MPAA Asks For Megaupload Data To Be Retained So It Can Sue Users... Then Insists It Didn't Really Mean That
from the how-not-to-win-fans-or-build-businesses dept
There are days that the actions of the MPAA just make you shake your head and wonder just what goes through the minds of the lawyers running that insane asylum. The latest is the news that they're considering suing Megaupload users directly, as if their reputation wasn't already mud. The details actually have to do with the fight over whether or not the data on Megaupload's servers is going to be deleted. There was a point, soon after the shutdown, when it was suggested that, due to a lack of anyone able to still pay the bills, the hosting provider that Megaupload used, Carpathia Hosting, would soon wipe the servers clean. That struck me as odd, because I would have thought that the data on those servers represented evidence in a criminal case -- but for reasons still not clear, the government insists it has no need for the data and that Carpathia is free to delete it. I won't even begin to speculate over the fact that the person who sent the letter to Carpathia suggesting this also happens to be the BSA's former head anti-piracy VP. An ex-anti-piracy exec for an industry lobbyist, now running a criminal anti-piracy case, basically telling the data center to delete evidence? Hmm...Others, of course, were concerned about both the evidence that could exonerate Megaupload as well as the legitimate files that were going to be lost -- so there was an effort made to try to have the files retained, and the hosting firm has said (for now) that they won't delete the data, despite the fact it is costing the company $9,000 per day to maintain these servers and the 25 petabytes of data they contain. But it wants to.
So here's the surprise. Those fighting to keep the data have an unexpected ally: the MPAA. Yes, you see the MPAA wants to keep its options open and is considering directly suing users who may have used Megaupload for infringement -- and for that to work, they'd need that data to remain available. This came out in a filing by Carpathia to the court, in which it notes that there is significant interest in keeping the data around, but it wants out of the burden of paying for all of this and having to retain the data itself. The filing notes that Megaupload itself wants the data for its defense, the EFF wants to help users get legit files back... and the MPAA wants the data to sue people. Apparently, unbeknownst to the public until now, the MPAA sent Carpathia a letter arguing in agreement with Megaupload and the EFF that the data shouldn't be destroyed, but only because the MPAA wants to have access to the data in case it decides to go hogwild and completely and permanently destroy its reputation by suing users directly. From the letter the MPAA sent Carpathia:
Independent of the ongoing criminal proceeding, the Studios have civil claims against the operators of Megaupload, and potentially also against those who have knowingly or materially contributed to the infringement occurring through Megaupload...Of course, recognizing just how bad its own lawyers' statements are on the matter, the MPAA has sent in its PR folks to try to clean up the mess. Almost immediately after David Kravets at Wired published the original article highlighting this, MPAA PR people started calling him insisting that it wasn't true at all. MPAA PR VP Howard Gantman told Kravets that the MPAA has no intention to sue users, despite the clear language of the letter it sent Carpathia.
... In light of the potential civil claims by the Studios, we demand that Carpathia preserve all material in its possession, custody, or control, including electronic data and databases, related to Megaupload or its operations. This would include, but is not limited to, all information identifying or otherwise related to the content files uploaded to, stored on and/or downloaded from Megaupload; all data associated with those content files, the uploading or downloading of those files, and the Megaupload users who uploaded or downloaded those files; all data reflecting or related to payments to third parties (including Carpathia) by the Megaupload operators; all data reflecting or related to payments to the Megaupload operators, including by users and other third parties, all electronic records regarding communications by the individuals involved in Megaupload's operations; and all internal documents and communications regarding Megaupload.
“The reason we did that filing so that there is a possibility that litigation might be pursued against Megaupload or various intermediaries involved in Megaupload’s operation. We’re not talking about individual users...”That's not what the plain language of the letter itself clearly states -- but never let facts get in the way of a good yarn spun by MPAA PR people desperately trying to make the organization seem not 100% evil. But, this is how the MPAA thinks: lawyers shoot their mouths off with threats first, and the PR folks are left to do cleanup. That's what happens when you put the lawyers in charge, without any real knowledge of technology, business or just how ridiculously bad they make themselves look with their extreme positions. And then they wonder why no one sides with them in debates like the one over SOPA. Perhaps it's because their position is so crazy that anyone with the slightest bit of common sense would have known to stay miles away. But that's not how the MPAA rolls. It goes to crazytown and beyond, and then just denies it was thinking about suing users, despite claiming exactly that.
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Filed Under: copyright, data, lawsuits
Companies: megaupload, mpaa
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Oh wait, all the people uploading to Mega were saints. Got it.
Anything you would like to add to your piracy apology of the day?
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2/10
Boring troll is boring.
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You forget MPAA math? 2+2 = 150,000
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Potential
Noun: Latent qualities or abilities that may be developed and lead to future success or usefulness.
Synonyms: possible - feasible - eventual
What part of "potentially" are you deliberately misunderstanding?
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Including employees of the MPAA, RIAA, and members of law enforcement.
Sure as hell wouldn't call THEM "saints"!
"Anything you would like to add to your piracy apology of the day?"
Yes, we accept your apology, boy.
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What? Spouting nonsense is how they get all their legislation passed.
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Yeah, because if anyone can sense and reject nonsense, it's a congressman.
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You want to protect the safe harbors clause by saying a service provider is not liable, then who is liable for infringing content if not the user who uploaded it? If you post infringing content and share it (nevermind whether or not the increased attention is a good thing for the rightsholder), then you are liable for copyright infringement. I'm all for protecting the service provider to let them create amazing new tools, but when a tool is abused, you can't freak out when the person who knowingly committed a crime gets punished for doing so. That's just not how this works.
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So for those three movies you uploaded... $250,000 and off with your head. Your carcass will be impaled on a pole and put out there for all to see.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackstone's_formulation
"better that ten innocent persons suffer than that one guilty escape"
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Most of the point of this site is that flailing around yelling that it 'used' to be this way (whether that's real or imagined) doesn't do anything to change the reality.
Would you rather be 'right' or 'realistic'?
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20120227/04401917888/would-you-rather-be-right-realistic.shtml
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What will happen...
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My look at it
and potentially also against those who have knowingly or materially contributed to the infringement occurring through Megaupload...
The data they want kept is an invasion of privacy, let's not forget that Sony got all the IPs last year in the Geohot case, even though they never sued the individual users. What they likely want to sue for is contributory copyright infringement, which is when a person meterially induces someone to infringe, such as providing labor or services to do so.
With that knowledge, let's read the clarification;
“The reason we did that filing so that there is a possibility that litigation might be pursued against Megaupload or various intermediaries involved in Megaupload’s operation. We’re not talking about individual users...”
It goes perfectly with the previous statement and the definition of contributory infringement.
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win-win-win
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Re: win-win-win
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Re: Re: win-win-win
Is that a legal statement? Assuming Megaupload knows how to keep keys secure (a big assumption, I admit), MPAA's possession of the ciphertext wouldn't do the MPAA any good or the owners any harm. Then the sifting could begin: the MPAA passes a small block of data to Megaupload, which decrypts it and passes it to the judge, who looks over it and decides whether it should be made public, returned to a user, or destroyed. Then the MPAA passes another small block. This could continue for quite a while...
Which reminds me, I should read Bleak House again.
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Re: Re: Re: win-win-win
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fucking insane
They have somehow elevated the value of their content in their own minds to something that MUST be paid for by someone if they have set eyes on it and using multiples of 100s they decide that you owe them say $975,000 for uploading a couple of movies to a file locker :)))
They are fucking insane , just thank God they never got their hands on PIPA / SOPA , ( yet ) .
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John Steele being bitch slapped by courts in Florida.
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Anyone who is for MPAA doing that suing: remember this
Two wrongs--or any number of wrongs for that matter--do not make a right.
Also, from the context of that letter, MPAA wants to sue ALL the users of MegaUpload, regardless of whether that user infringed with MegaUpload or not.
As for that ridiculous PR statement, it's ignoring DMCA safe harbors provision (not the first time MPAA has ignored the safe harbors provision).
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Re: Anyone who is for MPAA doing that suing: remember this
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Just Bill Them...
Carpathia should send the MPAA the monthly bill to keep the server farms running...
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business model
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"When they are young, they innovate.
When they are old, they litigate."
MPAA, RIAA, and other collection agencies worldwide must be ancient, because they've done very little other than litigate for (how many?) years.
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Later on companies around the MPAA did innovate, colour, sound and so on. But they were already in threat mode which they refined a bit when VCRs came along.
Now they whip out the paperwork for lawsuits is whipped out at the sniff of possible infringement 40 years down the road.
And we get remakes of My Mother The Car and John Carter (but not of Mars!!!). Now THAT's innovation!
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It would be interesting they might have to sue federal goverment members too.
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People weight the cost of pirating before they do it? Hmm, that doesn't sound much like pirates that I have known.
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I have yet to see a single initiative by the MPAA/RIAA to improve sales that was actually well thought out (e.g. the go-to-mall-scan-QR-Code-order-physical-DVD-in-mail idea that had so much fail I had to do a facepalm after reading it).
I'm pretty sure if the MAFIAA actually tries hard enough, they can stop copyright infringement. But guess what the end result will be?
A destroyed Internet, tens of millions of pissed off people who will en masse never buy a single MAFIAA product ever again.
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What country do you live in. Just because there is a drug dealer in your city block doesn't mean you are aware of them.
Seriously, I'm sure you intend to enjoy the rights of living in the US but are not willing to allow others?
DIAF
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Running the Insane Asylum
Is it just me, or do these people behave more like mobsters than businessmen? Between the insane price demands they make for sites/businesses/individuals that want to do business with them, which are so outrageous that they make the "negotiations" over contracts look like nothing more than a protection shakedown, to their willingness to sue every individual they can point to for far more money than they should be entitled to (kind of like "cross me and I'll destroy your life"). to the lengthy record of stealing and cheating the very artists they supposedly represent out of the money they've collected on their behalf, they are nothing more than gangsters...what more do they have to do to prove it? Walk around in pinstriped suits carrying submachine guns in violin cases?
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Re: Running the Insane Asylum
The main difference is the the MPAA doesn't change it's mind if you're a gorgeous model or not.
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Step 2 - File a several kajillion dollar civil suit.
Collect money for damages at each trial, because there is no way possible people would pay for MegaUpload if not for our content. Claim anyone who says differently is just a freetard pirate out to destroy America.
Try and scrub server logs showing MegaUpload being used by **AA's IP addresses, US Gov Addresses, and disguise the fact some of the "infringing" material they were aware of only because they placed it there.
Decide that things are looking bad, the Government can't find the fabled billions of dollars Dotcom/Mega is to have been holding. Look for a new revenue target, the users. While going after them originally would have been a PR nightmare, we have started this scenario to make more money and we can't find it. The end users HAVE to be much richer for having downloaded a movie, our reports show that making a copy of one of our films creates money out of nothing, and it is owed to us.
Cue the shills....
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Didn't they know ..
I'd love to see them prosecute half the planet, in fact, I dare them.
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Hmm. Wonder if you can run that amount of drives in a single RAID configuration.
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MPAA - the power
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Re: MPAA - the power
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Based on what law? Or just on the **AA's say-so?
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'... In light of the potential civil claims by the Studios, we demand that Carpathia preserve all material in its possession, custody, or control, including electronic data and databases, related to Megaupload or its operations.'
Emphasis mine. They don't ask, they don't get a court order for it, oh no, they demand that Carpathia retain the data so they can use it later. Now if in the next line they then said that they were willing to pay the costs to retain the data, that would be one thing, but I just don't happen to see that part for some reason.
Someone was definitely on a power trip when they typed that one up.
I'm rather surprised that when they sent out the first letter they didn't include a part claiming that it would be illegal for them to show it to anyone, though I imagine if they thought they could get away with it something like that would be auto-included on anything and everything they send out.
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Abstinence is the only way to be 100% sure
Since money is the only language these dolts sabe I suggest a BOYCOTT of all new offerings from all of them until such a time as they appear to comprehend the error of their ways.
If you don't give them your tacit approval (read 'buy their crap) the point may become more apparent to them.
This may or may not work but abstinence is the only way to be 100% sure they have a chance to get the message.
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Abstinence will only lead to more claims about piracy
Rethinking it, they will blame it on piracy no matter what - even if all infringers suddenly cried out in terror and died.
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Re: Abstinence is the only way to be 100% sure
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Did I read this right, there are 60,000,000 users of MegaUpload?
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Right on brother. Then let's put paying taxes up for a referendum. Then abortion, capital punishment and all the other shit people don't like.
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String up them lawyers.
Yes... because it's really not the executives for whom those lawyers work who want to sue the users. Give me a break.
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#1 - An MPAA group goes against what they are fighting for. www.acidplanet.com owned by Sony Creative Software (originally Sony Media Software upon the purchase of Sonic Foundry) is a subsidiary of Sony, focused primarily on their line of media production software. Additionally, they produce a series of audio loops, sound effects and other media for use with their software. The server of that site HOLD number of illegal copyright files that are unathorized by the bands and artist. This is in violating of ALL policies out there. Since an MPAA group is actually hold a site and server with illegal posting. So not the MPAA get sued for all the music on that site.
#2 - The MPAA and RIAA used sites like megaupload and others to distribute mixtapes on their artist and free promotional singles. So in turn, they are the MAJOR criminals in the case.
#3 - People would both formats like 8-tracks, cassettes, mini-disc, reel-to-reel, quad vinyl, quad 8-tracks, etc. were the major companies forces customers whom paid high costs on equipment to play these formats. They discounted the formats. Some go to MPAA doing 8mm films to VHS to VHS-C to DVD to Blue-Ray to Digital HD. They owe the customer trillions of dollars spent on the equipment to play them.
Both the MPAA and RIAA need to be counter sued due to their activities that are very mafia like. They HAVE broken the law and need to play the AMERCIAN public quad-trillions of dollars. The MPAA and RIAA are monolopies business now and when someone wants to Do It Themselves. The MPAA and RIAA sue them. It is time that both companies disolves and PLAY the USA customers they quad-trillions of dollars for using illegal business tactics.
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Totally legitimate
Seriously, what are you all afraid of? Its not like any of you pirated files from there, right?
Right?
Oh right, of course you did.
The MPAA is not going to sue a million people. Suing people who uploaded lots of illegal material, though? I could totally see them doing that, especially if they were paid to do so.
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They won't sue for using Megaupload, but
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Totally legitimate lawsuits
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