Facebook Hits Back Hard On Yahoo Patent Claims, Countersues Over Its Own Patents: Nuclear War Begins

from the what-a-waste dept

Tue, Apr 3rd 2012 2:02pm — Mike Masnick

It's not surprising, after Yahoo sued Facebook and Facebook stocked up on a bunch more patents, that Facebook would respond with guns blazing at Yahoo for the lawsuit. As we've been arguing for the better part of a decade, in many cases, patents are basically just nuclear stockpiling, where companies get a ton of patents to hopefully ward off strikes from competitors. But every so often, nuclear war breaks out. It seems like that's the case here.

Facebook hasn't just responded to Yahoo's claims by insisting that they're totally and completely bogus, it's also countersuing over a bunch of its own patents. Most of Facebook's response to Yahoo's claims are basically that it "denies the allegations" made by Yahoo. Sometimes, however, it takes some potshots.

Facebook admits that messaging and privacy are offered as options on certain websites. Facebook denies that “[w]ithout Yahoo!’s achievements, websites such as Facebook would not enjoy repeat visitors or substantial advertising revenue.” Facebook further denies that the functions identified in this paragraph of the Complaint involved any innovation by Yahoo!.

For defenses, it basically brings out every possible argument. It says it didn't infringe. It says the patents are invalid. Those are pretty typical. However, Facebook also points out that Yahoo sat on these patents for ages and did nothing with them, so it argues that the doctrine of laches bars the claims (basically saying you can't wait forever before suing) and similarly that any damages would be limited by the amount of time that Yahoo sat on these patents and did nothing. They're also using Section 287 of the patent law to argue that Yahoo's failure to "mark" their inventions as patented severely limits or bars any damages. Basically, every possible defense shows up.

And then come the counterclaims on 10 specific patents, listed here:

Patent 7,827,208: Generating a feed of stories personalized for members of a social network
Patent 7,945,653: Tagging digital media
Patent 6,288,717: Headline posting algorithm
Patent 6,216,133: Method for enabling a user to fetch a specific information item from a set of information items, and a system for carrying out such a method
Patent 6,411,949: Customizing database information for presentation with media selections
Patent 6,236,978: System and method for dynamic profiling of users in one-to-one applications
Patent 7,603,331: System and method for dynamic profiling of users in one-to-one applications and for validating user rules.
Patent 8,103,611: Architectures, systems, apparatus, methods, and computer-readable medium for providing recommendations to users and applications using multidimensional data
Patent 8,005,896: System for controlled distribution of user profiles over a network
Patent 8,150,913: System for controlled distribution of user profiles over a network

It's worth noting that only the first two of those patents initially started life with Facebook. The others it picked up along the way. Though, it does appear as though that last patent was issued... today. Overall, these patents look just about as silly as most of the ones that Yahoo used to sue in the first place, but that's the nature of patents these days (especially software patents). Facebook is using what it has to fight back against Yahoo, but the whole thing seems like an incredibly silly waste of time, money and resources for both companies.

Thank you for reading this Techdirt post. With so many things competing for everyone’s attention these days, we really appreciate you giving us your time. We work hard every day to put quality content out there for our community.

Techdirt is one of the few remaining truly independent media outlets. We do not have a giant corporation behind us, and we rely heavily on our community to support us, in an age when advertisers are increasingly uninterested in sponsoring small, independent sites — especially a site like ours that is unwilling to pull punches in its reporting and analysis.

While other websites have resorted to paywalls, registration requirements, and increasingly annoying/intrusive advertising, we have always kept Techdirt open and available to anyone. But in order to continue doing so, we need your support. We offer a variety of ways for our readers to support us, from direct donations to special subscriptions and cool merchandise — and every little bit helps. Thank you.

–The Techdirt Team

Filed Under: counterclaim, patent war, stockpiling
Companies: facebook, yahoo

27 Comments

If you liked this post, you may also be interested in...

Reader Comments

Subscribe: RSS

View by: Time | Thread

btr1701 (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 2:05pm

Faceback? ;-)
[ link to this | view in thread ]
:Lobo Santo (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 2:08pm

Preferably
If they had a real nuclear war, it would at least be decisive...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Noah Callaway, 3 Apr 2012 @ 2:09pm

And the money goes to...
Lawyers win.

Everybody else loses.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
weneedhelp (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 2:23pm

Re:
Sounds like a Facebook archive.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Jeremy2020 (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 2:45pm

I'm thinking extra cheese on the popcorn. Did Yahoo think facebook was going to settle?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Baldaur Regis (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 2:53pm

Someday, when people have had enough of stupid, software patents will be abolished and protections will be limited to simple plagiarism.

*takes another bong hit*

And someday, every home in America will have Color TV and men will walk on the moon.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 3 Apr 2012 @ 2:59pm

How Predictable. Our patent system is such a mess.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Mike42 (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 3:12pm

Re: And the money goes to...
Exactly. Someone needs to make a comic where each headquarters has a nuclear cloud above it, and lines of lawyers streaming from each carrying suitcases of cash and wearing shit-eating grins. The lines would intermingle in the foreground, with the lawyers from each side laughing and slapping each other on the back.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
This Space Intentionally Left Blank, 3 Apr 2012 @ 3:19pm

Wouldn't it be nice if...
they could completely destroy each other AND take microshaft with them?

Sweet dreams are made of these ...
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 3 Apr 2012 @ 3:26pm

North Korea wipo tech transfer
This just out:

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/04/03/exclusive-cash-for-computers-is-un-busting-its-own-s anctions-in-north-korea/#comment
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Phucque Owwwff, 3 Apr 2012 @ 3:31pm

You are linking to the enemy.
Fox "news"? Don't you have a functional mind?.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
The Infamous Joe (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 4:47pm

Re: Re:
He didn't want to get sued by FaceB*ok.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
The Moondoggie, 3 Apr 2012 @ 5:04pm

Finally Facebook and Yahoo face-off.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
V (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 5:07pm

Lesson from the Cold War...
In the Cold War, there were top level spies who didn't want peace. Why? Because they would lose their money, power and influence.

Same thing now... only it's the lawyers who gain from mutually assured destruction.

I'm fairly certain that the signers of the Constitution would personally line up the writers of every piece of Copyright and Patent legislation and introduce them to the 2nd amendment.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 3 Apr 2012 @ 5:14pm

This is retarded. Most of those have prior art and were invented by random people who never patented them. But with the USA being what it is,... well.. enjoy.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 3 Apr 2012 @ 8:24pm

Re: Re:
Or a wa to recover lost or stolen faces
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Atkray (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 9:54pm

Re:
Don't forget with jewels like TPP we are exporting this. Coming soon to a country near you.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
TtfnJohn (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 10:07pm

Just why is it that I recall doing all those things with an IBM mainframe back in the 80s at work? And not thinking anything about it.

Has no one at the patent office heard of things like prior art, originality and all that good stuff that's supposed to apply to a patent, including things like it can't be obvious?

NEWS FLASH
Yahoo and Facebook will both apply for patent covering the ability to keep time across a network that will take into account the rotation of planet Earth and additionally claim a patent on the forces of gravitation, strong and weak nuclear forces et al, just to make darned sure they've covered everything! ;-)
[ link to this | view in thread ]
SofaKing (profile), 3 Apr 2012 @ 11:50pm

Re: You are linking to the enemy.
I love FOX it's what I watch when I need a vacation from reality.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 4 Apr 2012 @ 1:59am

I don't have much of an idea about patents, I'm afraid, but I'll tell you how such tussling makes me feel: there's no more naked a sign of how little the companies involved care about me as a customer. There was a time when Google and Facebook (for example) felt like they represented a genuinely responsive relationship with me; their advances were my advances, and the whole thing felt flush and beneficial. Now, aside from a clutch of other issues, this cold war makes me feel like a pointless skin-sack unit of money production. Of course, that's the schematic of how all companies operate, let's not be so naive, but to have it rubbed in your face is the point when it becomes time to move on. Find some other blossoming little-guys to support, because even if those little guys grow into ogres, I'll have had the best of them.

Anyway! The patent bunfight may be a billion dollar enterprise, but it also seems to me that it's where the tragedy of the commons meets the cash-on-the-table principle. I think, for our ongoing society to have any chance of anything worthwhile, it's these kinds of overlaps that would need to be addressed. There's a universe of difference between doing something because it represents robust opportunity and lucidly useful role, and another just because you can legally get away hitting someone in the face with shovels until they are forced to give you all of their money.

My grandmother certainly wouldn't approve, sheesh.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Eugenijus, 4 Apr 2012 @ 2:18am

Their patents are, at best, worthless and that using their right to due process in face of negotiation breakdown, relegates them to "troll" status. Yet a company who profits by mining user information and selling it to advertisers is elevated to a "real company'. Really?
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 4 Apr 2012 @ 4:59am

This is what happens when you let authored projects or Copyrightable works be patented. Patenting software algorithms is ridiculous. Has anyone looked at Facebooks patents?
http://www.seobythesea.com/2010/01/facebook-patent-filings/
They are laughable. The majority of them are nothing but a form on a computer that has some javascript tied to it and then they give it a fancy name saying they did something new with it. Take a look at them, it totally proves that the patent office has no clue and all they want are the exorbitant fees.
Patents and Copyright are simply a Government License to Litigate.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Ninja (profile), 4 Apr 2012 @ 7:16am

I hope this sparks a full scale nuclear fight where all sides decimate each other beyond repair. Then we might be free to scrap the patent system and start over.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Anonymous Coward, 4 Apr 2012 @ 7:24am

USA are in paranoia mode.

I think I will move my sites and domains to European hosts.

Or there is a patent for "moving sites and domains"?

Enjoy destroing yourself. bye
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Renata, 5 Apr 2014 @ 5:35am

I think that between Facebook and Yahoo are the personal differences which affected the online space.
[ link to this | view in thread ]
Tbiuras, 11 Feb 2016 @ 6:39am

fights
constant struggle - which is better
[ link to this | view in thread ]
paslaugu kainos, 23 Feb 2017 @ 11:18am

Why
Why do you compare facebook, google and yahoo? I am not sure if yahoo has its own social network
[ link to this | view in thread ]