Avatar Blu-Ray Customers Not Enjoying Their DRM-Crippled Discs
from the annoying-your-customers-doesn't-stop-piracy dept
The film studios apparently should have spent as much time making sure their DVD new release DRM actually works with popular Blu-Ray players as they did on their new 28 day new release delay scheme. Avatar, which of course Netflix and Redbox users now won't be able to rent for a month, was released on DVD last Friday. While the title's hype and box office success easily translated to disc sales records, AdamR writes in to note that some customers were rewarded for their purchase by finding out the disc wouldn't play on many Blu-Ray players. While some users are able to fix the problem if they can manage to download new firmware that plays nice with the new Avatar DRM, new firmware for players like the Samsung BD-UP5000 doesn't (and may not ever) exist. It's almost as if the studios are trying to perfect the art of annoyance when it comes to Blu-Ray -- something that has helped contribute to the platform's less-than-anticipated adoption rates. While DVDs have always been loaded with unskippable crap (that ironically pirates don't have to deal with) newer Blu-Ray DVDs seem to enjoy taking this to an entirely new level -- with even more unskippable previews, promotions and warnings downloaded to your player via broadband. Somehow the studios continue to believe that layers of seemingly-endless annoyances (DRM, delaying new releases, unskippable "features" -- none of which pirates experience) are actually going to help keep piracy at bay and physical media relevant forever.
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Citizens Rebellion from Anti-Piracy STupidity On Recorded Media
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Re: Citizens Rebellion from Anti-Piracy STupidity On Recorded Media
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Re: Citizens Rebellion from Anti-Piracy STupidity On Recorded Media
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Idiot comments
My parents are old-timers, and both are very computer literate and they also have a Blu-Ray DVD player, which, they've learned the hard way, has been basically crippled by DRM bullshit. Personally, I will never buy another DVD. I don't need the "don't steal a movie" finger-wagging when I JUST FINISHED BUYING THE FRAKKING DVD, nor do I want to sit through ten minutes of Disney ads where they copyright stories that are, in fact, public domain.
I am convinced more and more that people are just plain stupid. Too many years of TV dumbing us down, I suppose.
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Re: Idiot comments
Take your morals and shove it.
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Re: Re: Idiot comments
Piracy however you want to spin is, is not, nor will it ever be equal to theft. Because no actual goods were taken.
Take your moral highground, and stuff it with a few dictionaries and lawbooks.
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Re: Idiot comments
The problem is that the morons developing DRM for their media releases is that they did not have properly educated and trained instructors; they fail to TEST the DRMs they develop as they should:
1) Test on a number of platforms.
2) Test playing with a number of applications.
3) Test with and without various codecs, et cetera.
Don't do this, and you alienate your target market. I don't buy Blu-Ray media because my experiences have not been consistent. I can never tell if a given title will play or not, and Redbox and Netflix don't give refunds. Stick to conventional DVDs until the idiots twig to the fact that their "enhancements" aren't generating the expected sales.
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Re: Old People?
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Re:
Why?
Because the younger generation that had t live and walk through all the muck will eventually take power.
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Re: @Seshan
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the easy mostly legal way
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Re: the easy mostly legal way
In australia, a potentially large file would cause issues in a couple of ways -
1 - downloading a full bluray image would take days, I imagine. I have never tried it, just the thought of it gives me headaches.
2 - downloading something like a full bluray image would almost certainly decimate most people bandwidth caps, which would result in dial up speeds for the remainder of the download/month.
I know it is different in America (I assume your location), but even then it still isnt legal. The point remains that studios are breaking peoples experiences, for a movie they are really excited about.
Is it even legal for them to change the DRM restrictions so that it wont play on existing bluray players?
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Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
A DVD is a RAW(uncompressed) format.
AVI/DIVX/... are all compressed formats.
Then you remove the RIDDLE of DRM, and the file will be about 1/4 the size, AT MOST.
Figure the Full movie will be in PARTS.
DVD size in chunks about 750 meg EACH and 1-2 DVD's(6-7 parts on each disk).
BR Disk, Im not sure yet..but CHUNK size might be 2gig. so about 2-3 files.
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Re: Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
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Re: Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
Sweet Jeebus, your post is so full of stupid I don't know where to begin.
DVD is not uncompressed. DVD uses MPEG-2, which is a form of lossy compression. Given, it's perceptual and high-enough bitrate that it looks good and can even be comrpessed further with good results, but it's not uncompressed or even losslessly compressed video.
DRM does not bloat the file size by 300%. In fact, it doesn't affect the file size in any significant way whatsoever.
As far as those "chunks" go, the main reason you see VOB files smaller than 2 GiB is because at the time the DVD format was specified, many operating systems and utilities had problems dealing with files larger than that. I'm not sure how BR disks are laid out, but so called "large file" support is the norm now, so there's no reason to have a single stream in more than 1 file.
What's more, BR discs are normally 25 or 50 GiB (for SL vs. DL discs). That's a lot more than 2-3 2 GiB "chunks".
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Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
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Re: the easy mostly legal way
Piracy is the perfect form of peaceful protest against DRM crippled bullshit.
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Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
On the contrary, the idustry will only take that an excuse to enforce more (legal) restrictions. Boycott is the perfect from of peaceful protest.
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Re: Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
This is the only protest they will understand. Unfortunately we are not organized or disciplined enough to do this.
Personally, I have only one BlueRay disc that was a gift. I do not care enough about the movies to buy them.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
Sadly, no it's not. If a large number of people boycott, they will just claim that "piracy" is taking away their sales. They will either make up numbers to support these claims - as they do at the moment - or they will claim that the current level of "piracy" are unprovable due to more underground encrypted methods being used. they will never admit that their problems are down to their own actions.
Even if nobody actually "pirated", it would get used as the scapegoat for their losses.
The only real way to force their hand is for people to insist on only buying non-DRMed, non-region controlled products. But, since the biggest titles are often the most infected and the masses tend to be morons, this will never happen.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
Why would that work? If their complaints about piracy and business models are not fact-based, why would shifting demand from DRM media to non-DRM work any better than shifting from DRM to nothing?
If the DRM-encrusted blockbusters are not making as much money as the MPAA think they should, they'll go to Congress (or just bypass Congress entirely) for new laws regardless of what else is happening in the market, whether that is nobody watching movies anymore, everyone downloading illegally, or buying non-DRM movies.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
If people were to boycott *everything* and the sales of *everything* drops as a result, there's no particular message that will be heard. The corporations will stick to their scapegoat of "piracy".
If, on the other hand, sales stay within expected levels, only with the sales shifted from DRMed/region-controlled crap to more consumer-friendly items, this sends out a message that's more difficult to ignore.
"If the DRM-encrusted blockbusters are not making as much money as the MPAA think they should, they'll go to Congress (or just bypass Congress entirely) for new laws regardless of what else is happening in the market, whether that is nobody watching movies anymore, everyone downloading illegally, or buying non-DRM movies."
Agreed, but the case is that much more difficult to prove if it ever gets there. The question of why the large numbers of non-DRMed media had increased while the DRMed sales had plummeted would have to be answered in court.
There would also be more chance that some sense would be seen by the studios before trying this (as with the record companies when they abandoned DRM) - a few successful trials of non-DRMed media would confirm the message that's being sent.
I admit that's optimistic, but it's more realistic than hoping that the studios would do the right thing if a blanket boycott were successful.
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Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
I would say that while buying it and downloading it may result in a series of legal events that you don't want to be part of, it may ultimately be legal.
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Re: Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
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Re: Re: Re: Re: the easy mostly legal way
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but its already been pirated
Which it is.
Avatar has been downloadable for weeks now. It's too late for DRM, since it's already out there.
What reason is their to ruin a legitimate user's movie watching experience after the damage has already been done?
Thats kind of the whole point of digital, you only need one copy to have infinite copies. They can DRM up the new disks all they want, those copies that are out their now won't be stopped by it.
It's like putting on body armour after you've been shot. It's a little late to do any good at this point.
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Re: but its already been pirated
DRM has never ever been about stopping piracy. It has always been about control, or at the very least, a last grasp at control.
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Re: but its already been pirated
Trying to defuse a bomb that has already gone off is just another example of poor strategies by the film industry leaders. Like the record companies and RIAA left a HUGE gap in the market for iTunes to come in, this is the gap the MPAA will have exploited as soon as someone with a lot of money and a little balls comes to market with a workable platform. HULU was a good start in the right direction, but until you can force the hand of the studios or educate them on the technologies of the 21st century pirates will continue to exploit the stupidity of the members of the MPAA.
The movie it self has value thats why customers want it, however their methods of distribution add negative value to the product their by making it "cheaper and easier" to acquire through other means.
Also if you plan to make someone watch 20 min of commercials just to watch your movie then don't charge for it. But If I just paid you $20 for a disc then I should have bought the right to put that disc in and hit play without any obstruction.
As some one noted earlier, the pirates do not put up with high prices, commercial offerings, or DRM crippled distribution. Why would any one CHOOSE to be a paying customer if it is more easily accessible and cost effective to pirate? In most cases of black market offerings the cost is higher and acquisition is more difficult, that is not the case with digital goods.
Too many film industry execs with MBA's and JD's and not enough with common sense and a set of balls.
But as long a they push their failed business model, the demand on pirated materials will remain high and as such the pirates will supply that demand.
Cheap electronics, Tax Free Buying only at PriceHonest.com
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Blueray or Pirate bay?
.....but if it means that I have to endure 5 or 10 mins of rubbish before the main feature EVERYTIME I want to watch it then no-thanks.
As a consumer I am fed up with paying for something just to have advertising stuffed down my throat... Its like paying for Sky & still having to endure the frequent & long ad breaks (So long now I frequently forget what program I am actually watching).
Whats the next ploy having unskippable ad breaks every 15 mins on the dvd's & bluerays.
Its going too far, and encourages pirate advert free viewing. More fools them.
BBC has 4 high quality tv channels & numerous radio stations all for £11 per month: AND NO ADVERTS. Best value by far.
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Re: Blueray or Pirate bay?
As a person outside britain how would I subscribe to this? Do they offer this as a streaming service?
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Re: Blueray or Pirate bay?
> mins of rubbish before the main feature EVERYTIME
> I want to watch it then no-thanks.
I recently rented a movie that had a full 17 minutes worth of ads and nonsense before the movie would start. And not only did the disc disable my FF button, "Next Chapter" button and my "Menu" button, but it even disabled the *power* button and told me I couldn't even turn off my own DVD player. The only way to stop the ads once they started was to pull the plug from the wall. The arrogance of these people is astounding.
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Re: Blueray or Pirate bay?
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Havent had any issues on my Sony Player
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Works fine on my Samsung BD-UP5000
I just wanted to say that that my Amazon-purchsed Avatar BD seems to work fine on my BD-UP5000 (With the latest firmware update, which is months old)
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Good work Fox. The pirates only had to wait three days but you've managed to piss off thousands of legitimate customers as well as brick various Blu-ray players.
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They will never learn....
If the AA's want to win the war against pirates, the AA's need to loose their war against the consumers.
Look at the options! Buy a drm infected Blue Ray that may or may not work on your player, can be scratched / broken / lost, can only be played in certian regions, you can't skip the previews, and calls you a thief when you play the damn thing even after you buy it.
Or download it in hours, play it on what you want, when you want, where you want, and never have to worry about a scratched/missing disk....
Give the people what they want, and torrents will vanish. They only exist because of a need, remove the need and everyone wins....
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Re: They will never learn....
Secondly, torrents will NEVER disappear because, despite what you think, there are millions of people out there who will steal whatever they want because it is easier and cheaper and they just don't care.
I buy then I rip. It's fast, fun and easy.
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@18
so arrest the son of the CEO of warner brothers first toss the fucker into jail so we can pound his ass like a good lil rich boy.
AND then labels also need all that ACTA laws so that no more non commercial use is alowed and in canada you would get the 20000 dollar infringment fine for commerical infringment. Then when poor guy cant pay he goes to rpison for 2.5 years , ( THIS IS PER MUSIC TUNE )
so to YOU #18 you come with all that acta and bring the swat team cause you can only get life in prison once and im a take a few assholes out on the way.
( GEEE isn't this new attitude i have great and who created it ?- YOU #18 , YOU AND YOUR GREEDY KIND, WE WILL ROCK YOU )
is this moral enough for you
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Which commenters actually bought Avatar?
DRM sucks, but upgradable DRM is part of the BD standard and something that should be anticipated for by the manufacturers. If your really "high-end" BD player doesn't have a firmware upgrade *cough*Denon*cough* it's not the media company's fault.
Also, BD rips are not full quality. The sound is often very downsampled.
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Re: Which commenters actually bought Avatar?
One of the reasons why I, among many others, refuse to buy Blu-Ray. I don't appreciate paying a premium only to be lectured to about not being a "pirate" or blocked from playing my legally purchased disc that I bought while on holiday in a different artificial "region".
It's bad enough that I have to use VLC or something similar with DVD to skip the moronic messages and can't play other regions' discs on my primary DVD-capable device (Xbox 360) - when I have legally paid for the content - without having to worry about firmware, internet connection and the like.
"If your really "high-end" BD player doesn't have a firmware upgrade *cough*Denon*cough* it's not the media company's fault."
Nor is it the customer's fault, hence the complaints. There's a very easy way for the firmware "upgrade" not to be an issue - make all discs compatible with the basic firmware. One easy way to do this is not to enforce DRM "protections".
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Re: Which commenters actually bought Avatar?
Yes, it certainly is. They are the only ones who force everyone to adopt their crap DRM schemes. These schemes are anti-consumer, but lame consumers aren't smart or organized enough to be able to assert their wishes. The "demand" side of the free market is broken, and the supply side can run roughshod.
Why would Hitachi put DRM into it's hardware. It doesn't behoove them. And then a buyer of Hitachi has to pay for the DRM that they don't know they don't want. Whose fault is it that these machines are designed to NOT WORK in a variety of situations, some which occur by accident? It is the media company's fault.
Their role is like that of a bully (MPAA) tricking a mentally handicapped person (OEM, Denon) to fire a gun at an unaware innocent victim (consumer). You say not to blame the MPAA, they didn't do anything wrong.
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Blu-Death-Ray
And I have come to the opinion that BluRay is the biggest hoax ever perpetrated on the American public. There is only marginal quality difference. I did a test with a BluRay and a regular DVD which was upscaled and COULD NOT TELL THE DIFFERENCE. BluRay is just a gimmick to foist DRM on the paying public and extort billions of extra cost from their legal users. I no longer get BluRay... just a waste of money and it only makes me mad.
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Re: Blu-Death-Ray
Are you just color blind, fully blind or are you using a std def TV?
The sound, definition and color spectrum on Blu is in a completely different league from DVD. If you need a connect-the-dots illustration watch 2001 on blu ray, then just *try to watch 2001 on DVD (or vhs, honestly.. the DVD was so bad). (Oh, and use a BD player or at least a high-quality BT for your comparison.)
That being said, this case is just another great illustration of why DRM is useless crap and unforgivably stupid, as are unskippable ads on a purchased, sorry "licensed", product.
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Re: Re: Blu-Death-Ray
It's the same way that many people literally can't tell the difference between FLAC and MP3. That while audiophiles will wail and howl about how inferior MP3s are to their preferred format, many just can't tell the difference between an HD and upscaled SD format.
That's the way it is, and no need to attack or question another's opinion on this subject. It also illustrates how dangerous the studios' tactic is if they're trying to depend on merely offering a higher def image to try and make more money from the masses.
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Re: Re: Re: Blu-Death-Ray
Granted, in retrospect my comment was slightly more acerbic than necessary.
Still, even for the least AV sensitive, I challenge anyone with a tiny HD set replete with crappy speakers to the "2001 BD vs. DVD Comparison". Several Kubrick movies use crazy color filters and audio which simply could not be conveyed using DVD coding. The difference is striking, as is the movie (on BD).
OK I'm done writing like a Bluray evangelist.
DRM sucks.
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Re: Blu-Death-Ray
There is a huge difference on bigger TVs (mine is 65", queue the penis size jokes now), and BluRay is the best picture and sound quality going. DVD isn't awful, but BD is awesome in comparison.
I'll take BluRay over DVD and especially over crappy quality downloads every time.
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Re: Re: Blu-Death-Ray
The sound on the other hand is pretty cool. You get some really nice sound on those discs.
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Re: Re: Re: Blu-Death-Ray
Then again, maybe you're one of those people who can't "see" Magic Eye 3D stereograms, either.
Of course, I have had to "fix" the configuration of several friends' TVs and players because they didn't have them set correctly and were disappointed with HD and/or BD quality. They were each pleasantly blown away once I corrected the settings, though.
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Blu-Death-Ray
And please don't patronize me Mr. A/V God. I understand how to hookup components and fiddle with settings on a TV thank you very much. Just because I don't see what the big deal is with the hype behind Blu-ray doesn't mean I'm a noob.
55" set, couch is 12' away. We are close enough. What I don't understand is why Blu-ray fan boys can't come to terms with the fact that not all people worship the format. It looks pretty good, let's leave it at that.
Oh, I "wasted all that money" on equipment so I could watch movies in 3D at home. It's pretty cool actually, too bad the glasses are so expensive. Really I could care less about Blu-ray other than that is the only format for 3D movie viewing at the moment. I don't consider it a "waste" just because the picture quality doesn't wow me as much as it does you. I can still view movies in 3D and believe it or not there is additional content I view other than Blu-ray. Crazy I know, but I also watch TV and play games on the setup. What a waste of money...
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Blu-Death-Ray
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Re: Blu-Death-Ray
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Ha Ha
It seems to work fine on the dedicatedtv.net work that I play it on.
It doen not have any of the annoying features that others have.
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Re: Ha Ha
8 gb sounds closer to DVD than BD
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Re: Re: Ha Ha
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Re: Re: Ha Ha
by Anonymous Coward
I have a blue ray rip and Avatar the was 8.1 gig in 720 format that I found out in the wild.
8 gb sounds closer to DVD than BD
You shouldn't comment without knowing what you are talking about.
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Just a couple of thoughts...
Second, articles like this only inform those in the know, given another just recently stated this particular movie is breaking sales records, meaning, people simply don't give a damn about DRM. If they did, then this movie wouldn't be breaking sales records.
Consumers are the least educated in this regard and the only time they'll have a problem with it is when the movie simply won't play. However, a telephone call to customer support will return them to their happy state once a firmware is updated.
DRM? Meaningless as along as it can play. Unskippable previews? Bathroom/snack breaks.
It's a losing battle against DRM on movies when the majority of consumers simply just doesn't give a damn.
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Re: Just a couple of thoughts...
They have a computer but don't own any flash drives or even any blank CDs so either of these methods would be a less than ideal.
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Re: Just a couple of thoughts...
Because the average consumer in uneducated in this regard, we need to continue the fight against DRM and work to educate the public. It angers me when I play one of my DVDs (Blu-ray or old school) and get the stupid FBI warning about piracy. I bought the damn DVD, so I'm not a pirate! Besides, as I am Canadian, the FBI are an irrelivant entity, but that's beside the point.
If the government used drugs in our water supply to maintain control of the public, but the vast majority of the public were "the least educated in this regard," those that were educated have a moral duty to spread the word. At least I would hope that some would do so. This issue is not quite at the same level, but my point is clear. Just because the majority are unaware of the issue is not reason for the rest to be lemmings.
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Re: Re: Just a couple of thoughts...
Whoa, I did not say this. I said it's a losing battle. Fight the fight all you want, but as written, how long do you think the fight will last if the majority simply don't care?
I've written letters to movie companies on my views against the DVD ads and locking of controls, but 6 years later, it's worse, not better.
I stopped fighting by refusing to buy their products. I certainly don't expect to see others take this approach, as the article clearly indicates.
Just because the majority are unaware of the issue is not reason for the rest to be lemmings.
The problem is, though, the majority are aware. One can't expect people to not notice they can't skip previews, right?
Yet the majority are the ones electing to continue purchasing rather than fight, leaving the few out there to spin their wheels on "education".
People have bitched about this for years, nothing's changed. The news this movie broke sales records is a significant hit against those fighting the fight, wouldn't you agree?
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Re: Re: Re: Just a couple of thoughts...
People might be aware of the issue of being unable to skip the anti-piracy message, but many are unaware that there is an alternative. This, sadly, is the product of complacency of the consumer. I've talked with less knowledgeable people and they tend to feel that the message was required to be put there, so they don't feel that there is any recourse.
But most regular consumers are unaware of the presence of DRM on a Blu-ray disc. I spoke with my brother-in-law who is a computer trainer and I was shocked when he said he never knew that there was such a thing. With all the press that DRM gets, most people just simply don't know about it. For most people, it really doesn't matter all that much to them such that they will research it. After all, they buy a DVD, they play the DVD and they're happy.
With Blu-ray, they buy a disc, they attempt to play the disc and, oh, ummm, it doesn't play. They either assume that there is something wrong with the disc or that it is incompatible. It seems that every manufacturer has that standard party line that some discs are incompatible with some players and people just accept it.
These incompatibilities should not exist. They exist because the standard allows for changes and deviations. In one way, it's nice, but it forces obsolesense, screwing the consumer. It also means that firmware updates are the way of the future.
So people may have bitched for years with no change, but we must continue to bitch and hopefully the lemmings of the world will hear the message and fight back.
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Formats
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Blue Ray et al
DRM is a good idea, but the implimentation is very poor. DRM excludes and denies fair use principles. It denies the consumer choice and the abiliity to protect their investment. There are many excellent reasons to fight DRM. The incovenience is certainly a good one, circular logic is another... Price is high partly because they have to keep upgrading drm to prevent copying... but, time and again, it has been proven(SONY) that DRM ONLY affects your legitimate customers and in part drives those to piracy... priates do NOT see your adverts, your warnings, your preview and MOST IMPORTANTLY - THEY NEVER SEE YOUR DRM - Only the ones that are interested in actaully purchasing your product are subjected to the added cost of DRM on the players and on the media...
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burnination
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Re: burnination
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Re: Re: burnination
Keep up.
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Maybe I should go torrent him a copy too and give it to him as well so he can watch it without having to sit through commercials.
In fact, I think I will.
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Re:
Here, on the other hand, Blu-Ray is at the point where it is meant to have matured. Any format issues should have been ironed out during the battle with HD-DVD. However, that haven't because in this case they *are* by design. We're not talking about incompatibility and using early adopters as glorified beta testers as in the DVD days, we're talking about people being specifically targeted by DRM that assumes they are criminals.
That's the difference, and it's quite a significant one.
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foxconnect@orderassistance.com
Email them.
I asked if it was legal to download a copy off torrent so I don't have to watch the commercials over and over again.
I send them a nice pissed-off email about how I paid for the damn DVD I don't think it's a 'deal' when I can't skip over the commercials. Let's assume I REALLY like the movie and would watch it a few times - that would be really annoying.
The best part is that I only bought one copy for my Dad for this Birthday - I *might* buy another copy for me and a friend *IF* they respond appropriately on the email.
That would be:
1. Say it's ok to download the torrent once I've bought the movie.
2. Offer to send a disc for free without locking it down so I have to endure the commercials.
The other option is that I buy something else, like maybe baseball tickets or something that doesn't involve the movie industry.
This is really getting on my last nerves, between my father and myself we probably own 500+ DVD's. But I'm getting SICK of buying this crap like this.
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Avatar BluRay
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Avatar
The war on pirates will be even less successful than the war on drugs. All the efforts at stifling only leads to greater innovation on the part of the pirates. There are now very professional blogs covering and reviewing the quality of the latest pirated releases and sites announcing openings at private trackers. Somebody throw the RIAA and MPAA a towel so they can throw it in.
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No unskippable crap
As for their DRM, it's like putting on a condom after you notice the burning sensation.
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Well so much for buying it.
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This is why I haven't bought Blu-Ray
You want to protest? Don't buy their crap, any of it. Lets see how much they love DRM when people begin refusing to put up with this kind of stuff.
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So now...
How about you put the commercials/previews in a separate section of the disc?
I think more people would watch them if they didn't feel like they were forced...I think I have seen some DVDs do this and I actually selected the previews that I wanted to watch and when the movie came out I went and bought the DVD or saw it at the movies. If you force me to watch commercials/previews, I'll go to the bathroom and make popcorn while the menu comes up and I won't watch any of them.
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Apple and BluRay...
When you constantly have to update your player and potentially BluRay Drive (on PCs) as well with firmware updates just to get movies to play - what a hassle. The fact that a consumer even has to worry about these updates each time a new release comes out is a joke.
Life isn't supposed to be this hard guys - I'm buying a legit product - it should just work on licensed sanctioned players - period. Anyone that buys a BR disk is part of the problem and voting to continue the system.
If you let someone walk over you, it isn't too long before they own you. Selling you values for some 1080p goodness just seems a bit shortsighted to me.
For what its worth, I stopped by both DVDs and BRs after buying a few and getting stuck in preview hell where my family had to literally wait for 20 minutes before we could watch the main movie. I'll be damn if I'm going to pay $15 to $40 (or more) for a disk that I'll watch once on average and have to waste 10 to 20 minutes of my life and have that choice taken away from me. If I pay that sort of money, I expect to get a restriction free copy. What's next - me having to pay the MPAA to tie me to a chair, use an eye speculum and force me to watch the ads as well?
Freedom
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You Guys Know About Chapter Skip Right?...
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Re: You Guys Know About Chapter Skip Right?...
The operative words here, I believe. From what I understand from the comments, the inability to skip previews is dependant on which player and firmware you have. Just because *you're* not having problem doesn't mean that the others here are lying.
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Re: Re: You Guys Know About Chapter Skip Right?...
I just assumed everyone is complaining because they can't press the menu button and go straight to the movie menu, not that they can't skip the previews and crap one at a time.
Worst case couldn't everyone just fast forward? That also works for me on everything except the copyright and FBI warnings.
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Re: You Guys Know About Chapter Skip Right?...
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I think there was 1 FBI warning on Pineapple Express that I couldn't skip. Nothing else comes to mind, and I ALWAYS skip that crap. Annoying as hell.
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Making it hard to play sucks DRM or not
I understand protecting your stuff but making it hard to play really sucks. This should not be the case when you pay an avg $10 more over a DVD.
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HA HA AH AHA AHHAAAAA
Thats what they get for buying a rental..
HA HA HA HA HA HA
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BLU-RAY WAS DEAD BEFORE DVD EVER DIED...
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http://gizmodo.com/5500433/james-cameron-hates-commercials-on-his-dvds-too
oh and DRM still bad (netflix streaming still good)
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Sharp 40” LED TV
Panasonic upscale DVD player
Yamaha DTS capable receiver
Sharp Blu Ray
If I bought a movie\album on VHS\cassette format, do I still own the rights to that song\movie? Does the purchase carry my ownership through all format changes?
I think it does.
Oh, and I’m waiting for a firmware update for my Sharp Blu Ray.
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Really?¿
Remember some people can still be using composite video from DVD > TV. In which case BD will look that much better. Using HDMI with a up-converting DVD player will look a lot better because there is no Digital > Analog > Digital conversion going on.
But you do have to keep a few things in mind when doing any comparison. This is a summary not a detailed write up.
MPEG/2 v. H.264. Almost all older codecs are not near as efficient as H.264. This results in less quality for the encode. Without getting too technical.
The level of compression and/or bit rate that was used to encode the video. When DVD was released the only TV sets were all SD with a resolution of 640x480 (480i). Everything was encoded knowing it would be converted by the players from Digital to Analog and that 480i was the max. resolution.
Cheaper DVD's where the movie is on a DVD5 not a DVD9 means that the movies are more compressed. As *ALL* video compression is *not* lossless you cannot regain that quality.
On my setup I can see the compression artifacts on every DVD I watch when played on the Toshiba DVD player (composite) and the PS3 or XBox 360 (HDMI).
When you take 640x480 16x9 Anamorphic Digital and try to convert that to 1280x720 or 1920x1080 (both non-anamorphic) resolutions with high compression, tons of lost data, outdated inefficient codecs and it will never ever be the same or even close to the same.
Thanks to artifact blurring and other so called up-conversion techniques it is less visually annoying than it used to be. For me I can count the hairs on actors heads or the pits on their faces in HD, something I cannot do with DVD. No to mention the fact I have seen things I missed that were blurred on DVD's.
At the end of the day it is not about what is better or worse, we all know you cannot take dog crap and turn it into a gold brick. It is all about individual perceptions and what is best for the person. If he/she is happy with the up-converted DVD quality that's just fine.
As far as more people to stop buying protest goes that's harder.
Most people get up in the morning drink the coffee and drive to work. If they hit a pothole in the road they get mad for a few minutes and say how they hate the city that don't take care of the roads. Before they even get to work they forgot all about that pothole. It is usually when the pothole does damage to their car that they complain to the city. Placated with "we will fix that when we have money", they return to their daily grind.
The point being 99.9% of people will accept whatever is thrown at them until it reaches a point that it has a drastic impact on their lives, or more importantly, their bank account.
People accept commercials as they have been there for so long, just like that pothole probably has.
As a person who teaches and assists people in moving away from DVD/BD to Digital Files, I find most people fear this change or are pre-programmed to simply accept what they are told (Backup / Format Shifting = Illegal = Bad) it is hard to convince them to adapt to new thought processes and/or to new technologies.
As far as the IP industry goes it is akin to you earning 200,000 a year and then someone saying they are going to switch you to a new way of figuring your salary but they cannot prove exactly how much you are going to earn. Would you simply say sure move me over to that way of getting paid now please! That's the way the see it from on high! We need to be assured of this $ before we move forward.
It is not as much about being greedy as it is what they are used to. Since the economy went sideways many people used to earning hundreds of thousands per year are now having to get used to earning 10% or less of that a year. Ask anyone who has experienced that it is not easy to scale back or change the things you are used to.
More importantly their whole business model is clunky and wasteful. It is certainly not easy to have to change the entire business model, especially when it is easier to lobby to retain that model and that lifestyle.
The Internet has fundamentally altered everyones lives and upset many business models. We are still in the early days of the changes, rest assured there are many more to come. In this age we don't need TV Networks, Record Labels, Newspapers or most of the old information / entertainment business models. All these models are based around a central necessity, the fact they were the only source. But now Studio's can stream movies and TV shows direct to people's homes, no middlemen needed. No bloodsucking networks, aggregators or cable companies required.
They all know this. They are fighting for their very relevance in the new age of information consumption. They will lose in the end as obsolescence approaches them. In my opinion it will not be the people that cause the end, but the money men behind these companies as they will see greater revenue and more benefits by replacing the old models with new more profitable ones.
Just my humble opinion.
FyI: I can you're wondering my den setup is a ...
Mitsubishi 65" DLP
360 Elite - PS3 - PS2 - Wii
Toshiba SD DVR
Toshiba (outdated composite) DVD Player
Popcorn Hour C200
Yamaha 9-1 Receiver with 2 klipsch front bookcase speakers and 4 Klipsch surround sound speakers. I still have to replace the sony center channel and add a subwoofer yet.
60% full 30 TB Fully Mirrored 3U Array connected to a dedicated 1U Intel Xeon Server to serve to all the PCH (Popcorn hour', yes I have 3) and the 360's (again, yes I have 3) in the house.
My awesome Giganews account and 2 6 Mb/sec DSL connections.
...
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An idea...
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Studio's ENCOURAGING piracy
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I don't need no DRM
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DVDs only play full-screen mode on computer DVD players.
3 tries with Nero Showtime and it finally comes up. Full-screen. No way to change it.
Thinking MAYBE I got a mis-packaged disk, I slip it into my rarely used HTIB and boom. Full screen. Getting REALLY fucking sick of being treated like a criminal for shit I bought legitimately.
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my samsung dvd playing avatar now
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i remove the DRM
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I got the solution
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skipping trailers
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fuck drm.. hooray piracy I guess
I am not interested in paying for the masochists experience. I will spend my money to play media ON MY TERMS: this is not negotiable
hollytards don't get it.. instead they're exacerbating a TINY piracy problem by turning would be "casual pirates" into FULL BLOWN PIRATES
brilliant! that's liberalism for ya
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porn industry wisely chose HD-DVD
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I like this one
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AnyDVD HD
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