The Ethical (And Mathematical) Dilemma Of Madoff Investors Who Took Some Money Out

from the what-to-do? dept

With respect to the Bernard Madoff scam, I'd been hearing plenty of people ask "where did the money go?" since there's none left. The answer has always been pretty straightforward: as a Ponzi scheme, much of the money went back out to the earlier investors who took some money out. The rest was probably invested in various investments whose value has gone down to almost nothing in the last few months. However, this is apparently creating something of a quandary for some of those early investors who took money out -- but still had some money (theoretically) still with Madoff. Should they apply for aid from the Securities Investor Protection Corp?

SIPC acts like an FDIC for these types of investments, helping to protect investors in cases of fraud. But some are realizing that if they took money out from Madoff over the years (and some did so profitably), if they go ask for money from the SIPC, it could alert regulators to the fact that they profited from Madoff's scam -- and they could suddenly owe the "profits" they had taken out in the past. The Feds can demand that those who profited from Madoff's scam return the money -- but that will involve actually being able to track them down. For some "victims," it may be better to just keep what they have, keep quiet, and forget what they thought they still had invested with Madoff. But there are concerns for others who have already admitted to cashing out (sometimes a long time ago), are they suddenly going to be forced to return the money they took out of their accounts?

Filed Under: bernard madoff, ethics, profits, scams

Perhaps Wall St. Really Is Just One Big Ponzi Scheme

from the finding-that-last-sucker dept

While we've always been pretty skeptical of the way Wall St. worked, at least it seemed like there was some semblance of reality on which it was based -- even if much of that foundation was a rickety house of cards. Yet, with the revelations coming out about Bernard Madoff's potentially $50 billion fraud, it makes you start to wonder if anything on Wall Street is real. Madoff admitted yesterday that his entire firm was "one big lie" and "basically, a giant Ponzi scheme." It appears that rather than paying investors back based on profits they earned, he was pulling money out of the principal from other investors -- and now there's basically nothing left. Not surprisingly, the firm's website touted Madoff's "high ethical standards." What's even more astounding is that no one happened to notice this was happening until he 'fessed up. At a time when one of the biggest things missing in the market is confidence, this is not going to help. Yes, there is some reality backing at least some of Wall Street, but people are going to have an increasingly difficult time figuring out what is real, and that's not going to encourage much investment. Conceptually, what Wall St. does is provide a very useful service for putting money to use where it's best needed as investment capital. In reality, it looks like there was an awful lot of fraud baked into the system. That's not good for anyone, and the fallout from this is not going to be pretty.

Filed Under: bernard madoff, fraud, ponzi scheme