Re: Re: Re: Not really surprising...I agree with Richard, in that the true impetus behind radical change and commercial upheaval in our society comes from the impetus and actions of people acting without government mandate...
gibberish ,, LAW and courts decide these issues ,, not you
"Phil Collins wins Johnny Mercer songwriting award"
----interesting little piece about musician culture,, but you will have to read between the lines a bit ,,to understand the music culture highlights here -- so Mike you will miss it for sure .
MIKE ::We're not talking about new arrangements. Jazz music is not new arrangements.
Me : sorry mike ,, your are off base ,, out of your venue ,, and just wrong.
Unless you are a "Jazz Jedi Master" ,, you cannot possibly understand what you are writing about with , "Jazz", "innovation", and "cover", RE: copyright issues.
JAZZ vs other forms of music on copyrights ////////////// I think I have found the answer
SL :: "I think the difference is that a jazz player is actually playing the music, while someone who is creating a remix or a mashup is using pieces of another recorded album."
"The jazz musician is not looping another album. He's playing the actual notes on an instrument and not using any notes/sounds taken from a recorded piece from someone else's vinyl or digital file.
"If the music originates from your instruments and/or your voice and you perform it or record it, you have arranged it."
"If you digitally copy segments from a previously recorded album, you are remixing."
---
ME : very accurate and understanding Suzzane !!!!
,, If you are not a musician ,, or deeply involved in music ,, no way you can really understand the ART of Jazz an how innovation , jamming , a "stealing riffs" fit into jazz ( and blues too ) composition.
very tough copyright issues ,,
REMEMBER :: "good faith ed musicians will never sue good faith-ed musicians ",
, is probably no more so than in Jazz and Blues,,, Melody ( and the riffs) is a messy copyright issue.
Chords you cannot copyright at all,,
and lyrics in Jazz , are never the issue.
Jazz is very tricky with Melody copyrights,,
i do not think a Jazz musician , "could sue another Jazz musician" , and ever expect to gig again..
They are a very tight group ,, even in NYC ,, most all jazz pros know each other.
Jazz is really a "musician sub-culture".
Jazz musicians usually only play with other jazz musicians,
, as opposed to ,, "folksingers" and "rockers" and "acid electric - head bangers" ,, who will all jumble together and call himself Niel Young.
Mike , you are just of of your league , legally and musically , on Jazz and copyright issues specifically ,,
I'm going to research the hell out of anything that interests me, so whether or not the research turns up here, I'll still keep looking for it. Knowing what is and isn't allowed in music is useful info for me.
You go girl :) --- you are the best poster here at techdirt SL ,, you bring a great perspective ,, too bad techdirt posters are -- simply too "closed brained" to understand.
The Silent Majority of readers ,, KNOW you are right SL.
uzanne. I cannot talk to you when you make such ridiculous statements.
ME to MIKE :
I have gotten to know Suzanne , here & through our private emails on copyrights.
Suzanne is one of the Sharper Minds , and Better Writers , I have ever met -- online or in person.
She is a music professional;. she deals with musicians and music issues,, and Suzanne WRITEs very well on music .
She is the EXPERT on the Musicians , Music , and Music industry ,, you are not Mike.
If you cannot debate reasonable with Suzanne Mike , the FAULT IS WITH YOU ,,
not her.
-----------------------------------
You a a jerk on this one Mike. Because you choose to be egomaniac --" un- deserving -ly " -- on music industry ,, stuff , you can not possibly know -- from the Musician's perspective.
You : "So, by your statement, if I were to send you a letter filled with hate speech, you'd hold the post office accountable for delivering the nasty letter? Good luck with that one."
ME :web masters are equally responsible in this situation , as i understand the law, ---- and I said IF it happens again.
Using the U.S. Mail for and "illegal" purpose is mail fraud et al.
Because the letter is private and unopened the Post office is clearly not responsible.
Here it is a public comment , on a public posting board.
------------------------
You :You are either dense, or incredibly delusional, or a very good actor trying to pass off as a copyright nitwit.
Me : I am none of the above. AT all .
Just as an "employer" would be responsible for an "employee" who "repeatably harassed" "another employee",
so too , IF it happens again here with my dyslexic , being subject to abuse, yes , Mike , would share responsibly.
=====================
through bi-focals ,,,, at 2 foot distance.-----
------------------
-----------
--------
,,,,give me a brake,
the foul language was unneeded--- and grossly offensive , in this instance. I clearly was talking about dyslexia for me and you write :
"You should really learn how to READ. It's Kari and not Karl. Fucking moron."
Disgusting.
Absolutely & Grossly Disgusting.
AND it shows more about your insensitivity,,
to a person w/ a disability than it does about whether ,
I am a "f-ing M".
-----------
-----------
To Mike :
Too much on my spelling and typing.
EVEN after specifically posting it in the thread in question -- like this one.
Dyslexia is an "established disability",,
and just as with "racism",, any form of discrimination , or harassment thereof , is "wrong", "immoral" & even "illegal".
Most every posting board I have ever participated in , would lock out "any comment" disparaging "ANY issue" , of "race" , "religion" , "sexual orientation" or "disability" .
I see you have a new rating system.
I hope it will be used in instances such as these to lock out those commentators who "violate social norms" -- that are "legally enforceable" if "repeated without restraint".
You are the webmaster Mike.
I hold you responsible for the comments here.
This ====
"You should really learn how to READ. It's Kari and not Karl. Fucking moron."
to someone who just wrote :
"been through this 20 X already , I have dyslexia , a serious and well established DISABILITY. When i write formal , i hire a proof reader ,, this is not formal. Bug off,"
=== IS out of bounds , even for TechDirt.
IF Happens again,, ..................
Please do not try me.
=============================end........==========
It's when ordinary citizens ban together to rise up against injustice being forced down on them by corrupt politicians acting on behalf of oppressors such as yourself.
"It's when ordinary citizens ban together to rise up against injustice being forced down on them by corrupt politicians acting on behalf of oppressors such as yourself."
ANS : Cyber-Pirates oppress me.
Please tell "how copyrights for Artists" oppresses you.
-----------------
"It's been so long since you've been on the side of the people, that you may have forgotten what "grass roots" means."
ANs, Not true. I am actually exploring running for NY state assembly from my district ( unofficial announcement-- meaning i do not have to file --yet -- with the NYC "campaign finance board"
-----------------------------------
[p,s, -- in 1990 is did "run" for NYC City Council, but withdrew , because my employer at the time - GreenPeace USA --expanded my portfolio , and i was NOT allowed to do both.]
On the post: Are Bad Copyright Laws Killing Jazz And Harming Jazz Musicians?
Re: Re: Re: Not really surprising...I agree with Richard, in that the true impetus behind radical change and commercial upheaval in our society comes from the impetus and actions of people acting without government mandate...
On the post: Are Bad Copyright Laws Killing Jazz And Harming Jazz Musicians?
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Not really surprising.....Yes, that would be correct if most copyright proponents were basing their actions on logic. .
ANS : the law is logical. it is in the Constitution. the courts decide the logic of copyright ,, not techdirt posters.
On the post: Are Bad Copyright Laws Killing Jazz And Harming Jazz Musicians?
Re: Re: Re: Not really surprising....People are losing respect for copyright at a very fast rate...
ME; But the law and Governments , and their POLICE forces, are better enforcing copyright
REALITY !! enjoy it !!
On the post: Are Bad Copyright Laws Killing Jazz And Harming Jazz Musicians?
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Yes, I think I have found the answer
"Phil Collins wins Johnny Mercer songwriting award"
----interesting little piece about musician culture,, but you will have to read between the lines a bit ,,to understand the music culture highlights here -- so Mike you will miss it for sure .
On the post: Are Bad Copyright Laws Killing Jazz And Harming Jazz Musicians?
MIKE ::We're not talking about new arrangements. Jazz music is not new arrangements.
Unless you are a "Jazz Jedi Master" ,, you cannot possibly understand what you are writing about with , "Jazz", "innovation", and "cover", RE: copyright issues.
On the post: Are Bad Copyright Laws Killing Jazz And Harming Jazz Musicians?
MIKE ::Suzanne, I know what covers are.
ME :Sorry Mike ,
, re: Jazz ,, you do not , understand Covers vs inovation AT ALL
,, this is something even musicians debate,, there is deep music the "ort" involved with JAZZ ,, and what is original and what is innovation.
Most good jazz players have encyclopedic knowledge of Jazz history and its music--
As i said Jazz is a deep musician sub-culture,, they live on their own Jazz Planet.
( i play the blues pretty well ,, and that is how i get to "talk" to them musically--- "the blues" is our common "musical language")
I DO NOT don't play pure jazz ,, WHILE Mingus & jazz guys don't sing Bob Dylan folk tunes.
"Blues ", we can "talk" ( i.e. Jam ) , us , Folkers & Jazzers.
But Jazz unto it self,, really "very different planet musically"
.
Very different sub-culture in music.
Mike you can not possibly understand it
On the post: Are Bad Copyright Laws Killing Jazz And Harming Jazz Musicians?
JAZZ vs other forms of music on copyrights ////////////// I think I have found the answer
"The jazz musician is not looping another album. He's playing the actual notes on an instrument and not using any notes/sounds taken from a recorded piece from someone else's vinyl or digital file.
"If the music originates from your instruments and/or your voice and you perform it or record it, you have arranged it."
"If you digitally copy segments from a previously recorded album, you are remixing."
---
ME : very accurate and understanding Suzzane !!!!
,, If you are not a musician ,, or deeply involved in music ,, no way you can really understand the ART of Jazz an how innovation , jamming , a "stealing riffs" fit into jazz ( and blues too ) composition.
very tough copyright issues ,,
REMEMBER :: "good faith ed musicians will never sue good faith-ed musicians ",
, is probably no more so than in Jazz and Blues,,, Melody ( and the riffs) is a messy copyright issue.
Chords you cannot copyright at all,,
and lyrics in Jazz , are never the issue.
Jazz is very tricky with Melody copyrights,,
i do not think a Jazz musician , "could sue another Jazz musician" , and ever expect to gig again..
They are a very tight group ,, even in NYC ,, most all jazz pros know each other.
Jazz is really a "musician sub-culture".
Jazz musicians usually only play with other jazz musicians,
, as opposed to ,, "folksingers" and "rockers" and "acid electric - head bangers" ,, who will all jumble together and call himself Niel Young.
Mike , you are just of of your league , legally and musically , on Jazz and copyright issues specifically ,,
and just ARTistIC copyright generally
------------------------ end ==============
BUT Good
On the post: Are Bad Copyright Laws Killing Jazz And Harming Jazz Musicians?
I'm going to research the hell out of anything that interests me, so whether or not the research turns up here, I'll still keep looking for it. Knowing what is and isn't allowed in music is useful info for me.
The Silent Majority of readers ,, KNOW you are right SL.
----------------------================
On the post: Are Bad Copyright Laws Killing Jazz And Harming Jazz Musicians?
uzanne. I cannot talk to you when you make such ridiculous statements.
I have gotten to know Suzanne , here & through our private emails on copyrights.
Suzanne is one of the Sharper Minds , and Better Writers , I have ever met -- online or in person.
She is a music professional;. she deals with musicians and music issues,, and Suzanne WRITEs very well on music .
She is the EXPERT on the Musicians , Music , and Music industry ,, you are not Mike.
If you cannot debate reasonable with Suzanne Mike , the FAULT IS WITH YOU ,,
not her.
-----------------------------------
You a a jerk on this one Mike. Because you choose to be egomaniac --" un- deserving -ly " -- on music industry ,, stuff , you can not possibly know -- from the Musician's perspective.
===============================================
On the post: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
Re: Re: Kari and not Karl.
It is the best defense of civil rights from abuse .
On the post: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
Re: Re: Kari and not Karl.
ME :web masters are equally responsible in this situation , as i understand the law, ---- and I said IF it happens again.
Using the U.S. Mail for and "illegal" purpose is mail fraud et al.
Because the letter is private and unopened the Post office is clearly not responsible.
Here it is a public comment , on a public posting board.
------------------------
You :You are either dense, or incredibly delusional, or a very good actor trying to pass off as a copyright nitwit.
Me : I am none of the above. AT all .
Just as an "employer" would be responsible for an "employee" who "repeatably harassed" "another employee",
so too , IF it happens again here with my dyslexic , being subject to abuse, yes , Mike , would share responsibly.
=====================
On the post: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
Kari and not Karl.
dyslexia ,is a disability that affects reading.
"Kari and not Karl." on a computer screen ,
through bi-focals ,,,, at 2 foot distance.-----
------------------
-----------
--------
,,,,give me a brake,
the foul language was unneeded--- and grossly offensive , in this instance. I clearly was talking about dyslexia for me and you write :
"You should really learn how to READ. It's Kari and not Karl. Fucking moron."
Disgusting.
Absolutely & Grossly Disgusting.
AND it shows more about your insensitivity,,
to a person w/ a disability than it does about whether ,
I am a "f-ing M".
-----------
-----------
To Mike :
Too much on my spelling and typing.
EVEN after specifically posting it in the thread in question -- like this one.
Dyslexia is an "established disability",,
and just as with "racism",, any form of discrimination , or harassment thereof , is "wrong", "immoral" & even "illegal".
Most every posting board I have ever participated in , would lock out "any comment" disparaging "ANY issue" , of "race" , "religion" , "sexual orientation" or "disability" .
I see you have a new rating system.
I hope it will be used in instances such as these to lock out those commentators who "violate social norms" -- that are "legally enforceable" if "repeated without restraint".
You are the webmaster Mike.
I hold you responsible for the comments here.
This ====
"You should really learn how to READ. It's Kari and not Karl. Fucking moron."
to someone who just wrote :
"been through this 20 X already , I have dyslexia , a serious and well established DISABILITY. When i write formal , i hire a proof reader ,, this is not formal. Bug off,"
=== IS out of bounds , even for TechDirt.
IF Happens again,, ..................
Please do not try me.
=============================end........==========
On the post: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
I have dyslexia , a serious and well established DISABILITY.
When i write formal , i hire a proof reader ,, this is not formal.
Bug off, Karl.
On the post: Once Again, The Justice Department Fails To Tell Congress About Its Wiretapping Activities, As Required By Law
Re: Wow, no trolls on this thread.
On the post: If You Want To Encourage Free Press And Free Expression, Subsidize Broadband, Not Newspapers
Re: Want to encourage freedom of anything? Don't subsidize things in the first place.
Please do elaborate.
On the post: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
Re: Re: Re: Re: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
On the post: Evidence Suggests RIAA Labels Behind 'Grassroots Citizen's Group' Supporting Canadian DMCA
It's when ordinary citizens ban together to rise up against injustice being forced down on them by corrupt politicians acting on behalf of oppressors such as yourself.
ANS : Cyber-Pirates oppress me.
Please tell "how copyrights for Artists" oppresses you.
-----------------
"It's been so long since you've been on the side of the people, that you may have forgotten what "grass roots" means."
ANs, Not true. I am actually exploring running for NY state assembly from my district ( unofficial announcement-- meaning i do not have to file --yet -- with the NYC "campaign finance board"
-----------------------------------
[p,s, -- in 1990 is did "run" for NYC City Council, but withdrew , because my employer at the time - GreenPeace USA --expanded my portfolio , and i was NOT allowed to do both.]
On the post: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
Re: Re: Re: Re: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
On the post: Evidence Suggests RIAA Labels Behind 'Grassroots Citizen's Group' Supporting Canadian DMCA
Re: Re: "Evidence Suggests RIAA Labels Behind 'Grassroots Citizen's Group' Supporting Canadian DMCA"
On the post: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
Re: Re: Copying Is Often Efficient And Smart
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