Reading Comprehension: A Terrible Thing To Waste

from the venting dept

Thu, Jan 29th 2009 8:58am — Mike Masnick

Nearly four years ago, Amazon.com announced its Amazon Prime shipping club. The idea was that high volume users of the site could sign up, pay $79/year, and get free two-day shipping. I don't buy enough (or enough that I need quickly) from Amazon to make this worthwhile for me, but some friends use it and like it. When it launched, we wrote about it. No big deal.

In 2007, some people who somehow signed up for the program without meaning to, started Google searching the program -- and commenting on that post, often complaining that they were signed up against their will. In April of 2007, one person noted that the charge on his credit card was denoted as being for AMZ*Prime Club. Within days, if you did a search on that phrase, we were the top result. At first, our comments started to fill up with angry messages from people who claim they never agreed to sign up for the program. Then... people started emailing and calling us demanding a refund. For a while it was a deluge of calls and emails, leading me to write a post warning Amazon that it was clear to us that many, many people were confused by the way they explained the Amazon Prime offering. That was because Amazon offered people a "free month" trial of Amazon Prime, after which they would be automatically charged the $79. Many people apparently signed up for the free month, and failed to read the details.

This continued for many months, and we ended up writing a second open letter to Amazon, pointing out that whether they knew it or not, an awful lot of people were confused and all of them seemed to be blaming us for the confusion. It was becoming quite a nuisance dealing with the various calls and emails. Some people in our comments noted Amazon was quite straightforward in how they described the details of the program, and we were wrong to tell them that it was too confusing. That may be so, but I can assure you that there are an awful lot of people who still don't understand the details of the program.

It has continued to this very day -- though we tend to only get two to three emails and calls per week nowadays, as opposed to the multiple complaints per day. To be honest, we've taken to ignoring most of the calls and emails, because it's just not worth responding. There was one very confused older woman who called a bunch of times, and we just had to help her because she sounded so distressed, but for the most part, we let them go. Until... this week.

I'm not sure why, but I was glancing at the customer service email account the other night when one such email came in. It read:

Subject: refund my $79.-- immediately [CustomerService]

------ Comments ------

I ordered some things from Amazon (for the last time, believe me) before Christmas. When I went on line tonight to check my bank balance I discovered that $79.00 had been deducted from my checking account withut my permission or prior warning. This is certainly not the way to get and keep customers. I want the money credited back to my account immediately, please. I do not remember anywhere on your website where it asked if I was willing to participate in this program. If there had been, I would have said NO!

I will be expecting an e-mail from you tomorrow. My cell phone is broken and I am waiting for a new one to be shipped to me which should take about a week. I certainly do not hope that I have to speak with you about this again.

I was going to just ignore it, but since the woman seemed to realize that the problem was with Amazon, and it only took a second, I figured I'd email her back a quick note:

Perhaps you should try contacting Amazon instead of us?

Simple, to the point... I thought I was being helpful. The woman clearly saw the email, because she replied immediately to me... but it was a blank email, other than her signature being appended above my response to her. I thought it was odd, but let it go, figuring it was an accidental reply (or maybe she even meant to say thanks for sending her in the right direction). The next morning, we received another feedback form message from the same woman:

Subject: need money put back into my checking account [CustomerService]

------ Comments ------

This morning as I was checking my bank, I realized that your organization had debited $79.00 from my checking account for something called : "tech dirt". This simply looks like current events. I am not interested in it and need to have the $79.00 redeposited into my husband's and my checking account immediately before we become overdrawn. I can be reached at my e-mail today - my cell phone broke and I am waiting for a new one to be shipped to me.

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Now, at this point, it's obvious the woman is lying. She had emailed us the night before about it, recognizing that it was a charge from Amazon and not Techdirt. This was confusing, but maybe (maybe?!) she was just confused. So, I tried to be helpful:

I am afraid you are confused. We do not charge people anything. We do not even have a merchant account with which to charge you. From your *other* email last night, it seems clear that it is Amazon.com that charged you for their Amazon Prime service, which costs $79. Please contact Amazon to have them take care of it:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=518316

Thanks,
Mike

Ok. I figured we were all done with things. But... a day and a half goes by and suddenly:

Subject: $79.00 refund [CustomerService]

------ Comments ------

I truly do not remember authorizing you to take $79.00 from my checking account using my bank card. I simply would not have approved of that high a debit. While I am sure your web-site is a good one, it's a site in which I have no interest.

Because of that I am asking for a refund of the $79.00 as soon as possible. Unfortunately, my cell phone broke the other day and it will still be a few days until my new one gets here. The only way you can communicate with me is through e-mail: [email address deleted]

Hmm. Ok. Perhaps my emails to her went into her spam filter...? Even though she had actually replied (blankly) to that first one? I gave it one more shot:

Hi [name deleted],

This is your third email to us. We have replied to each of the first two -- including the original one where you properly noticed that it was Amazon that had charged you -- not us, so I am somewhat confused as to why you are now saying we charged you. We are a publication that merely wrote about Amazon's program. We do not even have the ability to charge credit cards.

Your problem is with Amazon.com and you should probably contact them.
Thanks,
Mike

Five minutes later, she replies:

How the hell do I contact Amazon - it seems to me that you and Amazon are probably working in collusion to fleece people.

And... with that I give up. Apparently, it wouldn't matter how clearly Amazon explains their program. There are still some people who will not be able to figure it out.

Thank you for reading this Techdirt post. With so many things competing for everyone’s attention these days, we really appreciate you giving us your time. We work hard every day to put quality content out there for our community.

Techdirt is one of the few remaining truly independent media outlets. We do not have a giant corporation behind us, and we rely heavily on our community to support us, in an age when advertisers are increasingly uninterested in sponsoring small, independent sites — especially a site like ours that is unwilling to pull punches in its reporting and analysis.

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–The Techdirt Team

Filed Under: amazon prime, reading comprehension
Companies: amazon

79 Comments

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Farseer, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:06am

All too common
See what you get for being a good Samaritan? ;)

Not a day goes by that I don't miss retail...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Sean, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:08am

Her emails kind of remind me of those Nigerian scams, "yes post please just 10k into this account for me to pay the tax on this 6 million dollar in bank and you can have half."

I don't know what kind of woman that is, but she needs a good shaking. And just remember, she's probably driving a car on the road, as oblivious to the rules and other drivers as she was to your simple point.

Terrifying idiot.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Dan, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:18am

I hope she sues
Mike,

Actually Mike, if she's stupid enough to sue Techdirt, I can't think of a better way to prove your point.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:18am

Based on reading comments to your stories, I think you get a lot of idiots who read your site. I haven't been able to wrap my head around that. You have a great site, great stories, great ability for describing economics, you describe most everything wonderfully and yet, most of the comments are from mouth breathers. Therefore, I would like my $79 back.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:21am

Robots are coming
Everyone knows that robots are plotting against the elderly. So why wouldn't the "inter-tube" do the same thing?

PS, seriously, I need my $79 back...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:26am

Send one more email that says:

To contact Amazon, use this link:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=518316

I know you already sent it to her. Doesn't matter. Once a person stops accusing and actually asks a question, answer the question without offering additional information.

I say this as a Help Desk person that deals with folks like this every day. They will always blame you and not Amazaon, that cannot be changed. However, since they finally got around to askign a simple question, a simple answer can be effective.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Twinrova, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:31am

[many] People are idiots.
Wow. I would like to offer my condolences to Techdirt for having to deal with someone like this.

And me. ;)

Now, please give me my refund of $79 immediately, despite not being charged by Amazon or Techdirt.

I'll choose (looks at last online purchase)...

...oh. It was Amazon.

Place my refund here →
[ link to this | view in thread ]
:Lobo Santo, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:38am

Opportunities
You could send Amazon an invoice for doing "freelance customer service work"
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:39am

Re: [many] People are idiots.
(o)(o)

Would like anything else? Some shake with that?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:40am

Imagine someone of 'average intelligence.'
Now, imagine that half of the world is dumber than that.
It clears up a lot of confusion.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Killercool, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:41am

What COULD have been...
If this woman had contacted you just a few months ago, and you posted this, wonderful entertainment would have ensued from the angry posters about you "not only refusing to refund her money, but MOCKING her as well! My stars!"
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Ed G., 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:44am

Re:
The 'mouth breathers' that comment are due to the positive effect of high Google search rankings of the TechDirt content. People these days believe anything they read on the interweb and rarely want to look lower than #5 on their search results page. So, go figure, you get these kinds of issues when you are just than darn good!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Josephine, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:48am

blaming
The exchange sounds as if a friend of mine wrote it! She lives alone, uses a computer but doesn't understand the technology, and whenever something doesn't work as she expects it to, she blames. She loses her email, forgets passwords, disconnects the internet, calls tech support a lot, ... and blames.

It's a mindset.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:48am

I am of the belief that people this stupid should be sterilized, for the sake of humanity.

Also, kudos to you for not swearing. I would have laughed in her face, txt stylee, and explained to her in no uncertain terms how inept she is and asked her to please vacate the innernetz as quickly as possible.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
ericsamson, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:49am

Apparently this site's non-affiliation to Amazon does not pass the "moron in a hurry" test.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:55am

Aren't you kind of aggravating the problem more by writing about Amazon even more, since now more traffic will come to your site? :)
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Emilio, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:56am

But I don't have your 79 dollars, and you know I don't. Now eat your Cony Island and drink your Nehi...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Killer_Tofu (profile), 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:56am

Later on in life .
Later on in life doctors will tell her she has an IQ of 49 ....
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Steve, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:56am

Mike,

I want to personally thank you for this post! The stories here have made for some VERY entertaining reading over my lunch break! I know I can always count on TechDirt to come through for me when I need it.

Loyal reader,
Steve
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Cipher-0, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:57am

The tech support mantra applies...
If they hear, they do not listen.

If they listen, they do not understand.

If they understand, they do not obey.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:58am

Great article on the Blackberry Storm!
This is a great review of the Blackberry Storm. After reading so many bad reviews I was beginning to doubt my place in the universe as I really love the Storm. But after reading your fair and balanced review, my faith in my ability to choose the right smart phone has been restored. Keep up the good work.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Osno, 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:58am

It doesn't pass the "moron thinking it over" test, apparently.

Anyway, this does sound like a scam. Maybe lots of people realized that Amazon gets a lot of complaints on the program, and are trying to capitalize on the fact. And some of them aren't that smart.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Richard Ahlquist (profile), 29 Jan 2009 @ 9:59am

Anyone this stupid
Should be removed from the internet.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Richard Ahlquist (profile), 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:02am

Re:
If Mike doesnt keep TechDirt at the top of the keyword search for Amazon the morons of the world have no hope that an Amazon board member will ever see the problems the Prime program is causing.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Petréa Mitchell, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:03am

Re:
Anonymous Help Desk Coward is right. Give the answer in the context of a question, and it'll be used.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Ron Burgundy (profile), 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:05am

Re: Later on in life .
And will become an adviser to the Bush White House.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Petréa Mitchell, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:08am

And some useful information
If anyone is actually curious about improving reading comprehension on the Web, here's Alertbox's compilation of columns about it. The one on lower-literacy users is especially relevant here.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:12am

Re: All too common
At least I wasn't the only one having flashbacks from retail-hell from reading this.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Hulser, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:12am

Re:
Funny you should mention Help Desks because the conversation reminded me of my experiences with customer support e-mail addresses. Here's what I noticed...

1) Help/Support desks blatantly ignore information you provided. If you say "I tried rebooting my computer first", after three days, they'll write back and ask "Have you tried rebooting your computer?" and then add in the infuriating "It's been a pleasure helping you" type comment.

2) Help/Support desks blatantly ignore any question after the first one. You have three questions about a similar topic? Forget it. They'll "answer" the first and ignore the rest. And don't even think about trying a "If the answer to question 1 is No, then what about...?" type question.

Sure, there are probably a different set of reasons for this type of issue than the Refund-My-$79 lady, but the problem of lack of reading comprehension exists from both angles.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:14am

Remove the high-ranked story and make the link redirect to Amazon's customer service?

Seriously, I wouldn't want to deal with 1,000,000 stupid and angry Amazon customers.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:16am

Re:
yea, but us help desk monkeys do it because we are paid...well I did it cause I was paid cause I sure and heck not helping these cretins stumble around the dark insulting me the entire time for no money.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Hulser, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:21am

Re: blaming
Since you said this reminds you of a friend of your, I have to ask some questions. Would you say your friend is of average intelligence?

Not to be insulting, but from the exchange that Mike described, the woman seems to be of lower than average intelligence or, at best, purposfully obtuse. Is your friend functional in normal situation, but just can't handle situations that involve technology?

Forgive my curiosity, but I just can't wrap my head around how anyone can be smart enough to turn on their computer and send an e-mail, but not smart enough to understand the difference between a tech news web site and Amazon.com.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Tony, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:22am

Re: Re: Later on in life .
Bush is no longer president. Time to get over it.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Tony, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:24am

Mike, you have discovered the primary problem with libertarian ideas: too many people are just too dumb for them to work properly.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Jeremy, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:31am

Sad but true, I hear it every day
I work for a company that has in its products some that have a free offer leading to a reoccurring monthly charge. There is a much larger audience out there than you would think that simply are either deceptive or too stupid to understand the basics of the offer they are signing up for.

We get calls all day, every day calling us fraud, scammers, etc. over a very clear incentive to membership offer is they signed up for. "You stole my money" "This is an unauthorized charge" etc. gets claimed all the time.

You get those that legitimately didn't understand, though sad, you want to help them. Problem is many of them want *all* their money back, even shipping costs on the free incentive used to get them interested. Stupidity is not a ticket for free everything.

Another problem is the many-more-than-you-would-think out there that will just outright lie to try and get refunds. These same types, if you don't refund, will abuse the merchant account chargeback system to not only get money returned, but also damage your ability to do business.

It's a messed up world of Internet consumers out there, making it harder every day to do legitimate business.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
BulmaRO, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:44am

Some Idea
maybe u just need to make a format to reply to those 79 DLs refunds..

with the next stuff:
1)Tech Dirt and Amazon Aren't Related In Anyway
2)Contact Amazon: amazon-email@amazon.com
3)Please we don't need you to reply to his email, no need to thank either.

and that would be about it, i guess, still there would be people around that but eventually it has to disappear.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Yakko Warner, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:56am

Re: Re: All too common
Ever read NotAlwaysRight.com?

Ever submit anything to NotAlwaysRight.com? ;)
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:56am

As a company we use a 3rd party CC Processor, and almost got into a PR problem with the reoccuring charge system.

It turns out our CC processor was "offering" all customers a "special" deal, 1 free month & then some monthly fee after that.

Yes it was shown on the order form (From them) and yes it was an opt out system. After 1 person informed us of it, we dug into it & saw that they decided to add this feature to all accounts as a bonus.

Well we turned it off an haven't had any problems with it after. But the long story short is even the small business that appear to be doing the "free shipping" offer may not even know that they're doing this if they are using a 3rd party CC processor.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Jason, 29 Jan 2009 @ 10:59am

Re: Some Idea
4) Use your exchange server to make the email come from donotreply@techdirt.com so that they can't reply
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:03am

This has to be scam
This certainly sounds like a scam. The insistence on not being contacted by phone certainly sounds fishy. Also the fact that the second email was basically saying the same thing as the first one but using Techdirt instead of Amazon. I'm not sure how they could cash in on this, but it reminds me an awful lot of the Nigerian scams and the way the kind responses that I've seen to those emails.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:08am

Re:
Yeah, but that half that is dumber is coddled in school, making them think they are special!

Heck it's the reason that schools quit using the A,B,C,D,F grading system and went to Consistent, Satisfactory, Needs Improvement system. It's also the reason every kid gets a trophy for participating, when no one gets a trophy for winning any more.

People are no longer taught at a young age that they are dumb or inadequate, as it would hurt their self esteem.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Lucretious, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:11am

Re:
says the Anonymous Coward......
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Monarch, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:13am

Re: Re: Re: Later on in life .
There are more in the wings! OMG! NO! I just jinxed the country!

Jeb Bush will run next and the masses of ppl that can't tell the difference between Amazon and Tech Dirt will be voting for him!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:18am

New idea: (for humor, don't seriously do this)

Send her an reply with:

Dir Madam,

Sorry for the inconvenience. We would be happy to return the $79. We just need to verify some of your account information. Please send us a reply e-mail with your bank account, PIN number, CC Number and expiration date, SSN, ... and the amount will be refunded shortly.

:)
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:18am

Re:
OMG, that is the funniest post I have ever seen!
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:20am

take your cue from Cops
If you ever watch Cops (the tv show), you'll notice that when they are trying to communicate something to stubborn/ not overly bright/ wasted/ etc people, they use simple directive statements and repeat them. ie - sit on the curb, sit on the curb, sit on the curb (mace).

While your certainly not in the wrong here Mike, I think your phrasing was a bit too polite. A more direct way would be simply:

You have the wrong person.
Amazon charged you.
I'm not Amazon.

Tailor you message to the person, rather than expect them to read up to your level.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:23am

Re: Great article on the Blackberry Storm!
Apparently writing a bot to post random positive reviews about a product. This makes me think that the Blackberry Storm is a terrible product. If I had read many bad reviews (which I haven't bothered) I would agree with them, if this is an attempt to somehow reverse that trend. So... just for the Google engine:

Reviews say Blackberry Storm is a terrible product.
Reviews say Blackberry Storm is a terrible product.
Reviews say Blackberry Storm is a terrible product.
Reviews say Blackberry Storm is a terrible product.
Reviews say Blackberry Storm is a terrible product.
Reviews say Blackberry Storm is a terrible product.
Reviews say Blackberry Storm is a terrible product.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
NoahBuddy, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:32am

Re: Some Idea
Just because you make emails come from "donotreply@techdirt.com" will not stop people from attempting to reply.

Then they will blame you for not accepting or ignoring their email they sent to "donotreply@techdirt.com".
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 11:55am

Re: Failure to comprehend
Or say:
To start the process of getting your refund, click here.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=518316
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Xiera, 29 Jan 2009 @ 12:02pm

Thanks Mike!
I needed a good laugh. :D
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 12:03pm

Re:
"I am of the belief that people this stupid should be sterilized, for the sake of humanity."

But where will our comedy come from? Do not say the RIAA they would have been sterilized too.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Jono Barel, 29 Jan 2009 @ 12:03pm

Re: take your cue from Cops
Mike,

I think several people have actually got a VERY good point on the whole "I'm not Amazon" message not getting through.

I read your emails while I was reading the article, and they do come across as overly complicated.

Not that her obtuseness is excusable, she seemed to be making a real raging effort not to understand, but you could have gone the extra step to be more clear.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 12:07pm

Re: take your cue from Cops
You noticed that too? I think the adrenaline makes them repeat the same garbled statement louder and faster, for some reason, which of course leads to less understanding by the victim. I wonder what the evolutionary value of that reflex was, back before guns and mace?

If the Police routinely received training in how to communicate more clearly, how to improve understanding if the first demand is not met, and how to get compliance by communicating correctly, I bet we would see fewer abuse cases.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
DS78, 29 Jan 2009 @ 12:08pm

Moron in a hurry!
Obviously we have a bunch of morons in a hurry to get a refund here. If they can't tell the difference between Amazon and TechDirt we may have an infringement case on our hands!

I seriously don't see how people are confusing the 2 and demanding a refund from TechDirt.

DS
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Laughs@Idiots, 29 Jan 2009 @ 12:08pm

Re: Opportunities
lol
Good one!

"Dear Amazon,

Throughout the past month, I have received several hundred unsolicited emails regarding a service of yours. I have taken the necessary customer service steps to set them on the right track.

For my time and effort, I have charged $20,001.03 to your checking account.

Thanks,
Freelance CS Rep Mike"
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymoose, 29 Jan 2009 @ 12:19pm

Now I understand that tweet...
when you said you'd just found the world's dumbest person. I was waiting for a follow-up, and it never came. :)
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 12:24pm

Can I borrow $10?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
anonymous help desk guy from earlier, 29 Jan 2009 @ 12:53pm

Re: Some Idea
The reply to Mike will be:

1) If you aren't related, why are you emailing me? Just give me my money back.

2) I did and that's how I got to tech dirt in the first place.

3) See number 2. Please stop sending me in circles and give me my money back.

Answer only the question asked. Offering additional information only provides more information to be garbled.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 1:00pm

I know more old ladies like that than I would enjoy. :( First signs of Alzheimer's, I'm afraid.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
PRMan, 29 Jan 2009 @ 1:19pm

Domino's
I have a number that is one number off from Domino's Pizza and every once in a while we get calls from people. We simply tell them the correct Domino's number and they usually don't call back.

Every once in a while, the person mistakenly dials the same number again and I repeat myself, but they usually get it.

But for the one guy who called me back a third time, I just took his order, offering cheesy bread and 2 liters of Coke and Hot Wings. When I was all done I quoted a price that sounded reasonable and hung up.

He never called back.

Hey, I was nice the first 2 times...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 1:35pm

Re: Sad but true, I hear it every day
The easy way to avoid what you are describing is not to engage in fraud.

Be honest.

Do not run scams.

And! Guess what, you will not be noted as scam artists.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
jonnyq, 29 Jan 2009 @ 1:54pm

Re:
Libertarian ideals take into account that people are "dumb". They're geared to work without the cooperation of the "dumb". Socialist ideals are the ones that break down without the cooperation of the dumb.

I'll grant that there are business practices that prey on the dumb (video professor, anyone?) and that's why we have advertising laws, but in general, keeping the market open to stupidity in its basest form is what makes it work in the first place.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Gyffes, 29 Jan 2009 @ 2:20pm

Re:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAhAHA

lovely.

Mike, you were MORE than fair. Bravos and may she be hit with an intelligence stick sometime in the near future.

Hopefully, repeatedly.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
anymouse, 29 Jan 2009 @ 2:23pm

Intelligence vs Wisdom
"Forgive my curiosity, but I just can't wrap my head around how anyone can be smart enough to turn on their computer and send an e-mail, but not smart enough to understand the difference between a tech news web site and Amazon.com."

We tend to use 'smart' as a general measure, but it really consists of a couple components, Intelligence and wisdom. To use a quote as an example, The difference between a smart person and a wise person is that a smart person knows what to say and a wise person knows whether or not to say it." As another example, a highly intelligent individual would know that standing outside in the cold/rain can be detrimental to their health, but they may still walk outside in a twenty degree storm in their T-shirt (Albert Einstein was a great example of a highly intelligent individual who didn't always apply that intelligence to the world around him).
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Yakko Warner, 29 Jan 2009 @ 2:41pm

Re: Domino's
See, you guys are lucky.

I have a number that's one digit off from an Old Chicago pizzeria. Every once in a while, we'll get a call asking for reservations, or "what time are you open?" Once, I said "Hello" and got a rude, "Is that how you answer the phone??" But it usually takes about two seconds to establish that they have the wrong number, and the other person apologizes (even the rude guy), and that's it. No call backs or anything.

I never get to have any fun. *pout*
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s12, 29 Jan 2009 @ 2:41pm

new idea
Mike,

start up a new program called Techdirt points. you get points for responding to idiots like aprime_lady79. make it a social networking site where you completely outsource CS. readers get bragging points for responding to your emails... you don't have to deal with them anymore... it's win win!
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Richard 23, 29 Jan 2009 @ 2:49pm

WHERE ARE THE BOOKS, MASNICK?
What a stupid website this is. I can't seem to find the section where you sell books. Like you care. I think you're just trying to rip people off.

There's no way the $79 membership fee was worth it. I'd like a refund please.

Why would anyone buy books from the Amazon anyway? I thought people were worried about the rain forests. Besides I don't read Amazonian.
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Rose M. Welch, 29 Jan 2009 @ 3:02pm

Just gotta say...
...that I signed up for Amazon Prime during Christmas and it very clearly explained how to opt-out of the upcoming charge. In addition, I received a confirmation e-mail explaining what I had ordered and how to opt-out of the upcoming charge, with links. Last (but not least) a few days before the trial period was up, I received another e-mail very clearly stating that they were about to charge my card unless I opted-out, which they explained and linked to again. I was happy that they were so diligent.

Time Magazine, however, took my cc information last year and decided to keep it on file. Sometime in June they decided to gift all of their customers with automatic renewal. Even the ones like me, who explicitly said they didn't want it... Luckily, I had the confirmation e-mail from the original charge, which showed that I didn't sign up for auto renewal and warned me that I wouldn't be automatically renewed without it. Roflmao.
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Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2009 @ 3:08pm

Re: Re:
My school still does A-F. Except for one teacher I had four years ago, who gave "E's" instead of F's because she "didn't believe in F's." She was also addicted to Prozac.
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Griffyn, 29 Jan 2009 @ 3:10pm

Re: Re: blaming
I'm pretty sure this woman's responses fit a known psychological phenomenon. I've certainly experienced it. Where you engage in conversation with someone expecting a certain outcome and your brain simply ignores everything the other person says that does not conform to your expected outcome.

Similarly with troubleshooting computer problems. Someone starts to explain their problem, you quickly think 'ah, the problem is x', and wait patiently for them to finish so that you can advise them, while ignoring all the further information they say that would have shown you that you were wrong, and the problem is not x after all.
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Rekrul, 29 Jan 2009 @ 3:45pm

Funny you should mention Help Desks because the conversation reminded me of my experiences with customer support e-mail addresses. Here's what I noticed...

That's because they staff the help desk with trained monkeys.
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Tara, 30 Jan 2009 @ 12:31am

Re: New Idea
That is totally freaking brilliant! Made my day.
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Snuffy, 30 Jan 2009 @ 5:00am

Thanks!
I was surprised to see a credit to my debit of $79 today from Mike. You rock!
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Anonymous Coward, 30 Jan 2009 @ 5:27am

Re: Re: Re:
I was at a school once where Es were the substitute for As... it was all very confusing.
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Infospy, 30 Jan 2009 @ 5:39am

Wrote about this story in my blog.
Hi! I have a blog in Portuguese language where i write a lot of stuff that comes to my mind, so, as this story is practicly from "Common-Sense-Was-Just-Disabled-Dept" i've decided to write about it in my blog.

And, Damn! You have some patience...
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Anonymous Coward, 30 Jan 2009 @ 6:43am

Re: WHERE ARE THE BOOKS, MASNICK?
ROFL. Brilliant.
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Analmouse Coward, 30 Jan 2009 @ 8:25am

Wheres my money,
Gimme my money,
What you done with my money,
gimme my mother f*ing money.

you dead now b$*&h!
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Sean, 1 Feb 2009 @ 2:19am

Why did so many of you write similarly unfunny posts one after the other, each thinking yours would be funnier than the last? Honestly, who are you people?
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cKarlGo, 2 Feb 2009 @ 6:10am

My $79
You deducted $79 from my checking account for every story I've read on TechDirt. I need you to refund $79,000 to my checking account....

Seriously, am I the only one that wonders why these people aren't chased down the street by men with big butterfly nets?
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