U2 Claims It's Working With Apple On A New Music Format That 'Can't Be Pirated'
from the because-that-will-work dept
Apparently U2's deal with Apple goes further than taking a bunch of cash and dumping unwanted music files on hundreds of millions of iTunes users. The band has said that it's working on a brand new music format that "can't be pirated." Oh really? We've heard that before, many, many times. And every time someone claims that, whatever new DRM they created gets broken without hours. I imagine the same will be true of this. The format sounds like a rehash of other things that have been tried and failed before:[The new format will be] an audiovisual interactive format for music that can’t be pirated and will bring back album artwork in the most powerful way, where you can play with the lyrics and get behind the songs when you’re sitting on the subway with your iPad or on these big flat screens. You can see photography like you’ve never seen it before.Of course, we've been hearing this for years. Five years ago, the major labels were all going to team up to create "CMX", a new music format that had all those audiovisual components. Where's that now? Every few years we see startups claiming to have created a similar new music format that builds in all those audiovisual components... and no one cares. Is it possible that Apple with the help of U2 will suddenly figure it out? Sure. It's possible. But I wouldn't bet on it. Especially if it includes annoying DRM that no one wants.
Apple itself figured out long ago that DRMing its music was actually a bad deal since it made the music less valuable to consumers. Would the company really switch back in the other direction? While U2 claims that this magical new music format "will prove so irresistibly exciting to music fans that it will tempt them again into buying music — whole albums as well as individual tracks," it once again shows how little U2 understands about the way fans interact with music these days. The ability to share what you're listening to with others and to build on that experience is what excites people -- and that's true whether its unauthorized sharing or through streaming services like Spotify that allow users to share what they're listening to. Locking stuff up with fancy graphics isn't "irresistibly exciting." It's just something most people will ignore.
Besides, we already have an "audiovisual interactive format for music that can't be pirated," and it's called a concert.
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Filed Under: business models, copyright, drm, music formats, u2
Companies: apple
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The Only Real Piracy Immune Music Format
Completely 100% piracy free. But it would never succeed.
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Re: The Only Real Piracy Immune Music Format
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Re: Re: The Only Real Piracy Immune Music Format
Think Hotel California.
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Re: Re: Re: The Only Real Piracy Immune Music Format
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Re: The Only Real Piracy Immune Music Format
Make sure that no one can listen to the music.
After all, pirates could just record the music when it's playing to make a pirate-able copy!
It's the same thing with art work, simply prevent anyone from viewing the original, then no one can make copies of it!
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Re: Re: The Only Real Piracy Immune Music Format
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Re: The Only Real Piracy Immune Music Format
there's a bunch of youtube videos of musicians of all skill levels performing various songs.
if songs become more scarce, the void will be filled by these folks.
if you can hear it, it's reproduce-able.
it might be better than the original..
it might be worse than the original..
either way, the original artist is best served being the person associated with what people are listening to.
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That format is called "Give away our album for free and let someone else foot the bill".
The only other way I can think of "can't be pirated" is watching millions of people demanding Apple take the ridiculous album off their device.
No one pirates crap they don't want, as far as I know.
Bono should be taking good notes about the backlash of giving away an album no one wanted or asked for.
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Re:
U2 discovers that the best way to keep people from pirating their music is to get Apple to buy it and give it away - but Bono still can't shut his f***ing mouth.
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Bono and Apple figured out how to fight piracy by releasing music not even a pirate would want.
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Re: Re: Re:
Sell the music up-front to a distributor...
For bonus points, sell them the recording tracks as well as the mixdown. In Apple's case, that means they could sell the track bundle as a GarageBand song and let people remix and get creative with it. Using a Creative Commons Share and Share Alike license would prevent piracy.
If U2 was unhappy about such a solution, they could always just release the non-vocal tracks. under such a license, and sell the lyrics separately. Then people would have to get Bono on the phone to sing over the backing track if they wanted to hear it in its "original glory".
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Actually I'm pretty due there are many thousands of U2 fans who are pretty happy about it. Don't protect your musical opinions on everyone else, they don't count for much.
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They knew no one would pirate it so they tried giving it away. Apparently, that didn't work either.
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I guess it's a good thing they've never heard of the microphone before... or maybe it's a song with 3 minutes of silence no one would want to pirate.
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I'm not actually sure what makes any music "classic". I think it's connected to nostalgia rather than quality. In my mind, The Joshua Tree isn't a classic because I've barely heard the music and have no nostalgic connection to it.
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When I am thinking about who to work with for developing complex software designed to prevent people from accessing it in an unauthorized manner, I always have out-of-touch aging rock stars at the top of my list.
If this is being worked on, somewhere there is a group of Apple developers rolling there eyes at the notion that U2 could be adding any kind of value to their work.
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The real problem with this
The misguided thing is the "interactive, multimedia" part. Your writeup actually does focus on this, so kudos to you!
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Re: The real problem with this
Indeed. In their never-ending quest to stamp out piracy, I believe they've lost sight of what music actually is.
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Re: Re: The real problem with this
But they will say that's piracy too...
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The only music which cannot be pirated is no music...
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Re:
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Watching recordings of concerts might still be enjoyable, and record labels will surely continue freaking out about unauthorized videos cutting into their DVD and live album sales, or just generally defying their sense of entitlement. But the actual experience of going to see live music -- something people have enjoyed and sought out for centuries -- is a naturally scarce, rivalrous product that can't be freely replicated, and thus the perfect place to be making money.
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No. Not really.
No. I wouldn't even go that far. There is still a visceral perceptual quality to a live performance that cannot be replicated in any known recording format.
I would tend to go the other way.
A bad live performance trumps even a good studio recording simply because it's not something than can be replicated (really).
U2's own rise to stardom likely depended on this fact.
They are after all the band that was too bad to play covers of other people's music. So they had to write their own.
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Um, No.
There is still a visceral perceptual quality to a live performance that cannot be replicated in any known recording format.
A recording of a bad concert is no substitute for attending. The recording simply cannot convey how bad the experience actually was. You should have to suffer the full horror of the live performance like everyone else.
Also pirates should have to suffer through the bad concert, and pay for it, like everyone else who got ripped off.
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It's called enhanced interrogation techniques.
The US doesn't torture. It merely inflicts terrible things upon people in order to coerce them to say something, anything, to make it stop.
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me harties!
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Admittedly, I'm pretty tired of watching these guys maintain and try to strengthen control over all things entertaining. They feel that they have some inherent right to these things which is most certainly not in line with the intentions of copyrights much less reality.
I lost interest in anything new from U2 around 1985 and never heard Bono speak or sing anything remotely interesting since. Sure, they're better musicians all around but your approach to who ultimately gets control of everything that you make (like anyone 'representing the MAFIAA gang) is devoid of sense, imagination and foresight (as in benefiting society "foresight"). Pity. Bono is just another boy that turned into another man working for the man, but good luck anyway.
I'd be happier if they all got over themselves and stop the never-ending full frontal assault on creation and communication.
Honestly, you're all a bunch of puss greedy bastards with a warped sense of ownership and the all encompassing sense of entitlement that has morphed into something grotesque. I might add you are the very thing you claim your customers or potential customers already are. You're your own gifts to humanity - as if you and your expressionless whoring of art were created in the vacuum of space and time.
How about you leave the new music formats to the professionals, customers and engineers, and you just keep making your music.
Oh yeah, U2, for fuck's sake.. get a new god damn manager. You're guy's an idiot prick milking the milk man.
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Concerts?
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Re: Concerts?
Concerts are about the experience, and we as of yet can't pirate memories.
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Re: Concerts?
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The bottle neck here is the audio equipment not the music format(s).
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Makes perfect sense
Ahh, makes perfect sense. Who better than an aging, technophobe rocker to help you develop a brand new, state-of-the-art technology.
In other news, I hear Bill Gates & Steve Ballmer will be reuniting to help U2 write their next album.
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Does anyone buy albums?
Last time I listened to an album: Spotify's discovery mode.
I don't think any level of extras on an album will make me pay money for just that specific album.
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Re: Does anyone buy albums?
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Re: Re: Does anyone buy albums?
Quick, no cheating - what were the last 5 albums you bought?
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Re: Re: Re: Does anyone buy albums?
Nope. Nothing. I have made mistakes a couple of times (it can sometimes be a little tricky determining whether a given label is part of RIAA or not), but never intentionally. I haven't in about 20 years.
Mostly, I buy my music directly from indie bands. About half of the time, no label is involved at all.
"you'd be missing out on a ton of music"
Of course. But I'm missing out on a ton of music no matter what, so that's irrelevant. There is more excellent music available from non-label bands alone than I have years left in my life to hear.
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Re: Does anyone buy albums?
Then again, I'm older and my idea of a short attention span is "an hour", so it's completely natural for me to stop everything else I'm doing and listen to one all the way through. I recognize, though, that very few people under 40 will do this and almost none under 30: it's just not how music is enjoyed any more, and artists who want to be successful need to accommodate that.
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Re: Does anyone buy albums?
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SUCCESS!
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Progress!
/s
just goes to show how out of touch these guys are...
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I suspect the new system will be for large company's to pay for the music so that it can be given away for 'free'. Hence no possible way to pirate it.
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Re:
If someone gives me a copy of the album from theirs, that's piracy. It was not given with the sanction of the company.
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Piracy of a concert
Actually, with a good seating position and a decent digital stereo recorder, you can pirate a concert. It won't sound as good, but it will probably be decent. One caveat - just don't get caught!
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Re: Piracy of a concert
I suppose some iMax recordings can sortof approach it, but even then it's not nearly the same.
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Re: Piracy of a concert
Even then. Properly configuring surround speakers is a dark art that can easily be botched. It's a chore that many may not ever want to bother with.
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Re: Re: Piracy of a concert
That's precisely what those iMax concert recordings are trying to do. And it kinda-sorta works. However, you're still watching something on a screen -- even if it is a huge spherical screen surrounding you -- rather than taking part in a concert.
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Re: Re: Re: Piracy of a concert
That actually strikes me as a really cool thing to do with Oculus Rift. Sell a closer concert experience for people who hate to leave the house (like me!).
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Re: Re: Piracy of a concert
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Wow
What can't they do? You know, other than keep people out of your iCloud...
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Many fans would rather that FLAC be adapted as the only audio source because it's true lossless audio. Even Apple's lossless audio format doesn't even come close to touching 320kbps. It remains at 256kbps, if you're going by bitrate.
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8.6 courics
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U2 already figured out a piracy free format. If you put out a crap album then no one wants it even if it is free.
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U-huh - and I turn lead into Gold...
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"Free to copy" doesn't mean "no terms"
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Recreating the concert experience
• The wafting smell of pot that fading in and out
• That group of narcissist frat boys behind you having an overloud and unrelated conversation about their camping plans for the weekend
• Getting crappy overpriced beer spilled on you as some guy trip over a dozen people trying to carry 7 cups iwith his hands, forearms, chest teeth and chin.
• The pillowy pressure of an overweight girl and her friends progressively infringing upon you personal space, who don't have seats in your section and are trying to inconspicuously hang out in the aisle without the usher noticing.
• Waiting for 20 minutes in line just to pee, while listening to one of your favorite songs muffled from a quarter mile away.
• A drunk girl screaming the lyrics to your favorite ballad, thus mitigating your enjoyment
• Shivering uncontrollably for the last half of the concert because you forgot how cold it gets in California in the summer after the sun goes down. Then paying $50 for a concert sweatshirt you really don't want.
• Hanging out in your car at midnight for 45 minutes after the show—moving about 14 inches feet ever minute—trying to exit the parking lot with that nauseous "my body needs sleep" feeling.
If you can figure out how to pirate that, I can't wait to see it. ;-)
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Re: Recreating the concert experience
• Having your hearing damaged by the ridiculously excessive volume, and...
From personal experience, I'll add:
• Having an asshole repeatedly mosh into you because you happen to be stuck at the edge of the pit and having to repeatedly turn around to push him away so that when you turn back to the stage...
• Having someone stage-dive on your face, leaving your bleeding all over the place, and leaving you with a sneaker print on your face.
Concerts suck.
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Fail
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Re: Fail
Can't commit copyright infringement if there is no copyright to infringe
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It will Suck!!
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bono?
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Magic UNCRACKABLE!!! format announced. Suddenly a million strong horde out to crack it simply to prove they are smarter, no matter that the format is still unused.
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Brilliant
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Ah yes. Brilliant idea!
And the whole multimedia experience will maybe attract a small niche of people who aren't doing anything else while listening to music. It is progress on some small level so I welcome it, but it is by no means groundbreaking.
Sure there is Mac's and PC's that will be able to play this, but how the heck are you going to prevent people from recording the output channel? There are plenty of programs to do just that or just plain physical devices. Nobody needs to break the DRM.
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What's the point?
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The Basic Problem - WHY??
DVD? *Way* better than VHS in sharpness, convenience, size and handling, etc. CD? Far better than vinyl or cassette. MP3 - play anywhere on anything, no hassles. Digital photos? Far cheaper, faster, more convenient, fit more in a camera than film. Keurig or Tassimo - so much more convenient than paper filters and grounds, even if the coffee is more expensive... and so on.
So what's going to replace our current music format? Can a new format be significantly cheaper than MP3? No, not unless music sellers are going to cut album prices to $5 or less. More convenient? It's a file played on an electronic device -computer, iPod, phone - how do you change that? better quality? Heck, I can't tell my 128bit MP3 from the 320bit. Think anything is going to improve on that? Most music is listened to in the car, or walking down the street - noise cancelling might be great, but the music file itself - won't be noticeably different when competing with ambient noise.
the same can be said of video - unless someone has a better idea than the competing MP4, DIVX and similar standards, they aren't going anywhere. DIVX beat MPG/MP2/VOB because it could crunch the file down by a half to a quarter; I doubt there's much more you can squeeze it. Quality? You can already get 1080p. Price? Kind of irrelevant in video, it's formatted to whatever the market wants, and if too badly overpriced, is competing against free.
the only advantage I can see of a new format is for the publishers, but they aren't the ones making the buying decisions. The ones that fail to sell what the pubic wants will be the last to get profits.
I suspect this U2 pet project is just something Jobs then Cook nodded along with to get their trained monkeys onstage to go perform for the big events. It won't go anywhere.
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Good music.
I've bought full albums from exactly two new bands in the past year, singles from probably a dozen more, as well as a Ultra Special Super Duper Fancy Edition CD from my favorite band that came with a bunch of extras including DVDs and a beautiful goddamn coffee table book, of all things. But 99.99% of music these days is overproduced pop trash or ridiculously twee faux-folk crap, neither of which appeal to my tastes in the slightest. A new filetype is not going to entice me into buying drivel that barely manages to hide its corporate influences, sorry Bono.
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The secret to ending all piracy.
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Of course, that still wouldn't stop an ordinary microphone from recording the output. And some hacker somewhere would naturally want to take those special speakers apart to figure out how the DRM works, at which point you might as well have just flushed all those millions of development dollars down the toilet.
Finally, who would want to pay extra for "piracy-proof music" speakers, when you could just download the music off the internet and use the speakers you already have?
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That 'Can't Be Pirated'
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The U2 secret to unpiratable music, revealed!
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Challenge Accepted.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PdpHz8JNTo
Challenge accomplished.
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Re:
If you think watching a YouTube video is the same as being at a concert, then you've never been to a concert.
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It sounds like the ones you go to suck, true. Try one of the ones that don't include mosh pits.
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