DailyDirt: How Much Are Coins Worth?

from the urls-we-dig-up dept

Tue, Feb 26th 2013 5:00pm — Joyce Hung

While early coins represented the value of the metal they were made of, modern day coins are issued by the government and their value is determined by free market currency exchange rates. Ideally the value of a coin should be higher than the cost of the metals used to make it, but when the price of metals, like copper, increases, pennies can end up being worth more for their metal. For example, the Canadian government has officially stopped distributing pennies because not only do they cost almost 1.6 cents per penny to produce, but most people think pennies are worthless. But are they? Here are a few more interesting coin-related stories.

Pennies aren't worthless. They're legal tender and carry a value of 1 cent. That's why a Utah man tried to pay a disputed $25 doctor's bill in pennies. After he presented the clinic with almost 14 lbs of pennies and demanded that they count them, he was found guilty of disorderly conduct and fined $140. Hopefully he didn't try to pay the fine in pennies as well. [url]
Have you ever wondered why there are 100 cents in a dollar? In 1784, Thomas Jefferson suggested that the U.S. dollar should be decimalized, and being the influential guy that he was, he managed to convince the government to follow the suggestions he proposed in his essay, "Notes on the Establishment of a Money Unit, and of a Coinage for the United States." [url]
Coin collectors can now get their very own platinum-plated "trillion dollar coin" for just $9.95. The coins commemorate the idea that the U.S. Treasury could simply mint a $1 trillion platinum coin to get around the debt ceiling. Apparently, U.S. law allows the Treasury to produce platinum coins in any denomination. [url]
The Royal Canadian Mint wants to create a secure digital alternative to cash in the form of MintChip. The MintChip smart card chip could be installed in a number of devices, and value would be transferred onto the chip by a MintChip broker, allowing users to securely exchange Canadian dollars both online and offline. [url]

If you'd like to read more awesome and interesting stuff, check out this unrelated (but not entirely random!) Techdirt post.

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Filed Under: coins, currency, dollar, money, pennies, platinum, royal canadian mint

44 Comments

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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2013 @ 5:22pm

Pennies ARE effectively worthless...
you don't even need to be bill gates. if your hourly wage is greater than $36, it's not worth your time to pick up a penny off the sidewalk. if it takes you more than a second to handle a penny, then you've just wasted your time.
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- radarmonkey (profile), 26 Feb 2013 @ 5:30pm
  
  Re: Pennies ARE effectively worthless...
  But sometimes I like wasting my time!
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- Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2013 @ 5:57pm
  
  Re: Pennies ARE effectively worthless...
  If you need a reason to pick up a penny off the streets, how about "do it for the animals".
  
  Quote:
  Pennies and other small coins are sometimes ingested by dogs, resulting in the need for medical treatment to remove the foreign body. The zinc content of some coins can cause zinc toxicity, which is commonly fatal in dogs, where it causes a severe hemolytic anemia, and also liver or kidney damage; vomiting and diarrhea are possible symptoms.[199] Zinc is highly toxic in parrots and poisoning can often be fatal.[200] The consumption of fruit juices stored in galvanized cans has resulted in mass parrot poisonings with zinc.
  
  Source: Wikipedia: Zinc
  
  Although Zinc is very important for biological systems, excess of it can cause death and many small animals swallow those coins.
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- Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 7:21am
  
  Re: Pennies ARE effectively worthless...
  I never liked this logic. Say i make 36 an hour, i'm only getting paid that while i'm working. so I i pick up a penny while i'm off the clock my hourly rate is effectly $0. I guess you could assume i could be working instead of pick up a penny but i'm only gonna work so many hours no matter what. but even while i'm working i've effectly increased my rate for that hour from 36 to 36.01. The only way this wouldn't be worth my time is if you assume that i would not get paid the full amount of my regular pay if i stopped to pick up a penny. but i've already got the $36 per hour weather i pick up the penny or not so i'm just losing out on the penny by not picking it up.
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  - Vincent Clement (profile), 27 Feb 2013 @ 9:11am
    
    Re: Re: Pennies ARE effectively worthless...
    Agreed. I never understood how you could equate the value of non-work time with the value of work time.
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Gee, 26 Feb 2013 @ 5:42pm

At least here in Canada, the Currency Act states that you cannot pay for something that is worth 25 cents or more, with only pennies.

http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-52/page-1.html#h-6
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- Gee, 26 Feb 2013 @ 5:44pm
  
  Re:
  ETA: but seeing how they are trying to phase out the penny, it's a moot point
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- Bergman (profile), 26 Feb 2013 @ 8:06pm
  
  Re:
  By the letter of that law, something priced at $40.99 would be impossible to purchase with cash.
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  - Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2013 @ 8:31pm
    
    Re: Re:
    2-20's, a 5, and what every coinage makes up the rest
    
    I think you read it wrong
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    - Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2013 @ 8:37pm
      
      Re: Re: Re:
      I thought you said 49.99, turns out I read yours wrong :P
      So 40.99 would be 2-20's, 3 quarters, 2 dimes, and 4 pennies
      I see no restriction on that
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      - Bergman (profile), 27 Feb 2013 @ 2:17am
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re:
        So how do you pay the $0.99 if coins are not legal tender in purchases over $40?
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        Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 3:32am
        
        Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:
        it's illegal to use ONLY pennies. Therefore, how you pay the $0.99? same way as you would pay for something costing $0.99
        
        (matter of fact, if you wanted to be an ass, it would be legal to use a dime and pay the rest in pennies)
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- Rabbit80, 27 Feb 2013 @ 5:55am
  
  Re:
  Here in the UK we have rules on how many coins you can use as well...
  
  Coins are legal tender up to the following amounts:
  �1 (or above) - for any amount
  50p - for any amount not exceeding �10
  25p (Crown) - for any amount not exceeding �10
  20p - for any amount not exceeding �10
  10p - for any amount not exceeding �5
  5p - for any amount not exceeding �5
  2p - for any amount not exceeding 20p
  1p - for any amount not exceeding 20p
  
  Next time I buy a car, I will have to see if I can pay in �1 coins!
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out_of_the_blue, 26 Feb 2013 @ 5:47pm

Knowledge FAIL.
"modern day coins are issued by the government and their value is determined by free market currency exchange rates."

No, it's fiat currency. The face value of the coins is no more related to metal prices than are the same numbers put on a piece of paper. -- The value of the metal coins are made from is (vaguely) determined by markets, ones always manipulated by RICH speculators, not free markets. Besides that, the "gold" traded on Wall Street for instance, isn't in physical possession but on paper, or even just numbers in a computer.

With so much definitely wrong in just one paragraph, your understanding of gov't and Wall Street financial shenanigans is near zero.
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- Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2013 @ 5:53pm
  
  Re: Knowledge FAIL.
  umm the currency market is not the same thing as the metal market.
  
  So your entire post make no sense.
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  - Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 4:32am
    
    Re: Re: Knowledge FAIL.
    Par for the course of course
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- Chronno S. Trigger (profile), 26 Feb 2013 @ 6:31pm
  
  Re: Knowledge FAIL.
  There are at least 4 different versions of value that one coin could have.
  
  1) the face value determined by the US treasury.
  
  2) The metal value, determined by free market.
  
  3) How many Twinkies I could buy with it, determined by free market
  
  4) The currency exchange rate, determined by how strong the American Dollar is compared to other countries in a free market.
  
  So, I agree with you; Knowledge fail. Usually you're not kind enough to label your own posts properly.
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  - Rekrul, 27 Feb 2013 @ 7:40am
    
    Re: Re: Knowledge FAIL.
    There are at least 4 different versions of value that one coin could have.
    
    You forgot the value to collectors.
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- Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2013 @ 6:48pm
  
  Re: Knowledge FAIL.
  I will help you blue.
  
  Quote:
  Fiat money is money that derives its value from government regulation or law.
  
  Source: Wikipedia: Fiat currency
  
  The value on the face of the coin is the value that the "authority" say it was, Fiat Currencies are based on trust, a government says the value of that money is 1, that it is one, the government assures everyone that that value will be honored.
  
  Fiat currency is like virtual currencies, is only good if people trust the thing otherwise is worthless.
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- Bergman (profile), 27 Feb 2013 @ 2:21am
  
  Re: Knowledge FAIL.
  All money is fiat currency. Money is a symbol of wealth but is not wealth -- you can't eat it, drink it, drive it or (unless you have an absurd amount of it) use it as physical shelter.
  
  Gold has value because everybody agrees it's worth something. Dollar bills have value because everybody agrees they're worth something. The fact that a government invented the bills doesn't make them any more inherently valuable or worthless than gold ingots.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2013 @ 5:51pm

Good ol Thomas was wrong on this one, the money should never be allowed to go bellow zero is a nightmare to calculate those fractions.

About the value of the penny well they are worth something, copper and zinc are both valuable metals, with which you can do a lot of interesting things.

Youtube: Make Glow in the Dark Powder (Zinc Sulfide)
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- Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 4:37am
  
  Re:
  "the money should never be allowed to go bellow zero is a nightmare to calculate those fractions."
  
  It is possible that what you typed is not exactly what you meant ... as fractional amounts are not necessarily less than zero.
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2013 @ 6:09pm

A decade of pain: The only foot surgeon in Nova Scotia has waiting list 3,500 names long

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/02/26/a-decade-of-pain-the-only-foot-surgeon-in-nova-scoti a-has-waiting-list-3500-names-long/

Wendy Berringer�s feet are killing her. They hurt when she stands, when she walks and when she sits, which is what she was doing Tuesday, in her favourite rocking chair in her Halifax home, telling me about her bunions, a tiny broken bone in her left foot and her creaking left ankle, which cracks and groans and aches, causing her all manner of grief.

�I had my first appointment with my family doctor for my feet in 2002,� she says. �The original problem was my bunions. They rub in your shoes and you can�t walk properly. They are very sore. My family doctor made me an appointment to see a foot surgeon in Halifax to get the problem fixed.

�That was 11 years ago.�

In what seems like a parody of complaints over medicare waiting lists, Wendy Berringer is still, 11 years later, waiting for that appointment.
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- Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 4:40am
  
  Re:
  Maybe you confused the word coin with corn ???
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Ben or Jerry, 26 Feb 2013 @ 6:29pm

I hope Canada goes with the digital currency plan so we can name an ice cream after it.
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Mike Coady, 26 Feb 2013 @ 6:36pm

Pennies
Australia has removed 1 cent an 2 cent coins from circulation many years ago, when visiting USA I find when given change that is in lesser denomination you pocket fills very quickly. There is no need in 2013 to have denominations so small. Tax in Australia is added to an item before the item is sold. By adding tax after woods you end up with stupid situation. Haven't the people of America convinced their Government of this waste.
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- Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 4:42am
  
  Re: Pennies
  Convincing government is like talking to a brick wall
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  - Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 5:05am
    
    Re: Re: Pennies
    if your from the US you don't actually have a functioning Government at the present time, it's a joke worthy of the Simpsons.
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Lawrence D'Oliveiro, 26 Feb 2013 @ 7:42pm

Legal Tender
Why did that patient have to be charged with disorderly conduct? Don�t you have laws about legal tender that spell out what denominations are or are not acceptable for what amounts?
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- Bergman (profile), 26 Feb 2013 @ 8:36pm
  
  Re: Legal Tender
  My guess would be he got a bit loud when they refused the pennies. Possibly for making the mess by dumping them all over as well.
  
  If paying in legal tender is disorderly conduct, then we're all repeat offenders.
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  - ChrisB (profile), 26 Feb 2013 @ 10:41pm
    
    Re: Re: Legal Tender
    Legal tender is for paying government debts (taxes) only. Businesses don't have to accept any U.S. currency.
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    - Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 4:47am
      
      Re: Re: Re: Legal Tender
      They do not have to stay in business either apparently.
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- Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 5:13am
  
  Re: Legal Tender
  because he engaged in conduct that is not orderly !!!... go figure!!
  
  I am sure it was not the person behind the counter that fined him the $25, and they have better things to do with their time and YOUR money than performing an act that had spite and inconvenience as it's intent. I really hope that guy spend some pleasant hours before taking the money in counting it himself to make sure he had the right value.
  
  Kind of stupid really, and backfired big time for him, should people pay for their stupidity, hell yes. Starting with idiots like that.
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  - Anonymous Coward, 28 Feb 2013 @ 4:17pm
    
    Re: Re: Legal Tender
    But what is "orderly" and what is not?
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Anonymous Coward, 26 Feb 2013 @ 9:29pm

Disorderly Conduct
Ah disorderly conduct the favorite stand by bullshit charge. It is a mystery to me how this absurdly broad shit hasn't gotten declared unconstitutionally vague. Right up there with obstruction of justice which never gets used when it'd be actually warranted, and the sole charges of resisting arrest.
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 4:47am

the penny is not only totally worthless, but it would represent NEGATIVE VALUE, it would clearly cost more to mint that coin than the coin in worth as currency or it's base metals.

So having pennies is a cost to all people regardless of if you ever use them or not.

Americans, not real smart sometimes.
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- Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 4:51am
  
  Re:
  "Americans, not real smart sometimes."
  
  Yeah, because one can judge the whole based upon decisions of a few. This minimal data set logic has been proven to work out well in at least one case, so it must be applicable universally.
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  - Anonymous Coward, 28 Feb 2013 @ 3:15pm
    
    Re: Re:
    Well, let's see. Clinton elected twice. Bush elected twice. Obama elected twice. Beginning to see a pattern here?
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 5:16am

what penny coins are only available to some people, you have never had the chance to have them removed from circulation and chosen not too ???
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 7:11am

I guess this just doesn't make sense to me. It's exactly like going from metric to imperial. It complicates calculations for no good reason.

It's like forcing children to use math using only multiples of five (as the nickel would be the smallest denomination left) because any number less than five isn't worth bothering with.

They have options to make pennies cheaper to produce. I prefer those to getting rid of them, unless there's a better reason than I've seen so far.
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- Vincent Clement (profile), 27 Feb 2013 @ 9:16am
  
  Re:
  Rounding is only used for cash transactions. Any purchase via credit card, cheque, or debit is to the penny.
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Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 7:50am

Does anyone remember the artist who made use of a photograph of Canadian pennies and was sued by the Canadian mint for it?
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Theodore Smith, 27 Feb 2013 @ 9:18am

American Mint is a scam!
Read the fine print on the American Mint website!!!

Sure, you can buy a fake trillion dollar coin for $9.95 (I did). Cool, huh?

But look at their fine print: "Should you decide to keep your preview item, it will be charged at the regular price ($79.95) to your credit card after your 20 day preview period."

What you thought you were getting for $9.95 + $4.95 shipping suddenly became $94.85.

When I immediately called them to cancel my order, the woman said she couldn't find my order (!!) and wouldn't cancel it!

Can you say, "Scam!!!"?
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- Anonymous Coward, 27 Feb 2013 @ 12:53pm
  
  Re: American Mint is a scam!
  At least they didn't charge you a trillion dollars...
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