Microsoft: The Heavyweight OS Is Here To Stay
from the great-vistas dept
Considering all of the tumult surrounding the release of Vista, not to mention the lukewarm reaction to it, there's been a lot of discussion over whether or not Vista represents the last Windows operating system of its nature. On top of everything else, the emergence of web-based software is rapidly reducing the significance of the client-side operating system. But Microsoft insists that Windows as we know it here to stay and that the successor to Vista will be another "heavyweight" system. It's not surprising that Microsoft would have this attitude, as it has little choice but to continue feeding the Windows cash cow. The question for Microsoft, then, is whether it can do a better job of pushing out the next operating system than it did with Vista. Has the company identified why the product development cycle went so far awry, or can customers expect multi-year delays, once again? And can it address other complaints, such as the prodigious amount of computing power that it takes to run? It seems pretty safe to say that unless it addresses these issues, it's unlikely that the next version of the operating system will see any more success.Thank you for reading this Techdirt post. With so many things competing for everyone’s attention these days, we really appreciate you giving us your time. We work hard every day to put quality content out there for our community.
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wow
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Re:
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i-tunes doesn't work
The last set of "security patches" for Vista disabled i-tunes completely, so I had to reinstall it.
I can just imagine MS and Apple blaming each other for it, too.
Installing SAS didn't work either, I went into the install disc and set dozens of binaries to XP compatibility mode. It worked then. Every software I've installed on Vista has been a scary adventure.
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Re: Xubuntu
IMHO, Windows is only really necessary for gaming. I look forward to the day when Mac gaming catches up with Windows gaming. Then we will literally have no need for Microsoft. Maybe, at that point, they will be forced to make a version of Windows that is worth using. I'm not holding my breath, though.
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Eventually they will make it work, (sort of)
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Re: Eventually they will make it work, (sort of)
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Re: Eventually they will make it work, (sort of)
I play many of games on OSX, without a hitch or a crash.
Stop using Windows as a security blanket, there is no reason to not use an OS just because it is foreign to you.
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Re: Re: Eventually they will make it work, (sort o
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Re: Re: Eventually they will make it work, (sort o
I rest my case.
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"640K ought to be enough for anybody." -- Bill Gates, 1981
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Re: Overcast, wrong quote
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Re:
You are an idiot.
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Evolutionary dead-end
The idea of actually trying to sell a closed-source operating system has reached a dead end. Microsoft may promise another heavyweight upgrade, but it's not going to be able to deliver.
Neal Stephenson predicted this years ago, in his essay "In The Beginning Was The Command Line". Still well worth a read.
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Re: Evolutionary dead-end
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Re: Evolutionary dead-end
Norman619 wrote:
Actually, at last count, only about 1900 apps had been "converted" to work properly under Vista. Compare this with the tens of thousands of packages that are just a mouse-click away with a major Linux distro like Debian, and you see that Microsoft is perhaps not so invulnerable as is often made out.
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Microsoft: The Heavyweight OS Is Here To Stay?????
Here is the way I see my progression 3.11 to 95 to 98 to 'Millineum the Joke' to 2000 to XP to soon to be Mac.
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Re: Microsoft: The Heavyweight OS Is Here To Stay?
Customer : I don't buy this
is that old?
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Re: Microsoft: The Heavyweight OS Is Here To Stay?
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When is MS going to do what Apple did?
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Re: When is MS going to do what Apple did?
I cannot even begin imagine the huge amount of developer resources that are spent supporting the huge amount of hardware that runs on windows (not to mention the huge amounts legacy hardware that still works).
This is not to say that the MS dosen't have development problems (the Vista delays and feature cuts proved that), but comparing OSX and Vista in this regard is like comparing apples to to oranges
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Re: Re: When is MS going to do what Apple did?
It's also the limitations Apple added to OSX keeping developers out. There are many cases where Apple has sued (search techdirt) over people creating their own Apple software that competes with something Apple sells. This doesn't happen (as much) with apps written for MS Windows, the ease of coding is why MS Windows is THE gaming platform, not to mention also THE custom business app platform. (Think CRM, ERP, MRP, EPM, etc...)
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Re: Re: When is MS going to do what Apple did?
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Re: When is MS going to do what Apple did?
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Re: When is MS going to do what Apple did?
Then Java fanboys would have been touting all the exact cool features that C# has but that it would have been called Java 2.0 or something...
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one less customer for Microsoft...
Now, Microsoft no longer offer products so innovative that we actually WANT them. Instead, they just say, "OK, kids, time to upgrade! Why? Because we said so!" As a software developer, I see no advantage to learning Vista-specific API. The recent releases of Halo 2 and Shadowrun are classic jokes. They were paraded as "Vista only" games, but after a few light tweaks, they were both XP compatible. I am sure that Microsoft will continue this pattern with future software releases.
Now, I program in Java, PHP, MySQL, and whatever other open source language comes my way. Why? They are FREE and supported on all operating systems. (On a side note, I am amazed that an IDE like Netbeans is completely free. I will NEVER invest in Microsoft development tools.)
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Re: one less customer for Microsoft...
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Re: Re: one less customer for Microsoft...
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Re: Re: one less customer for Microsoft...
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: one less customer for Microsof
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: one less customer for Microsof
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Re: Re: Re: Re: one less customer for Microsoft...
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My system is dual boot with ubuntu but I rarely use Linux due to the need to twitter and tweak everything to get it to minimally work. I still haven't gotten Linux to fully work and I don't have time to play with it.
For a good portion of the population I don't see the "heavyweight" OS going anywhere. Even my retired father couldn't get by with all web based apps due to his MIDI needs.
Just think, once they've convinced everyone that "there's no need" to store anything locally, the government can step in and search to their hearts content under the covers. RIAA and the MPAA can finally have access to everyone's media.
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Re:
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http://gears.google.com/
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on a totaly unrelated note, maybe microsoft could try to get the next os to run on a weaker system? shouldent be too hard since they set the bar so high already.
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I might just wait
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Wait....
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Vista is Evil
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Re: Vista is Evil
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You may be new to computers and networking, but Apple has been slower to release and actually delayed the last release to get iPhone out on time. There is some general sentiment that Apple will soon get out of the OS business all together and concentrate on their iPod business.
All of that notwithstanding, besides the fact that the Mac has such a paltry share of the overall personal computing market, Mac users enjoy the stability they do because of the way that Apple requires the hardware purchase to get the OS. If M$ wouldn't support 5 year old scanners and video cards with each subsequent release they could probably put out a far more stable product. But then you would cry to the heavens about the evil Microsoft requiring you to buy new hardware.
In summary, each OS has a place. I personally believe that M$ is running out of steam. I would never use the internet for all of my computing activities, but it is clear that many people will and Microsoft simply does not seem ready to respond to this paradigm shift. Will Linux be the answer? Who knows. But as it gains popularity and a greater share of the market you will find that you will have the same problems that you did with Windows.
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Re:
Except with Linux there were always be a FREE solution!!!
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Re: Re:
I personally use Ubuntu, I love it. I've used some flavor of Linux for years, and it has been a long time since I've paid for Software, but you need to understand that I'm happy to always tweak on my system. Free for me, is big $$ in service and downtime for the average computer user.
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No, you are as always
"Linux is still not remotely ready for the average computer user."
My grandmother, mother and father all use Linux. None of them are computer savvy. I don't know what that says about you Norman...:)
"It's still an OS for the tech savy. You want proof? Have a tech newbie try to install and configure it w/o any help."
Have someone who has never used Windows install it and all relevant drivers. Your logic is flawed.
"Have them try to install and uninstall stuff. "
Pretty easy with most package managers, but I guess clicking on add/remove programs is just too complex for people huh?
"I'm willing to bet they may have started out as your friend btu at the end they will be ready to shoot you."
I am willing to bet that you have a hard on for Windows. Congrats, it must be great to be in love with a bloated hog.
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You speak the truth? give me a friggin break jack*ss
"None of what you said changes the truth of what I said earlier."
Of course you speak the truth, I forgot the first time. Oh wait I speak the truth too!
"Linux is not for teh Average user. "
This is called opinion not truth, that is the truth from me ... lol
"They will need a Linux-head type like you to get it running liek they want it."
And no-one needs a Windows power user to help them with Windows? Wait, your spewing brown stuff out of your mouth again.
"It's not quite as easy as you make it out to be. I have played with Linux for a few years now."
Wow, you "played" with it. I guess you need to spend more time playing with yourself and less time speaking the "truth".
"I'm not just talking out of my ass."
Why does it stink so bad then? BTW thats the truth!
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Re:
wtf? o_O
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Next MSOS
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Re: Next MSOS
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The real question is..
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Re: The real question is..
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Replies & Thoughts
Re #24: Indeed, the kind that can be pirated. Why pay for something that doesn't work how I want it, and is horribly over priced because they wasted time and resources making it.
Re Video Game Makers: Wake up and everyone start using OpenGL. If you all did, then its abilities would continually go up, and it could easily be better than DirectX. The instant they FINALLY make most games for Linux, I am done forever with Windoze. I eagerly await the day.
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Re: Replies & Thoughts
Nice pipedream you got there.
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Disclaimer
It works, for the main stream games, but a lot of the games I play are not mainstream, and are never enabled.
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Re: Disclaimer
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Re: Re: Disclaimer
No you are a joke. Wine isn't emulation anyways, duhhh!
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Re: Re: Re: Disclaimer
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I am in love with DX10
Yes, you are a joke Norman, but it is a very sad joke that makes me cry more than laugh.
No, I don't want your from-under-there cheese. That's just gross :)
Emulation is a joke in what respect anyways? Works great for everything but high-end games (Which is probably how your dumb*ss judges it)
You seem to really like DX10, must be because you are a MS Fanboy. Please name the games you want to play that only work in DX10?
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Re: I am in love with DX10
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Market inertia
THe installed base of users has a lot of inertia, with no overwhelming reason to change. (Flame on Mac and 'nix fanbois, I speak the truth.) Windows is 'good enough' and comes pre-installed on mass market PC's.
Hardware vendors from Dell down to white-box integrators get discounted license fees -- but that can be in jepardy if they dabble in non-MS OS and software.
MS has both carrot and stick with software developers -- MSDN and other support features make it easy to do developement for Windows.
Businesses that setteld on Office are locked in the proprietary formats and high retraining costs to migrate to (for example) Open Office. WINE simply adds to support costs, so that would never fly in a cost-control business environment.
Windows would probably have to rise to over $1,000 per PC license in bulk quantities before any significant number of corporate users would migrate away.
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Re: Market inertia
Sorry for the double post...
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Re:
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Re:
Do you know if there are stable drivers for the current DX10 cards out for Linux? The drivers I have now are pure crap and I wouldn't bother running a DX10 game on it.
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How does MS Stay in Business?
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Re: How does MS Stay in Business?
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RE: Market inertia
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Use Ubuntu
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It's not the "heavy weight" that's the problem
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UBUNTU with Beryl + VMware
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Same old story
They all have different levels of total success, but they also all share a common story of comming out buggy, unstable, and giant resource pigs, much like Vista is now.
After SP1 for Vista (Jan 2008) many of the large problems will be resolved. Hardware will get faster and catch up, and in 18 months Vista will be as popular as XP is now.
It's not perfect, and the problems may be larger that previous versions issues, but the leap in function is also much greater, so this should be expected.
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Why the complaining?
I really don't understand why everyone compalins about Vista at all. I love it!
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Linux? Only for peolple who know what they're doin
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Re: Linux? Only for peolple who know what they're
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Re: Linux? Only for peolple who know what they're
There are "Themes" that make the Desktop "look" like Windows, maybe that would make it more "usable"??
I am sure there is a hack to make the Gnome-Control-Panel as useless and non-functional as any Windows version's Control Panel.
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Re: Re: Linux? Only for peolple who know what they
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games, games, games...
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Re: games, games, games...
Peopel like you make me laugh. You think you know how a PC should be used. A Pc is nothing more than a tool. What kind of tool depends on what programs you choose to run on it. Get a life.
If you were just joking then please ignore what I just said. :-)
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Linux is split
Aside from installations, Linux has many features I love such as being able to set ANY window to "always on top" (I heard Vista can do this, but I cannot find that option anywhere. Help?) As for software selection, Linux takes some adjusting. One cannot expect to find Linux equivalents for everything in Windows, but the exact same thing can be said in reverse. Linux has numerous tools (and even some games) that simply do not exist in Windows. Also, with WINE around, one can enjoy the best of both worlds (or just dual boot).
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Re: Linux is split
I expect that the 'killer apps' for mass-market appeal of Linux will be in the hands of Intuit. If they would port Quicken and Turbo-tax to one or more Linux distros, then Joe Average will become interested. Especially if Joe thinks that the computer is safer with a non-MS OS.
Also, I doubt that any other brands would help -- even if they are file and feature compatible with the Intuit products.
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Re: Re: Linux is split
Wine is hit or miss, but generally most utility type applications work decently. Rarely perfect though. Ubuntu is a great choice for first time Linux users, great easy to use interface and the majority of hardware supported.
"I expect that the 'killer apps' for mass-market appeal of Linux will be in the hands of Intuit. If they would port Quicken and Turbo-tax to one or more Linux distros, then Joe Average will become interested. Especially if Joe thinks that the computer is safer with a non-MS OS."
Too late, check out this project for your Linux tax needs.
http://taxgeek.sourceforge.net/
Its called tax geek and I haven't personally used it yet. Looks promising though!
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Bla Bla Bla!!!
Argh!
You all cannot compare linux and windows. Why?
Cos I can't need to pay a lot of good money for a so worst piece of soft.
Cos I can do all kind of things a want to do with linux at less powerfull machines.
Cos internet use as far far way more secure with linux.
Cos I can control deeply what is going on at my pc with linux than with windows.
Cos each new linux version comes with REAL achievment insted this fake win improvments.
Cos I can realy define what sort of soft will be installed and control the process in my pc.
Cos Blackbox could be good for airplanes not for me or for my company.
Cos Vista, be honest gave us not new, not better. Jst new colors and new icons, walpapers.... hadaches, new problems(solved in early versions) Ohhh, yes, new and expansive machines!!!
Go ahead mate!!
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okay...
Its a little prettier... but basically they didn't give us features we really needed, and took some of the great features of XP and tossed them... I hope XP will still work 10 years from now
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Delaying upgrade as long as possible
Though I have used other operating systems a little, I reluctantly continue to use Windows, because using it has made me a lot of money, despite its many sucky aspects. But as others have pointed out, it becomes less and less critical as web-based software improves, and I may yet dump it.
I did dual-boot with Linux previously, and it finally proved too inconvenient. Also, the driver that worked with my video card could not do the resolution I wanted, so I finally ditched Linux. But as Linux tools develop, I
wouldn't rule out trying it again, or maybe a Mac.
I have XP now, and I will delay getting Vista, if I get it at all, as long as I possibly can. And there's even less need to get the latest MS Office - that's truly a silly expenditure IMHO.
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The best part of multi-year deployments
Back to my original statement, rapid deplotments of new OSs is not always the best thing in the world. I wouldn't mind if Microsoft took another 5-7 years to come out with a new OS.
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VISTA - You can't polish a turd
No DOS/Win95 legacy crap and no Unix base either. I like my Linux workstations and servers + my Mac but come on. Unix has been around for almost 40 years.
I'm not holding my breath.
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Re: VISTA - You can't polish a turd
Yes because what would make perfect business since.
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Amazing!!!
90% of home users runs just web browser, e-mail and a text program.
Maybe the same for 60% at workplace.
Firefox and Opera are great and FREE browsers.
You also have Firebird and other great e-mail soft for FREE .
Ok, OpenOffice is still worst than MSOffice. BUT they are FREE and do the same.
We are talking to pay or not about US$500/PC.
For company with 1000 PCs, even with some kind of discount.. They will waste a large amout to get that simple set of tools at work.
Let's beguin to use our brains. The majority of Win user don't need to use it, to pay for use the PC.
They use win, well, they realy don't know why... just use it. For sure, this people just want to keep at the "confort zone" Be honest not so confotable !
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