Congressional Rep. John Carter Discovers Encryption; Worries It May One Day Be Used On Computers To Protect Your Data
from the i-don't-know-anything-about-this-stuff dept
Here's a suggestion: if you're a Congressional Representative whose job it is to regulate all sorts of important things, and you state in a hearing "I don't know anything about this stuff" before spouting off on your crazy opinions about how something must be done... maybe, just maybe educate yourself before confirming to the world that you're ignorant of the very thing you're regulating. We famously saw this during the SOPA debate, where Representatives seemed proud of their own ignorance. As we noted at the time, it's simply not okay for Congress to be proud of their own ignorance of technology, especially when they're in charge of regulating it. But things have not changed all that much apparently.We already wrote about FBI Director James Comey's bizarre Congressional hearing earlier this week, in which he warned those in attendance about the horrible world that faced us when the FBI couldn't spy on absolutely everything. But the folks holding the hearing were suckers for this, and none more so than Rep. John Carter. The ACLU's Chris Soghoian alerts us to the following clip of Carter at that hearing, which he says "is going to be the new 'The Internet is a Series of Tubes'" video. I would embed the video, but for reasons that are beyond me, C-SPAN doesn't use HTTPS so an embed wouldn't work here (randomly: Soghoian should offer CSPAN a bottle of whiskey to fix that...).
Here's the basic transcript though:
Rep. John Carter: I'm chairman of Homeland Security Appropriations. I serve on Defense and Defense subcommittees. We have all the national defense issues with cyber. And now, sir, on this wonderful committee. So cyber is just pounding me from every direction. And every time I hear something, or something just pops in my head -- because I don't know anything about this stuff. If they can do that to a cell phone why can't they do that to every computer in the country, and nobody can get into it? If that's the case, then that's the solution to the invaders from around the world who are trying to get in here. [Smug grin]Holy crap! Rep. John Carter just learned about encryption! And he thinks it's only on mobile phones but (ooooh, scary) might one day be used on "big super computers" to keep stuff safe. But he doesn't realize that it's been widely used for many, many, many years to keep his very own data safe and many of ours as well.
FBI Director Comey: [Chuckle and gives smug, knowing grin]
Carter: Then if that gets to be the wall, the stone wall, and even the law can't penetrate it, then aren't we creating an instrument [that] is the perfect tool for lawlessness. This is a very interesting conundrum that's developing in the law. If they, at their own will at Microsoft can put something in a computer -- or at Apple -- can put something in that computer [points on a smartphone], which it is, to where nobody but that owner can open it, then why can't they put it in the big giant super computers, that nobody but that owner can open it. And everything gets locked away secretly. And that sounds like a solution to this great cyber attack problem, but in turn it allows those who would do us harm [chuckles] to have a tool to do a great deal of harm where law enforcement can't reach them. This is a problem that's gotta be solved.
The conversation continues with Carter again demonstrating confusion over some rather basic concepts:
Carter: If you're following the Bill of Rights, you have every right to be able to go before a judge, present your probable cause, and if he sees it, that's a right, get a warrant and get into that machine. And I don't think there's a right of privacy issue in the world that prevents you following the law.Uh, right. There isn't a right of privacy issue that prevents the FBI from going and getting a warrant, but the larger argument is whether or not individuals can protect other things privately -- and they've always been able to do so. If you and I have a conversation just between the two of us, there is no way for the government to then find out what that conversation was about. Because there's no way to "decrypt" a verbal conversation that is now stored entirely in our minds. That's been true forever. Yet we don't see Rep. Carter or Director Comey demanding recording devices to record every conversation. But, to Carter, the fact that you might be able to do the same thing with your email, is a "monster."
Carter: So if that's what they've created, they've created a monster, that will harm law enforcement, national security and everything else in this country. And this really needs to be addressed. And I wasn't even going to talk about that, but that upsets the heck out of me. 'Cause, you know, I don't think that's right.Yeah, Rep. Carter, you're kind of decades too late. And you're totally wrong, too. It didn't create a monster. It didn't harm "everything else in this country." It protected millions of law abiding people -- including Carter by keeping their data safe. That's the whole point of encryption. Saying that "it needs to be addressed" is ridiculous. However, it does make it clear that Rep. Carter was being honest at the beginning when he admitted "didn't know anything about this stuff." Perhaps he should have stopped there.
At the end there's this bizarre dialogue about how law enforcement and judges handle information in a locked safe, but it seems like Carter still doesn't understand the question, finally saying that it's "bad policy" to have a safe that can't be opened by the manufacturer and "a crisis." So is Rep. Carter arguing that all safe's need to have backdoors that the manufacturers can open?
Doesn't Rep. Carter have staffers who can point out to him that computer encryption has been around for decades, and it's what keeps all sorts of stuff safe, including his banking details, his credit card purchases, the confidential memos he receives in Congress and much, much more? And yet, he's suddenly discovered encryption and he's decided it's bad because it might, someday, end up on computers?
And he's in charge of these issues? Yikes!
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Filed Under: encryption, fbi, fud, james comey, john carter
Reader Comments
The First Word
“Perhaps he needs to get out more.
This new-fangled encryption stuff is scary. Maybe he needs to relax and go see a nice movie. I've heard "The Imitation Game" is good.Subscribe: RSS
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Your so full of cyber that when you run into a bears cyber in the woods, you just meld with it.
Or, cyber this!
Or up your cyber with a red hot guidon...sideways (old WWII insult, updated).
Any others?
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Bill learns about rap music
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Representative
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Is too okay
They keep getting re-elected. As long as the voters want politicians who are ignorant about technology, the voters will keep getting these guys.
Is too okay.
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Re: Is too okay
He's not stupid. It's unlikely that he's even actually that dense when it comes to cryptography.
He's playing up fear, ignorance, and respect for authority, in order to appeal to the fearful, ignorant, authority-respecting 50%+1 of voters who will re-elect him.
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Re: Is too okay
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Re: Re: Is too okay
The will of the non-voter is entirely irrelevant, as is the cause of their non-voting status. Additionally, from a practical perspective, a non-voting constituent isn't a constituent. Voting constituents on the losing side of the election are also irrelevant to politicians.
with the low voter turnouts we've seen the last decade plus, it makes it easy for politicians to know who to try to please - and it only seems to be - on average - 10-15% of the registered voters in any given district.
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Re: Re: Re: Is too okay
I actually vote but I don't like my choices sometimes. I feel I'm voting for the lesser of evils. If there was a "None of the above" choice I'd vote that quite a bit. Maybe then a few politicians would get the message.
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Just like the current president who only voted present on almost everything so that he wouldn't have a voting record to hold against him.
Also, elections are run and won on 1 or 2 issues, all the rest are never discussed. So there is no way to know about someone's stance on copyright, encryption, etc.
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This is what happens when you let a Martian in . . .
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Re: This is what happens when you let a Martian in . . .
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What a bonehead!
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Re: What a bonehead!
Um, I suspect he does not use email. Most likely to avoid it being pwnd some day.
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solved
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Perhaps he needs to get out more.
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Re: Perhaps he needs to get out more.
Wait till he finds out computer decryption was invented by a gay man.
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Tell me he's the only one
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Re: Tell me he's the only one
That's all that counts.
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Re: Re: Tell me he's the only one
THIS is the problem right here.
/facepalm
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Re: Tell me he's the only one
Since when did law enforcement need to get into someone's phone to see who they've been texting? Given the right app, they may need to get into the phone to see the actual message, but not to see the recipients. The phone companies will happily help you out there, Mr. Comey.
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Bio
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This is embarrasing...
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Re: This is embarrasing...
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I think the state legislature split Austin into a bunch of districts to make sure the Democrats there don't get represented.
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I think I see the problem here
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Re: I think I see the problem here
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The problem that's gotta be solved is getting this dipshit out of any discussion where technology is involved.
He's a moron, and has no business making "smart people" decisions.
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Give Representative John Carter a break, okay?
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Re: Give Representative John Carter a break, okay?
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Re: Give Representative John Carter a break, okay?
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He should be replaced by a magic 8 ball. It would be much cheaper for the same quality of decision making.
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I'm growing tired of TechDirt's "no HTTPS" whinging
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Re: I'm growing tired of TechDirt's "no HTTPS" whinging
C-SPAN does not make them downloadable. If someone wants to figure out a way to get the actual video, we'd happily post it. But, as a warning, doing so may circumvent technological protection measures in violation of the DMCA section 1201.
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Re: Re: I'm growing tired of TechDirt's "no HTTPS" whinging
https://www.downloadhelper.net/
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Re: Re: Re: Re: I'm growing tired of TechDirt's "no HTTPS" whinging
I've uploaded the clip to vimeo. Perhaps you'll have better luck obtaining it from there.
https://vimeo.com/123539078
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Re: I'm growing tired of TechDirt's "no HTTPS" whinging
A swing and a miss.
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Carter, you clearly failed grade school. You would fail a US Naturalization test if you were to take it today and denied citizenship if you hadn't been born here. You are a disgrace and should never hold public office anywhere in the US on grounds of incompetence alone.
Carter, would you feel the same about encryption if we required all your communications be broadcast in the clear to the public? All cell phone conversations, emails, instant messages, photos, contacts, health records, bank transactions and account information? How about complete transparency of what is discussed in your position on Homeland Security Appropriations, Defense, and Defense subcommittees? No encryption and no redaction.
Sincerely,
A US citizen who actually knows and understands the US Bill of Rights and the utility of encryption.
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Re:
Unless of course, a part of the re-interpretation of the Bill of Rights after 9/11, was to re-purpose the term "unreasonable" to mean something less restrictive.
Thus,
"...against unreasonable searches and seizures..."
might become, for example,
"...against unseasonable searches and seizures...".
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C-Span video URL
http://boingboing.net/2015/03/27/top-homeland-security-congress.html
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Another massive mistake by The Masnick
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Re: Who Is Watching C-SPAN
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...and this is the best that America can put up for office to make laws? Let me ask this then. Were Carter to come into your HR office looking for a job, would you hire him? This is what we have for leaders to make laws? Yah, there ougtta be a law alright. A law that says public servants should at least be educated in the fields they are to make laws over.
No damn wonder this country is in the shape it's in.
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I swear that man could give comedians a month's worth of work in a half hour. And to make it worse, he sounded serious.
As an example, least we forget:
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Depends -- is he willing to work cheaper than my current janitor?
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I think he's referring to the difference between crackable encryption, and the new "uncrackable" technology that Sony, etc. is pushing, and that Comey is bitching about, and not necessarily encryption per se... in the sense that if said technology can make for an uncrackable cellphone, it can make for an uncrackable PC, and as such, would solve a lot of problems, yet at law enforcements expense.
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Except that it's not new, it's been around for decades. It also shouldn't be any more of a hindrance on investigations than the fact that you and I can have a private conversation that they don't get to hear and never get to know about.
Comey and past FBI directors like to parade out the usual scary suspects any time they want to gain more access to data, but they never seem to be able to point to a case where the "bogeyman" got caught because they broke crypto.
We went through this exact same bunch of scare stories back in the '90's.
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Torture Decryption
Haven't you heard? That's what torture is for, to "decrypt" the mind! See how it all makes sense now?
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I'm sure China and Russia are drooling and salivating at the mouth thinking about the prospects of installing their own backdoors/frontdoors in software and technology sold to American consumers and businesses.
Unless Rep. John Carter, is naive enough to think America will be the only country able to corner the entire global market with strictly American frontdoors/backdoors. Foolishly thinking other countries won't be installing/mandating their own versions.
I'm disappointed in American leaders. It's rather obvious the kind of rabbit hole they're leading the entire world down. Either they're not nearly as intelligent as they claim to be. Or they simply can't come to grips with the thought of not having total information control over the global population. Or both.
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End of civilizaiton
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- Confirmed -
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It's one thing that half the people on the planet have no idea...
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In the old days
What's the difference with encryption and encrypted files and systems today? Yes, good encryption is hard to break (like really good safes), but the remedies are similar.
We don't need more restrictions on privacy. We need less! Otherwise, all the petty burglars out there (malware authors) will soon own all of our private stuff.
Idiots like Carter need to have all of their e-stuff pwnd and posted on the internet just to show them how stupid they are...
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Official Minionship
He was obviously hired specifically because of his lack of comprehension and understanding of the things he is being told to regulate.
How is this different from any of the myriad other typical government officials in charge of regulating anything else in America?
It is after all, so much easier for those who run America Co., to direct a moron who has no clue to do their bidding, than it is to direct someone who might actually realize that what they are demanding is stupid and foolish and who might then question their motives and intentions... like for example, someone like Snowden.
This man obviously knows how to do his job perfectly.
He signs the papers that are placed in front of him, speaks the words written out for him to say, and dutifully cashes his paychecks with a large grin on his face.
He is a perfect public servant.
Without such minions, a fascist government could not operate a profitable pseudo-government business like America Co..
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Then stand down, collect your monthly pay, STFU and let other people do their freaking job.
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Holy shit! That's some hardcore Red Scare thinking right there.
Please remind me, why the f**k does US allow representatives in technology, education, security and the like to persist as completely ignorant buffoons.
I mean you just had Lindsey Graham a.k.a "I've Never Sent an Email" spell out his incompetence around three weeks ago.
Also, what's their excuse for being so unfamiliar with 15+ year-old technology ? Are these people routinely older than 65 or just ignorant ?
Don't these old men and women have any younger counsellors to keep them in touch with mainstream technology (at least at the basic level) such as e-mail and putting a password on your phone ?
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My new Mac is encrypted
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Re: My new Mac is encrypted
That was probably just the NSA's hard-coded backdoor process, built into all American and most foreign built hard drives for the last decade or so, installing itself - because you said YES to encryption, meaning you must be a bad guy who is hiding something.
So now only you and the USG can read your drive. :)
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This guy sounds like the CISO at one of the companies I worked for
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Re: This guy sounds like the CISO at one of the companies I worked for
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download C-SPAN videos
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