Netflix Exec Claims That Delaying Movie Rentals For A Month Benefits Customers
from the assuming-you-didn't-want-to-see-that-movie-when-it-was-released dept
With Netflix caving in to Warner Bros. and agreeing to delay offering DVDs for 28 days after release in order to get movies to stream online, it certainly pissed off a bunch of Netflix subscribers. But, you've apparently got it all wrong. A Netflix exec is now trying to explain how the deal is pro-customer because it will keep demand down for the DVDs, meaning that when they finally do come out, you may have a better chance to rent them. Seriously:The most practical reason is that the savings derived from this deal enable us to be in stock completely on day 29. Remember that we're a subscription service and the way that you manage the economics of a subscription service is to manage the demand of any disc, depending on the economics of the disc. In the case of the most expensive disc, which in this case is a Warner Bros. disc, purchased through a 3rd party, those discs were out of stock for far longer than 29 days for most Netflix subscribers.I'm still trying to parse this, but it really does sound like he's saying that Netflix couldn't handle the demand for new releases before, so by getting rid of them entirely, it may be able to handle them on the 29th day, since fewer people will care about renting that movie then. Now, you could claim that's a better customer experience if you ignore the 28 days in which no one on Netflix can rent the movie (though they can get it elsewhere). But if you realize that you're now taking away the ability to serve all of your customers for nearly a month at the point when their demand is likely to be the highest... well, that doesn't seem very customer friendly at all.
So what were able to is create a deal with them that gave them a little open running room in terms of creating a sell-through window ahead of rental, for us, and hopefully that they'll find enough value in that it'll extend to other retailers and other studios will take note and it'll extend across other studios as well. The net savings derived from technically creating a better customer experience have been redeployed in additional streaming content for all customers.
Thank you for reading this Techdirt post. With so many things competing for everyone’s attention these days, we really appreciate you giving us your time. We work hard every day to put quality content out there for our community.
Techdirt is one of the few remaining truly independent media outlets. We do not have a giant corporation behind us, and we rely heavily on our community to support us, in an age when advertisers are increasingly uninterested in sponsoring small, independent sites — especially a site like ours that is unwilling to pull punches in its reporting and analysis.
While other websites have resorted to paywalls, registration requirements, and increasingly annoying/intrusive advertising, we have always kept Techdirt open and available to anyone. But in order to continue doing so, we need your support. We offer a variety of ways for our readers to support us, from direct donations to special subscriptions and cool merchandise — and every little bit helps. Thank you.
–The Techdirt Team
Filed Under: delays, dvds, rentals, spin, windows
Companies: netflix, warner bros.
Reader Comments
Subscribe: RSS
View by: Time | Thread
56 Days Later, anyone?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re:
Lies, all lies
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Let the money flow in!
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Let the money flow in!
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
You may feel a slight period of discomfort
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Netflix Customer
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Netflix Customer
My response? I've cut back my rentals, going from what was once a seven-disc queue to three. I've also started using Redbox a lot more.
Netflix's job (for the moment) is to ship discs. If they can't or won't stock enough of them to meet demand in a reasonable time frame, then people will find someone who can.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Well not now. Fuck you WB, and fuck you Netflix. I'll just have to keep torrenting movies and TV shows since I can't get them legitimately in a format I want. That format is completely non-DRM'ed, playable on any device, convertable to any format I want... in short, in a format that's useful to ME, not the studios or distributors or whoever. ME. And I will NEVER knowingly or willingly "buy" DRM'ed content. "Buying" DRM'ed content is not buying, it's renting.
But that's off topic. I AM willing to rent content, such as through Netflix streaming. But not when the company engages in blatantly anti-customer moves like this. And then they make it worse by acting like we're all stupid and we'll just believe their bullshit. Sorry, no sale. Literally.
It's the same reason I'll never buy any of the current ebook readers. Especially a Kindle. The anti-customer bullshit Amazon has perpetrated is just staggering. I've also bought things at sites other than Amazon recently because of that.
We all need to vote with our wallets and let companies know they cannot do this kind of thing. Had Netflix been forced into this and gone down fighting, that would have been a world of difference. But they caved, and then acted like we're all stupid.
Again, fuck you WB, and fuck you Netflix.
And fuck you Amazon. :-p
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re:
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Streaming?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Stop while you were sort of ahead...
Just stop. Seriously. Just shut up.
Your customers are not idiots. We get it, you had to make a business decision.
Leave it at that.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Stop while you were sort of ahead...
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
For some netflix customers it may make sense
Having move movies I can watch streaming is a definite plus for me, even if it incurs a delay when I can watch them. The people who want a wide variety of movies including some "older" ones are definitely the contingent netflix serves best. If you think you could serve a different contingent better, you are welcome to make your own startup and rove yourself right. Moverover, even if you can't run your own startup, you can always go to you local blockbuster store, they tend to be filled with copies of the latest releases that are available and more limited selections of older releases.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: For some netflix customers it may make sense
i agree sort of. i do see a lot of movies in the theater, probably once or twice a month, but i torrent a lot more. the "new release" section for me is sorting a couple of trackers by seeds and seeing what's hot. that means i already get new releases a week to a month before they hit retail. i use netflix to augment my back catalog of independent/obscure films, and netflix streaming to watch arbitrary stuff when i don't feel like waiting for something.
so while it's bad news that netflix caved in, it doesn't really matter for me, since i don't use netflix for new stuff.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
True
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re:
I'm with everyone else.. I'm done with Warner Brothers movies. Never another penny from me EVER.. You other studios want to follow suit, that's fine, you'll be on the no-buy list too.. I'll wait the 28 days and view it when I'm damn good and ready on the format I want but I'm NOT paying anything more to see movies.. If Netflix pisses me off anymore, they are done with getting anything from me as well.. Does that mean I'll pirate? Not really. I believe that someone will come out with a better service without the BS or for a better price and I'll move on to that or some other form of content delivery.. I will NOT however play into their hands by paying multiple times for access to content because they want to make their product scarce to any form other than direct purchase / rental.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
decisions, decisions
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: decisions, decisions
Because (1) DVDs are usually available on torrent sites a couple weeks before release, and (2) you sure as sh*t ain't gonna be able to watch brand new releases via Netflix streaming if they won't even be allowed to ship out the DVD.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Why they can't just come out and say they're making the best of a bad situation rather than spinning it as 100% pro-customer I have no idea, though, unless they're worried that Warner Brothers might cut them off completely if they admitted to being less than pleased.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re:
Really Netflix gets to take the double whammy on this one, no good way to spin it (customers piss), and the WB just hung them up by the short and curlies while stealing their wallet...
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
just trying to wrap my head around this.
I understand that there will be some customers who are adversely effected by this decision, but with the infinite availability on the 28th day, isn't that a better economic option than having a limit based on a physical good.
To really dig into it, you would need to know a lot of information about how netflix deals with inventory and purchasing decisions.
The negative in this equation is all the people who would have received the dvd in the first 28 days, and any added delay associated with those 28 days. But, the positives, include the infinite good of streaming, the reduced demand for the physical dvd due to the availability of streaming, and anything that netflix gains as a result of reducing costs of distribution via streaming versus mailing of dvds.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: just trying to wrap my head around this.
And they sure aren't going to allow Netflix to stream new releases as soon as they are allowed to ship the DVDs because then Netflix wouldn't need to purchase as many DVDs themselves.
Likely, they worked with Netflix to create more of their wondrous "windows". They'll get more of WB's back-catalog of titles to stream, the ones that have already been sapped dry of DVD sales or are seen as non-sellers ... and then after several months the "new releases" will be windowed for on-line streaming, probably after a couple of television deals have been signed.
Essentially, to get more of WB's old crap, Netflix has probably signed away their soul of current cultural relevance. And this is good for the consumers, somehow. And great for RedBox, Blockbuster, and torrent sites.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Ratings?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Ratings?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
I don't care if it 29 days or 180 days
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
How much do release windows really matter?
In the long run, though, how much does it really matter? Does the average Netflix customer really care *when* the movie is available for streaming? Sure, there will be some demand when commercials for the DVD start showing up on TV, but won't most people just look in and say, "Oh, let's see what's new," and go from there? Maybe I'm underestimating the public's patience for these things, but I just don't see the vast majority of Netflix subscribers pining for that sort of instant gratification -- especially if there are plenty more movies available and waiting to be discovered.
The studios have to know this. That's why they can get away with creating these windows, even if they aren't consumer-friendly and seem to be merely propping up old business models. We can rail against these windows until we're blue in the face, too, but with so many people still going to the cineplexes and still subscribed to Netflix, our complaints become little more than a fly's buzzing to the MPAA and its members.
Perhaps we should be less focused on the release windows and more focused on the broader issues associated with copyright, like ACTA and other attempts to force abhorrent laws and regulations down our throats. Release windows are silly and unnecessary, yes, but evil? That seems like a stretch to me. It's a business tactic, and it's one that plenty of people will begrudgingly accept in exchange for more viewing options overall.
Besides, if we don't like the MPAA, we can always stop watching movies, right?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Overall this isn't really that big of a deal for the customer. I can see how, philosophically it's frustrating, but the service already has so much content, watch something else and wait for the movie to arrive.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re:
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re:
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Re:
Keep in mind that the only pool of people affected are Netflix customers, and many of them won't care if the disc lands in their queue this month or next month. When it ships, it ships.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
That's why there's Redbox
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
This is a very interesting statement that no one seems to have commented on. Why do they purchase WB discs from third parties instead of directly? After they do this deal, will WB allow them to buy directly at a reduced price?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
I Like It...
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Throttling Ring a Bell
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Could be true...
"Yeah, it sucks, but lookit, you wouldn't have gotten the DVD within a month of release anyway cause we only have 3 copies. At least now you've got episodes of MacGyver to watch on your PC while you wait..."
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
and only a Buck a night
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
I find it hard to complain
The subscription price is the price (not 10 pages of fine print and add-on fees - they even *lowered* the subscription rate once). They haven't raised prices since I've been a customer. It's easy to switch between subscription levels (they don't even give you a sales pitch if you go to a cheaper plan). Easy to return damaged videos for a replacement. Fast service. Easy to rate vids. Etc., etc.
I wish other companies would follow their lead on actually treating customers well and not just saying they treat customers well.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Gonna lose money from me
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
the value of pirates
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
This should work for bakeries too
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: This should work for bakeries too
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
NetFlix 29 Day Window
And if I find that I don't use Netflix all that often i will just disconnect that subscription, just like I disconnected my Subscription to Dish Network 2 years ago, and went with Netflix.
I actually hope someone will report this to Netflix, since after talking to family and friends they feel pretty much the same.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Harvard Case Study
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
You misunderstand a basic element of this deal...
Whether or not this is a positive for consumers depends entirely on your use of the service. I for one love the idea that I can stream more high-quality titles after this deal goes through. That's much more useful to me than getting in line for a handful of WB new release titles that I wanna see each month. If you don't use the streaming service I could see how you'd think of this as a negative.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Next Press Release: "Netflix Claims Customers Don
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Next Press Release: "Netflix Claims Customers Don't Want To Watch Movies, Exits Business"
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Streams tied to actual DVDs
By delaying for a little bit, they are giving up some viewership that they would have lost anyway by not having enough DVD stock (either for physical delivery or for streaming), but they are also able to get the DVDs at a lower price.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: Streams tied to actual DVDs
I doubt that.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
logical business decision??
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Re: logical business decision??
I doubt it.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
It's VERY friendly to customers...
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Blockbuster Online
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Not much of a business model
Doesn't seem like much of a business model, either. ...taking away the ability to collect revenue from your customers for nearly a month at the point when their demand is likely to be the highest...
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Welcome to the real world Jackass...
Lesson: Once you send your customers else where to get serviced and they find a way to get the same service or better (EARLY RELEASED DVD SCREENERS) for FREE. You will not get them to come back and pay you for mediocre service just cause its the "Moral" thing to do.
These days especially, people are broke, and hollywood execs in their million dollar mansions have the audacity to tell the rest of us that they are going broke cause we download movies. Well Mr Hollywood exec GO {INSERT COLOR METAPHOR FOR PROCREATION HERE} YOURSELF !
Since you wont let movie theaters turn a real profit filling seats they in turn rob us at the concession stand. We in turn download movies for free.
You limit exposure by delaying releases. We in turn download it cause we want it now. This is America and we always want things NOW. That's just how it is and that is your customer base. Why the hell should I have to pan around your schedule? If I have time to watch a movie i dont wanna wait till Next Friday when it hits theaters if I can download a leaked copy and watch it right now in my boxers on my couch with a cold beer from my fridge and a steak not flat movie theater soda and stale popcorn... in case you missed it thats me giving you the middle finger mr hollywood exec.
If you cant service your customers someone else will. And places like the pirate cove make tons in advertising cause YOU created their demand and encouraged their growth by not adapting to the needs of the customer. Welcome to the real world jackass.
BOTTOM LINE: I still get what i want, I watched your shitty movie. What did you get? Not my money jackass. However, anyone that makes a masterpiece like the Godfather deserves to have that movie paid for and appreciated. Yeah sure i can download that movie and probably have when my dvd copy was out of reach but thats the point. I had the tape and then I bought the DVD cause to me, the customer, that movie has REAL value and in turn creates a willingness to PAY for it.
Or more recently Avatar was released with a 3D option I paid the 18 dollars to watch it because thats an experience I can not duplicate at home for a more reasonable cost... YET.[ link to this | view in chronology ]
Unclear on the concept
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
For now....
So would one less customer put less of a strain on your supply chain, Netflix?
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
New "Rental" Movies from Netflix
If this is the wave of the future at Netflix I will be a customer for about another week and I'm done. When I pay rental fees for The Invention of Lying and Netflix describes it as: interactive menus; scene access; making-of featurette; "Prequel: The Dawn of Lying;" "Meet Karl Pilkington;" "More Laughter: Corpsing and Outtakes;"; "Rick and Matt's Video Podcasts;" additional scenes.
And find it has not a single one of these, and it was actually NOT in 5.1 Surround but instead Stereo. (The same problems with Night at the Museum 2) I find this to be unacceptable. I will instead end up returning to the days of Burning Bootleg DVDs. At least I get the extras with them, and I won't pay the obscene price to buy the darn things! (I do buy DVDs of my Favorites and will continue to do so, the bootlegging is in lieu of renting)
Netflix tried telling me these "RENTAL" movies are for our benefit, "So we are assured to have enough copies" B.S. I have never waited so long for New Releases in my life, I have had 10 New Release movies in the top of my queue for over 6 weeks, I have received 2 of them in the 6 weeks (both arrived in the past week). Never in the 8 years of membership have I waited this long, and never have I even considered dropping my membership, until now. This is all a case of the Movie Execs and Companies wanting a larger piece of the pie, they are whining about revenues! When they are spending close to a half a BILLION to make AVATAR, they truly are out of touch with their average movie viewer.
I say show Netflix and the Movie industry how you feel by boycotting them. If I knew how to make a website I would start one on this RENTAL movie crap.
Well that's my piece...
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
I find it to be a pretty good deal. I watch about 15-20 movies a month through them for less than 10 dollars. I used to buy dvd's all the time for 10-15 dollars each, sometimes 10 of them at a time, so Netflix is a huge money saver for me.
Obviously we would all like new releases to arrive at our door the morning they come out but it's just not going to happen. Not at these prices anyway.
I think you can get new releases through blockbuster's online site, but I act fast because they wont be around for long.
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
lanuage
[ link to this | view in chronology ]
language
[ link to this | view in chronology ]