I hadn't heard of her when she was with her label. I've heard a lot more of her since she left her label, because she has put out the word herself.
Chicken/egg. I heard about The Dresden Dolls before they signed, but I know a LOT of the fanbase came along in the years following.
I won't detract from the amount of touring they did to raise awareness, but in a pre-everyone-on-the-internet-era / pre-easy-DTF-tools, the label did do some good.
I don't doubt that Amanda would've still garnered attention and success after leaving them, she's TALENTED and SMART, but they also helped put her into a position so that when she shouted into the ether, it shouted back.
Maybe you didn't hear about her 'till she was free, but I bet a combination of interest earned via fans who DID, helped spread her message to you.
This is the most arbitrary crock-of-shit-response, and I it see come up EVERY time someone finds success (whether that's within their niche, or by breaking through to a larger audience).
Kickstarter projects (of ALLLL varieties) have about a 40-50% success rate. Should they just shudder their doors and tell people to go elsewhere? The numbers show successfully funded projects aren't overwhelmingly the rule/the norm, right?
Stupid.
But hey, if you're so easily discouraged from trying to do something, more room for someone who's going to fight and work and train like their life depended on it.
Amanda's assemblage of positive elements are clearly working for her (in this instance and in many others), and they definitely are NOT interchangeable with any other artist…but no one's saying THAT.
The message of the video - "THIS IS THE FUTURE OF MUSIC" - is not trying to tell people that her project is a blueprint or that if you try and copy her bundle rewards you'll raise $100k on a Monday morning…the MESSAGE is about fucking connection.
As she said on Twitter this afternoon: "$100,000 raised in 6 hours. no label, no cocksucking mainstream radio shows, no billboards, no marketing bullshit. PEOPLE + INTERNET. DONE."
Fair enough…but Christ, seeing that little "insightful" emblem next to this comment makes me worry…either a lot of the readers here are living in some sort of North Korean-like police state, or we have a lot of paranoid cry-babies in our midst, waiting to jump on the next thing "infringing" on their rights…
From what I can tell, it's not even a very close replica - I think Warner could easily let this guy try and take them to court, only to be laughed out.
A shitty tribal tattoo is still just a shitty tribal tattoo, it just so happens few enough people are stupid/crazy enough to put them around their eyesocket and so we recognize what they're going for, with it.
"$5000 is a pretty high price, but you never know what one fan will pay, I guess."
You're right, you never know. Except in this case we know/it was noted that said "one fan" took to Twitter to pool the money with others.
"Why play a $5000 bbq when you can play a $20,000 concert?"
Really, why? Jesus. If you're asking this question you're probably going to argue with the dozen or so reasons I could give you as to why, but it's not always about "whoring time for cash outside of 'the system'"...
I've seen lots of people up in arms about this, and I just can't wrap my head around their whining and entitlement issues to appreciate it as a real concern.
I don't work for 'em, but I've spent enough time over the years on hold with Apple Care or waiting in line at the Genius Bar to have a bit of sympathy when it comes to the volume of troubleshooting they've got to do.....and how much of that troubleshooting is with complete morons who don't know what they're doing and break their device. I know multiple people who've decided it's not worth being without their phone for a day or two, and take it upon themselves to "fix it"...and then when they do REAL damage, go in to an Apple Store with an attitude -- wasting the employee's time, AND the time of people like you or I.
Like software modding, if you want to take the risks involved with it, you're responsible for whatever happens......if you want to muck with your hardware/glass/case/whatever......go buy the $5 screwdriver and don't take it out on everyone else if something goes wrong.
BTW, I'm not saying Apple is infallible, but this just isn't a hill worth dying on in my opinion; I've seen lots of "this is the LAST straw" and "I'm done with Apple because of this, you shouldn't keep me out of MY device that I PAID for" type commentary...and...well...I guess be thankful your life's easy enough that such concerns are the biggest problem you're living with?
and literally as i was typing my response to you, someone chimed in.
i'm sorry, but that "comparison" is piss-poor.
you might be able to get sonic* on the wii, but you're not going to see "final fantasy 13" or "halo" or "bioshock" and a bazillion other titles there, just as you're not going to see the mario or zelda franchise on the ps3.
no one goes after sony, microsoft, or nintendo shouting about how they can't play any game they want from the history of time (all the while trying to correlate that an evil corporation is the one fucking them over).....
no one forced anyone at gunpoint to buy (or develop for) apple, and the fine print people seem to think they can ignore and bitch about later leaves the company enough loopholes shit can change.
* depending on which particular "sonic" title you're referring to.
i was thinking that the entire time i was reading the article and would be curious to see an explanation of why it's different (as i'm sure someone here is going to argue it is)
Anyone been following the Amanda Palmer/Evelyn Evelyn drama?
Before I even read this piece, I was wondering how closely it'd parallell to what recently happened to songwriter Amanda Palmer, and the Evelyn Evelyn album that she's been working on.
To quickly summarize:
* An album produced by Amanda
* By "conjoined twins" (with a full backstory that's later going to be put into comic book form via Dark Horse)
* Without hearing the record/getting most of the contest, people freak out
* There becomes a war of "This is offensive" vs "you fucking thought this was REAL? You're DUMB!" type comments
While I can see both sides of the argument (a lot more than in the case of the giraffe), it's definitely very bizarre to see stuff like this go down at all........
"However, filesharing does take money that the artist was previously making and turns that into a loss (fans who would've have paid before are now not paying for the music)."
Maybe. MAYBE. But I'd also garner to bet that a) a lot of people downloading her shit NEVER would've checked her out had they had to pay b) a LOT of people who heard about her did so via torrents, downloads, sharing, burned CDs, etc, and wouldn't otherwise have been buying her future releases, concert tickets, merch, etc.
And like I just posted, I HAVE paid for her music before and now never will again because of her ignorant, poorly-informed, stupid ideology that hearing/having music "for free" doesn't make any money for her at the end of the day.
I've seen more than a few people point out that they had checked out Lily Allen (via a forum wherein she wasn't necessarily making any money from them) but how they "definitely wouldn't support her, now".
That's easy to say but it ends up being a wash -- your "word" that you were going to buy something probably doesn't resonate with someone like this - she'd probably just roll out with "actions speak louder than words"...
I don't necessarily think she'd see me in any different light but regardless, I'm someone who HAS purchased her music. And I won't, ever again. Even if I was to suddenly be able to look past her personality and enjoy the stuff for what it is (fun pop), I'm not going to buy it. Period. Not now. I'm not supporting nonsense like this, I just wouldn't feel good about it.
I was turned off by the Lefsetz piece the second he said (to paraquote) "who cares about the drummer, anyway?!" - especially (as my friend pointed out), $10 says Lefsetz is a fucking Phil Collins' fan.
Regardless, I'm glad you picked up on something he completely lost focus of in his blog and did so without talking down to your audience.
and if you're going to naysay and point fingers about "mythmaking" you need to take 2.2 seconds and have links that back up your facts
you're not paying very good attention and the info in said video you linked to as it points out that it was recorded the same day as the above "music vid"
the video is labeled 6/10 i.e. 6 out of 10 videos......nowhere did i see 6/10/09. don't come huffing and puffing based on your sheer distaste of mike/amanda...do YOUR research
and by the by, i apologize in advance if i somehow got confused....i mean......it makes total sense i might've....and that the same uploader has a magic calendar wherein they saw tegan and sara play a show on "15/22" whenever the hell that falls in the calendar year
such a detective, you are!
still, i gotta give you credit for managing to find something i hadn't preemptively put down above.
in all fairness though, you're apparently not a fan of amanda (or at least haven't seen her live/followed her career too much) so let me explain:
amanda attracts people of all types, shapes, and sizes. many of those people are artistic (musicians, actors, performance artists, writers, etc), and many of them love the opportunity to "put on their costume" and bond with like-minded folks...when she puts out a call to head to the beach and "see what happens" (often how she plays her shows, too) people are gonna bring random stuff (i.e. tuba, frames, balloons, etc.)
in the past when amanda has done random twitter gatherings, it's been a chillier affair....rainy afternoons before a gig, during the winter/spring thaw, etc...even then people showed up with instruments and oddities. it doesn't surprise me one bit that in california people poured in with fun junk.
in regards to the "lighting"? you've gotta admit california has "perfect weather"......in the times i've been to LA (and to the beach) it's looked almost identical to that at around 4 or 5.......the only thing "planned" in that department is that you can count on it looking like that daily and it's a good time of day to do that kind of thing. people are out of work/school, it's not too hot, and it's not too dark to see anyone.
i'm not trying to say "amanda palmer is INFALLIBLE" (and i apologize if i'm coming off like that) i just don't feel there's too much to be gained from being so cynical. it's not a video of the loch ness mosnter, and there (from what i can tell) are a few dozen people in that video who could verify and account for it being what it was: spontaneous fun that turned into something cool.
such a detective, you are!
still, i gotta give you credit for managing to find something i hadn't preemptively put down above.
in all fairness though, you're apparently not a fan of amanda (or at least haven't seen her live/followed her career too much) so let me explain:
amanda attracts people of all types, shapes, and sizes. many of those people are artistic (musicians, actors, performance artists, writers, etc), and many of them love the opportunity to "put on their costume" and bond with like-minded folks...when she puts out a call to head to the beach and "see what happens" (often how she plays her shows, too) people are gonna bring random stuff (i.e. tuba, frames, balloons, etc.)
in the past when amanda has done random twitter gatherings, it's been a chillier affair....rainy afternoons before a gig, during the winter/spring thaw, etc...even then people showed up with instruments and oddities. it doesn't surprise me one bit that in california people poured in with fun junk.
in regards to the "lighting"? you've gotta admit california has "perfect weather"......in the times i've been to LA (and to the beach) it's looked almost identical to that at around 4 or 5.......the only thing "planned" in that department is that you can count on it looking like that daily and it's a good time of day to do that kind of thing. people are out of work/school, it's not too hot, and it's not too dark to see anyone.
i'm not trying to say "amanda palmer is INFALLIBLE" (and i apologize if i'm coming off like that) i just don't feel there's too much to be gained from being so cynical. it's not a video of the loch ness mosnter, and there (from what i can tell) are a few dozen people in that video who could verify and account for it being what it was: spontaneous fun that turned into something cool.
waits for pointless comments such as:
* well she wouldn't have those fans and people around her (that could film it etc) if it wasn't for her record deal
* you have my attention and you play a song you didn't write? pfft
* mike had a hard-on for amanda palmer - enough posts about her, already!
while this made me chuckle, i'd wager herodotus didn't mean to imply they were "checking out underaged girls" and moreso just saying something that's obvious......so much of the music hitting the charts these days -- the fabricated pop and such -- IS reliant on image, height, weight, and bone structure...
i don't know mylie cyrus' body from adam but i don't so much associate her with being sold as a sex object (yet) whereas looking at the way taylor swift is being marketed....? "look at this down home country vixen....she's like the girl next door but she can sing....p.s. she's legal"
i donated $5 to the site. a site which i (and apparently you) read - amongst many others - daily. do i do the same when and where i can? yup. do i agree with everything on here or out there? nope.
BUT
that's neither here nor there in regards to amanda palmer and the comment i made, now is it?
every time she writes something like this i'm amazed by how many people try and use the "well if she wasn't signed to a major label she wouldn't have fans in the first place...NEXT" argument. idiots.
On Bandcamp the artist actually COULD set it so that they're willing to sell "by album only"...most people on there are obviously smart enough to have the variables, but it'd be easy to do on that site should someone want to say "you want my music, you buy ALL of it"...
On the post: No Record Label, But Amanda Palmer Raises Over $100k In Just Six Hours On Kickstarter
Re: Re: Re: Sell music, not copies
Chicken/egg. I heard about The Dresden Dolls before they signed, but I know a LOT of the fanbase came along in the years following.
I won't detract from the amount of touring they did to raise awareness, but in a pre-everyone-on-the-internet-era / pre-easy-DTF-tools, the label did do some good.
I don't doubt that Amanda would've still garnered attention and success after leaving them, she's TALENTED and SMART, but they also helped put her into a position so that when she shouted into the ether, it shouted back.
Maybe you didn't hear about her 'till she was free, but I bet a combination of interest earned via fans who DID, helped spread her message to you.
On the post: No Record Label, But Amanda Palmer Raises Over $100k In Just Six Hours On Kickstarter
Re:
Kickstarter projects (of ALLLL varieties) have about a 40-50% success rate. Should they just shudder their doors and tell people to go elsewhere? The numbers show successfully funded projects aren't overwhelmingly the rule/the norm, right?
Stupid.
But hey, if you're so easily discouraged from trying to do something, more room for someone who's going to fight and work and train like their life depended on it.
Amanda's assemblage of positive elements are clearly working for her (in this instance and in many others), and they definitely are NOT interchangeable with any other artist…but no one's saying THAT.
The message of the video - "THIS IS THE FUTURE OF MUSIC" - is not trying to tell people that her project is a blueprint or that if you try and copy her bundle rewards you'll raise $100k on a Monday morning…the MESSAGE is about fucking connection.
As she said on Twitter this afternoon: "$100,000 raised in 6 hours. no label, no cocksucking mainstream radio shows, no billboards, no marketing bullshit. PEOPLE + INTERNET. DONE."
On the post: Turns Out Some Police Like Being Filmed While On Duty
Re: A Good Step
On the post: Guy Who Did Mike Tyson's Tattoo Sues Warner Bros. For Copyright Infringement
A shitty tribal tattoo is still just a shitty tribal tattoo, it just so happens few enough people are stupid/crazy enough to put them around their eyesocket and so we recognize what they're going for, with it.
On the post: The Awkwardness Of Cutting Out The Middleman
Re:
You're right, you never know. Except in this case we know/it was noted that said "one fan" took to Twitter to pool the money with others.
"Why play a $5000 bbq when you can play a $20,000 concert?"
Really, why? Jesus. If you're asking this question you're probably going to argue with the dozen or so reasons I could give you as to why, but it's not always about "whoring time for cash outside of 'the system'"...
On the post: Apple Using Special New Screws So You Can't Open Your iPhone
Re: Device over user
I've seen lots of people up in arms about this, and I just can't wrap my head around their whining and entitlement issues to appreciate it as a real concern.
I don't work for 'em, but I've spent enough time over the years on hold with Apple Care or waiting in line at the Genius Bar to have a bit of sympathy when it comes to the volume of troubleshooting they've got to do.....and how much of that troubleshooting is with complete morons who don't know what they're doing and break their device. I know multiple people who've decided it's not worth being without their phone for a day or two, and take it upon themselves to "fix it"...and then when they do REAL damage, go in to an Apple Store with an attitude -- wasting the employee's time, AND the time of people like you or I.
Like software modding, if you want to take the risks involved with it, you're responsible for whatever happens......if you want to muck with your hardware/glass/case/whatever......go buy the $5 screwdriver and don't take it out on everyone else if something goes wrong.
BTW, I'm not saying Apple is infallible, but this just isn't a hill worth dying on in my opinion; I've seen lots of "this is the LAST straw" and "I'm done with Apple because of this, you shouldn't keep me out of MY device that I PAID for" type commentary...and...well...I guess be thankful your life's easy enough that such concerns are the biggest problem you're living with?
On the post: Apple To Face Antitrust Investigation Over Its iPhone Development Policies?
Re: Re: nothing to see here...
On the post: Apple To Face Antitrust Investigation Over Its iPhone Development Policies?
Re: nothing to see here...
On the post: Judge Orders Satirical Site To Remove Joke Story About Fictional Giraffe Attack
Anyone been following the Amanda Palmer/Evelyn Evelyn drama?
To quickly summarize:
* An album produced by Amanda
* By "conjoined twins" (with a full backstory that's later going to be put into comic book form via Dark Horse)
* Without hearing the record/getting most of the contest, people freak out
* There becomes a war of "This is offensive" vs "you fucking thought this was REAL? You're DUMB!" type comments
Amanda's response is available at:
http://blog.amandapalmer.net/post/396762227/evelyn-evelyn-drama-drama
(One of my other favorite/most interesting responses to the whole thing was at http://amuchmoreexotic.livejournal.com/408855.html)
While I can see both sides of the argument (a lot more than in the case of the giraffe), it's definitely very bizarre to see stuff like this go down at all........
On the post: Lily Allen, Don't Apologize To Me, Apologize To Everyone Else
Re: Re: I'm not coming here anymore...
Maybe. MAYBE. But I'd also garner to bet that a) a lot of people downloading her shit NEVER would've checked her out had they had to pay b) a LOT of people who heard about her did so via torrents, downloads, sharing, burned CDs, etc, and wouldn't otherwise have been buying her future releases, concert tickets, merch, etc.
And like I just posted, I HAVE paid for her music before and now never will again because of her ignorant, poorly-informed, stupid ideology that hearing/having music "for free" doesn't make any money for her at the end of the day.
On the post: Lily Allen, Don't Apologize To Me, Apologize To Everyone Else
That's easy to say but it ends up being a wash -- your "word" that you were going to buy something probably doesn't resonate with someone like this - she'd probably just roll out with "actions speak louder than words"...
I don't necessarily think she'd see me in any different light but regardless, I'm someone who HAS purchased her music. And I won't, ever again. Even if I was to suddenly be able to look past her personality and enjoy the stuff for what it is (fun pop), I'm not going to buy it. Period. Not now. I'm not supporting nonsense like this, I just wouldn't feel good about it.
So there you go, Lily. It goes both ways, moron.
On the post: Music And Marketing -- You Need Them Both
Good call on all fronts...
Regardless, I'm glad you picked up on something he completely lost focus of in his blog and did so without talking down to your audience.
On the post: The Details Behind Amanda Palmer's Amazing Impromptu Music Video
Re: Smoking Gun did not learn song that morning
you're not paying very good attention and the info in said video you linked to as it points out that it was recorded the same day as the above "music vid"
the video is labeled 6/10 i.e. 6 out of 10 videos......nowhere did i see 6/10/09. don't come huffing and puffing based on your sheer distaste of mike/amanda...do YOUR research
and by the by, i apologize in advance if i somehow got confused....i mean......it makes total sense i might've....and that the same uploader has a magic calendar wherein they saw tegan and sara play a show on "15/22" whenever the hell that falls in the calendar year
On the post: The Details Behind Amanda Palmer's Amazing Impromptu Music Video
Re: This story doesn't add up...
On the post: The Details Behind Amanda Palmer's Amazing Impromptu Music Video
Re: This story doesn't add up...
On the post: The Details Behind Amanda Palmer's Amazing Impromptu Music Video
* well she wouldn't have those fans and people around her (that could film it etc) if it wasn't for her record deal
* you have my attention and you play a song you didn't write? pfft
* mike had a hard-on for amanda palmer - enough posts about her, already!
On the post: Amanda Palmer Talks About Connecting With Fans: Fans WANT To Support Artists
Re: Re:
i don't know mylie cyrus' body from adam but i don't so much associate her with being sold as a sex object (yet) whereas looking at the way taylor swift is being marketed....? "look at this down home country vixen....she's like the girl next door but she can sing....p.s. she's legal"
On the post: Amanda Palmer Talks About Connecting With Fans: Fans WANT To Support Artists
Re: Re: Re: Inspiring
BUT
that's neither here nor there in regards to amanda palmer and the comment i made, now is it?
On the post: Amanda Palmer Talks About Connecting With Fans: Fans WANT To Support Artists
Re: Inspiring
On the post: The Death Of The Album Has Been Exaggerated
Re: full albums only
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