Snowden & Greenwald Reveal PM John Key Lied About Kiwi Mass Surveillance; Key Hits Back By Calling Greenwald 'A Loser'
from the not-very-convincing dept
Over the weekend, Glenn Greenwald made it clear that he was going to reveal evidence of domestic mass surveillance on New Zealanders by the GCSB (the Kiwi version of the NSA). The plan was to reveal it at a political event organized by Kim Dotcom. Before Greenwald even had the chance, New Zealand Prime Minister John Key tried to preempt the story by claiming that the country had considered such options, but never actually went through with it. He also used the opportunity to toss out random ad hominem insults at Greenwald, because that's always convincing."Dotcom's little henchman is wrong," says Mr Key..... "I'm probably not going to jump in front of what information he's got," says Mr Key. "It's up to the henchman to go and deliver that information I suppose, but mark my words, he's wrong. I'm right and I'll prove I'm right."Except he did try to "jump in front" by revealing that there were plans in place for such a system and in promising to "declassify and release top secret documents" that would prove his side of the story.
This morning, Greenwald delivered on his half of the bargain with a detailed look at how the NSA was relying on New Zealand to change its laws to further legalize GCSB domestic surveillance. Greenwald got a further assist from Ed Snowden himself who wrote about how he regularly had access to New Zealanders' metadata, collected by the GCSB. Snowden's really damning point is that there was a simple "checkbox" if he wanted to turn off such searches:
Greenwald's piece further details how the NSA was pushing New Zealand to pass a new law last year to finalize the full legalization of this kind of surveillance, noting that the legal change was considered the final blockade on such a program. As we noted last year, while most of the world was passing laws to cut back on domestic surveillance, New Zealand was actually passing a law to expand those powers. While that bill was being debated, New Zealand Prime Minister John Key insisted that it was not enabling broad new domestic surveillance options, even though it was pretty clear from the text of the law.If you have doubts, which would be quite reasonable, given what the last year showed us about the dangers of taking government officials at their word, I invite you to confirm this for yourself. Actual pictures and classified documentation of XKEYSCORE are available online now, and their authenticity is not contested by any government. Within them you’ll find that the XKEYSCORE system offers, but does not require for use, something called a “Five Eyes Defeat,” the Five Eyes being the U.S., U.K., Canada, Australia, and yes, New Zealand.
This might seem like a small detail, but it’s very important. The Five Eyes Defeat is an optional filter, a single checkbox. It allows me, the analyst, to prevent search results from being returned on those countries from a particular search. Ask yourself: why do analysts have a checkbox on a top secret system that hides the results of mass surveillance in New Zealand if there is no mass surveillance in New Zealand?
At the time Key vehemently denied that it was legalizing domestic mass surveillance, responding to such claims by arguing "none of that is true." And yet, Greenwald highlights documents that show that the domestic surveillance program was entirely in place, just waiting for that last legal hurdle to be knocked down:
But in high-level discussions between the Key government and the NSA, the new law was clearly viewed as the crucial means to empower the GCSB to engage in metadata surveillance. On more than one occasion, the NSA noted internally that Project Speargun, in the process of being implemented, could not and would not be completed until the new law was enacted. The NSA apparently viewed that new law as providing exactly the powers that Key repeatedly and publicly denied it would vest.And, of course, Key did this with pure and blatant FUD. At the time, he went on and on about immediate threats to the nation:
The Prime Minister says the country faces genuine security threats, while his opponents reckon he's being manipulative.Except there doesn't appear to be any evidence to support that. Just evidence that the NSA really, really wanted this bill to pass. As Greenwald highlights with newly revealed Snowden documents:
[....] John Key says he has received some briefings from intelligence agencies that have deeply concerned him. "I think it would cut dead some of the most fancible claims I've heard lately from those who oppose this Bill."
Critically, the NSA documents note in more than one place that completion of Speargun was impeded by one obstacle: The need to enact a new spying law that would allow the GCSB, for the first time, to spy on its own citizens as well as legal residents of the country. As one NSA planning document put it, completion of Speargun was “awaiting new GCSB Act expected July 2013.”
"People got really wound up about me calling him Dotcom's little henchman. I would have a modicum of respect for the guy if he had the guts to turn up here six months before the election, or six months after. If this loser is going to come to town and try and tell me, five days before an election, staying at the Dotcom mansion with all the Dotcom people and being paid by Dotcom, that he's doing anything other than Dotcom's bidding - please don't insult me with that."Except, of course, Greenwald has long explained that Dotcom agreed to pay Greenwald's usual speaking fee to charity (though, he did pay for Greenwald's flight to New Zealand). But, honestly, anyone following Glenn Greenwald for more than about five minutes would know that the guy is not exactly the kind of person who takes orders from anyone, no matter who's paying for what.
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Filed Under: ed snowden, gcsb, glenn greenwald, insults, john key, kim dotcom, metadata, surveillance, truth
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Re:
They defend their liars vigorously and will not even admit it in the face of exposing truth.
In short, the average politician in power these days. The only time a liar of this type will ever admit to a small portion of the truth is when that small truth finally suits them better than the original lie. Which incidentally just comes out as another lie.
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I too participate in the US political process.
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Re:
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Enough Is Enough!
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Re: Enough Is Enough!
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Re: Re: Enough Is Enough!
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Re: Re: Re: Enough Is Enough!
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Enough Is Enough!
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For sale!
Options include:
Terrorism
Paedophiles
Criminals
Governments
Hurry now, before they're gone!
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Re: Re: Enough Is Enough!
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Re: Enough Is Enough!
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Re: Enough Is Enough!
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Note to Key
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Re: Note to Key
All you need to do is monitor which way a certain section of the population is voting, make sure those are the ones likely to not notice if their vote was mysteriously changed and hey presto! another term for someone....
In the interests of fairness and balance I'm obligated to say it could be anyone...but its John Key.
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Re: What makes you think the NZ election result hasn't ALREADY been decided?
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Re: Note to Key
Bad advice. You don't want to change horses in midstream.
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remember when....
https://torrentfreak.com/new-zealand-prime-minister-apologizes-to-kim-dotcom-120927/
I guess Key wasn't sincere.
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...goddammit. Anyone know how to get derp out of a cotton shirt?
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How very telling that one of the major concerns is the timing of the revelation for Key. I expect it was done on purpose to damage Key as much as possible just prior to the election. Something he himself would not be afraid to do to an opponent were the positions reversed and would be crowing to high heaven about his new 'facts'.
This alone tells me that Key knows how damaging it is and likely it he sees it as more important to the voters most likely because it's true and knows the exposure damages him worse in his eyes through his own conscience. His reactions are one you would expect from someone guilty.
It is also telling that the Hollywood side immediately jumped in claiming it was all lies. Would anyone care to bet that emails were being scrubbed while the denial was going on?
No this is the point where all the lies catch up to the government. Greenwald has not been known for lying in his Snowden releases. They have provided the proof more times than not we were being lied to by the government and suddenly the supporters were caught in their own lies while trying to change the story. If anyone has a shred of credibility in this, it isn't NSA, GCSB, GCHQ, nor the political supporters behind them. Everyone one of that group have been caught in multiple lies and it should be recognized that the truth will not come from them willingly.
I tend to believe it is the absolute truth in the claims of scheming. Hollywood is no better when it comes to the truth and what is moral than the government and is often at the initial push to make things happen, legal or not. We don't even need to bring up things like Rojadirect, the ICE actions, or the COLP actions in trying to do domain closures without court orders.
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(Seriously, what it is about Glenn Greenwald that reduces grown men to hurling 4th-grade insults? Aside from the fact that they can't actually refute anything in his stories...)
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Literal forth graders
My experience with the internet is that this is typical, though I have presumed that not all of them are actually forth graders.
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Re: Literal forth graders
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It is just a little sad....
I know it is probably the only way to change things but still i feel like we are using their tactics: the blitz attack. It just shouldn't be necessary in a real democratic society.
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Re: It is just a little sad....
Since polls indicated Humphrey was going to win the election, he decided not to publicize Nixon's clear-cut treason.
The polls were wrong, Nixon went on to win the presidency. And he continued in style.
Sorry, but there is no point to let those kinds of crime rest until after election. It is a disservice to keep the voters in the dark about things that deserve to let an enemy of the people lose an election.
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Re: Re: It is just a little sad....
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-21768668
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Re: Re: It is just a little sad....
What I was thinking of, was that if it is the case, they shouldn't hold stories back until just before the election.
I would like to think that it is just a coincidence that the story was finished and published now, but we see this tactic all the time, so it's hard to trust the motives.
Even if it was the case I also believe it to be ultimately for the better if this man was replaced, but I still wouldn't like the method.
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Close, but I think you're a little off-track here. The various trade deals and whatnot are not being instigated to benefit the USA (and they don't). They're being instigated to benefit multinational corporations and the extremely wealthy.
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More like trying to bring the U.S.' abject contempt for laws into other countries.
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I've been telling friends in NZ
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But we do it for you. Well not you directly, we do it for multinational corporations mainly.
But they do it for you.
Well thats not entirely true I suppose.
They do it for their shareholders.
But the Shareholder do it for you. Actually that's an outright lie but there have been so many whats one more.
Look their are terrorists everywhere.
There's probably one under your bed right now. Don't bother checking they're probably armed. Oh you did check? There was nothing there?
Hey hey lets just all calm down and forget about this.
Or at the very least lets attack the messenger. Look at him and his henchmen. That Snowden gets my goat. he lives in Russia you know. He's a communist. i mean he has to live there because he said something his government doesn't like.
Now thats the country I want to live in. Anyone says something you don't like. Bang, they're gone!!!
And thank god for John Key.
Cause that's where he's taking us.
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What do you do when the facts speak for themselves...
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Watch The Presentation
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Pot, Kettle, Black
GET THIS NEWS OUT TO THE MAINSTREAM NZ PRESS NOW, BEFORE HE GETS RE-ELECTED!! This guy needs to be turfed out, then charged with treason.
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If they know what we are doing all the time it is a lot easier to rule us. Except I don't want to be ruled. I will submit to government authority that I have had a hand in making but this is something much more nefarious. Where are our governments going with all this surveillance.
In a war two things give one side an advantage. If they know what the other side is doing and if they can destroy the other sides ability to communicate.
What does it all mean?
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The Robot Labor Revolution
* I'm too lazy to make a link right now but it's easy to Google and has its own Wikipedia entry.
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An important point
promising to "declassify and release top secret documents" that would prove his side of the story.
With that statement, there's only two real possibilities. Either the documentation should never have been classified in the first place, and it was only classified in order to hide the actions of the government from the people, or, it was legitimately classified, and he's releasing it, despite the threat the information going public poses to the public, as nothing more than a political ploy to try and defend himself.
It goes without saying that neither option makes Key look good.
If this loser is going to come to town and try and tell me, five days before an election
This? This all but reeks of desperation and lashing out at what he knows is a perfectly timed release.
Releasing the information after the election wouldn't do any good, people might get upset, but unless it was so massive as to force him to resign, he could just weather it out.
Releasing it months before the election likewise wouldn't do much good, as that gives them plenty of time to spin it in his favor, or just wait for the uproar to die out. Not exactly going to work very well.
However, releasing the information less than a week before the election? Perfect timing. It will be fresh on people's minds, there's not enough time for him to effectively spin it or try and bury it under some other inconsequential distraction, both of these increase massively the odds that he can, at least in part, be held accountable for his actions and lies, by people refusing to vote for him and giving him the boot.
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Stay tuned. :)
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