in the media. Take this congressmens statement that a poor kid can't make the rational disconnect between ficition and reality simply because he's impoverished, but if you have money then surely you're able to. If a person seriously thinks that mashing a button to enable a script to make the pixles on the screen shift from a guy holding a gun, to a guy killing someone with it is by any means real, then they have a deeper problem than being inspired by a video game to resort to crime or murder.
To be brought up in an area where you have to fight for everything you can get, be it respect or to hold down a job, and constantly being the brunt of iggnorant misclassifcitaions, evnetualy it will lead a person to the point at which frustration trumps rationaity, and the road of conveinece is chosen.
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MAOA gene influenced by "life"
This doesn't mean that urban kids are better/worse than suburban kids. Even though it seems more likely that suburban children get more time with their mothers, most suburban mothers work b/c single-family income isn't possible hardly at all any more.
But it does explain why some kids can play GTA:SA for 72 hours at a time with no obvious social skill damage.
It also explains why some criminals reform, while most are recidivists.
Then again, just because reported research results explain something well is no reason to blindly accept these results.
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Um....
Yeah because Hilary Clinton, Joe Liberman, and Jack thompson are all old republicans right?
Um...aren't they all in the Senate???
/not saying the first statement isn't mostly true about both parts of Congress...
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As far as video games go...
Anytime someone brings up the argument video games lead to crime they always say look at the statistics. Well guess what, THERE ARE NOT ANY IN THIS REGARD. People revert to previous comments made by congressmen, and the same stupid illegitimate claims. Video games present the player with a problem that they must use their intellect to resolve. So if you need to get from one side of town to other in 10 minutes, but your only options are to run, or steal a car from a guy who's life span is only 15 seconds while he goes from being rendered on your screen, to being wiped form your memory to render the new scenery then where's the consequence of your action? There is none, because it is fictional, and isn't REAL. What congressmen and like minded people want to argue is that it is real, because people can't make the disconnect between the two (fiction and reality).
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To the person who posted comment #67
You have something very wrong in your brain. Games are games, reality is reality.
"playing video games habitually to relieve anger can be damaging to children. in effect they learn that the best way to relieve the pressures of life is through violence."
First congratulations on making a claim, then providing no support for it. This makes it so much easier for me to prove how wrong you are. Habitualy playing video games doesnt lead to violence. Not knowing how to properly vent your frustration does. If you get pissed off at someone and the only way you can immediately dissepate your anger is go to kill something in a video game, but no other course of action (such as removing ones self from the situtaion that is causing said frustration?) will have the same result, then you're pschologicaly impaired. To say gaming leads to violence is to say that the only influence in a persons life is a video game, and they have no concept of reality. Their entire psychy is built around the dissillusions of pre-renderd environments that reflect the most basic isntinct of man to crush the weak and establish dominance.
"i hold that violent video games can be linked to rash actions in cases when there is no way to vent your anger."
Once again you're wrong, but you were almost right. What you should have said is "When there is no way to vent your anger, it can lead to rash actions." This is true, the whole inclusion of the link of video games is your biased, misinformed, deluded opinion of what is reality.[ link to this | view in chronology ]
I'm not caring
If I pick the republican.... dang it.
If I pick the democrat..... dang it.
Yup, let's watch some american idol.
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Hello! The gov't makes its OWN violent video games
But anyway about America's Army? According to Military.com, "Unable to get the necessary recruits for the military the old-fashioned way, the U.S. Army has sunk $16 million into a government-sponsored video game that blurs the line between fantasy and the reality of war." In the article, Major Chris Chambers says, "It's not real; it's simulated. But we're simulating reality."
Hypocrisy much?
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Violence to the masses....
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Where to begin...
You're right... selling violent video games isn't a protected right. Creating them is.
But you're missing the point. It's not a question of "where did the child get the game" or "how did he sneak it in"... it's "why didn't the child know already that the game wasn't to be played". That's called parenting. Teach the kids what games are acceptable for their age and level of development. Teach them why the violent games are different than reality, instead of just assuming that they do or do not already know this.
There are regulations for this. It's what the game rating system is supposed to do. I know, I know... it doens't work too well. But should't that show us that placing regulations on the distrubtion of games isn't the solution? Shouldn't we look at other options? I don't think that even more useless laws are going to help when the first one didn't.
This is assuming that the only thing one gets out of violent games is the violence. You know what I enjoyed most about GTA games? Vehicle stunts. The beating-up of random people got real old real fast. There's a lot less thrill in doing that than these politicians seem to think. They have this image of a kid somewhere euphorically pressing a button over and over again like it's the morphene dose button at a hospital. While yes, statistcally, there's got to be a kid somewhere that enjoys that, it's going to be in vast, vast minority.
Playing video games to "releive stress" is not just what you think it is. I play them to relieve stress... but it's not through blind violence. It's as an escape. When I play my VG's it's to destract myself from those thing causing me stress. Gives me time to regroup and tackle them later.
Over all, "got it backwards", you've been making a lot of assumptions and not backing them up. Sorry to say that your argument is weak, at best.
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I'd Rant...
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parents
(i do find it funny thought that hollywood used the politicians to try to snuff videogames in order to try to keep box ticket sales up)
and no its not hollywood
its simply poor parents and facked up kids.
you can not censor media.
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Video games stuff
Gaming is big business... it can also be an effective tool to share ideas and thoughts...
...where's Sam Fisher when you have problems with these kind of "leaders"?
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...and before video games & movies it was...
before we blamed video games & movies for all manner of ills afflicting teens, before we blamed Marilyn Manson for Columbine, etc. ... we blamed it on "violent" cartoons (like Bugs Bunny, Daffy Duck & The Roadrunner? can you see a good cartoon on TV these days? NO) and stuff like the 3 Stooges.
before that we blamed Black Sabbath and various other metal bands (like Twisted Sister?? get real.).
before that we blamed comic books and pulp novels.
...and the list goes on...
i point this out to help those that would yawp things like "back in my time it was different" and "oh the good old days". BULL. there were no "good old days" -- they are a myth.
the root cause of all of this CRAP is that people really do not want to accept the responsibility of having screwed things up. the parents of the Columbine kids didn't fail to do their job, it was Marilyn Manson and video games and a "culture that glorifies violence". that kid in NY who ballooned to 300+ pounds eating fast food 3 meals a day was the victim of the fast food industry, of course it couldn't be the weak-willed parent who fed him the crap instead of feeding him something more wholesome (and maybe less of it), oh no can't be that...
frankly, part of the reason MySpace is popular (and for the record, I have a MySpace & I'm almost 50) is that society in general has become way more mobile, kids have friends at school on Tuesday and those friends are moved to another city on Thursday, kids no longer are able to just hang out after school as they run from soccer to Sylvan to dance to home... at least on sites like MySpace they can stay in touch, swap gossip, share silly photos of their toes, stuff that kids will do with friends.
the fact that a few kids have had bad experiences where the bad thing was somehow related to an online social networking site (either being accosted by predators or in a Michigan case, running off to the Gaza Strip to be with some guy) is no different than being accosted by a flasher in the parking lot at the mall or the movies. there are kids who because of their behavior and reactions to what goes on around them will become prey or predators. that is just the way it is. it has happened that way since well before video games, computers and mobile phones were even dreamt of. it will happen long after the Internet fades into the dustbin of history.
MySpace is like a gun. if you point a gun at your foot and pull the trigger, you may blow your foot clean off. same with social networking tools and the Internet, you can do good things like keep up on your favorite band, share your goofy pictures, send silly bulletins to your friend list or you can put up alluring cheesecake photos and make plans to see that guy who "really understands me" in meatspace. when you point the tool at your foot and pull the trigger, there are consequences and all the sanctimonious pontification and bad laws written by all of the legislatures in this land can't change it.
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I repeat: Comment#55 on this board.
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A better video game...
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spin? nooooooo
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video games do not caous violance
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Video Games - An excuse for the "lack of" parenting skills?
The problem isn't with the video games... it's the parents and lack of discipline.
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