Intel Claims DRM'd Chip Is Not DRM, It's Just Copy Protection
from the um,-that's-the-same-thing dept
There's been a lot of talk this week about Intel building DRM into its Sandy Bridge chip. I had initially passed on writing this story, as we seem to hear the same thing every few years. Back in 2005, for example, there were similar stories about Intel planning DRM built into its chip. However, what got me interested enough to actually write about this is Intel's bizarre response to the press coverage, in which they play one of the most ridiculous games of corporate doublespeak in ages. First, they insist it's not DRM. They say that right up in the headline: "No, It's Not DRM" Then they kick it off with an explanation of what DRM is, followed up by again saying: "I am not going to get into a discussion about the pros and cons of DRM in this blog; but I will say that Intel Insider is NOT a DRM technology." Ok. So what is it. That's in the next paragraph:Intel Insider is a service that enables consumers to enjoy premium Hollywood feature films streamed to their PC in high quality 1080P high definition. Currently this service does not exist because the movie studios are concerned about protecting their content, and making sure that it cannot be stolen or used illegally. So Intel created Intel insider, an extra layer of content protection.Um. So it is DRM. You just said it's not, and then described DRM. Content protection is DRM. I'm not sure exactly what Intel thinks it's doing here. If they say it's not DRM and then explain how it is DRM, they think people will think it's not DRM? If you're going to include DRM, just admit that it's DRM. Then we can argue about whether or not it's smart (and, no, it's not).
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Filed Under: copy protection, drm, hollywood
Companies: intel
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Kowtowing
What do they possibly have to gain by helping those groups? I must have missed some news somewhere because I just can't see anything they have to gain, aside from maybe being paid off to do so.
I doubt their sue the 3rd party efforts could manage to get far enough to actually sue Intel or others and not get thrown out of court.
I must have missed something. Anyone care to fill in the blank for me here?
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Re: Kowtowing
Money money money money mo - - ney!
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Re: Kowtowing
Well, actually, Intel is quite an important part of the MAFIAA cartel because they're the ones who created HDCP for the content arm of MAFIAA. For those that aren't familiar with HDCP, HDCP is the encryption mechanism used to "secure" data going over HDMI connections. HDMI is just the classic DVI with HDCP on top.
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Re: Re: Kowtowing
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Re: Re: Re: Kowtowing
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Re: Re: Kowtowing
There, I fixed it for you. :D
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Re: Re: Re: Kowtowing
There, I fixed it for you. :D"
Yes, you're right:). I knew that but I didn't considered it would make a difference to my point. More likely, it would have made an unknowing reader think "Ooooh, but it adds audio as well, that really cool!", which would be completely missing the point. The point I was trying to get across was that HDMI is just Intel taking an open technology (the DVI standard interface) and locking it down with HDCP.
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Re: Re: Re: Kowtowing
HDCP is not a part of, or a requisite for HDMI.
HDMI is the physical connector and digital signalling standards for transmitting audio and video over a cable.
The digital signalling of video is an enhancement of DVI, as it allows for greater bandwidth.
HDCP is a device level layer (nothing to do with the cable) that adds encryption/authorization.
You can have HDCP over DVI, you can have HDCP over HDMI, hell you can probably have HDCP over ethernet.
You can have DVI and HDMI without HDCP.
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Re: Re: Kowtowing
I still am unclear why they even got into that to begin with, short of Lobo Santo's explanation above.
Sorry about the late reply. I usually avoid the internet on the weekends and didn't get back on TD on Friday there.
One would think that even with HDCP being broken and cracked and worked around so much, Intel would have perhaps learned some sort of lesson about how DRM does not work.
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Re: Kowtowing
Relevancy. With their continued loss of the mobile and low-power industry (like set top boxes) and now the announcement that Windows is going to run on non-Intel hardware, they need new and inventive way to keep people buying their chips. If they have a tech that the MAFIAA buys in to, they can then license that tech to other chip makers to take a cut of their profits, or keep it all to themselves and ensure people keep buying their chips.
They have no real alliance with them, they just need to keep them buying in.
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Re: Re: Kowtowing
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Force Fail
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Re:
What does Direct Rendering Manager (DRM) have to do with this discussion?
I'm taking back the acronym!
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Haha
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Re: Haha
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Re: Re: Haha
You also forget that this DRM will ONLY BE USED IF THE APPLICATIONS IN QUESTION ASK FOR IT TO BE USED!
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Re: Re: Haha
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Re: Re: Haha
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Re: Re: Haha
AMD - CPU
nVidia - graphics
no thanks on intel or ati graphics (and yes I know who owns them, and I still WONT USE THEM!!)
This just solidifies my stance against intel... now if AMD would just release a dual core atom like processor I would be good to go!
With this DRM, and YES THIS IS DRM! Lack of Linux drivers for features which require practically bleeding edge if not development versions of libs etc.. FAIL, EPIC FAIL.
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Re: Haha
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Re: Haha
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Re:
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Re: Re: Re:
I have had DRM on some games that I have downloaded or bought bother me, but that isn't Windows 7 nor is it the in-built DRM of that OS bothering me.
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Re: Re: Re: Re:
I have to as well. Vista had bugs in it related to DRM, such as when I'd place a pre-written CD-R in the drive and it would tell me that the disc wasn't formatted and would overwrite the CD-R, but I haven't had Windows 7 do anything like that to me. The only thing that I've experienced with Windows 7 has existed since WindowsXP (file transfers via SMB are abnormally slow,) but I am not sure this is related to the DRM issue that has been published and not just bad network coding. (FTP takes about 30 seconds to transfer a file which takes 8 minutes to transfer using SMB.)
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The explanation is not really about DRM...
For the record, they aren't kowtowing - they're trying to put in a piece of DRM that will be so attractive to the MAFIAAs that their competitors get frozen out of the market for any device that plays audio or video, which these days, is pretty much everything. Bending the customers over and stuffing their rights where the sun don't shine is just part of doing business (and government) these days.
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Best line from Intel Blog
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Re: Best line from Intel Blog
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Hint: The future is coming, and it won't be wide open. Deal with it.
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Re:
Locking out an operating system, which is what it would do to linux is illegal. Microsoft already got tagged for this kind of practice.
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Re:
Heh. Heheh. No, sorry. Hint: The present is here, and it's already wide open. Accept it.
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Re:
People will deal with it by breaking it. Those who cannot participate in this will do their part by complaining loudly.
Don't like people complaining? Deal with it. That part isn't going away either.
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Re:
Now who should one listen to on this issue, you or widely respected security expert Professor Ed Felten of Princeton?
Writing in his review of predictions for 2009:
"DRM technology will still fail to prevent widespread infringement. In a related development, pigs will still fail to fly.
By tradition this is our first prediction, and it has always been accurate. Guess what our first 2010 prediction will be? Verdict: right."
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a pile of crap, by any other name, still stinks
took them ten years, but they finally got their wish, and they didn't even have to ... donate any more money to congressional campaigns.
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"DRM is a piece of software, not hardware."
That's a rather obscure way to look at it (or, well, a rather self-serving way to look at it) and they are nutty if they think anyone will accept it. That article can be summarized as saying "It's not DRM, it just does all the exact same things as DRM."
Shit by any other name...
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Re:
"It's just a feature available to programers to use how they will, for DRM purposes or not"
Without any info, I'd say it's likely probably just some sort of encryption or compression handling technology. What makes it DRM I'm guessing will come when they give some sort of key or special control over the technology to *IAA and not to the owner of the chip.
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Re: Re:
Nothing about that sounds neutral or programmer-friendly to me. They know exactly what this is for and how it will be used - and they announce it right off the bat. They clearly already have plans to use this for DRM straight out of the gate.
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Re: Re: Re:
It doesn't really matter if it's friendly, it has to be controlled somehow. For me, the question comes down to who has the keys, the customer, everyone, intel, *IAA?
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It is all really quite vague right now though.
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Re: Re: Re: Re:
You can argue the technicalities of whether the processor feature, in itself, qualifies as DRM - but given that they have explicitly said that its purpose is to enable "content protection" for film studios, I think it's pretty fair to call it DRM technology.
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Intel is going all-or-nothing on the super-performance and overclocking crowd (read: kids with rich parents or console-spawns), and expect to coax these into spreading their DRM.
I myself will keep buying AMD. At least they know how to do floating point math and don't put remote kill switches on their CPUs.
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Re:
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Careful!
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Re: Careful!
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Piracy is theft. Sounds familiar ?
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Re:
These activities may or may not involve theft. So just slapping the "thief" tag on pirates not only shows your ignorance, it also perpetuates the notion that pirate are mere petty crooks and overlooks their diverse array of activities and their positive impact on society (like eliminating evil pirate ghosts, for example).
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If it walks like a duck...
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If you come back and say they are ok with it with a straight face you may deserve and Oscar.
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why would i A. buy a shitty Intel chip and B. change my MB and RAM, just so i can pay industry to watch movies i can download for free.
This is begging to be DOA, to bad industry has a good life support system it can put things on, including itself.
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Its not DRM...
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Re:
But if you want to have your hardware decide when it is going to die on you (read: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_bridge#Other_Details second paragraph), by all means, go ahead and buy that piece of crap.
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Re: Re:
"include the ability to remotely disable a PC or erase information from hard drives. ... commands can be received through 3G signals, ethernet, or internet connections"
Cyberwar aluminium foil hats at the ready then.
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"In addition, Sandy Bridge processors will implement security features that include the ability to remotely disable a PC or erase information from hard drives. This can be useful in the case of a lost or stolen PC. The commands can be received through 3G signals, ethernet, or internet connections."
and, WTF is that about your first quote? It could have been developed in Mars for all I care. What I don't like is the fact that anyone besides me can erase my data and neutralize my CPU remotely. If you are ok with this, then please, apply a brick to your forehead until you regain your senses.
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Re:
People who want to "steal stuff without paying for it" will continue to be able to do so. All that will happen is some soccer moms somewhere won't be able to figure out why the movie they just bought won't work properly. Want to know what version of the movie will work properly? The one from bittorrent.
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Re:
It is just one of those silly features that will never get used because it will be cumbersome LoL
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When barriers to the products have broken down and you no longer control the distribution channel what do you do?
If you are an idiot you try to put an artificial barrier that will be ignored by the masses and will devalue your product because it is clunkier than the competition.
Right this will work wonders. That and the "Ultraviolet" thing will fail miserably in the near future, but don't just believe me, watch and see it happen before your eyes.
They then will try to make it work through legislation, when the people already proved they don't care and will happily ignore it.
Not to mention the drive that this puts on the creation of legal free alternatives that could become mainstream in the next decade, then it will be game over for them.
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it passes the duck test
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Tobacco companies claiming cigarettes don't kill people, they're just unhealthy.
Obama claiming that going after embarrassing leaks and resisting most FOIA requests doesn't contradict his promises for transparency, it just ensures national security.
They're all lies and we know it.
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Think of Open Source
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Re: Think of Open Source
Time to buy from AMD or the lesser evil(compared to Intel apparent intentions) the Chinese, although I hear Koreans have a x86 microprocessor too.
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Thinking about it, this is the most stupid idea ever.
If I was a government I would not buy Intel ever because of the risks involved.
If I was a company I wouldn't buy that either, since with the easy for misguided actions, errors in procedure or any other reason could lead to total loss of data.
As a user that scares me and I'm going to stay away from Intel because I don't want them controlling what I do with my computer.
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So with this chip it turns your entire computer into a warehouse of RENTAL MEDIA.
Guess I will NOT be upgrading to these new chips
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hold on a second...
Cool bananas! this means cracking it isn't protected by the DCMA!!!!!
Time for Intel to do 1 of 2 things:
1. Admit this IS DRM and seek DCMA protection (embarassing)
2. Give up the ghost on the whole idea.....
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"a service that enables consumers to enjoy premium Hollywood feature films streamed to their PC in high quality 1080P high definition."
... I guess in that case I should purchase an AMD cpu/mobo
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1080p HD on a PC
That's funny. I've recently watched a Hollywood feature film on my PC in 1080p HD, and I did it without any help from "Intel Insider". (eMule, on the other hand ...)
I have over 3TB of disk storage here, broadband, and a will to use it. I'm pretty sure I'm not alone.
The morons at the film cartel better wise up or step down soon or they'll run their whole oligopoly nose-first into the Pacific and we'll have another big economic crisis on our hands. "Intel Insider" won't save them. (Watching that copy, which probably came from a screener Bluray or a cracked HDMI device, would not be affected by it.) COICA won't save them. (eMule does not depend on any particular web sites staying up and is quite comfortable using raw IP addresses.) Only business model innovation can save them.
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Re: 1080p HD on a PC
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Re: Re: 1080p HD on a PC
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Re: Re: 1080p HD on a PC
These 'protections' will only be used if applications ask for them to be used, so if the applications don't ask for them to be used? You won't even notice them, it will be like they are not even there.
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Intel Inside
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Re: Intel Inside
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DRM
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Re: DRM
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Re: Re: DRM
If you are using a program that DOESN'T call for the DRM to be used, you are golden. Windows 7 does N O T automatically call for all the DRM stuff in it to be used, it waits for individual applications to ask for it to use it.
I would assume this would ALSO be true with this processor-based DRM.
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Re: Re: Re: DRM
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DRM isn't the full issue here
When Intel says this is not DRM, they probably are using EA's and Ubisoft's definition of DRM. If you want to look it up, you'll see that these have been patched, due to the DRM increasing the amount of pirating, since people didn't want the DRM to control their computers. Intel Insider, though, is a hardware aspect to do the same thing, so technically not DRM, but still serves the same function.
So, what are the difficulties and costs associated with a hardware recall and a revamp of your production line in addition to scrapping processors that are on shelves compared to issuing a software patch, anyone?
If programmers can use this for DRM or not, according to their will, what's to stop viruses from using this "feature" to kill your processor or erase all your data? If the law authorities are the only ones who can access it, they're going to have pretty big headaches fixing it when the average Joe buys a pre-assembled computer and gets a virus of that type.
Additionally, I don't see any protection against someone purchasing this as a second computer solely for the video streams, then simply recording them and uploading them to file-sharing programs. It wouldn't be streaming, but you would still have the quality given the right recording program.
When this shit hits the fan, Intel deserves to be kicked down a couple notches, hopefully making chips at comparable prices to AMD, instead of a difference of ~$800 for the top models.
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Waste of Money
Maybe if they stopped they could lower prices and compete with AMD for power per price point. ALways been an AMD loyal and this is only more reason for me to be.
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